Howard Dean is a LIAR!

[Tigermike 3,425]

But Dean is more than a liberal, he is a liar and a narcissist. So if he is nominated, it's going to be long, long year.

I think she has him pegged.

The latest example: Last August, the Quad-City Times of Davenport, Iowa, circulated a questionnaire to the Democratic candidates for president. The paper asked the candidates to complete the following sentence: "My closest living relative in the armed services is …" Dean wrote: "My brother is a POW/MIA in Laos, but is almost certainly dead." In point of fact, Dean's brother Charles, whose remains have recently been returned from Laos, was not in the armed services. He was a tourist, visiting Laos as part of a one-year world tour. The Quad-City Times editorially expressed dismay at Dean's mendacity. Instead of apologizing for misleading readers, Dean dashed off an indignant letter to the editor.

Duhhhhhhh, did he think no one would check this out?

http://www.creators.com/opinion_show.cfm?columnsName=mch

[Jenny AU-92 0]

A lot of veterans groups got really mad when full military honors were provided for the return of his brother's remains too. Civilians do not typically receive an honor guard.

[Ranger12 46]

That makes me sick to my stomach.

[MDM4AU 337]

What a Jack-Ass!

[CShine 0]

Charles Dean, although a civilian, was considered by the U.S. government to have been a prisoner of war. The effort to recover the bodies of Dean and Sharman was coordinated by the Defense Department's Joint Task Force Full Accounting, a Pentagon unit created 11 years ago to find remains of Americans missing in Indochina.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,103419,00.html

[MDM4AU 337]

Charles Dean, although a civilian, was considered by the U.S. government to have been a prisoner of war. The effort to recover the bodies of Dean and Sharman was coordinated by the Defense Department's Joint Task Force Full Accounting, a Pentagon unit created 11 years ago to find remains of Americans missing in Indochina.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,103419,00.html

That still doesn't change the fact that he lied about his brother and his military action.

PEMBROKE, N.H., Dec. 22 — Howard Dean came under criticism from an Iowa newspaper last weekend for an answer to a questionnaire in which he implied that his brother was serving in the military when he disappeared in Laos 29 years ago. His brother had been traveling in Southeast Asia as a tourist.

Asked by The Quad-City Times, which is based in Davenport, Iowa, to complete the sentence "My closest living relative in the armed services is," Dr. Dean wrote in August, "My brother is a POW/MIA in Laos, but is almost certainly dead."

[AUloggerhead 2,356]

A lot of veterans groups got really mad when full military honors were provided for the return of his brother's remains too.  Civilians do not typically receive an honor guard.

All true. But in this case, the fact that Charles Dean's remains were recovered just a month ago and that his brother is currently running for president is purely coincidental. C. Dean's background of not being in the military and his anti-war stance shouldn't be held against him. Even his naive choice to travel/see the world beginning in communist-controlled SE Asia in 1974(!) can't excuse the fact that he was wrongly detained & then murdered. The decision to label him a POW/MIA wasn't his, or even Howie's.

However (back to the original point of this thread,) the decision to associate C. Dean with "my closest living relative in the armed forces" on a seemingly innocuous presidential candidates' questionnaire IS Howie's. And it is a troubling decision on his part because it calls into question his veracity. And it raises further questions about his qualifications to hold the highest office in the land if he can't even answer a simple question about his past. For instance, here is a transcript of an interview that Howie had with Tim Russert Link:

MR. RUSSERT: Let me turn to a Boston Globe article about the military service during the Vietnam War as it applies to you and I'll put it on the screen. "Dean did not serve in the military during the Vietnam War because he received a medical deferment for an unfused vertebra in his back. Several articles in the last year have noted that after his deferment, Dean spent 80 days skiing in Aspen, Colorado."

And then The Aspen Times wrote this profile. "In Howard Dean, we could have a president who spent the winter of 1971-72...pounding bumps on Aspen Mountain. 'I paid $250 for a ski pass and skied 80 days on Ajax. It was the greatest mountain. ... I went to work pouring concrete for a small company.'"

Why were you able to ski on Ajax Mountain, pounding your back, and pouring concrete, and not serve in the military?

DR. DEAN: First of all, let me say that there's only one person who's contending for the Democratic nominee for president who did serve in the military, nomination for president, and then let me explain the circumstances of my draft classification. I went to my physical in Ft. Hamilton in Brooklyn, which was a great deal like the scene out of Alice's Restaurant in terms of the different sizes, shapes, colors, and all kinds of people were there. I was given an examination. I had a previous back problem, which is evidently congenital, which prevented me from doing any sustained running, a problem that I've had since then, since that time, which requires that when I get out of the car I often have some pains up and down my leg and back and so forth.

But I have been able to exercise at--ry vigorous athletic life except for some things. One of those is long-distance running, which is how the problem came to my attention in the first place. I noticed the pain when I was in high school running track. In any case, the--after the physical, I received a one Y deferment. That's how the United States government decided that they would use me. One Y deferment means you can only be called in times of national emergency. I didn't have anything to do with choosing any draft deferment. I didn't try to get out of the draft. I had a physical. The United States government said this is your classification. I'm not responsible for that. I didn't have anything to do with the decision. That was their choice.

