Jon Stewart: Trump isn't some incredible supervillain

[DKW 86 7,440]

Jon Stewart: Trump isn't some incredible supervillain. See the 7:00 Mark

Jon Stewart has some really truly deep thoughts on the future 

[AUDub 11,182]

He's right. Trump is simply a reflection of what a large segment of this country wants now. He's ultimately a symptom, not the disease. 

[bigbird 60,580]

On 12/13/2021 at 9:51 AM, AUDub said:

Trump is simply a reflection of what a large segment of this country wants now. He's ultimately a symptom, not the disease. 

Why do you think that so many "want" it that way now? And what do you think the disease is?

[McLoofus 35,182]

7 hours ago, bigbird said:

Why do you think that so many "want" it that way now? And what do you think the disease is?

Ignorance, fear, and politicians and media exploiting it. 

The GOP base has been made to believe that people who aren't like them and causes that aren't inherently of interest to them are the cause of all their troubles. Brown people, LGBTQ people, vaccines, masks, environmental regulations... all threats to their way of life. Same s*** that every conservative government has done throughout history. 

I'm sure there's a what about argument to be made. 

[bigbird 60,580]

17 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Ignorance, fear, and politicians and media exploiting it. 

The GOP base has been made to believe that people who aren't like them and causes that aren't inherently of interest to them are the cause of all their troubles. Brown people, LGBTQ people, vaccines, masks, environmental regulations... all threats to their way of life. Same s*** that every conservative government has done throughout history. 

I'm sure there's a what about argument to be made. 

Not at all. I'm fed up with divisiveness from both sides and am actively looking for causes to treat rather than symptoms. Appreciate the response.

[AUDub 11,182]

9 hours ago, bigbird said:

Why do you think that so many "want" it that way now? And what do you think the disease is?

I think there's fertile ground worldwide for right wing populism. Here in America we have the extreme rightward lurch of the Republicans and and electoral system that favors them, in the Philippines you have Duterte, in Italy Berlusconi, in Turkey Erdogan, in the UK Nigel Farage (though their parliamentary system there keeps guys like him in check) and in France the Le Pens and Front National (though the way their elections work tends to filter out extremists,  which is why Macron is president there).

The main reason, IMO, is anti-globalization. Globalization is inevitable, and is mostly good, but there is some bad. Take for instance how Trump broke the blue wall in 2016. Want to know why that area is generally called the Rust Belt? A lot people were put in a bad position, they're upset, and they're an easy target for right wing brands of populism like Trumpism. "Here's a guy with simple solutions for complex problems! Must be those immigrants he talks about so much! Or those woke elites that don't have out best interests at Heart! etc. etc. ad nauseam."

Edited December 15, 2021 by AUDub

[I_M4_AU 7,970]

5 hours ago, bigbird said:

Not at all. I'm fed up with divisiveness from both sides and am actively looking for causes to treat rather than symptoms. Appreciate the response.

You received two responses that explained why there is divisiveness from one perspective.  As usual, those responses are to blame one side for all the problems which, in turn, points out that we are still divided as a country.  I’m not sure how we move forward, but our current leadership (no matter what political party we are talking about) is not going to unify this country.

We had compromise when both parties were more closely aligned to the center, but now it seems the politicians are moving toward the extremes of the movement they represent.   God help us.

[AUDub 11,182]

5 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

You received two responses that explained why there is divisiveness from one perspective.  As usual, those responses are to blame one side for all the problems which, in turn, points out that we are still divided as a country.  I’m not sure how we move forward, but our current leadership (no matter what political party we are talking about) is not going to unify this country.

We had compromise when both parties were more closely aligned to the center, but now it seems the politicians are moving toward the extremes of the movement they represent.   God help us.

There's a reason we put forth a guy that basically made a career of compromise in Biden rather than Bernie.

Hell, even Obama wasn't much of a change from generic centrists going back to Bush senior, even given his soaring rhetoric. 

[bigbird 60,580]

21 minutes ago, AUDub said:

There's a reason we put forth a guy that basically made a career of compromise in Biden rather than Bernie.

