aujeff11 6,243 Posted August 30, 2016 Author Share Posted August 30, 2016 44 minutes ago, Mims44 said: It is impossible for me to know (or anyone else) what a man who died so long ago would think or say if he had been around experiencing all that has happened from his death day to today. Nobody knows 100 percent but the odds are leaning to one side. Don't play dumb and say there is no relevance in what Kaepernick did as compared to what Robinson said though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aujeff11 6,243 Posted August 30, 2016 Author Share Posted August 30, 2016 10 minutes ago, Mims44 said: So now you haven't seen or read the tons of "blatant disrespect! kick him out of the country!" Or any of the other myriad of different responses easily construed as people being against protesting in any way they dislike (which is whatever way people protest). I said "most" not "all," genius... Why do you have such a hard time with intrepreting qualifiers? Based on this thread, I see no proof that the posters here think "people should not protest in general" which is exactly what you said. Even NC1407 said last week he'd fly the "distress flag" if the government tried to snatch up his land. Maybe specifically, people feel the flag is sacred, but again, your claim is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aujeff11 6,243 Posted August 30, 2016 Author Share Posted August 30, 2016 Basketball legend Kareem Abdul-Jabbar weighed inon the controversy surrounding Colin Kaepernick's decision to sit during the national anthem, in an op-ed published today in The Washington Post, portraying his protest as "highly patriotic." "What should horrify Americans is not Kaepernick’s choice to remain seated during the national anthem, but that nearly 50 years after [Muhammad] Ali was banned from boxing for his stance and Tommie Smith and John Carlos’s raised fists caused public ostracization and numerous death threats, we still need to call attention to the same racial inequities," Abdul-Jabbar wrote, referring to prominent protests by black athletes that were once considered controversial but have since become iconic symbols of the U.S. civil rights movement. Abdul-Jabbar's defense of Kaepernick comes amid growing backlash against the quarterback's actions. Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump said Monday that "maybe [Kaepernick] should find a country that works better for him," and fans posted videos of themselves burning Kaepernick jerseys and other memorabilia on social media. Abdul-Jabbar — an NBA Hall of Fame center who played for the Milwaukee Bucks and Los Angeles Lakers and holds the league record for points scored, blocks and MVP awards — certainly adds prestige to those defending Kaepernick's protest. JohnnyOncomingStorm/YouTube A homemade Colin Kaepernick shirt burns in a video posted to YouTube on Aug. 27, 2016 titled, "49ers Colin Kaepernick Jersey Burning!!"more + Previously, Kaepernick's most vocal defenders were activists like Black Lives Matter advocate and New York Daily News columnist Shaun King. The retired NBA star, 69, noted in his piece the financial risk that Kaepernick took by speaking up for his beliefs and compared him to Army Reserve 2nd Lt. Sam Kendricks, who, while competing in the Rio Olympics, stopped short while pole vaulting to honor the national anthem. Abdul-Jabbar wrote that both athletes made a sacrifice. "What makes an act truly patriotic and not just lip-service is when it involves personal risk or sacrifice. Both Kendricks and Kaepernick chose to express their patriotism publicly because they felt that inspiring others was more important than the personal cost," he said. He portrayed the matter as a nonpartisan issue, suggesting that a discussion around Kaepernick comes amid "Trump and [Hillary] Clinton supporters each righteously claiming ownership of the 'most patriotic' label." Abdul-Jabbar is no stranger to commenting on political matters and is widely regarded as liberal. He regularly contributes opinion pieces on issues of race and religion to The Washington Post and The Huffington Post. He disappointed some progressives by endorsing Clinton before the New York primary in April in an op-ed for The Washington Post in which he praised Sanders' "dedication to the welfare of all Americans" but said he preferred Clinton, whom he called a proven warrior." Bettmann Archive/GettyImages Bill Russell, left, Cassius Clay and Lew Alcindor, later Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, speak at a press conference rejecting US Army induction, June 1967.more + Abdul-Jabbar was born in New York City and emerged as a high school basketball star there. In 1967, Abdul-Jabbar, then known as Lew Alcindor, participated in what is known as the Ali summit, a news conference lending support to Ali's rejection of his military induction and conscientious objection to the Vietnam War. NBA legend Bill Russell and NFL star Jim Brown were among the news conference's other notable attendees. New York Knicks star Carmelo Anthony referred to Ali in an Instagram post in July, after the police shooting deaths of Alton Sterling and Philando Castile, calling for fellow athletes to "step up" and "demand change." