If we would only hold the makers of assault weapons to the same questioning...........

[AU9377 5,025]

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/01/31/meta-x-tiktok-snap-and-discord-confront-congress-eager-for-tighter-social-media-regulation-.html

[I_M4_AU 7,957]

Social media can cause mental illness (doubt in teens especially) and predators can and do take advantage of such mental illness social media creates.  Gun manufactures do not cause mental illness, but that illness can take advantage of a legal right to own a firearm.

[aubaseball 2,648]

Good one.   Equating social media apps that anyone can use  at any age to adults owning a firearm.   Why didn’t you throw in cell phone manufacturers, fast food, car manufacturers, Atv manufacturers and motorcycle manufacturers? 

[AU9377 5,025]

32 minutes ago, aubaseball said:

Good one.   Equating social media apps that anyone can use  at any age to adults owning a firearm.   Why didn’t you throw in cell phone manufacturers, fast food, car manufacturers, Atv manufacturers and motorcycle manufacturers? 

Does an app actually cause the harm or is it the human that uses the app?  Do underage people use firearms to harm people?  Is free speech not as important of a right as gun ownership?  Do you really believe that any platform wants to be used for bullying or any of a long list of bad acts?

I believe that they should be regulated in ways that forces them to be accountable.  However, why is it wrong to question the makers of an assault weapon in the same manner?  Is their product not used to kill innocent children? All I have heard for years is that gun regulations only impact good gun owners.  Do you believe that someone wanting to circumvent social media regulations couldn't do it rather easily?

Any real regulation over speech online will be met with a constitutional challenge.  How is it not free speech when someone says rude or unpleasant things about someone else?

I feel for those parents that lost a child because of online bullying or anything of that sort.  However, is it not the parent's obligation above all others to be aware of what their child is consuming online?  These are all real questions.

Edited February 1 by AU9377

[I_M4_AU 7,957]

27 minutes ago, AU9377 said:

Does an app actually cause the harm or is it the human that uses the app?

Does the gun kill people or is it the human that uses the gun? 

[CoffeeTiger 5,165]

2 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Does the gun kill people or is it the human that uses the gun? 

It's the human using the gun for the purpose it was built and designed for that kills people. 

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

4 hours ago, AU9377 said:

I believe that they should be regulated in ways that forces them to be accountable.  However, why is it wrong to question the makers of an assault weapon in the same manner? 

When you say "they," you are referring to social media apps, right?

Are you suggesting that gun manufacturers are not being regulated in ways that forces them to be accountable? In other words, neither social media apps nor gun manufacturers are regulated in ways that ensure accountability--is that your position?

Edited February 2 by NolaAuTiger

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

4 hours ago, AU9377 said:

Is their product not used to kill innocent children?

Yes. And it is, at the very least, possible for the parents of those children to hold a gun manufacturer liable. 

Yet, when the same harm is wrought via social media, parents have no recourse. 

[auburnatl1 5,010]

 

1 hour ago, CoffeeTiger said:

It's the human using the gun for the purpose it was built and designed for that kills people. 

The  person kills, the gun’s capability establishes the scale  of the body count.

[AU9377 5,025]

3 hours ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Yes. And it is, at the very least, possible for the parents of those children to hold a gun manufacturer liable. 

Yet, when the same harm is wrought via social media, parents have no recourse. 

Lawsuits against gun manufacturers are extremely difficult to bring.  They have a great deal of protection under the 2005  Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act.  

https://news.bloomberglaw.com/us-law-week/can-gun-makers-be-liable-in-mass-shootings

I am not against regulating social media platforms in some way.  My question is do they bear responsibility simply because they exist or do they have to fail to do something in order to be culpable? 

[AU9377 5,025]

3 hours ago, NolaAuTiger said:

When you say "they," you are referring to social media apps, right?

Are you suggesting that gun manufacturers are not being regulated in ways that forces them to be accountable? In other words, neither social media apps nor gun manufacturers are regulated in ways that ensure accountability--is that your position?

