Lying about dying for political gain

[TexasTiger 13,028]

Mr. McClellan and other administration officials blamed the Newsweek article for setting off the anti-American violence that swept Afghanistan and Pakistan. "The report had real consequences," Mr. McClellan said. "People have lost their lives. Our image abroad has been damaged."

But only a few days earlier, in a briefing on Thursday, Gen. Richard B. Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, had said that the senior commander in Afghanistan believed the protests had stemmed from that country's reconciliation process.

"He thought it was not at all tied to the article in the magazine," General Myers said.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/05/17/politics...agewanted=print

What about the leader on the scene in Afghanistan?

"He thought it was not at all tied to the article in the magazine," General Myers said.

Guess he didn't get the Rove memo on how to spin the tragedy.

[Tiger in Spain 0]

Well, Texas.....that nugget completely absolves Newsweek of any blame for irresponsible journalism. To image the people of the country upset that yet another news organization got it wrong.....AGAIN! Completely unjustified on our part. We should all be ashamed of ourselves.

I'm sure if you look through enough of your sources (NY Times, LA Times), you'll find another credible source that will swear those 17 people that were killed because of this story either died of natural causes or Bush/Rumsfeld/Rove/big evil US military killed them or had them killed in order to fuel a conspiracy against the poor embattled, misunderstood American media.

What gets me though is how many liberals in this country fail to see the damage propaganda like the Newsweek article can do abroad. Even though the general in Afghanistan says that the protests (in his opinion) had stemmed from that country's reconciliation process; don't you find it odd that massive demonstrations were held not only in Pakistan and Afghanistan, but in the Middle East as a whole as a result of this article? My opinion is that the good General didn't want to get involved in the political bickering of this issue. Too much of his time is being spent tracking down the terrorists to engage in mud throwing. Just my $.02.

The bottom line is how many new jihadists do you think Al Qaeda recruited thanks to the half assed work of Michael Isikoff and Newsweek magazine?

[AURaptor 1,126]

Awww, gee Wally, but what about all those reports from the REST of the Islamic world that said how Muslims were all bent out of shape about the Qu'ran being stuffed down a toilet?

[TexasTiger 13,028]

Well, Texas.....that nugget completely absolves Newsweek of any blame for irresponsible journalism. To image the people of the country upset that yet another news organization got it wrong.....AGAIN! Completely unjustified on our part. We should all be ashamed of ourselves.

I'm sure if you look through enough of your sources (NY Times, LA Times), you'll find another credible source that will swear those 17 people that were killed because of this story either died of natural causes or Bush/Rumsfeld/Rove/big evil US military killed them or had them killed in order to fuel a  conspiracy against the poor embattled, misunderstood American media.

What gets me though is how many liberals in this country fail to see the damage propaganda like the Newsweek article can do abroad. Even though the general in Afghanistan says that the protests (in his opinion) had stemmed from that country's reconciliation process; don't you find it odd that massive demonstrations were held not only in Pakistan and Afghanistan, but in the Middle East as a whole as a result of this article? My opinion is that the good General didn't want to get involved in the political bickering of this issue. Too much of his time is being spent tracking down the terrorists to engage in mud throwing. Just my $.02.

The bottom line is how many new jihadists do you think Al Qaeda recruited thanks to the half assed work of Michael Isikoff and Newsweek magazine?

160110[/snapback]

You guys are amazing. There have been numerous accounts in the past of the very act alleged here. The Newsweek retraction focused on the claim that the account was in an official Pentagon report, which 11 days after being given a chance to dispute it, the Pentagon finally disputed it. You act as if this story exists in a vacuum and not in a context of so many other percieved indignities.

Of course, you guys also blamed the media for Abu Graib. You think Al Qaeda was having recruiting difficulties before this article and now they'll make quota? Really? Remember, we also sent in female interrogators in Guantanamo who among many other outrageous things, smeared what they led detainees to believe was their menstural blood on them because it was such an indignity, especially in their religion.

[Tiger in Spain 0]

I didn't blame the media for what happened at Abu Ghraib, I blamed them for blowing the thing way out of proportion. The military already knew abuses had occurred and investigations were ongoing. That wasn't good enough for the media, they had to have a scandal. As far as the actual reporting of events, there were no inaccuracies as far as I can tell in this Abu Ghraib case. With Newsweek, a failure to get the story straight before throwing it out to the consumers is what most sane people find troubling. Instead of coming out to the world and saying, "we're sorry....the article was not the truth", Newsweek does a partial retraction to the story yet still denies any responsibility for wrongdoing. They must have taken the CBS News approach to damage control.....deny and shift blame onto others until the public forgets what happened. What the real story is here is Newsweek was so bent on making the military and our President look bad that they didn't even bother to check the accuracy of the story before it went to print. This is the Bush Guard memo thing all over again.