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AURaptor 1,122 Posted August 30, 2016 Share Posted August 30, 2016 Then blame Democrats .its their failed policies that's kept us divided as a country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanTiger 20,479 Posted August 30, 2016 Share Posted August 30, 2016 53 minutes ago, aujeff11 said: Most of the posters I've seen on here have said" he had the right to do it but he is an idiot." I think the two points are covered right there. What's the issue? It seems from their subsequent arguments that "he has the right" simply means, "it's not illegal." Many seem to be arguing that one should never protest in this way (sitting during the anthem) because it's disrespectful, regardless of the rationale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aujeff11 6,243 Posted August 31, 2016 Author Share Posted August 31, 2016 46 minutes ago, TitanTiger said: It seems from their subsequent arguments that "he has the right" simply means, "it's not illegal." Many seem to be arguing that one should never protest in this way (sitting during the anthem) because it's disrespectful, regardless of the rationale. It's fine if they truly think he disrespected America or the flag. I don't agree with it but whatever floats their boat. When the prohibition of flag desecration was passed, of all people, the Vietnam veterans were pissed, because according to them, they fought for the constitutional rights, not for a cloth. Nobody has denounced what Ali or Robinson said as disrespectful though. Which is my issue. Are we hung up on that Kaepernick was only a second string QB and a douche at that, and people are dismissing his claims as disrespectful only because they think he wants attention? Is the issue that people think black Americans are no longer under oppression so Kaepernick is disrespecting the flag by using it as a prop to bring light to his false agendas? The reaction has been less than consistent this far. In a way, I feel for Kaepernick, because, if by chance, his protest was sincere, people are writing it off for heinous reasons other than why his personal reasons were flawed. I can understand if people think just saying "oppression" is too vague. Say that, Dont say, ""Colon" is a douche, so he says douche things. Hell, even if he was/ is a douche, that doesnt meant that one shouldn't look within the substance of his claims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexava 6,973 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 I would have less problem if he sat quietly and then was asked why he didn't stand. I understand he sat three games and no one noticed until he mentioned it to the media. If I have that wrong correct me. If this is correct he does want attention. He must take the good with the bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AURaptor 1,122 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 So we're to assume that Colin will never stand for the national anthem of this country ever again. Apparently nothing has changed in the last 50-60 years. And since he has no real solutions, other than ' stop oppressing " , what ever the hell that even means, he's just gonna pout, mope and whine. Such a patriot ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest NC1406 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 2 hours ago, aujeff11 said: I said "most" not "all," genius... Why do you have such a hard time with intrepreting qualifiers? Based on this thread, I see no proof that the posters here think "people should not protest in general" which is exactly what you said. Even NC1407 said last week he'd fly the "distress flag" if the government tried to snatch up his land. Maybe specifically, people feel the flag is sacred, but again, your claim is wrong. It was NC1406 not 1407. Would never have wanted to run that last tenth of a mile. The "distress flag" is not a statement of disrespect, it is a statement that we have been over ran and are under distress. This young man has the right to protest, I promise to remind all that support him the next time they complain about the tea party protesters. Not sure why the word "even" was required in that statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanTiger 20,479 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 56 minutes ago, alexava said: I would have less problem if he sat quietly and then was asked why he didn't stand. I understand he sat three games and no one noticed until he mentioned it to the media. If I have that wrong correct me. If this is correct he does want attention. He must take the good with the bad. I don't know where that narrative got started, but it isn't true. Some media outlets noticed that he sat during the anthem and asked him about it. I believe ProFootBallTalk was the first to mention it and at the time, there was no statement from Kaepernick as to why: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/08/27/kaepernick-sits-during-national-anthem/ He later spoke with NFL.com about it: http://ftw.usatoday.com/2016/08/colin-kaepernick-49ers-national-anthem-sit-explains Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest NC1406 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 Anyone remember when Jim McMahon was fined for headbands.......man we have come a long way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AURaptor 