A Medical View of the 'Spice' Situation

[passthebiscuits 6,889]

The purpose of this post is not to open old wounds. I have resisted posting until I accurately composed my thoughts about the situation. As a disclaimer, I work as an emergency room physician locally. So, in danger of preaching to the choir, here goes:

• I found an email today that I've been searching for. It's dated June 2010 from the CDC in Atlanta. It was sent to our emergency room in Opelika and to Tuscaloosa. It serves notice that many of our college aged students were visiting local ERs with symptoms that were a bit unusual. It turns out that these kids were smoking 'Spice.' It accounted some of the symptoms that these patients could exhibit. It could cause "anxiety, hallucinations, rapid heart beat (tachycardia), vomiting, tremors, or even seizures." According to the CDC, less than a handful of patients visited Eds nationally in 2009, but in 2010 there were over 2000 visits. (Remember that these are just ER visits, let alone the patients actually smoking the stuff that didn't seek medical attention.) Spice was referred to as 'Fire and Ice', 'Spice Diamond,' 'Santana Fire' and 'Solar Flare' by other campuses. The chemical makeup was JWH-018 and JWH-073. These chemicals are similar to TCH, the active ingredient in marijuana but "could go undetected in common ER drug screens."
  

POINT: This was a national problem, and at the very least, a college problem (including BAMA), NOT an Auburn only problem. To suggest that there was a prevalence in Auburn (where "half the team" smoked the stuff) was an error in our schools ability to curb the problem-- is laughable if it weren't such an inflammatory statement.

1. Spice gave about a 30-45 minute high, to varying degrees, followed by no hangover effect. Once the spice wore off, effects were over.
   

POINT: Even IF the students were smoking spice, the suggestion is by ESPN: The Magazine that our players were rampantly smoking the stuff and affecting their play on the field. I don't see how this could be the case.

1. I don't understand how, realistically, Bama could enforce things so much better than Auburn, given the chemical makeup of the drug. Here are the possibilities: a) Bama somehow had better scientists to somehow test it better. b)Bama players were so scared to take Spice that they just didn't partake of the stuff (again, noting that the CDC saw a spike in the number of patients in Tuscaloosa that were smoking it). c)Bama players smoked Spice but either got away with it, didn't test for it, or had someone cover the results up.
   

POINT: I don't know which one of these options is the truth…but I have some theories. For a ground-breaking 6 month investigation, how about a real journalist finding the answer? It would blow the lid off of college football. Calling S.Roberts…wait, I need a real journalist.

1. Did we mention that Spice was legal? So if drinking beer is also legal and can give you a high, but you drink it on your own time and cause no trouble, is it so wrong for a 21 year old to drink it? Ok, if it's a team rule, and sounds like we didn't want our kids to smoke it, then we needed a way to figure out how to test it…which we did. We needed to notify parents…which we did.
   

POINT: The students who committed the crime need to hold themselves accountable, not the effects of spice or the apparent lack of a test to check for it. We all know this, but apparently ESPN doesn't.

Thanks for allowing me to vent. Carry on.

[Mikey 16,781]

Nice post, and informative. Thanks.

[cptau 169]

the UAT reference that ESPN made what just another slap at Auburn. Good ole ESPN probably called UAT said they were doing a hit story on Auburn about Spice, K2, etc. and asked UAT if they tested for the stuff in the fall of 2010. UAT probably said, sure we did. RIght, UAT was testing for a drug that was legal, not against NCAA rules, and there was no accurate test available to them.

[AuburnDad 0]

Deny the charges and shift the blame. That fixes everything.

[Eagle Flight 0]

the UAT reference that ESPN made what just another slap at Auburn. Good ole ESPN probably called UAT said they were doing a hit story on Auburn about Spice, K2, etc. and asked UAT if they tested for the stuff in the fall of 2010. UAT probably said, sure we did. RIght, UAT was testing for a drug that was legal, not against NCAA rules, and there was no accurate test available to them.

Redwood Labs did come out with a test in 2010, and LSU and Alabama were using it then. They only have 10-15 schools that use them, and the other 100-110 in FBS all use Aegis, including us. What ESPN could have mentioned is 1) we were 3rd to use the test in the SEC,2) at the start of the 2012 season 12 of the 14 teams in the SEC tested for it, 3)and 10-15 teams in FBS still didn't test for it. But that would have given facts that would have not fit the story line that we were the only school not doing any thing. Don't know how accurate Redwood is with their tests, but 3 LSU players did test positive for it, including the Honey Badger(of course they fail to mention he quit counting failed drug tests at 10.) All that info took me about 20-30 minutes to look up, so if ESPN looked for 6 months, maybe they should have spent another hour to get it right. As of the 2012 season, UAT didn't release the number of players that have failed drug tests, and they are one of 3 schools in the SEC to cite privacy as the reason. That is a bogus reason, because they can list the number without releasing any names(none of those schools have changed the policy on it.) By the way the NCAA didn't list it as a banned substance till August 2012, and will not test for it in bowl/championship games till the 2013 season. So even if half ower team had tested positive for it, none of those players would have been ineligible according to the NCAA!!!!