Think about this for a moment, in your honest opinion shouldn't the reporters investigative intuition immediately screamed once it was revealed that the guard had offended these murderers by "flushing the koran down the toilet". Must have been one hell of a toilet, because mine frequently clogs anytime 2-ply toilet paper is used. Let's wait 10 minutes and see how the story changes in the press.

AFA the menstural blood thing I have to admit I never heard of this one occurring, maybe because I'm overseas and somewhat sheltered from the tin-foil hat wearing moonbat grapevine.

[TexasTiger 13,028]

AFA the menstural blood thing I have to admit I never heard of this one occurring, maybe because I'm overseas and somewhat sheltered from the tin-foil hat wearing moonbat grapevine.

160119[/snapback]

You're sheltered from the truth. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6876549/

[Tiger in Spain 0]

hmmm.....interesting. I guess the interrogation could be worse, we could be sawing their heads off or having them run across a open field as we shoot them down in cold blood.

What is the need of bringing something up that occurred 2-3 years ago especially since, as the article you linked states, strict guidelines for interrogation are used now. Could there be a underlying motive? :roll:

[BamaGrad03 0]

Seems to me that the "media" has no business putting SOLDIERS' business in the news. They find something WRONG going on...they should report it to the pentagon, not the world.

Im glad I dont have some prick journalist sitting at my desk ready to tell on me.

Journalists love to take things out of context. Here we see american SOLDIERS who protect the lives and freedoms of said journalists...being cruicified in the media for not "playing nice" with the TERRORISTS they interrogate.

Since Vietnam, mainstream press has waged war against american soldiers on the terrorists' behalf. American soldiers are ALWAYS the bad guy. They never put it into perspective.

Oh no, an american soldier tortured a terrorist by making him wear panties on his head. BFD. They torture our soldiers by cutting off heads.

Bottom line, we read about these "travesties" because of money and political agenda...not because of the need for "journalistic integrity".

[AUesquire 1]

Preach on BG.

[Auburn85 432]

my goodness.... Yeah, the riots didn't have absolutely anything with the newsweek article.

My goodness, yeah, the Islam Fanatics already hate us to know end, but this is something that put them over the edge. They retracted the story, but its too late the Islamic world already believes its a coverup by the Bush administration.

TT, who getting the benefit of the doubt... our soldiers or the terrorists?

The terrorists are trained now, so when they are detained, that should automatically claim abuse because they know that the media will report it and that Al- Jazeera will run it non stop to feed the Islamic Fascists.

[AURaptor 1,126]

Seems to me that the "media" has no business putting SOLDIERS' business in the news. They find something WRONG going on...they should report it to the pentagon, not the world.

( at a loss for words! )

Perhaps the smartest thing I've ever heard from a UAT fan - EVER!

Couldn't agree more!

[Tiger in Spain 0]

TT, who getting the benefit of the doubt... our soldiers or the terrorists?

The terrorists are trained now, so when they are detained, that should automatically claim abuse because they know that the media will report it and that Al- Jazeera will run it non stop to feed the Islamic Fascists.

160163[/snapback]

Well put, Auburn85!

[TexasTiger 13,028]

Afghan President disputes the WH spin machine:

BLITZER: How much damage to the U.S. image was done by that "Newsweek" story, that has since been fully retracted, alleging that U.S. interrogators at Guantanamo Bay flushed a Koran down the toilet?

KARZAI: It was a very unfortunate story. First of all, a very serious matter: a matter of people's beliefs and feelings. It is reported in a column, in a gossip column. That's very -- well, I don't know what to say about that. That's just not good.

We were angry about that. It's a rumor. Let's be wise. Let's be assistive. Let's check if it's true or not true, and then react, and react reasonably.

What happened in Afghanistan a week ago was really not something done by the Afghan people. It was actually the violence -- the trouble was directed at the strategic partnership that Afghanistan is talking with the United States.

It was directed at the peace process that we have of inviting back the thousands of the Taliban to come back to their country. It was actually against the elections in Afghanistan. So we know what was going on there.

http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0505/22/le.01.html

[Auburn85 432]

so the timing was just coincidental?

I think the minority of Afghan people that already hate us, just came to a boiling point when they heard of this story.

[Tiger in Spain 0]

Yeah, I'll buy that.