Hell, even Obama wasn't much of a change from generic centrists going back to Bush senior, even given his soaring rhetoric. 

Yeah, Bernie would never have come close to beating Trump. Don't pretend Biden was the choice based on merit or platform. He was the nominee for one singular reason. Polls showed he gave the DNC the best chance to beat Trump.

[McLoofus 35,182]

8 minutes ago, bigbird said:

Yeah, Bernie would never have come close to beating Trump. Don't pretend Biden was the choice based on merit or platform. He was the nominee for one singular reason. Polls showed he gave the DNC the best chance to beat Trump.

Extreme circumstances require extreme measures. Or, in this case, extremely bland, boring measures.

Edited December 15, 2021 by McLoofus

[bigbird 60,580]

3 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Extreme circumstances require extreme measures. Or, in this case, extremely bland, boring measures.

I didn't say it was a wrong strategy, just transparent. 😂

[McLoofus 35,182]

1 minute ago, bigbird said:

I didn't say it was a wrong strategy, just transparent. 😂

Indeed. I remember McWifey and I having that conversation ahead of the primaries. "Christ, it's going to be Biden." Didn't vote for him in the primaries. Held our noses in the general. I didn't and still don't think he's nearly as bad as many on the right (and far left) make him out to be, but it's still depressing that we elected an empty suit once again. Almost as depressing as just how far superior to the alternative he was. 

[bigbird 60,580]

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

Indeed. I remember McWifey and I having that conversation ahead of the primaries. "Christ, it's going to be Biden." Didn't vote for him in the primaries. Held our noses in the general. I didn't and still don't think he's nearly as bad as many on the right (and far left) make him out to be, but it's still depressing that we elected an empty suit once again. Almost as depressing as just how far superior to the alternative he was. 

There has been far too much nose holding in our elections lately

[I_M4_AU 7,970]

2 hours ago, AUDub said:

There's a reason we put forth a guy that basically made a career of compromise in Biden rather than Bernie.

Hell, even Obama wasn't much of a change from generic centrists going back to Bush senior, even given his soaring rhetoric. 

During the Democratic debates it became obvious to most conservatives Biden did not have the same centrist views he had before that debate.  The candidates were tripping all over themselves trying to see how far left they could get.  One even was fight for abortions for trans women and getting applauded for his stance.

Obama was a great politician that most people wanted to believe.  When the Dems really bought into identity politics is when the divide started to widen. IMO

[AUDub 11,182]

3 hours ago, bigbird said:

Yeah, Bernie would never have come close to beating Trump. Don't pretend Biden was the choice based on merit or platform. He was the nominee for one singular reason. Polls showed he gave the DNC the best chance to beat Trump.

We literally held a primary to let the voters decide lol. Our voters like him.

I like Bernie's policy positions but I'm well aware the country at large isn't ready for his ideals, though. We are by and large a centrist to center right country, and while Bernie's core voters are enthusiastic (and IMO, loud, annoying and abrasive) they're only a wing, and Bernie wasn't interested in trying to court the people that would win a general election, much less a primary. Case in point, Biden absolutely thrashed him among women and minorities. 

Edited December 15, 2021 by AUDub

[AUDub 11,182]

54 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

During the Democratic debates it became obvious to most conservatives Biden did not have the same centrist views he had before that debate.  The candidates were tripping all over themselves trying to see how far left they could get.  One even was fight for abortions for trans women and getting applauded for his stance.

He did have to angle to his left before pivoting into general election mode, yeah, but he did a good job keeping it tempered. Guy absolutely refused to utter stupid catchphrases like "defund the police" lol. 

Quote

Obama was a great politician that most people wanted to believe.  When the Dems really bought into identity politics is when the divide started to widen. IMO

We're more polarized nowadays but don't absolve the Rs of their rightward shift. A shift that started going all the way back to Goldwater followed by Nixon's Southern Strategy. Take his Republican predecessors. Richard Nixon can be summed up as "Hate is good," Ronald Reagan "Greed is good," and George W. Bush "Dumb is good." Trump takes all of that and adds "Cruel is good."

At least the Dems still have a smattering of those blue dogs around and have to count on their coalitions. McConnell has pretty much purged any R that isn't in lock step on policy.  