[Elephant Tipper 430]

Thanks for this good post passthebiscuits.

Makes me wonder all the more why Selena Roberts in her recent attack on AU she focused solely on Auburn rather than the problem of "spice" use among athletes from ALL colleges. SR appears to have an unknown grievance against AU especially in light of her many omissions. Whoever discovers that issue can put the muzzle on the ole b****.

In contrast, IF Auburn had been guilty of allowing "spice" to be such a problem among the team, why is it that a hack like SR and a propaganda network like SPEWN were the ones prosecuting this issue, and only against AU, rather than the NCAA who actually camped on the AU campus for a REAL investigation of the program in 2010 ? OH, "spice" wasn't illegal then you say ? (and I'm not arguing that it's use should have been allowed, only that SR indicts AU for not holding guilty its players when they legally could not).

[Dixie1860 27]

Can we make this the final thread on this subject? I am just SO sick of all of it. Nothing against anyone who started this or any other thread on the subject. Maybe we could merge all BSPN/Selena threads? I know things will come up in regards to this from time to time but I for one am ready to let it rest for a good minute.

[cptau 169]

the UAT reference that ESPN made what just another slap at Auburn. Good ole ESPN probably called UAT said they were doing a hit story on Auburn about Spice, K2, etc. and asked UAT if they tested for the stuff in the fall of 2010. UAT probably said, sure we did. RIght, UAT was testing for a drug that was legal, not against NCAA rules, and there was no accurate test available to them.

Redwood Labs did come out with a test in 2010, and LSU and Alabama were using it then. They only have 10-15 schools that use them, and the other 100-110 in FBS all use Aegis, including us. What ESPN could have mentioned is 1) we were 3rd to use the test in the SEC,2) at the start of the 2012 season 12 of the 14 teams in the SEC tested for it, 3)and 10-15 teams in FBS still didn't test for it. But that would have given facts that would have not fit the story line that we were the only school not doing any thing. Don't know how accurate Redwood is with their tests, but 3 LSU players did test positive for it, including the Honey Badger(of course they fail to mention he quit counting failed drug tests at 10.) All that info took me about 20-30 minutes to look up, so if ESPN looked for 6 months, maybe they should have spent another hour to get it right. As of the 2012 season, UAT didn't release the number of players that have failed drug tests, and they are one of 3 schools in the SEC to cite privacy as the reason. That is a bogus reason, because they can list the number without releasing any names(none of those schools have changed the policy on it.) By the way the NCAA didn't list it as a banned substance till August 2012, and will not test for it in bowl/championship games till the 2013 season. So even if half ower team had tested positive for it, none of those players would have been ineligible according to the NCAA!!!!

and LSU waited till the stuff was banned by the NCAA in August of 2012 to kick Honey Badger off their team. ESPN could have done a hit story on the whole SEC, but that would make their cash cow UAT look bad.......

[AURandy56 148]

We all know the bottom line with ESPN was that they were going after Auburn. They had egg on their faces after the Cam Newton fiasco when they had AU drawn and quartered, only to have the NCAA shut them up by being unable to find ANY evidence that AU did anything wrong with the recruitment of Cam Newton to AU---along with any wrongdoing with AU and the HBO 4 and only could find some minor secondary violations that didn't amount to a hill of beans. ESPN has a vendetta against AU, and I for one don't think it's going to stop with the Spice issue or, if they have to, they'll invent something else, especially if AU has a good 2013 football season.

[Warbird82 160]

Can we make this the final thread on this subject? I am just SO sick of all of it. Nothing against anyone who started this or any other thread on the subject. Maybe we could merge all BSPN/Selena threads? I know things will come up in regards to this from time to time but I for one am ready to let it rest for a good minute.

No offense 1860, but this post has relavant information that we didn't previously have. Quite frankly if you don't like the subject matter of a post don't read it. I do it all the time. I personally like new information on a subject that is certainly important to AU and the AU Family. Again, don't take offense to this response...it is not meant in that vain. WDE!

[war eagle6 0]

We all know the bottom line with ESPN was that they were going after Auburn. They had egg on their faces after the Cam Newton fiasco when they had AU drawn and quartered, only to have the NCAA shut them up by being unable to find ANY evidence that AU did anything wrong with the recruitment of Cam Newton to AU---along with any wrongdoing with AU and the HBO 4 and only could find some minor secondary violations that didn't amount to a hill of beans. ESPN has a vendetta against AU, and I for one don't think it's going to stop with the Spice issue or, if they have to, they'll invent something else, especially if AU has a good 2013 football season.