It couldn't possibly have anything to do with the media circling their wagons to protect yet another f-ed up journalist, now could it?

While you're busy defending these SOB's, here's the cover of the Japanese release of their rag from February. The bold white letters read (in Japanese, of course) ""Amerika ga shinda hi", which translates to "The day America died."

Granted, this has nothing to do with the caveman riots, but I believe it proves the point that they have an anti-US agenda. BTW, the same issue distributed in America had some of the Hollywierdos on it blabbing about the oscars on the cover. I wonder why Newsweek didn't have the plums to go with the overseas cover in the states? See that US flag in the garbage can? How nice.

Here's another interesting cover. This is the international edition of the same Newsweek magazine from February. Other than downing the US abroad (why again don't they have the guts to do this in the states?), nothing really catches your eye. But wait....look at that name Fareed Zakaria. Do a google search on him and read through some of his articles. Amazing how many anti-American pieces he pens for distribution overseas. He's the male version of CNN's Christiane Amanpour. Is this illegal? No, but again, it shows the anti-US bias of this magazine.

Link

[Tigermike 3,055]

I have several good friends who have lived and worked overseas for years. They have commented more than once on the difference in articles and slant of articles overseas. They have told me many times how CNN Europe is apparently "anti American". I'm sure TIS can attest to or discredit those statements.

[AURaptor 1,126]

Afghan President disputes the WH spin machine:

WH spin machine?

You maybe haven't been keeping up on current events but Newsweek retracted that story! They could not substantiate their claim, sound familiar ? (eg- CBS )

Karzi seems to just be placating everyone so as to somehow smooth things out w/ all sides. In fact, he didn't really deny anything. He said it was MORE to do w/ those who were pushing for political instability. Duh! He just said it was, "It was a very unfortunate story"

Just turn the page and get over it.

[TexasTiger 13,028]

Afghan President disputes the WH spin machine:

WH spin machine?

You maybe haven't been keeping up on current events but Newsweek retracted that story! They could not substantiate their claim, sound familiar ? (eg- CBS )

Karzi seems to just be placating everyone so as to somehow smooth things out w/ all sides. In fact, he didn't really deny anything. He said it was MORE to do w/ those who were pushing for political instability. Duh! He just said it was, "It was a very unfortunate story"

Just turn the page and get over it.

160703[/snapback]

Current events? You can't even keep up with the events this thread. The first post:

Mr. McClellan and other administration officials blamed the Newsweek article for setting off the anti-American violence that swept Afghanistan and Pakistan. "The report had real consequences," Mr. McClellan said. "People have lost their lives. Our image abroad has been damaged."

But only a few days earlier, in a briefing on Thursday, Gen. Richard B. Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, had said that the senior commander in Afghanistan believed the protests had stemmed from that country's reconciliation process.

"He thought it was not at all tied to the article in the magazine," General Myers said.

The WH tried to spin it. Newsweek retracted only the assertion that the official report substantiated the numerous allegations of mishandling the Koran that have been reported numerous times. Nonetheless, Myers said it wasn't related. The Pentagon had 11 days to refute it before it was translated into Arabic. They didn't. Why not? They could've headed this off, if, in fact, as they NOW assert, it led to the riots. Once again, you prove to be impervious to facts, logic, reason and your least favorite thing, the truth.

[AURaptor 1,126]

The Pentagon had 11 days to refute it before it was translated into Arabic. They didn't. Why not? They could've headed this off, if, in fact, as they NOW assert, it led to the riots. Once again, you prove to be impervious to facts, logic, reason and your least favorite thing, the truth.

Gee, maybe Newsweek should try verifying their work themselves, instead of expecting the Pentagon to do it for them. It's you who is spinning and impervious to the facts.

[TexasTiger 13,028]

The Pentagon had 11 days to refute it before it was translated into Arabic. They didn't. Why not? They could've headed this off, if, in fact, as they NOW assert, it led to the riots. Once again, you prove to be impervious to facts, logic, reason and your least favorite thing, the truth.

Gee, maybe Newsweek should try verifying their work themselves, instead of expecting the Pentagon to do it for them. It's you who is spinning and impervious to the facts.

160713[/snapback]

If you print something that claims I did something I didn't do, why shouldn't I call you on it? Or vice versa? I don't know enough of the details to fully assess their judgment here-- they had a generally reliable source, supposedly, whom they relied upon for years and they went with it. Nonetheless, when it's wrong, they're responsible, whether the judgment seemed reasonable at the time or not. That said, if a reporter has the story wrong and an organization like the Pentagon has a vested interest in the truth, why not point it out?