When I read that, I get the impression that Dean didn't have anything to do with his draft status, ... that it was the military that discovered his back problem and thus, decided he COULDN'T serve even if he wanted to. If you dig a little deeper you discover that this isn't the case at all. Dean showed up at his physical with X-rays and a letter from a doctor to buttress his desire to NOT serve at all. Then he took his 1Y deferment and spent the next winter as a ski bum in Aspen -- placing concrete in the summer months and skiing the bumps down Ajax Mtn in the winter.

Tell me again, ... how is Howie supposed to stand up to the Osamas & Kim Il-Jongs of the world without possessing a functional spine?

[DKW 86 7,726]

Shades of AlGore here.

[Donutboy 0]

Shades of AlGore here.

Not quite like Dubya though. Dubya got an assignment based on political leverage and then abandoned that. Al Gore did serve in Vietnam, even if it was as a reporter. Dubya couldn't even honor his commitment stateside and was AWOL for his final years of service. If not for his family's political clout, he'd have been tried for desertion. This is the guy questioning other people's patriotism today and you wonder why so many people don't like him.

[AUloggerhead 2,356]

Shades of AlGore here.

Not quite like Dubya though. Dubya got an assignment based on political leverage and then abandoned that. Al Gore did serve in Vietnam, even if it was as a reporter. Dubya couldn't even honor his commitment stateside and was AWOL for his final years of service. If not for his family's political clout, he'd have been tried for desertion. This is the guy questioning other people's patriotism today and you wonder why so many people don't like him.

This thread is supposed to be about Dean and his disturbing habit of stretching the truth, or omitting crucial facts about the whole truth.

Your chronic claims that 'Dubya went AWOL' have been shown to be such a preposterous lie so many times already (Jenny's post is the one that I remember most) that I would think you would be ashamed to continue to post this blatant untruth. There are many smart people posting on this board -- I doubt if any one of them is stupid enough to fall for that tried & true Nazi/Communist tactic of, "repeat a lie often enough and people will start believing it." C'mon Donutboy. Get with the program.

[Donutboy 0]

Shades of AlGore here.

Not quite like Dubya though. Dubya got an assignment based on political leverage and then abandoned that. Al Gore did serve in Vietnam, even if it was as a reporter. Dubya couldn't even honor his commitment stateside and was AWOL for his final years of service. If not for his family's political clout, he'd have been tried for desertion. This is the guy questioning other people's patriotism today and you wonder why so many people don't like him.

This thread is supposed to be about Dean and his disturbing habit of stretching the truth, or omitting crucial facts about the whole truth.

Your chronic claims that 'Dubya went AWOL' have been shown to be such a preposterous lie so many times already (Jenny's post is the one that I remember most) that I would think you would be ashamed to continue to post this blatant untruth. There are many smart people posting on this board -- I doubt if any one of them is stupid enough to fall for that tried & true Nazi/Communist tactic of, "repeat a lie often enough and people will start believing it." C'mon Donutboy. Get with the program.

Oh yeah? The truth hurts, doesn't it?

THE TRUTH ABOUT BUSH'S MILITARY SERVICE RECORD

[AUloggerhead 2,356]

As brief as I can be: GWB left the service with an Honorable Discharge. Someone who's AWOL has to be given a Dishonorable Discharge.

The truth only "hurts" when you're unused to seeing it.

[DKW 86 7,726]

Shades of AlGore here.

Not quite like Dubya though. Dubya got an assignment based on political leverage and then abandoned that. Al Gore did serve in Vietnam, even if it was as a reporter. Dubya couldn't even honor his commitment stateside and was AWOL for his final years of service. If not for his family's political clout, he'd have been tried for desertion. This is the guy questioning other people's patriotism today and you wonder why so many people don't like him.

My point was Gore's habit of stetching the truth, not Gore's service record. I think he had a pretty good service record for a REPORTER for Stars and Stripes. Afterall, he had to lead that security detachment that his Dad had follow him around all through Vietnam. No other reporter had armed escorts in-country.

But the point was about Gore and his Gorisms.

[Tiger Al 0]

Shades of AlGore here.

Not quite like Dubya though. Dubya got an assignment based on political leverage and then abandoned that. Al Gore did serve in Vietnam, even if it was as a reporter. Dubya couldn't even honor his commitment stateside and was AWOL for his final years of service. If not for his family's political clout, he'd have been tried for desertion. This is the guy questioning other people's patriotism today and you wonder why so many people don't like him.

This thread is supposed to be about Dean and his disturbing habit of stretching the truth, or omitting crucial facts about the whole truth.