^^^ Get ready!!

[passthebiscuits 6,889]

Can we make this the final thread on this subject? I am just SO sick of all of it. Nothing against anyone who started this or any other thread on the subject. Maybe we could merge all BSPN/Selena threads? I know things will come up in regards to this from time to time but I for one am ready to let it rest for a good minute.

I'm ready also. I have been literally looking for the official CDC email since the story came out. To call us out on it is outrageous, then to say UAT had some sort of angel glow is another step against the truth.

a BIG thanks to the poster who cleared up what labs we run. That actually makes a lot of sense.

War Eagle. Lets go win some games!!!

[dyehard95au 0]

Not saying it doesn't go on everywhere, but I'd just like to point out one of my buddies walked on at Bama and 2 years ago an he brings home like $200 bucks a week during the season from other players paying him to take their drug tests for them.

[Dixie1860 27]

Can we make this the final thread on this subject? I am just SO sick of all of it. Nothing against anyone who started this or any other thread on the subject. Maybe we could merge all BSPN/Selena threads? I know things will come up in regards to this from time to time but I for one am ready to let it rest for a good minute.

No offense 1860, but this post has relavant information that we didn't previously have. Quite frankly if you don't like the subject matter of a post don't read it. I do it all the time. I personally like new information on a subject that is certainly important to AU and the AU Family. Again, don't take offense to this response...it is not meant in that vain. WDE!

None taken. It isn't that it is not relative and I'm not saying to dump it all. Maybe we just merge it all somehow? i.e. an ESPN thread (media), a spice thread etc. Maybe not.

Believe me, I understand the relevance and the importance of educating people about this in general. I do a good bit of work with a non-profit men's rehab near my home and this has been a major issue for several years. It isn't going to go away. I'm just curious if we are testing for other synthetic compounds i.e. Bath Salts, inhalants etc. They are even worse for you medically.

I apologize if I seemed a bit whiney. Lol. Seriously, I would like to know about whether we test for these other things as well. If ANYONE knows could you please PM me? TIA!

[Elephant Tipper 430]

Not saying it doesn't go on everywhere, but I'd just like to point out one of my buddies walked on at Bama and 2 years ago an he brings home like $200 bucks a week during the season from other players paying him to take their drug tests for them.

How long did your friend do this and for how many players ?

[Dixie1860 27]

Not saying it doesn't go on everywhere, but I'd just like to point out one of my buddies walked on at Bama and 2 years ago an he brings home like $200 bucks a week during the season from other players paying him to take their drug tests for them.

(Insert pic of man beating dead horse)

[keesler 5,934]

Not saying it doesn't go on everywhere, but I'd just like to point out one of my buddies walked on at Bama and 2 years ago an he brings home like $200 bucks a week during the season from other players paying him to take their drug tests for them.

Were they still pissing in cups back then? Hair samples are the testing trend now. Less room for contamination, more accurate readings, "less likey to get tampered with," etc.

[Warbird82 160]

Can we make this the final thread on this subject? I am just SO sick of all of it. Nothing against anyone who started this or any other thread on the subject. Maybe we could merge all BSPN/Selena threads? I know things will come up in regards to this from time to time but I for one am ready to let it rest for a good minute.

No offense 1860, but this post has relavant information that we didn't previously have. Quite frankly if you don't like the subject matter of a post don't read it. I do it all the time. I personally like new information on a subject that is certainly important to AU and the AU Family. Again, don't take offense to this response...it is not meant in that vain. WDE!

None taken. It isn't that it is not relative and I'm not saying to dump it all. Maybe we just merge it all somehow? i.e. an ESPN thread (media), a spice thread etc. Maybe not.

Believe me, I understand the relevance and the importance of educating people about this in general. I do a good bit of work with a non-profit men's rehab near my home and this has been a major issue for several years. It isn't going to go away. I'm just curious if we are testing for other synthetic compounds i.e. Bath Salts, inhalants etc. They are even worse for you medically.

I apologize if I seemed a bit whiney. Lol. Seriously, I would like to know about whether we test for these other things as well. If ANYONE knows could you please PM me? TIA!

I hear you...WDE!

[johnjacob 44]

Thanks for this good post passthebiscuits.

Makes me wonder all the more why Selena Roberts in her recent attack on AU she focused solely on Auburn rather than the problem of "spice" use among athletes from ALL colleges. SR appears to have an unknown grievance against AU especially in light of her many omissions. Whoever discovers that issue can put the muzzle on the ole b****.

