Stidham's problem was Auburn's offense

[aujeff11 6,243]

6 hours ago, McLoofus said:

His offense works against teams that we can out-talent like Purdue, and very occasionally against better teams (exactly twice since 2014

Washington was ranked number 6 in scoring defense, number 10 in total defense, and number 12 in rushing defense. They were also ranked higher as a team. That number can swell to 3. 

[Auburn Kev 1,653]

 

 

[auburnphan 6,050]

The discussion has been great.

Gus does not develop QBs from a fundamental/skill level.  He really only develops them in learning his offense.  Either you like this or you don't.

I think they had an outstanding offense designed for last season.  Unfortunately, the OL couldn't execute their part most of the time.  When a QB loses trust in their o-line it is tough for them to be confident in executing the offense.

Nix comes in as probably the most fundamentally sound QB at any point in the Gus era, freshman to senior.  As he becomes more comfortable in the offense he will be great.

Gatewood is a freak and a gamer.  Fundamentals are not great, but his athleticism and arm strength are through the roof.  As he becomes more comfortable in the offense he will be great.  If he develops his fundamentals, Heisman possibilities.

[DAG 33,982]

20 minutes ago, Auburn Kev said:

 

 

Crazy how

things change 

[doc4aday 1,887]

On 5/4/2019 at 1:08 PM, I_M4_AU said:

If this is true (and I’m not saying it isn’t) why wouldn’t Gus get Joey ready last year with some real live playing time?  It was obvious Gus did not have any confidence in MW just by the way he dogged Malik when he came off the field.  When Stidham was ineffective against MSU and Tennessee, he was painful to watch, yet Gus would not replace Stidham.  Why?  Gus reports the Joey is something special in live action (as we saw in the Purdue game), so why not get a change of pace QB in the MSU game?  It could have worked wonders.

If Joey is as good as people say, it was a waste to red shirt him last year when the starting QB was nursing a shoulder problem.  Gus’ roster management and in game decisions are what I am most interest in seeing if he really has changed his approach.  He’s got all the talent he needs and if we sustain another KJ type injury like in last season’s Bama game there is no excuse to trot an injured player out there.

Now where is my blood pressure meds?

Hey IM4U_AU....where is Mooresville? How far is it from Asheville and the mountains?  I am about 25 miles due south of Asheville in the southern Smoky MTNs. Last year, Joey had a thumb injury on this throwing hand and this was some of his issues from not playing in 2018. I am excited to see what Joey is going to do in 2019. I am not concerned with the QB position for 2019 in that we have some cannons and legs with Joey and Bo. I hope that Joey runs over the Oregon DBs & LBs and gets the attention of the SEC very quickly with having a 6-5 & 1/2 , 235 lb QB that loves to run over people and then light their drawers with some nice passes.

I hope this comes to fruition and that Auburn becomes an offensive force to reacon with all season. Maybe I am being too much of an optomist, and then again maybe not!  We have a lot of the pieces of the offensive puzzle for 2019 with a seasoned OL of seniors, a stable of RBs and a receiving crew with a ton of potential.

I almost forgot about a defense that could be one of the best in the country to boot!

[Win4AU 4,052]

23 minutes ago, doc4aday said:

I am about 25 miles due south of Asheville in the southern Smoky MTNs.

Lucky.

I hope more negative articles come about Gus and his offense and people like Danny Sheridan and Paul Finebaum keep calling Gus a mediocre coach.  I want Gus to hear how impossible this schedule is and how Jimbo has already passed him.  It’s just like how Brohm was going to our coach Gus in the bowl game.  Poor Stidham.  If only he had a real offense he’d have been the top draft pick etc.  I want to keep hearing all the talking heads already trying to figure out who will replace Gus after he’s fired this season.  Freeze, Clark, Campbell?  Keep it all coming.  Make the chip as big as you can on Gus’s shoulder.

[doc4aday 1,887]

27 minutes ago, Win4AU said:

Lucky.