1,122 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 24 minutes ago, NC1406 said: Anyone remember when Jim McMahon was fined for headbands.......man we have come a long way. Yeah... backwards. We really do need to make America great again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlueVue 177 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 13 hours ago, TitanTiger said: It seems from their subsequent arguments that "he has the right" simply means, "it's not illegal." Many seem to be arguing that one should never protest in this way (sitting during the anthem) because it's disrespectful, regardless of the rationale. I'm looking at it from an entirely different point of view. The 49ers is a business organization that fields a product to win and to entertain their customers. CK is a part of that product for better or worse for which he is being paid $11.8 million guaranteed this season even if he gets cut. Despite his enormous salary and good fortune, he has caused a negative distraction to achieving the goals of the organization. Actions have consequences and he's done this to himself. I could not possibly care less what CK thinks politically and I'm betting a good portion of the Niner fan base doesn't either. I would cut him today if I was in their player personnel dept for reasons stated and his politics have nothing to do with it. Besides, he was a flash in the pan anyway and, based on his current lack of production, he is arguably the most overpaid player in the league. When this is the kind of fan reaction you get.....that's not good. Loyal fans are much more important than CK political stunts. http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2016/08/29/fans-burn-jerseys-after-nfls--refuses-to-stand-for-national-anthem-n2211460 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aujeff11 6,243 Posted August 31, 2016 Author Share Posted August 31, 2016 9 minutes ago, TheBlueVue said: I'm looking at it from an entirely different point of view. The 49ers is a business organization that fields a product to win and to entertain their customers. CK is a part of that product for better or worse for which he is being paid $11.8 million guaranteed this season even if he gets cut. Despite his enormous salary and good fortune, he has caused a negative distraction to achieving the goals of the organization. Actions have consequences and he's done this to himself. I could not possibly care less what CK thinks politically and I'm betting a good portion of the Niner fan base doesn't either. I would cut him today if I was in their player personnel dept for reasons stated and his politics have nothing to do with it. Besides, he was a flash in the pan anyway and, based on his current lack of production, he is arguably the most overpaid player in the league. When this is the kind of fan reaction you get.....that's not good. Loyal fans are much more important than CK political stunts. http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2016/08/29/fans-burn-jerseys-after-nfls--refuses-to-stand-for-national-anthem-n2211460 Your entire POV is one giant red herring. Being a star QB or not doesn't matter. None of it matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aujeff11 6,243 Posted August 31, 2016 Author Share Posted August 31, 2016 11 hours ago, NC1406 said: ot sure why the word "even" was required in that statement. Poor usage of words on my part. I was just giving an example that posters here are not against the idea of protest in general if they feel it is warranted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlueVue 177 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 1 minute ago, aujeff11 said: 1 minute ago, aujeff11 said: Your entire POV is one giant red herring. Being a star QB or not doesn't matter. None of it matters. Your entire POV is one giant red herring. Being a star QB or not doesn't matter. None of it matters. I'm betting he gets cut. We'll see whose right. Like many liberals, you want to make the episode into more than what it is. Bottom line its an unnecessary and very negative distraction the organization doesn't need and probably wont abide.. If he was a star, which he definitely is NOT, he might get some slack. I wont be surprised if he isn't with the team on opening day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aujeff11 6,243 Posted August 31, 2016 Author Share Posted August 31, 2016 3 minutes ago, TheBlueVue said: I'm betting he gets cut. We'll see whose right Are you dense Who cares if he gets cut? That's another red herring. He was destined to be traded or cut any day now. His team doesn't like it but that is the nature of the beast. Players can go through a whole year of contract talks and contract holdouts. It happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanTiger 20,479 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 5 minutes ago, TheBlueVue said: I'm betting he gets cut. We'll see whose right. He was likely to get cut regardless of his outward shows of patriotism, or lack thereof. It has everything to do with his play on the field. So while you may be right about him getting cut, it won't be about sitting during the national anthem. 