In contrast, IF Auburn had been guilty of allowing "spice" to be such a problem among the team, why is it that a hack like SR and a propaganda network like SPEWN were the ones prosecuting this issue, and only against AU, rather than the NCAA who actually camped on the AU campus for a REAL investigation of the program in 2010 ? OH, "spice" wasn't illegal then you say ? (and I'm not arguing that it's use should have been allowed, only that SR indicts AU for not holding guilty its players when they legally could not).

Ole Selena was attacking AU football and it's players even when she was at AU. My theory is that one of the players hit it & quit it with her and she hasn't let it go or she has always been a closeted bama fan that just happened to go to AU for college.

[Mikey 16,781]

Thanks for this good post passthebiscuits.

Makes me wonder all the more why Selena Roberts in her recent attack on AU she focused solely on Auburn rather than the problem of "spice" use among athletes from ALL colleges. SR appears to have an unknown grievance against AU especially in light of her many omissions. Whoever discovers that issue can put the muzzle on the ole b****.

In contrast, IF Auburn had been guilty of allowing "spice" to be such a problem among the team, why is it that a hack like SR and a propaganda network like SPEWN were the ones prosecuting this issue, and only against AU, rather than the NCAA who actually camped on the AU campus for a REAL investigation of the program in 2010 ? OH, "spice" wasn't illegal then you say ? (and I'm not arguing that it's use should have been allowed, only that SR indicts AU for not holding guilty its players when they legally could not).

Ole Selena was attacking AU football and it's players even when she was at AU. My theory is that one of the players hit it & quit it with her and she hasn't let it go or she has always been a closeted bama fan that just happened to go to AU for college.

That's my guess. That's what I thought way back when she was spewing hatred on The Plainsman.

[Dixie1860 27]

Thanks for this good post passthebiscuits.

Makes me wonder all the more why Selena Roberts in her recent attack on AU she focused solely on Auburn rather than the problem of "spice" use among athletes from ALL colleges. SR appears to have an unknown grievance against AU especially in light of her many omissions. Whoever discovers that issue can put the muzzle on the ole b****.

In contrast, IF Auburn had been guilty of allowing "spice" to be such a problem among the team, why is it that a hack like SR and a propaganda network like SPEWN were the ones prosecuting this issue, and only against AU, rather than the NCAA who actually camped on the AU campus for a REAL investigation of the program in 2010 ? OH, "spice" wasn't illegal then you say ? (and I'm not arguing that it's use should have been allowed, only that SR indicts AU for not holding guilty its players when they legally could not).

Ole Selena was attacking AU football and it's players even when she was at AU. My theory is that one of the players hit it & quit it with her and she hasn't let it go or she has always been a closeted bama fan that just happened to go to AU for college.

That's my guess. That's what I thought way back when she was spewing hatred on The Plainsman.

I would guess that said player wishes he had just done the same thing that Vincent Vega was talking himself into doing (in the bathroom mirror) in Pulp Fiction when he had taken the boss' lady home!

[Elephant Tipper 430]

Thanks for this good post passthebiscuits.

Makes me wonder all the more why Selena Roberts in her recent attack on AU she focused solely on Auburn rather than the problem of "spice" use among athletes from ALL colleges. SR appears to have an unknown grievance against AU especially in light of her many omissions. Whoever discovers that issue can put the muzzle on the ole b****.

In contrast, IF Auburn had been guilty of allowing "spice" to be such a problem among the team, why is it that a hack like SR and a propaganda network like SPEWN were the ones prosecuting this issue, and only against AU, rather than the NCAA who actually camped on the AU campus for a REAL investigation of the program in 2010 ? OH, "spice" wasn't illegal then you say ? (and I'm not arguing that it's use should have been allowed, only that SR indicts AU for not holding guilty its players when they legally could not).

Ole Selena was attacking AU football and it's players even when she was at AU. My theory is that one of the players hit it & quit it with her and she hasn't let it go or she has always been a closeted bama fan that just happened to go to AU for college.

That's my guess. That's what I thought way back when she was spewing hatred on The Plainsman.

I would guess that said player wishes he had just done the same thing that Vincent Vega was talking himself into doing (in the bathroom mirror) in Pulp Fiction when he had taken the boss' lady home!

Blankity blank....I just erased it from my dvr. Reminder please.

[Dixie1860 27]

Vega looking into the bathroom mirror "you are just going to walk out there, thank her for a nice time, go home, **** ***, take a shower and go to bed. And thats all your gonna do..." That isn't the exact quote but it is very close.

[Elephant Tipper 430]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.....that's it. Brain freeze. Thanks.

[bdc81 90]

Forget about spice, if someone wants to become psychotic I could give a rip unless they live in my house, operate public transportation or work with me.

Tell me about the uat steroid testing program.

Little doc