I hope more negative articles come about Gus and his offense and people like Danny Sheridan and Paul Finebaum keep calling Gus a mediocre coach.  I want Gus to hear how impossible this schedule is and how Jimbo has already passed him.  It’s just like how Brohm was going to our coach Gus in the bowl game.  Poor Stidham.  If only he had a real offense he’d have been the top draft pick etc.  I want to keep hearing all the talking heads already trying to figure out who will replace Gus after he’s fired this season.  Freeze, Clark, Campbell?  Keep it all coming.  Make the chip as big as you can on Gus’s shoulder.

Hey...I am pulling for Gus to  make it happen in 2019 and hope we do some serious damage. There has been more than one time where I was ready to hang Gus out to dry and I have no problem admitting this. However, what I saw in the Purdue game restored my faith in Gus as a coach and an offensive coordinator. I want Auburn to win and win big regardless of who is on the sideline.

[Win4AU 4,052]

1 hour ago, doc4aday said:

Hey...I am pulling for Gus to  make it happen in 2019 and hope we do some serious damage. There has been more than one time where I was ready to hang Gus out to dry and I have no problem admitting this. However, what I saw in the Purdue game restored my faith in Gus as a coach and an offensive coordinator. I want Auburn to win and win big regardless of who is on the sideline.

Sorry.  I wasn’t directing that at you.  I was being jealous of you living so close to Asheville, Brevard, and the rest of that AUmazing area.  

I was just regurgitating all the garbage I’ve heard the past week.  It’s slow this time of year so the football pundits have to stir the pot to keep themselves relevant.  Finebaum doesn’t talk Nascar after all.

[Dual-Threat Rigby 8,667]

I still can't believe people are missing the context in which this guy is critiquing Gus's offense 

5 hours ago, Auburn Kev said:

 

 

Gus had alot of believers in 2014, when Cleveland wanted him. He's lost as many outside of this fanbase as he has in it...

[McLoofus 35,182]

13 hours ago, aujeff11 said:

Washington was ranked number 6 in scoring defense, number 10 in total defense, and number 12 in rushing defense. They were also ranked higher as a team. That number can swell to 3. 

I mean, we beat them, with 21 points and 420 yards of total offense. Pretty good but not exactly an offensive explosion. They gave up more yards than that to both Stanford (at home) and UCLA, and they gave up more points than that to UCLA, Oregon, Stanford, Oregon State and Ohio State.  And, of course, that was the game where we saw some wrinkles that we hadn't seen before and haven't since, such as the Canella TD. Not that our offense ever seems to be "Gus's offense" in the first game of the season.

I'm comfortable with the 2 game statement. 

[AU64 10,122]

7 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

I mean, we beat them, with 21 points and 420 yards of total offense. Pretty good but not exactly an offensive explosion. They gave up more yards than that to both Stanford (at home) and UCLA, and they gave up more points than that to UCLA, Oregon, Stanford, Oregon State and Ohio State.  And, of course, that was the game where we saw some wrinkles that we hadn't seen before and haven't since, such as the Canella TD. Not that our offense ever seems to be "Gus's offense" in the first game of the season.

I'm comfortable with the 2 game statement. 

Good point …and of course the unresolved question...."who was calling the offensive plays for the regular season? "   

Far as we know, the Purdue game was the only game where Gus was fully responsible for the offense.  Hoping that's the offense we see this year. 

[aujeff11 6,243]

13 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

I mean, we beat them, with 21 points and 420 yards of total offense. Pretty good but not exactly an offensive explosion. They gave up more yards than that to both Stanford (at home) and UCLA, and they gave up more points than that to UCLA, Oregon, Stanford, Oregon State and Ohio State.  And, of course, that was the game where we saw some wrinkles that we hadn't seen before and haven't since, such as the Canella TD. Not that our offense ever seems to be "Gus's offense" in the first game of the season.

I'm comfortable with the 2 game statement. 

I think you’ve been hacked. 

