Starbucks and Racial Profiling

[homersapien 11,393]

26 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

It doesn't happen enough that black people should be "grateful" every time they encounter a Cop without being shot  to warrant the response you gave. Bad form Homer, and bad form on my part before edit. 

Do those thoughts run through your head whenever a cop encounters a black person? 

As Salty said, my post was meant as a hyperbolic statement - sarcasm.  Sorry, I thought that was obvious.

Nevertheless, you have no standing to state it doesn't "happen enough" to influence how people - especially black people - might respond to such an incident as this.

[kevon67 2,368]

53 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said:

I am have hard time seeing a 911 call for this type of situation. Is 911 not for emergency only any longer? I do not see it as racial but more "choose your battles" by someone.

 

I totally agree and if mistakenly labled a 911 call and it was an actual call to local police I do apologize.

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

2 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Nevertheless, you have no standing to state it doesn't "happen enough" to influence how people - especially black people - might respond to such an incident as this.

I said it doesn't happen enough to warrant your response. Let's not twist words. 

I just find it to be an odd proposition (they should be grateful they weren't shot). Like, what's the reasoning behind it? 

 

[homersapien 11,393]

Just now, NolaAuTiger said:

I said it doesn't happen enough to warrant your response. Let's not twist words. 

I just find it to be an odd proposition (they should be grateful they weren't shot). Like, what's the reasoning behind it? 

 

Please look up "hyperbolic" and "sarcasm".

 

[homersapien 11,393]

3 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

I said it doesn't happen enough to warrant your response. Let's not twist words. 

I just find it to be an odd proposition (they should be grateful they weren't shot). Like, what's the reasoning behind it? 

 

You said:

37 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

It doesn't happen enough that black people should be "grateful" every time they encounter a Cop without being shot  to warrant the response you gave. Bad form Homer, and bad form on my part before edit.  

That's not exactly "twisting words".

[kevon67 2,368]

I do indeed apologize..........the call was to Philadelphia police and not 911 as I previously stated.......it was honest mistake.

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

26 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Please look up "hyperbolic" and "sarcasm".

 

Sarcastic statement I get it. Makes your “standing” comment a bit out of place. On that same note, I didn't say it doesn't happen enough to influence how people - especially black people - might respond to such an incident as this. Rather, I said it doesn't happen enough to warrant you (Homer) proposing that they should be "grateful" they weren't shot - which you have confirmed was a sarcastic statement. 

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

11 minutes ago, homersapien said:

You said:

That's not exactly "twisting words".

This is all meaningless. You weren’t actually responding in the way I thought. You were being sarcastic. I don’t know why you even took the time to twist my words

[SaltyTiger 7,816]

16 minutes ago, kevon67 said:

I do indeed apologize..........the call was to Philadelphia police and not 911 as I previously stated.......it was honest mistake.

USA Today says 911 call 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2018/04/17/hear-911-call-led-starbucks-arrests-two-african-americans/526255002/

[homersapien 11,393]

57 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Sarcastic statement I get it. Makes your “standing” comment a bit out of place. On that same note, I didn't say it doesn't happen enough to influence how people - especially black people - might respond to such an incident as this. Rather, I said it doesn't happen enough to warrant you (Homer) proposing that they should be "grateful" they weren't shot - which you have confirmed was a sarcastic statement. 

Exactly!   Good boy. 

But to your point, I seriously think profiling and police mistreatment of black people - most particularly unnecessary shootings - do happen enough to influence people's reactions to such an incident, generally speaking.

 

[kevon67 2,368]

55 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said:

USA Today says 911 call 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2018/04/17/hear-911-call-led-starbucks-arrests-two-african-americans/526255002/

Well I'll be.........didnt see USA Todays.............just based on video I watched from a youtube channel didnt indicate 911 just based it on dispatch answering"Philadelphia P.D."

[kevon67 2,368]

Would like to have video of prior to police arriving.

[kevon67 2,368]

Last time I was in a Starbucks they were inside a Barnes and Noble, the day after Steve Irwin passed.........Never stepped foot in a stand alone location.

[McLoofus 35,182]

5 minutes ago, kevon67 said:

Last time I was in a Starbucks they were inside a Barnes and Noble, the day after Steve Irwin passed.........Never stepped foot in a stand alone location.

I go in from time to time. Their mobile app is great. Order and pay with a couple clicks, walk in and it's just sitting there waiting on you. Great coffee. We had a lot of awesome, independent coffee shops in Atlanta that I would frequent instead, but when I'm on the road, or now that I'm having a hard time finding a dependable local spot where I live, heck yeah. 

PS- Chipotle is also clutch with the mobile app/online ordering. 

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

30 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Exactly!   Good boy. 

But to your point, I seriously think profiling and police mistreatment of black people - most particularly unnecessary shootings - do happen enough to influence people's reactions to such an incident, generally speaking.

