Modern US liberalism ?

[auburnatl1 4,914]

So the GOP (historically “capitalists”, free enterprise oriented) has been overwhelmed by populists - generally white,  blue collar workers who are concerned more  about social traditionalism/ individual rights / and judeo christian values. Less so economic issues.  The main  theme: government is not  to be trusted (ie Halley is part of the “system”) and the less gov the better. 

Liberalism was historically focused on helping exactly this demographic.   Big gov, big programs. The “Labor Party”.  Redistributing wealth , regulating capitalism, and increasing governments role  in managing “fairness “.

So if liberalism was meant to help the working class, and the working class doesn’t want their help - what is the purpose of liberalism today besides green and racial/gender issues? Whats is it in 2024?

[homersapien 11,373]

2 hours ago, auburnatl1 said:

So the GOP (historically “capitalists”, free enterprise oriented) has been overwhelmed by populists - generally white,  blue collar workers who are concerned more  about social traditionalism/ individual rights / and judeo christian values. Less so economic issues.  The main  theme: government is not  to be trusted (ie Halley is part of the “system”) and the less gov the better. 

Liberalism was historically focused on helping exactly this demographic.   Big gov, big programs. The “Labor Party”.  Redistributing wealth , regulating capitalism, and increasing governments role  in managing “fairness “.

So if liberalism was meant to help the working class, and the working class doesn’t want their help - what is the purpose of liberalism today besides green and racial/gender issues? Whats is it in 2024?

Much of this post is what I would call "begging the question".

Classical liberalism is defined as:

• willingness to respect or accept behaviour or opinions different from one's own; openness to new ideas.

  • the holding of political views that are socially progressive and promote social welfare.

     
  • the belief that many traditional beliefs are dispensable, invalidated by modern thought, or liable to change.

     
• 2.

  a political and social philosophy that promotes individual rights, civil liberties, democracy, and free enterprise.

   

  Speaking personally, I am a liberal because I embrace the general values of liberalism as stated above. 

 

 

Edited March 5 by homersapien

[auburnatl1 4,914]

I haven’t been facepalmed in months. @icanthearyou’s back!!!

[jj3jordan 2,053]

8 hours ago, homersapien said:

Much of this post is what I would call "begging the question".

Classical liberalism is defined as:

• willingness to respect or accept behaviour or opinions different from one's own; openness to new ideas.

  • the holding of political views that are socially progressive and promote social welfare.

     
  • the belief that many traditional beliefs are dispensable, invalidated by modern thought, or liable to change.

     
• 2.

  a political and social philosophy that promotes individual rights, civil liberties, democracy, and free enterprise.

   

  Speaking personally, I am a liberal because I embrace the general values of liberalism as stated above. 

 

 

Begging the answer:  You fail on bullet 1 and 1A, and 2. Well done.

[auburnatl1 4,914]

8 hours ago, homersapien said:

Much of this post is what I would call "begging the question".

Classical liberalism is defined as:

• willingness to respect or accept behaviour or opinions different from one's own; openness to new ideas.

  • the holding of political views that are socially progressive and promote social welfare.

     
  • the belief that many traditional beliefs are dispensable, invalidated by modern thought, or liable to change.

     
• 2.

  a political and social philosophy that promotes individual rights, civil liberties, democracy, and free enterprise.

   

  Speaking personally, I am a liberal because I embrace the general values of liberalism as stated above. 

 

 

These considerations are also only social. Traditionally liberalism focused heavily on wealth and power disparity  ie 1) capitalism is rigged and purely profit driven - and should be regulated 2) income, wages, and taxes should be better aligned to equitably redistribute wealth across the classes

[TexasTiger 12,869]

12 hours ago, auburnatl1 said:

So the GOP (historically “capitalists”, free enterprise oriented) has been overwhelmed by populists - generally white,  blue collar workers who are concerned more  about social traditionalism/ individual rights / and judeo christian values. Less so economic issues.  The main  theme: government is not  to be trusted (ie Halley is part of the “system”) and the less gov the better. 

Liberalism was historically focused on helping exactly this demographic.   Big gov, big programs. The “Labor Party”.  Redistributing wealth , regulating capitalism, and increasing governments role  in managing “fairness “.

So if liberalism was meant to help the working class, and the working class doesn’t want their help - what is the purpose of liberalism today besides green and racial/gender issues? Whats is it in 2024?

Liberalism “won” many battles that are now mainstream— social security, Medicare, sick leave, workers rights in general. Although mainstream, they all face opposition from the “right” and still require defending. This is ongoing. But most of the Republican voters who “don’t want liberalism” assume Medicare & social security will be protected even as they vote for a party that pretty consistently threaten these things. Most these voters are low information, or more accurately, disinformation voters. They focus on other issues and are, frankly, easily manipulated. 
 

Then there are less partisan voters who value these things, too, but have to decide between the party that threatens them, but thus far has failed in its efforts, and a party they may view as too focused on less important issues in addition to the programs they have thus far protected.

[homersapien 11,373]

12 hours ago, auburnatl1 said:

These considerations are also only social. Traditionally liberalism focused heavily on wealth and power disparity  ie 1) capitalism is rigged and purely profit driven - and should be regulated 2) income, wages, and taxes should be better aligned to equitably  redistribute wealth across the classes

Well, I agree w/ #1, except for the term "rigged". (Capitalism is what made me relatively wealthy.)  I do think regulation is necessary in a free market system, otherwise a lack of trust will harm it.

I also have a problem with the term "redistribute" wealth in # 2.  It sounds coercive.

Having said that, severe income/wealth disparity is not good for democracy and policies to attenuate such disparity - particularly in promoting equitable opportunities - are a good thing.  Examples might include education and healthcare.

I do think taxes should be progressive. "To those to whom much is given...." 

It seems fair for those who have benefited most from our system pay more in taxes.

Edited March 6 by homersapien

[homersapien 11,373]

13 hours ago, jj3jordan said:

Begging the answer:  You fail on bullet 1 and 1A, and 2. Well done.

I doesn't surprise me in the least you are:

1. Close-minded

     a. Socially regressive

2. Oppose individual rights, civil liberties, democracy, and free enterprise.

But thanks for affirming it.     

 

[jj3jordan 2,053]

3 hours ago, homersapien said:

I doesn't surprise me in the least you are:

1. Close-minded

     a. Socially regressive

2. Oppose individual rights, civil liberties, democracy, and free enterprise.

But thanks for affirming it.     

 

We are talking about you not me. I see you have no answer. 

[AURex 1,998]

As to the OP --

Historically, the GOP (and its predecessor conservative ilk), was the protector of individual freedom, natural rights, freedom of expression, separation of religion and state, racial equality (Lincoln was a Republican), etc.

The current GOP is all about conformity, everyone must think and speak and act like us! Suppression of women's rights and minority rights, suppression of voting rights, limiting freedom of speech (book banning and right wing agenda in schools), etc. March to the right wing drummer or die!