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

On 5/6/2019 at 8:22 AM, DAG said:

I never once in my post said Gus SIGNED 5-star players. I said he had 3 5 star players play in his backfield ( Dyer, Thomas, Johnson). I guess Johnson is a 4-star player, so technically two. However, at the end of the day, he is still ELITE.  I am not arguing for the sake of argument. I am debating your positioning on critiquing Gus for not signing 5-star guys like that is just something so easy to do. Auburn is the Clemson of the SEC before Clemson made the leap with the big boys. You keep bringing up our rivals. LSU/UGA have fertile ground for recruiting. They are the main pipeline for their state, so they are already going to have an advantage right there. We have one of the greatest dynasties within our proximity. You mention Texas A&M. They are in arguably the best state for high school football (It also help that they got away from Texas, who has been down). So, yes they will recruit at a high level, but if you don't produce at the college level,  it will affect your draft status at the next level (Most of the time). Kyle Allen was a 5-star recruit at Texas A&M. Didn't even get drafted. But he is in the NFL because he was an ELITE recruit and now that he is in the NFL, It is HIS job to become an elite NFL player. Same thing with Daylon Mack (Drafted in the 5th round). Christian Kirk (5-star player), he is not setting the NFL on fire. Speedy Noil? Where the heck is he? Nick Saban has had some of the best COLLEGIATE RUNNING backs and how many of them are ELITE NFL RBs?

Gus Malzahn job is not to prepare people for the NFL. His job is to win games at Auburn at the highest level. By doing that, this should expose people to NFL teams and get them to be drafted at a higher rate.  Once, they get that look, it is their job to become ELITE at the next level. The problem is Gus Malzhan's offense is inconsistent at best and we don't win enough. When we won our NC, did you think this offense made Cam Newton into an NFL QB? No, It allowed him to showcase his freakish abilities by utilizing his skillset and promoted him in a manner to be the #1 pick. Once he got there, he worked his ass off to become an NFL MVP QB and to grow in his QB acumen. Now, in terms of 5-star players, we have to consistent win to get those guys. No 5-star recruit is going to be lining up at a program where one season, we are lighting up the field and the next we are losing to Tennessee. Not to mention, every other year, our coach is on the "hot seat." And please don't compare us to the USC and Michigan of the worlds, who are bluebloods and will always recruit at a high level. If we win CONSISTENTLY and produce at a high level, players are going to want to come. 

I dont disagree with much of what you said at all. And i had already stated that it isnt Gus' job to prepare players for the NFL. It is to win games at Auburn. I also agree we have not won enough of those games. Nor am i calling for his job. That is going to work itself out. I really hope he can turn it around. I am taking the Missouri route... Show Me.

But none of that changes the fact Gus needs to do a better job of both retaining and developing the offensive talent he signs. And until he does, we will have NFL guys criticizing our offensive players, our offensive players will continue to not be first day guys, and it will be more and more difficult to maintain top10 recruiting classes. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

40 minutes ago, AU64 said:

Good point …and of course the unresolved question...."who was calling the offensive plays for the regular season? "   

Far as we know, the Purdue game was the only game where Gus was fully responsible for the offense.  Hoping that's the offense we see this year. 

Not really unresolved. It's been discussed quite a bit. Just a matter of what and who you choose to believe. 

You're right that it was different for Purdue, and the results were better than they had been. But I doubt it will be the offense we see this year. We're going from a 4th-round draft pick- who would have been drafted higher if not for the dysfunctional offense to which this thread is dedicated, and who is considered the best pure passer in this past draft- to either a true freshman, or a redshirt freshman and true dual-threat guy who caught as many balls as he threw his senior year in high school. It will be interesting to see how we transition from that QB without our 2 leading WRs from last year. It will also be interesting to see what we do have looks like against a team that is significantly more talented than Purdue. Purdue is the 35th-most talented team in the country based on their 4-year recruiting ranking. For comparison, every team in the SEC West is ranked inside the top 25. Oregon is 13th. Also, Oregon was 49th in the country in team defense, playing in the Pac 12. Purdue was 83rd coming out of the the Big 10. 

Fortunately we get a couple tune-up games in a row after that so hopefully we know who we are before we get into SEC play. But we're probably not going to throw for almost 400 very often. 

[Tiger 8,825]

Lombardi was being hyperbolic for certain (likely due to being turned down by Gus 5 years ago) but that doesn't mean he's wrong in that our O makes it impossible for the NFL to scout our players. We are likely one of the worst offenses when it comes to showing what our players can do at the next level though. Some people are fine with that as it's Gus' literal job to win games at AU, even though he probably does sell how he can prepare them for the NFL during recruiting. Ideally you want the wins on the field, as goal #1, to be the spring board for the kids to showcase their skills for the next level. We are failing to reach this goal of winning games while also falling short of preparing them for the next level. But I'm sure we would be less mad if our draft results were the exact same but we were winning more.