5 minutes ago, TheBlueVue said: Like many liberals, you want to make the episode into more than what it is. Bottom line its an unnecessary and very negative distraction the organization doesn't need and probably wont abide.. If he was a star, which he definitely is NOT, he might get some slack. I wont be surprised if he isn't with the team on opening day. Can you stop labeling people? You are almost always wrong because you make ridiculous assumptions based on one or two data points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlueVue 177 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 4 minutes ago, aujeff11 said: Are you dense Who cares if he gets cut? That's another red herring. He was destined to be traded or cut any day now. His team doesn't like it but that is the nature of the beast. Players can go through a whole year of contract talks and contract holdouts. It happens. No he wasn't destined for anything. They're paying dude $11.8 million and he doesn't represent that kind of value on the field and definitely not off the field. He may have made the roster this year but I guarantee you nobody is going to trade sh*t for him. He'll get an unconditional release and his career is more than likely over. It happens,. you're right, he just expedited the process and effectively branded himself an undesirable. Organizations notice this kind of behavior don't kid yourself. ' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlueVue 177 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 6 minutes ago, TitanTiger said: He was likely to get cut regardless of his outward shows of patriotism, or lack thereof. It has everything to do with his play on the field. So while you may be right about him getting cut, it won't be about sitting during the national anthem. Can you stop labeling people? You are almost always wrong because you make ridiculous assumptions based on one or two data points. No I wont. I'm not wrong. Sure the organization will say cutting him had nothing to do with his political stunt but it didn't help his case. I'm not wrong. He was not likely to be anything. He's been their starter bro for several years and had injuries last year that kept him out of the line up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aujeff11 6,243 Posted August 31, 2016 Author Share Posted August 31, 2016 6 minutes ago, TheBlueVue said: No he wasn't destined for anything. They're paying dude $11.8 million and he doesn't represent that kind of value on the field and definitely not off the field. He may have made the roster this year but I guarantee you nobody is going to trade sh*t for him. He'll get an unconditional release and his career is more than likely over. It happens,. you're right, he just expedited the process and effectively branded himself an undesirable. Organizations notice this kind of behavior don't kid yourself. ' You are completely missing the gigantic point. Please stop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlueVue 177 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 Just now, aujeff11 said: You are completely missing the gigantic point. Please stop OK that's probably because I'm looking at it from a business point of view and not a political one. Nobody GAS about CK politics but you. and a few others in here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanTiger 20,479 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 2 minutes ago, TheBlueVue said: No I wont. I'm not wrong. Yes, you are. Over half the time you start tossing out political labels and you're laughably off base. 2 minutes ago, TheBlueVue said: Sure the organization will say cutting him had nothing to do with his political stunt but it didn't help his case. I'm not wrong. He was not likely to be anything. He's been their starter bro for several years and had injuries last year that kept him out of the line up. Poppycock. He was almost certain to be cut no matter what, because he's expensive and not producing. Simple as that. It's been a huge topic of conversation for months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlueVue 177 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 1 minute ago, TitanTiger said: Yes, you are. Over half the time you start tossing out political labels and you're laughably off base. Poppycock. He was almost certain to be cut no matter what, because he's expensive and not producing. Simple as that. It's been a huge topic of conversation for months. There was absolutely NO talk of cutting him before last weekend...NONE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanTiger 20,479 Posted August 31, 2016 Share Posted August 31, 2016 1 minute ago, TheBlueVue said: There was absolutely NO talk of cutting him before last weekend...NONE You're a dope. They were talking about cutting him earlier this year, but once April 1st came, his salary was guaranteed and cutting him would have made no financial sense. Then there were heated attempts to trade him away, but there wasn't any interest beyond some talks with Denver, and Denver wanted him to take a pay cut. If it weren't for the salary cap hit the 49ers would have likely have let him go already. Educate yourself. The team has been trying to get rid of him for months before any of this ever happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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