Yes, I was referring to social media apps.

What I think is clear is that both topics concern areas where there is a constitutional right established.  Freedom of Speech and the 2nd amendment's right to bear arms.  My initial question was seeking the opinion of others as to why the same people applauding the public dress down of social media companies in the Senate hearing would be angered by the same questions being asked to the manufacturers of assault weapons?

[aubiefifty 16,892]

the problem with guns is they are giving them to anyone. people that should never have a gun are getting them and this is a huge problem in my eyes.........

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

On 2/1/2024 at 9:48 PM, AU9377 said:

Lawsuits against gun manufacturers are extremely difficult to bring.  They have a great deal of protection under the 2005  Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act.  

https://news.bloomberglaw.com/us-law-week/can-gun-makers-be-liable-in-mass-shootings

I am not against regulating social media platforms in some way.  My question is do they bear responsibility simply because they exist or do they have to fail to do something in order to be culpable? 

My point is, you can bring those lawsuits nonetheless. State consumer protection laws are a good example. The same cannot be said of social media platforms. Granted, I don't think badgering Zuckerberg on national television solves anything; pointless clickbait in my opinion. 

If a gun manufacturer can be held liable under a typical state consumer protection law, I think a social media company should too. I haven't seen that happen, however. 

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

On 2/1/2024 at 9:55 PM, AU9377 said:

Yes, I was referring to social media apps.

What I think is clear is that both topics concern areas where there is a constitutional right established.  Freedom of Speech and the 2nd amendment's right to bear arms.  My initial question was seeking the opinion of others as to why the same people applauding the public dress down of social media companies in the Senate hearing would be angered by the same questions being asked to the manufacturers of assault weapons?

Subjecting social media companies to even half the number of regulations imposed on gun manufacturer's would be a solid start. I think that's what people want to see.

My solution would get shouted down by both sides, but here it is: Parents, don't give your children iphones. 

[arein0 977]

48 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Parents, don't give your children iphones. 

I agree with that 

[Mims44 1,889]

55 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Parents, don't give your children iphones. 

Agreed!

Give them droids!

[I_M4_AU 7,957]

On 2/1/2024 at 6:16 PM, CoffeeTiger said:

It's the human using the gun for the purpose it was built and designed for that kills people. 

The gun is an inanimate object, an app is not and, obviously, the app can change thought by the user.

[AU9377 5,025]

3 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

The gun is an inanimate object, an app is not and, obviously, the app can change thought by the user.

The app forces people to bully others when they use it to communicate?  The problem is human behavior.  The apps, when it comes to minors, are no different than a public wall that people write on.  Is destroying the wall the only solution to unkind things being written on the wall ? 

The truth is that kids are often very unkind to other kids.  It helps when parents raise their children in an atmosphere that deplores treating others disrespectfully, but even the best behaving young people can at times treat others badly.  Social media amplifies the voice when that happens, but even without it, it will happen.  The only real way to insulate a child from all danger is to keep them from all risks.  That, in itself, is wrought with consequences as well.

I am honestly not trying to be argumentative about this.  I am genuinely interested in differing solutions that people have.

[jj3jordan 2,059]

48 minutes ago, AU9377 said:

The app forces people to bully others when they use it to communicate?  The problem is human behavior.  The apps, when it comes to minors, are no different than a public wall that people write on.  Is destroying the wall the only solution to unkind things being written on the wall ? 

The truth is that kids are often very unkind to other kids.  It helps when parents raise their children in an atmosphere that deplores treating others disrespectfully, but even the best behaving young people can at times treat others badly.  Social media amplifies the voice when that happens, but even without it, it will happen.  The only real way to insulate a child from all danger is to keep them from all risks.  That, in itself, is wrought with consequences as well.

I am honestly not trying to be argumentative about this.  I am genuinely interested in differing solutions that people have.

Absolute truth 77. The problem is human behavior. 

[auburnatl1 5,010]

 I have a feeling our posters understand guns a whole lot more than they understand “apps”.