[I_M4_AU 7,827]

13 hours ago, doc4aday said:

Hey IM4U_AU....where is Mooresville? How far is it from Asheville and the mountains?  I am about 25 miles due south of Asheville in the southern Smoky MTNs. Last year, Joey had a thumb injury on this throwing hand and this was some of his issues from not playing in 2018. I am excited to see what Joey is going to do in 2019. I am not concerned with the QB position for 2019 in that we have some cannons and legs with Joey and Bo. I hope that Joey runs over the Oregon DBs & LBs and gets the attention of the SEC very quickly with having a 6-5 & 1/2 , 235 lb QB that loves to run over people and then light their drawers with some nice passes.

I hope this comes to fruition and that Auburn becomes an offensive force to reacon with all season. Maybe I am being too much of an optomist, and then again maybe not!  We have a lot of the pieces of the offensive puzzle for 2019 with a seasoned OL of seniors, a stable of RBs and a receiving crew with a ton of potential.

I almost forgot about a defense that could be one of the best in the country to boot!

Mooresville is about 2 hrs from Asheville up I-77 and over on I-40, the wife and I have enjoyed visiting your area on occasion.  We spend a lot of time in the NC mountains near Wilkesboro as we do enjoy the hiking and rafting.

’Tis the season to get hyped on nothing more than people’s opinion about the future.  After years of believing the hype and listening to our leader concerning our potential, I have decided that the wait and see method would be better for my attitude, long term.  Every once in a while, I get frustrated with what I have witnessed with Gus and it spills out.  The post you quoted was one of those times.

I believe the reason you almost forgot about the defense is they are the constant since Steele has arrived.  Can’t say that about the offense under Gus.  Every year is like a box of chocolates.....you know the rest.

[McLoofus 35,182]

9 minutes ago, Tiger said:

Lombardi was being hyperbolic for certain (likely due to being turned down by Gus 5 years ago) but that doesn't mean he's wrong in that our O makes it impossible for the NFL to scout our players. We are likely one of the worst offenses when it comes to showing what our players can do at the next level though. Some people are fine with that as it's Gus' literal job to win games at AU, even though he probably does sell how he can prepare them for the NFL during recruiting. Ideally you want the wins on the field, as goal #1, to be the spring board for the kids to showcase their skills for the next level. We are failing to reach this goal of winning games while also falling short of preparing them for the next level. But I'm sure we would be less mad if our draft results were the exact same but we were winning more.

Soooooo much all a dis. 

I can't believe these things keep having to be explained. 

[DAG 33,982]

2 hours ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

I dont disagree with much of what you said at all. And i had already stated that it isnt Gus' job to prepare players for the NFL. It is to win games at Auburn. I also agree we have not won enough of those games. Nor am i calling for his job. That is going to work itself out. I really hope he can turn it around. I am taking the Missouri route... Show Me.

But none of that changes the fact Gus needs to do a better job of both retaining and developing the offensive talent he signs. And until he does, we will have NFL guys criticizing our offensive players, our offensive players will continue to not be first day guys, and it will be more and more difficult to maintain top10 recruiting classes. 

I 100 percent agree. Gus has to do a much better job developing and using his players skill set. We recruit high level guys and yet pigeonhole them in roles to their disadvantage and even more so when the offense isn’t working. I get frustrated for the guys so I can’t imagine what they must feel at times. 

[DAG 33,982]

1 hour ago, Tiger said:

Lombardi was being hyperbolic for certain (likely due to being turned down by Gus 5 years ago) but that doesn't mean he's wrong in that our O makes it impossible for the NFL to scout our players. We are likely one of the worst offenses when it comes to showing what our players can do at the next level though. Some people are fine with that as it's Gus' literal job to win games at AU, even though he probably does sell how he can prepare them for the NFL during recruiting. Ideally you want the wins on the field, as goal #1, to be the spring board for the kids to showcase their skills for the next level. We are failing to reach this goal of winning games while also falling short of preparing them for the next level. But I'm sure we would be less mad if our draft results were the exact same but we were winning more.

