Biblical Marriage

[jj3jordan 2,060]

1 hour ago, homersapien said:

Oh I understand it completely. 

I just like to get you guys to publicly admit it.  It's good for everyone to see how irrational and extremist you are.

So, if you aren't Christian, "you are going to hell". 

Never mind all the irrational considerations wrapped up in that - such as Christians represent only a small fraction of the world's population.  Never mind that many who are non-Christian are just as virtuous as Christians. They don't embrace MY religious beliefs so they are going to hell.  God doesn't care about them, he only cares about Christians.

I like giving people like you to reveal yourselves for the irrational religious fanatics you are.  Anything I can do to expose such dangerous thinking, I'll do it.

So thanks for playing.

I would congratulate you on you Pyrrhic victory over me. What I think, however, has nothing to do with the ultimate outcome. I am happy to admit/refer to the New Testament regarding salvation or lack thereof. If being a Christian makes me irrational and extreme in homer’s world then I will gladly accept your label. I understand that you must do everything in your power to discredit Christianity. It is the only way to deal with your rejection of Jesus. I like revealing Biblical truth to you also. If it exposes your dangerous rejection of Jesus and perhaps in your latter days cracks open a door that allows your heart to soften to Jesus, then I’ll do it.🙏😇

[Leftfield 2,654]

9 minutes ago, jj3jordan said:

I would congratulate you on you Pyrrhic victory over me. What I think, however, has nothing to do with the ultimate outcome. I am happy to admit/refer to the New Testament regarding salvation or lack thereof. If being a Christian makes me irrational and extreme in homer’s world then I will gladly accept your label. I understand that you must do everything in your power to discredit Christianity. It is the only way to deal with your rejection of Jesus. I like revealing Biblical truth to you also. If it exposes your dangerous rejection of Jesus and perhaps in your latter days cracks open a door that allows your heart to soften to Jesus, then I’ll do it.🙏😇

Does this mean you are OK with someone being punished for eternity because they were never made aware of Jesus?

[AUDynasty 585]

15 hours ago, Leftfield said:

I would hope that's what it means. If not, many children born into other cultures and with other beliefs, by that way of thinking, have no chance at meeting God, through no fault of their own. Some are immersed in cultures where Christianity isn't even mentioned. They will go their entire lives possibly never hearing the name Jesus, much less having the chance to learn about Him. 

Could you accept that God would refuse them entrance into heaven due to reasons completely beyond their control? That they have to pay for the "sins" of their ancestors believing in another god/gods (even if their teachings are similar) and raising their children to believe such because they feel that's the moral thing to do?

On a personal anecdote, that's the exact same question I had for myself when I learned about other religions growing up. I can't wrap my head around the fact that if God and Jesus are loving, kind, and compassionate -- why would they banish people who have NEVER heard of Christianity to hell? I was horrified to think that this could be the case. As of a result, when I was a child, I said that I believed in God but it was out of fear that I was going to be punished for eternity. It didn't take until much later in my high school years that I realized that it's an extremely unhealthy way to approach religion. Terrible people were using religion as a channel to control and force people. 

If it's true that you have to be a Christian in order to go to Heaven and that all other religious people are banished for eternity, then I don't want to go to Heaven when I die. And that's when it dawned on me. Jesus is love. God and Jesus represent love and kindness. 

[PUB78 1,362]

10 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

Does this mean you are OK with someone being punished for eternity because they were never made aware of Jesus?

Be grateful that you know about Jesus and have the opportunity to accept him as your Savior.

[Leftfield 2,654]

9 minutes ago, PUB78 said:

Be grateful that you know about Jesus and have the opportunity to accept him as your Savior.

So that's a yes, then. Thanks.

Please remember this the next time you wonder why so many are turning away from religion.

[AUDynasty 585]

3 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

So that's a yes, then. Thanks.

Please remember this the next time you wonder why so many are turning away from religion.

And the number is going to grow and grow the more Christian people become more hostile towards people who are different from them. LINK.

[icanthearyou 4,463]

59 minutes ago, PUB78 said:

Be grateful that you know about Jesus and have the opportunity to accept him as your Savior.

Has someone accepted Jesus by merely proclaiming him as their savior?  Or, do you accept Jesus by following his commandment of love for all?

Personally, I believe the latter is much more important.

 

[PUB78 1,362]

51 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

So that's a yes, then. Thanks.

Please remember this the next time you wonder why so many are turning away from religion.

Yes, to their eternal destruction.

However, you ask good questions, many of which we as Born Again Christians struggle with.

[PUB78 1,362]

1 minute ago, icanthearyou said:

Has someone accepted Jesus by merely proclaiming him as their savior?  Or, do you accept Jesus by following his commandment of love for all?

Personally, I believe the latter is much more important.

 

You must be “Born Again “ first.

[icanthearyou 4,463]

I would encourage most people to turn away from religion and, follow Jesus. 

You can go back to "Christianity" once you feel and understand the love of Jesus.  You will not be so quick to judge, condemn, admire your own self righteousness. 

[icanthearyou 4,463]

1 minute ago, PUB78 said:

You must be “Born Again “ first.

By what authority?

 

[PUB78 1,362]

16 minutes ago, icanthearyou said:

By what authority?

 

The words of Jesus in John chapter 3

[Leftfield 2,654]

31 minutes ago, PUB78 said:

Yes, to their eternal destruction.

Eternal destruction of those who never had a choice.

For beings that supposedly have free will.

I want no part of that, but feel free to support a religion that condemns for no reason.

[icanthearyou 4,463]

30 minutes ago, PUB78 said:

The words of Jesus in John chapter 3

What does that actually mean?