[I_M4_AU 7,957]

4 hours ago, AU9377 said:

The app forces people to bully others when they use it to communicate?  The problem is human behavior.  The apps, when it comes to minors, are no different than a public wall that people write on.  Is destroying the wall the only solution to unkind things being written on the wall ? 

The truth is that kids are often very unkind to other kids.  It helps when parents raise their children in an atmosphere that deplores treating others disrespectfully, but even the best behaving young people can at times treat others badly.  Social media amplifies the voice when that happens, but even without it, it will happen.  The only real way to insulate a child from all danger is to keep them from all risks.  That, in itself, is wrought with consequences as well.

I am honestly not trying to be argumentative about this.  I am genuinely interested in differing solutions that people have.

Yes, kids will and always have been cruel to their peers.  The only difference is social media allows these cruel kids spread their cruelty to people they don’t even know just because they can.  20 years ago these kids may have a couple of days to humiliate their subjects and it would be over.  Now, the cruelty can last a life time and the feed back they get really feeds the ego of these kids.

Their upbringing plays a big part of this and that is where is should start.

Really, this has nothing to do with gun manufacturers and it was a mistake to compare the two.  No, the app doesn’t *force* others to bully anybody, but it does allow the bullying to be much worse than before.  As mentioned above, it is a human behavior problem.

What ever happened to the EOs that Biden signed to eliminate bullying in schools?  If you don’t remember it was to teach *gender identity* to battle bullying.  How is that working; or was it just a way to get *gender identity* in our schools?

[DKW 86 7,440]

On 2/1/2024 at 5:16 PM, CoffeeTiger said:

It's the human using the gun for the purpose it was built and designed for that kills people. 

AAAnnnddd...30-40 years ago we had guns and no issues with mass shootings. The guns haven't changed, the people have. If you want to test for mental illness before selling a gun to someone, I will be your biggest supporter. If you want to add M4A and wildly alter Mental Illness Care, I will be your biggest supporter. What I expect is that NONE of that will happen or is even talked about.

[AUFAN78 3,926]

On 2/1/2024 at 1:22 PM, I_M4_AU said:

Social media can cause mental illness (doubt in teens especially) and predators can and do take advantage of such mental illness social media creates.  Gun manufactures do not cause mental illness, but that illness can take advantage of a legal right to own a firearm.

Yes indeed. 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7366944/

[auburnatl1 5,010]

12 hours ago, DKW 86 said:

AAAnnnddd...30-40 years ago we had guns and no issues with mass shootings. The guns haven't changed, the people have. If you want to test for mental illness before selling a gun to someone, I will be your biggest supporter. If you want to add M4A and wildly alter Mental Illness Care, I will be your biggest supporter. What I expect is that NONE of that will happen or is even talked about.

Columbine (which was before social media) let the crazy genie out of the bottle. Countless copy cats from there. Add to that “responsible gun owners” are convinced that they need 50 round clips to bag a deer or stop an intruder (shooting lessons maybe?) and you have the current 1 crazy = 20-40 deaths math.

[I_M4_AU 7,957]

50 minutes ago, auburnatl1 said:

Columbine (which was before social media) let the crazy genie out of the bottle. Countless copy cats from there. Add to that “responsible gun owners” are convinced that they need 50 round clips to bag a deer or stop an intruder (shooting lessons maybe?) and you have the current 1 crazy = 20-40 deaths math.

Columbine happened 25 years ago so DKW’s point stands.  Columbine was a watershed moment is school shootings, but the focus has been on the gun because it is the easiest thing to blame without dealing with the underlying mental health of the individual committing the crime.  Is the mental health issue even being addressed?  A lot of these gun incidents are due to bullying and gun incidences at schools have skyrocketed in 2018 and beyond, which is definitely in the socal media age.

https://www.security.org/blog/a-timeline-of-school-shootings-since-columbine/

We have a lot of anti-bullying programs in schools, but for some reason are not taken seriously.

 

Edited February 6 by I_M4_AU