Yep win games and all of this works itself out.

[triangletiger 1,599]

4 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Mooresville is about 2 hrs from Asheville up I-77 and over on I-40, the wife and I have enjoyed visiting your area on occasion.  We spend a lot of time in the NC mountains near Wilkesboro as we do enjoy the hiking and rafting.

’Tis the season to get hyped on nothing more than people’s opinion about the future.  After years of believing the hype and listening to our leader concerning our potential, I have decided that the wait and see method would be better for my attitude, long term.  Every once in a while, I get frustrated with what I have witnessed with Gus and it spills out.  The post you quoted was one of those times.

I believe the reason you almost forgot about the defense is they are the constant since Steele has arrived.  Can’t say that about the offense under Gus.  Every year is like a box of chocolates.....you know the rest.

You're not too far from me.  I live in Cabarrus County east of Charlotte.  To stay on topic: I looked at Lombardi's profile on Wikipedia as I was curious to know whether he's related to Vince Lombardi. (He's not.) One thing I read was that he has a son on the coaching staff at Baylor.  Kind of sheds new light on his statement that Stidham would have been better off staying at Baylor.

[auburn4ever 1,266]

Stidham's problem was Malzahn's so called "hurry up" offense and Malzahn's play calling. Nothing is going to change with Gus calling the plays in his 7th year as head coach.

[James Howell 80]

On 5/4/2019 at 12:02 PM, toddc said:

Here’s a few of Auburn’s stats while CGM has been here!

One of the most innovative offensive minds in football, Malzahn’s high-powered offense has averaged 450 yards of total offense and 33 points per game in his five seasons at Auburn.

He has produced 15 1,000-yard rushers in 11 seasons as a college coach, at least one in each season, including Heisman Trophy finalist Tre Mason (1,816) and Nick Marshall (1,068) in 2013 and Cameron-Artis Payne (1,608) in 2014. Kamryn Pettway ran for 1,123 yards in 2016 despite missing significant time with injuries and Kerryon Johnson led the SEC with 1,320 yards in 2017.

On three occasions, he has had two 1,000-yard rushers in the same season: 2013 (Auburn), 2010 (Auburn) and 2006 (Arkansas) and this year, in addition to Pettway, Kerryon Johnson notched 862 rushing yards. Malzahn has also coached five 1,000-yard receivers and three 3,000-yard passers. His 2007 Tulsa team had three 1,000-yard receivers.

Since Malzahn’s arrival, Auburn has the top rushing offense in the SEC, averaging 253.9 yards per game. In 2013, Auburn led the nation in rushing at 328.3 yards per game, the first SEC team ever to do so. Three of the top six team rushing totals in SEC history (2010, 2013, 2016) have come under Malzahn’s leadership.

Auburn was just the second team in SEC history to gain more than 7,000 yards of total offense in a season in 2013, finishing the year with 7,018 yards; the other was Texas A&M in 2012.

The Tigers set a school record with 48 rushing touchdowns in 2013 and set a school record against SEC opponents with 677 yards of total offense vs. No. 5 Missouri in the SEC Championship Game. The Tigers set SEC Championship Game team records with 26 rushing first downs, 74 rushing attempts, 545 rushing yards and seven rushing touchdowns.

Tre Mason, a Heisman Trophy finalist and SEC Player of the Year in 2013, ranked third in the nation with 23 touchdowns, was fifth nationally with 1,816 yards rushing, sixth with 10.7 points per game, sixth with 169.57 all-purpose yards per game and eighth with 129.7 rushing yards per game. Mason set the Auburn single-season record with 1,816 rushing yards and 2,374 all-purpose yards, is second with 317 rushing attempts. His 46 rushing attempts and 304 rushing yards vs. No. 5 Missouri set SEC Championship Game records and fell three yards shy of the Auburn record.

In his five seasons, a total of 20 players have been selected in the National Football League draft, first round picks Greg Robinson (No. 2 overall) and Dee Ford (No. 23) of the 2014 draft. This past spring, offensive lineman Braden Smith, running back Kerryon Johnson and defensive back Carlton Davis were all taken in the second round of the 2018 draft.