[homersapien 11,440]

3 hours ago, jj3jordan said:

I would congratulate you on you Pyrrhic victory over me. What I think, however, has nothing to do with the ultimate outcome. I am happy to admit/refer to the New Testament regarding salvation or lack thereof. If being a Christian makes me irrational and extreme in homer’s world then I will gladly accept your label. I understand that you must do everything in your power to discredit Christianity. It is the only way to deal with your rejection of Jesus. I like revealing Biblical truth to you also. If it exposes your dangerous rejection of Jesus and perhaps in your latter days cracks open a door that allows your heart to soften to Jesus, then I’ll do it.🙏😇

First I didn't say I rejected Jesus.  I don't.  In fact, I respect his teachings more than I think you do.

What I reject is the notion one has to accept him as the "son of God", or literally burn in hell.

Furthermore, to believe other people - regardless of their merit,  religious beliefs or innocence - are going to burn in hell because they don't share your dogmatic beliefs is evil and dangerous. That's what makes you irrational and extreme.

Likewise I don't reject Christianity.  I reject self-described "Christians" like you.

Real Christians don't worry about their afterlife IMO.  They focus on living according to Christ's teachings and treating others accordingly.

Focusing on your afterlife - especially as the motivating factor of embracing Christianity - is a self-centered conceit. 

 

 

Edited May 18, 2023 by homersapien

[gr82be 14,466]

5 hours ago, homersapien said:

Cute.

Are you implying that any Muslims that remain Muslims until they die are going to Hell?

Based on my belief yes. That's why it's my belief and not theirs. Look, only one belief can be right and I have made my choice. It's not my call whether they go to hell or not but as a Christian I believe they will or else I wouldn't be a Christian, would I? We disagree and it's not the first time on this subject matter. I can tell you that I won't sell out to the worldly views that everyone is doing fine and dandy as long as they aren't evil. People have a choice to make as the gospel reaches into all corners of the earth. For some, this life is as close to heaven as they will get. For others it's as close to hell as they will get. We have the freedom of choice and free will. I can die today with my choice and I'm very comfortable saying that. 

[icanthearyou 4,463]

1 hour ago, PUB78 said:

Yes, to their eternal destruction.

Why would you follow such a god?

Does that sound like Jesus to you?  Does it sound typical of humans?

[Leftfield 2,654]

5 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Real Christians don't worry about their afterlife.  They are focused on living according to Christ's teachings and treating other's accordingly.

"He who controls the keys to Heaven has ultimate power."

[icanthearyou 4,463]

1 minute ago, gr82be said:

It's not my call whether they go to hell or not but as a Christian I believe they will or else I wouldn't be a Christian, would I?

I do not believe that is the proper motivation.  I think you are missing something very significant.

Not trying to be judgmental in the least but, I would think less about the bible and more about the love of Jesus.

[Leftfield 2,654]

5 minutes ago, gr82be said:

It's not my call whether they go to hell or not but as a Christian I believe they will or else I wouldn't be a Christian, would I?

But plenty of Christians don't believe that.

Why must anyone who doesn't believe be condemned, especially if they are ignorant of Jesus and who you define God to be? Does that sound like a fair and just God to you? If no one else can bring awareness to those people, why does God not reveal himself to them?

[gr82be 14,466]

5 minutes ago, icanthearyou said:

I do not believe that is the proper motivation.  I think you are missing something very significant.

Not trying to be judgmental in the least but, I would think less about the bible and more about the love of Jesus.

I am as in no one will enter the kingdom of Heaven except through Him (Jesus). Love and acceptance are two different things. He can love us and not accept our behavior. We can only serve one God so I can't willingly acknowledge that someone else may have another god and think that is good for them. I'm not hating on them. I'd rather pray for them even though they may not accept that line of thinking. 

[gr82be 14,466]

4 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

But plenty of Christians don't believe that.

Why must anyone who doesn't believe be condemned, especially if they are ignorant of Jesus and who you define God to be? Does that sound like a fair and just God to you? If no one else can bring awareness to those people, why does God not reveal himself to them?

The Christians I know certainly believe that spreading the Gospel into all corners of the earth is our responsibility. So yes, if they have heard of Jesus and that he is their personal Savior and then choose to reject Him then yes, they will go to Hell. If they are in the 3000 languages that do not have translated bible then I really don't know. That's why I put my money where my mouth is and contribute to that mission.

[Leftfield 2,654]

1 minute ago, gr82be said:

If they are in the 3000 languages that do not have translated bible then I really don't know. That's why I put my money where my mouth is and contribute to that mission.

I appreciate that. Truly, I do, but what does that mean for those that you and others can't reach in time? Why should they suffer simply because others chose to mission in other places?

[gr82be 14,466]

3 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

I appreciate that. Truly, I do, but what does that mean for those that you and others can't reach in time? Why should they suffer simply because others chose to mission in other places?

That's what we don't know and my wife and I have discussed many times. Not sure if they do because I don't believe in predestination like some Christians do. If predestination was a thing then Jesus wouldn't have had to die for us. 

[homersapien 11,440]

3 hours ago, AUDynasty said:

If it's true that you have to be a Christian in order to go to Heaven and that all other religious people are banished for eternity, then I don't want to go to Heaven when I die. And that's when it dawned on me. Jesus is love. God and Jesus represent love and kindness. 

When Christianity is first and foremost about personal "salvation", the fact non-Christians  are condemned to hell is the point.   It's a feature.

Living according to Christ's teachings?  That's way too hard! (Thus, the built in get-out-of-hell-free deathbed clause. Sweet huh?)

The whole religion is built on fear.  The beatitudes and other teachings of Christ are nice, but incidental.  Following them isn't really necessary as long as you "accept Christ as your savior".  (How many times have you heard, "we are all sinners"?)

Edited May 18, 2023 by homersapien