Your chronic claims that 'Dubya went AWOL' have been shown to be such a preposterous lie so many times already (Jenny's post is the one that I remember most) that I would think you would be ashamed to continue to post this blatant untruth. There are many smart people posting on this board -- I doubt if any one of them is stupid enough to fall for that tried & true Nazi/Communist tactic of, "repeat a lie often enough and people will start believing it." C'mon Donutboy. Get with the program.

Oh yeah? The truth hurts, doesn't it?

THE TRUTH ABOUT BUSH'S MILITARY SERVICE RECORD

What a pathetic little priss.

[War Eagle 96 10]

please let dean be nominated;please let dean be nominated;please let dean be nominated;please let dean be nominated;please let dean be nominated;please let dean be nominated;please let dean be nominated;please let dean be nominated;please let dean be nominated;please let dean be nominated;please let dean be nominated!

[Jenny AU-92 0]

Dubya couldn't even honor his commitment stateside and was AWOL for his final years of service. If not for his family's political clout, he'd have been tried for desertion.

:roll: You are so clueless it is not funny. How many times does this have to be refuted for you to grasp the simple truth that GWB was never AWOL? He would not have received an honorable discharge if he had ever been AWOL at any point in his term of service. He was released from his term of service seven months early - this was not a release that was unique to him or smacked of special privilege - it was routine. And your last statement is just a total and complete fabrication - his family's clout had nothing to do with anything, and there was no way he would have ever been tried for desertion. That is one of the more assinine comments you have ever made, and there have been plenty. As you repeatedly demonstrate, you obviously know NOTHING about how the military works. With as many current and former military personnel as we have on this board, one would think you would have learned by now that this is not a safe area in which you can spout off and not get called for the stupidity of your comments. :roll:

Democrats never seemed to have a problem with Clinton, who left this country to avoid service, and then protested against the war in a foreign country. This makes Clinton more honorable? "Oh, he was a conscientious objector..." Bull crap. He just avoided service altogether!! As did Howard Dean. Bottom line, GWB served - just because he never saw combat does not diminish this fact. Bush learned to fly a jet fighter plane - he didn't get that skill by relying on his name or special privilege - no one flew the plane for him. HE learned to fly. I think that also speaks as to his intelligence - leaning to fly in general is not a cakewalk - learning to fly a fighter is a billion times more difficult.

My father was in the Air Force during Vietnam, and flew in and out of Hickam Air Base in Hawaii as part of the crew for the Airborne Command Post. He and my mother spent three years there - not exactly a tough tour of duty - and my dad never saw combat - he never set foot in Vietnam. And then in 1970 he decided not to re-enlist so he could go to college - at Auburn. The war was still going on, but Dad got out. Guess that diminishes his service as well?

[Tigermike 3,425]

Dubya couldn't even honor his commitment stateside and was AWOL for his final years of service. If not for his family's political clout, he'd have been tried for desertion.

:roll: You are so clueless it is not funny. How many times does this have to be refuted for you to grasp the simple truth that GWB was never AWOL?

And your last statement is just a total and complete fabrication.

That is one of the more assinine comments you have ever made, and there have been plenty.

.

As you repeatedly demonstrate, you obviously know NOTHING about how the military works. With as many current and former military personnel as we have on this board, one would think you would have learned by now that this is not a safe area in which you can spout off and not get called for the stupidity of your comments. :roll:

Democrats never seemed to have a problem with Clinton, who left this country to avoid service, and then protested against the war in a foreign country. This makes Clinton more honorable? "Oh, he was a conscientious objector..." Bull crap. He just avoided service altogether!! As did Howard Dean. Bottom line, GWB served - just because he never saw combat does not diminish this fact. Bush learned to fly a jet fighter plane - he didn't get that skill by relying on his name or special privilege - no one flew the plane for him. HE learned to fly. I think that also speaks as to his intelligence - leaning to fly in general is not a cakewalk - learning to fly a fighter is a billion times more difficult.

My father was in the Air Force during Vietnam, and flew in and out of Hickam Air Base in Hawaii as part of the crew for the Airborne Command Post. He and my mother spent three years there - not exactly a tough tour of duty - and my dad never saw combat - he never set foot in Vietnam. And then in 1970 he decided not to re-enlist so he could go to college - at Auburn. The war was still going on, but Dad got out. Guess that diminishes his service as well?

Hey Donut,

Oh yeah? The truth hurts, doesn't it?

[TitanTiger 20,708]

Jenny, that's not fair. Donut has a hard time grasping facts. He's much more comfortable dealing with the irrational and repetitive rantings of rabid left-wing lunatics and Bush haters. You're not giving him a fighting chance. Please try to be more considerate by confining your arguments to those of an unreasonable and uninformed nature.

[Jenny AU-92 0]

Jenny, that's not fair. Donut has a hard time grasping facts. He's much more comfortable dealing with the irrational and repetitive rantings of rabid left-wing lunatics and Bush haters. You're not giving him a fighting chance. Please try to be more considerate by confining your arguments to those of an unreasonable and uninformed nature.

You are right, TT - my apologies. I am appropriately chastened. Shan't happen again... :roll:

[War Eagle 96 10]

Shan't