 

I think law enforcement unlawful use of deadly force is rare. But when it happens (or when an incident occurs where it is questionable on the surface because of a ten second cell phone video clip), it saturates news outlets. IMO, It's the news coverage that influences reactions, not the frequency. 

[kevon67 2,368]

14 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

I go in from time to time. Their mobile app is great. Order and pay with a couple clicks, walk in and it's just sitting there waiting on you. Great coffee. We had a lot of awesome, independent coffee shops in Atlanta that I would frequent instead, but when I'm on the road, or now that I'm having a hard time finding a dependable local spot where I live, heck yeah. 

PS- Chipotle is also clutch with the mobile app/online ordering. 

If this mobile app you speak of doesnt come with an adapter that plugs into my 8-track, I am lost? 

[McLoofus 35,182]

7 minutes ago, kevon67 said:

If this mobile app you speak of doesnt come with an adapter that plugs into my 8-track, I am lost? 

No smart phone, huh? Impressive. 

[kevon67 2,368]

1 minute ago, McLoofus said:

No smart phone, huh? Impressive. 

Actually my wife does.........Havent used a cell phone since 2011............I use my landline to reach Mt. Pilot? 

[kevon67 2,368]

My wife uses app for pizza and subway, I pick it up.......I was on call quite a bit in my work career......cell phone  was an off day killer for me......

[McLoofus 35,182]

7 minutes ago, kevon67 said:

My wife uses app for pizza and subway, I pick it up.......I was on call quite a bit in my work career......cell phone  was an off day killer for me......

Makes total sense.

We keep trying to cut down on cell phone (and tablet, and TV) use in our free time. 

[stoic-one 1,548]

A couple things:

1. Calling 911 or dispatch, a distinction without a difference. As far as the Starbucks manager is concerned, and even according to Starbucks own policy, these guys were trespassing. They were asked to purchase something or leave, they refused, the police were contacted. It doesn't really matter which method was used, 911, blah blah blah... At that point the incident is out of the managers hands, and is in the officers hands. Given that the Police Chief stated that his officers followed policy and did nothing wrong tells me that there is more to this than racial bias.

2. Even after this incident, based on what I'm reading, Starbucks is still not going to change their loitering policy, makes me wonder why they are bothering to shut down at all for "training".

3. I'm not convinced there isn't an agenda somewhere lurking... These guys had every opportunity to defuse the situation. All they had to do was spend $1 and buy a cookie or a couple bucks for a shot of espresso and the store would have been happy to have them sit and enjoy it. Or they could have left when the manager asked them to. Or they could have left when the cops asked them to. Instead they chose to get arrested so that they could be national news. And now they are.

This issue is not relegated to Starbucks, any coffee, sandwich shop or cafe has struggled with this. There was a Panera I used to frequent, a great spot for lunch. Then they installed WiFi. After a few weeks you would go in there and find a person, camped out at a table for 6, with work spread all over it, hacking away on a laptop, drinking bottled water. There were several times when 4 of us showed up, and couldn't find a place to sit because these 'remote office' people had every table occupied. A restaurant with a 60 person capacity held hostage by 11 people, 7 of which weren't buying anything. Eventually they put a 30 min cap on WiFi and that got rid of most of them. Then they implemented a policy preventing 1 person from occupying tables for 4 or 6 between 11am-2pm.

Given that I travel a lot, I occasionally find myself with time to kill and work to do. Starbucks, Panera, Atlanta Bread, etc are good places. I keep to myself at a small table and always get a beverage. If I'm there a while, maybe two. That is common courtesy. It's a business not a library.

How about some unintended consequences, picture the scene - After the employees get their sensitivity training, a couple of minorities camp at a table, don't buy anything, maybe even cause a disturbance (loud talking, using profanities, insulting other customers etc). What manager is going to ask that they leave, no matter how justified? This whole thing will be exploited and, the offenders will be wearing Teflon.
 

As far as I'm concerned, Starbucks created this mess, and I hope they choke on it.

 

[AUFAN78 3,911]

9 hours ago, homersapien said:

They should be grateful they weren't shot. 

Always be scared of those barista sidearms. 

[channonc 466]

Anyone who does not see this a glaring example of white privilege hasn't done some real reflection about their own experiences or our society at large. 

[AU64 10,122]

as for 911....they get calls for every conceivable reason now.....believe it was a woman complaining about the fries at some fast food place on 911 so no surprise someone might have called them. 

Meanwhile I will be looking for the lead article in New Yorker next week suggesting that people should be boycotting Starbucks over their handling of this situation..though the best reason to boycott Starbucks is because of their absolutely out of this world prices. 

[stoic-one 1,548]

58 minutes ago, channonc said:

Anyone who does not see this a glaring example of white privilege hasn't done some real reflection about their own experiences or our society at large. 

As I understand things, the supervising officer on the scene and the police commissioner, who are both black, say this wasn't an issue of racism, just simple trespassing by two men who refused to leave, even at the officers request.

But I'll "reflect" if you insist...