[Tiger in Spain 0]

So, by your logic Texas Tiger, the 2 propagandists that concocted this story are not to blame at all simply because the Pentagon didn't come out immediately to refute Newsweeks false story. Is that the proper way to report a story....throw something out (without personal research by the journalist to verify what his source said BEFORE it goes to copy) and see if it sticks? If it's not automatically denied then it MUST be true!!

Sounds a lot like the George Soros/Mike Moore/Dan Rather school of journalism to me.

[TexasTiger 13,028]

So, by your logic Texas Tiger, the 2 propagandists that concocted this story are not to blame at all simply because the Pentagon didn't come out immediately to refute Newsweeks false story. Is that the proper way to report a story....throw something out (without personal research by the journalist to verify what his source said BEFORE it goes to copy) and see if it sticks? If it's not automatically denied then it MUST be true!!

Sounds a lot like the George Soros/Mike Moore/Dan Rather school of journalism to me.

160752[/snapback]

Not my logic. Try again.

[TexasTiger 13,028]

McClellan Backs Away from Claims that 'Newsweek' Story Cost Afghan Lives

By E&P Staff

Published: May 24, 2005 1:10 PM ET

NEW YORK At a White House press briefing Monday, Press Secretary Scott McClellan, pressed by reporters and with Afghan President Karzai in disagreement, retreated on claims that Newsweek's retracted story on Koran abuse cost lives in Afghanistan.

He also claimed that he had never said it did, even though a check of transcripts disputes that. On May 16, for example, he said, "people have lost their lives." On May 17, he said, "People did lose their lives," and, "People lost their lives" due to the Newsweek report.

Here is the transcript from the latest White House press briefing:

Q: One other question. Karzai was quite definite in saying that he didn't believe that the violence in Afghanistan was directly tied to the Newsweek article about Koran desecration. Yet, from this podium, you have made that link. So --

McCLELLAN: Actually, I don't think you're actually characterizing what was said accurately.

Q: By whom?

McCLELLAN: As I said last week, and as President Karzai said today, and as General Myers had said previously, the protest may well have been pre-staged. The discredited report was damaging. It was used to incite violence. But those who espouse an ideology of hatred and oppression and murder don't need an excuse to incite violence. But the reports from the region showed how this story was used to incite violence.

Q: But Karzai seemed to think that that wasn't what led to the violence, that it was --

McCLELLAN: That's right, he actually -- he talked about -- President Karzai spoke about how the demonstrations were aimed at undercutting the progress being made toward democracy in Afghanistan, and the progress on elections. They have elections coming up soon. And I spoke about that, as well, last week.

Q: So could it be said that the Newsweek article played a role, but was not --

McCLELLAN: John, I think we've made our views known when it comes to the discredited report. There are some that want to continue to defend what is a discredited report that has been disavowed by Newsweek, and that's their business. We're perfectly willing to trust the American people to make their own judgment about it.

Q: Who's doing that, exactly?

McCLELLAN: I'm sorry?

Q: Who wants to defend it?

McCLELLAN: Well, you can see in the media coverage, there are some that want to continue to do that.

Q: One other question. Karzai was quite definite in saying that he didn't believe that the violence in Afghanistan was directly tied to the Newsweek article about Koran desecration. Yet, from this podium, you have made that link. So --

McCLELLAN: Actually, I don't think you're actually characterizing what was said accurately.

Q: By whom?

McCLELLAN: As I said last week, and as President Karzai said today, and as General Myers had said previously, the protest may well have been pre-staged. The discredited report was damaging. It was used to incite violence. But those who espouse an ideology of hatred and oppression and murder don't need an excuse to incite violence. But the reports from the region showed how this story was used to incite violence.

Q: But Karzai seemed to think that that wasn't what led to the violence, that it was --

McCLELLAN: That's right, he actually -- he talked about -- President Karzai spoke about how the demonstrations were aimed at undercutting the progress being made toward democracy in Afghanistan, and the progress on elections. They have elections coming up soon. And I spoke about that, as well, last week.

Q: So could it be said that the Newsweek article played a role, but was not --

McCLELLAN: John, I think we've made our views known when it comes to the discredited report. There are some that want to continue to defend what is a discredited report that has been disavowed by Newsweek, and that's their business. We're perfectly willing to trust the American people to make their own judgment about it.

Q: Who's doing that, exactly?

McCLELLAN: I'm sorry?

Q: Who wants to defend it?

McCLELLAN: Well, you can see in the media coverage, there are some that want to continue to do that.