Malzahn has coached 10 All-Americans as head coach at Auburn: RB Tre Mason (2013), RS Chris Davis (2013), C Reese Dismukes (2014), PK Daniel Carlson (2015-16-17), DL Carl Lawson (2016), DL Montravious Adams (2016), OL Braden Smith (2016-17), DB Carlton Davis (2017), DL Jeff Holland (2017), and RB Kerryon Johnson (2017). Dismukes was named the 2014 Rimington Award winner as the nation’s top center and Carlson was a three-time Lou Groza Award finalist.

The Tigers have faced the nation’s most difficult schedule collectively during Malzahn’s five years on the Plains facing 28 ranked opponents, including 15 in the top 10. Auburn was the nation’s only program in 2016 to face both the No. 1 and No. 2 ranked programs and in 2017 it faced three of the four CFP Semifinalists a total of four times, earning two wins.

Malzahn has his coaching staff have been highly successful on the recruiting trail, recording five consecutive Top 10 nationally ranked recruiting classes, a first in the program’s history.

Academically, Malzahn’s Tigers have excelled as 100-plus players have graduated since his arrival. In the fall 2016 semester a program-best 56 players posted a 3.0 grade point average.

Malzahn, who won the Broyles Award as the nation’s top assistant coach in 2010 while helping the Tigers to the national title, returned to Auburn after serving as the head coach at Arkansas State in 2012, where he led the program to the Sun Belt Conference title.

As offensive coordinator, Malzahn made an immediate impact during his tenure at Auburn, highlighted by a record-setting offense in 2010 when the Tigers finished 14-0 and claimed the school’s first national title since 1957.

Malzahn’s arrival in 2009 and style of offense marked a drastic turnaround from the 2008 season when Auburn struggled offensively. In a two-year period, the Tigers improved from a tie for 110th to seventh in the nation in scoring offense (from 17.3 to 41.2) and from 104th to seventh in total offense.

The 2010 Auburn offense set nine school records, while leading the SEC and finished in the top 10 nationally in six statistical categories. He coached Heisman Trophy winner Cam Newton, who had one of the best single-season performances at the position in college football history. Newton threw for 2,908 yards and 30 touchdowns, while rushing for 1,586 yards and 20 TDs. Newton, the No. 1 overall draft pick in the 2011 NFL Draft, also won the Davey O’Brien, Manning and Maxwell Awards

Those stats are from a career. What would be interesting to see is those stats from 2015 - present to get an indication of how well that offense worked after DCs got a good look at it.  As for Cam he was such a talent I could have coached him and I am not a coach.

[aujeff11 6,243]

4 hours ago, James Howell said:

Those stats are from a career. What would be interesting to see is those stats from 2015 - present to get an indication of how well that offense worked after DCs got a good look at it.  As for Cam he was such a talent I could have coached him and I am not a coach.

Well in 2017 Auburn led the SEC in scoring. 

[James Howell 80]

28 minutes ago, aujeff11 said:

Well in 2017 Auburn led the SEC in scoring. 

We did well for the most part in 2017 but we tailed off in the championship game and the bowl game.  I am just wondering how much of the game scheme was Al Borges in 2017.  I know we ran more misdirection in 2017 than we ever did under gus.  If you go back 2004 you can see that auburn would misdirection off the power running game which could indicate Borges was helping with the game plan in 2017.

 

However, my overall point is that 1 year in every 5 or 6 years being an offensive threat is not going to cut it.

[keesler 5,924]

22 hours ago, Tiger said:

Lombardi was being hyperbolic for certain (likely due to being turned down by Gus 5 years ago) but that doesn't mean he's wrong in that our O makes it impossible for the NFL to scout our players. We are likely one of the worst offenses when it comes to showing what our players can do at the next level though. Some people are fine with that as it's Gus' literal job to win games at AU, even though he probably does sell how he can prepare them for the NFL during recruiting. Ideally you want the wins on the field, as goal #1, to be the spring board for the kids to showcase their skills for the next level. We are failing to reach this goal of winning games while also falling short of preparing them for the next level. But I'm sure we would be less mad if our draft results were the exact same but we were winning more.

Great post Tiger!

Gus isn't winning enough games, and he isn't putting his players in position to show their full potential.  This isn't something new though, we've said it for years on this very board, now others are just putting it in print.