Edited December 15, 2021 by AUDub

[bigbird 60,580]

38 minutes ago, AUDub said:

We literally held a primary to let the voters decide lol

Because the DNC has never setup a primary, huh?

 

Come on, you really can't believe that, right? Even Loof knows and admitted as much.

[AUDub 11,182]

7 minutes ago, bigbird said:

Because the DNC has never setup a primary, huh?

 

Come on, you really can't believe that, right? Even Loof knows and admitted as much.

They altered the process last cycle, giving Bernie and his wing a lot more input after the rat f*ckery in 16. 

Fact of the matter is that Bernie got blown out of the water. Biden isn't Hillary. 

[bigbird 60,580]

3 minutes ago, AUDub said:

They altered the process last cycle, giving Bernie and his wing a lot more input after the rat f*ckery in 16. 

Fact of the matter is that Bernie got blown out of the water. Biden isn't Hillary. 

I will happily just agree to disagree.  Have a great night.

Auburn got better today, War Eagle!

[AUDub 11,182]

38 minutes ago, bigbird said:

I will happily just agree to disagree.  Have a great night.

Auburn got better today, War Eagle!

Not sure what you disagree with. That Bernie wing got more input into the process after Debbie Wasserman-Schultz got caught needlessly putting her hand on the scales is documented fact. 

And that Biden's coalition was a far more robust and reliable coalition than Hillary's is also fact. 

[I_M4_AU 7,970]

1 hour ago, AUDub said:

He did have to angle to his left before pivoting into general election mode, yeah, but he did a good job keeping it tempered. Guy absolutely refused to utter stupid catchphrases like "defund the police" lol. 

We're more polarized nowadays but don't absolve the Rs of their rightward shift. A shift that started going all the way back to Goldwater followed by Nixon's Southern Strategy. Take his Republican predecessors. Richard Nixon can be summed up as "Hate is good," Ronald Reagan "Greed is good," and George W. Bush "Dumb is good." Trump takes all of that and adds "Cruel is good."

At least the Dems still have a smattering of those blue dogs around and have to count on their coalitions. McConnell has pretty much purged any R that isn't in lock step on policy.  

He did angle to he left until he got elected, from that point he has consistently appeased the radical left to his own detriment IMO.

Republicans are not blameless, however, trying to shift the blame on Goldwater’s view is like blaming the boomers on things you yourself have control over.  Times change and the Republican Party is taking a more visible stance to combat the ideals of gender fluidity and race baiting that is the result of identity politics.  Defunded the police is just idiotic and is still promoted by *the squad*.  

[AUDub 11,182]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

Times change and the Republican Party is taking a more visible stance to combat the ideals of gender fluidity and race baiting that is the result of identity politics. 

This what it takes to get elected as a Republican now. 

Kneel before the altar of Trump. 

[AUDub 11,182]

Not rare anywhere. I personally like Katie Boyd Britt here in Alabama myself but watching her try to twist herself into pretzels to avoid throwing the race "because Trump" is painful to watch. 

[AUDub 11,182]

In my opinion we have one party that is flawed and getting them to do anything at all is tantamount to herding cats, then another that is simply foaming-at-the-mouth stark raving mad.

Edited December 16, 2021 by AUDub

[McLoofus 35,182]

14 hours ago, bigbird said:

Come on, you really can't believe that, right? Even Loof knows and admitted as much.

Wait, what? I did no such thing. What I said was that Bernie couldn't beat trump and that I and many other Democrats realized that. I didn't say anything about the DNC fixing the primary, which is clearly what you're insinuating here.

14 hours ago, AUDub said:

while Bernie's core voters are enthusiastic (and IMO, loud, annoying and abrasive) they're only a wing, and Bernie wasn't interested in trying to court the people that would win a general election, much less a primary.

Don't remember which debate it was, but my mind changed on Bernie in real time as I watched him refuse to stop the angry old man act and even refuse to fully address the questions being asked, choosing instead to keep going back to a very short list of talking (yelling) points. I didn't disagree with anything he said, but I knew that he was never going to change anyone else's mind or listen to what they had to say.