The Myth of the Lopsided Rivalry

[OnthePlains 2,014]

So this is nothing new to our lives as Auburn fans but recently it seems to have gotten louder and more arrogant than ever.  There has been a theme on local sports radio lately where bama fans call in and remind Auburn fans how much better their program is and has been.  The hyperbole will make you vomit.  I've heard this stuff all of my life as an Auburn guy and most of the time I just blow it off.  Recently though it did get me thinking about what the numbers look like since Bear left.  Admittedly, Bear Bryant had his way with us for most of his tenure at bama so I thought lets look at where the rivalry has been in the last 34 years since his departure.  Below are the numbers and some commentary by me.  I plan on sending this to our local radio host to get his opinion (he is a bama grad). I would love to hear thoughts on this.  Thanks. 

 

Addressing the “Auburn just can’t compete with Bama” myth.

 

Since the end of the Bear Bryant era at Alabama in 1982, Auburn has competed at a very high level against its chief rival.  In fact, prior the juggernaut of Nick Saban’s arrival in 2007 and his subsequent unprecedented run beginning in 2008, Auburn had the advantage in most every category. Even with the recent run of Saban dominance (who incidentally is 7-3 against Auburn), Auburn still compares very favorably to one of college football’s so called “bluebloods” in the last 34 years.  The series is dead even at 17 to 17 which says a lot about Auburn’s ability to compete even with the Saban run.  Consider the numbers below and form your own opinion…

All numbers are since 1983, the first year without Bryant coaching at Bama…

Total Wins           UA 314       AU 282 – Difference of 32 wins. Do the math since 2008 when Saban hit his stride and it’s a difference of 39 wins to Bama meaning Auburn actually had a slight advantage before the current Saban run.

 

National Titles    UA 5            AU  1 – this one is of course one of Bama fan’s favorite arguments to point out in any conversation pertaining to these two teams.  Consider that 3 of those 5 came in the last 6 years though and when Auburn won in 2010 there was only a 2-1 difference.  Also consider how difficult it can be to win a national title under normal circumstances.  What Bama is doing now with Saban is unprecedented and will likely not be duplicated by any school in the near future.  While Auburn only has the one title, they have been very close on multiple occasions to others including ’83, ‘93, ‘04 and ’13.  Bama has had some other close calls as well but it shows the difficulty in judging these things solely on national titles.  Even blue bloods Ohio State, Michigan and USC only have a TOTAL of 5 between them in this time span. 

 

SEC Titles             UA 8            AU 7 – again, until the Saban run this was in favor of the Tigers and even with the run by Saban its still only a margin of one title.  Also consider that in this 34 year time span Florida would probably be considered the second most dominant program in the SEC and they are tied with Auburn at 7 SEC titles in that span. 

 

Unbeaten Seasons      AU 3     UA  2 – Even if you want to take away the unbeaten ’93 season for Auburn due to probation its still a tie.  Unbeaten seasons are extremely difficult in college football.  Just ask Steve Spurrier.  The Gators have exactly zero undefeated seasons during this time frame along with LSU.  Tennessee has just one themselves.

 

Wins head to head when both teams finish with 9 or more wins     AU  8   UA  2- of all the numbers, this one stands out most.  Over the last 34 years, when these two teams are both really good in the same season, Auburn has dominated the head to head matchups with both of Bama’s wins coming over 20 years ago. 

Let’s consider the series overall record which goes to Bama by 10 wins at 45-35 with one tie.  To hear some Bama fans talk this series has been as lopsided as Tennessee vs. Vanderbilt (75-31 UT).  Not even close to comparing.  Take the Michigan-Ohio State rivalry, the Wolverines own a 10 game series lead as well and that rivalry is frequently referred to as one of the most competitive in college football.  Georgia has a 24 game lead on Georgia Tech for more comparisons sake.

There is no question that with Saban’s run of success Bama has had two dominant runs against Auburn.  Bear’s run in the 60’s and 70’s and now Saban’s.  Even so, during this current run by Bama the Tigers have managed a national title, 2 SEC titles and nearly a second national title.   Also consider that for much of the rivalry’s existence the Tigers had to play the Iron Bowl on one of Bama’s HOME FIELDS.  The fact is that since Dye resurrected the Auburn program and put it on even ground in the 80’s Auburn has competed head to head with the Tide about as well as any rival could hope for.  Alabama fans and media have done a fantastic job of building up a mythology around their program and making it seem as though the rivalry is very lopsided.  The numbers just don’t bare it out. 

Both teams have had coaching issues over these 34 years so neither get to make excuses on that front.  Nick Sabans don’t grow on trees and the likelihood of Auburn landing a comparable coach is slim but that goes for the rest of the SEC as well.  The Alabama program is and should be very respected for all of its accomplishments.  It has had the benefit of two of the greatest coaches to ever walk the sideline and that is to its credit.  However, for a school that for so long had so much less resources available and to this day has some built in disadvantages, the Auburn Tigers have done just fine. 

[gr82be 14,423]

One thing that bugs me is that in my 47 years of being an Auburn fan is the fact that we haven't beaten them soundly. 10 point margin has been the best we could do. I would love to see a rout. 1969 was a blowout but a little before my awareness of Auburn football. The first quarter of the 05 game was a cruel joke by Tuberville because I thought it was finally going to happen. It was not to be. 

[OnthePlains 2,014]

3 minutes ago, gr82be said:

One thing that bugs me is that in my 47 years of being an Auburn fan is the fact that we haven't beaten them soundly. 10 point margin has been the best we could do. I would love to see a rout. 1969 was a blowout but a little before my awareness of Auburn football. The first quarter of the 05 game was a cruel joke by Tuberville because I thought it was finally going to happen. It was not to be. 

Agreed.  It has been frustrating.  I would say that there have been a handful of games where it seemed Auburn dominated everywhere but the scoreboard including '87, '89 and that '05 game you mentioned.  One thing I guess we can give bama credit for is they don't seem to completely slip off a cliff even in their really bad seasons quite the way Auburn does.  They beat really bad Auburn teams really bad. 

[triangletiger 1,599]

9 minutes ago, OnthePlains said:

Agreed.  It has been frustrating.  I would say that there have been a handful of games where it seemed Auburn dominated everywhere but the scoreboard including '87, '89 and that '05 game you mentioned.  One thing I guess we can give bama credit for is they don't seem to completely slip off a cliff even in their really bad seasons quite the way Auburn does.  They beat really bad Auburn teams really bad. 

That hasn't happened since Dubose's final season (2000) when they were ranked #3 in the preseason and ended up going 3-8.

[corchjay 5,311]

I will not care about MNCs until

they are actually won on the field and it doesn't matter what the name is on the front of the jersey.  You need to look no further for proof in 2011 when bama didn't win the conference and got to the title game and last year when Ohio State was taken over Penn State which beat them and won the conference.  So sick of the "on paper" and the "eye test" crap.  

You want real national championships then reduce the number of teams to 64 in FBS and build 4 regional conferences of 16 teams and and the winner of those conference games go to the playoff.  Sorry Vandy and Miss State.  You're replaced with FSU and Miami.  Because they are never going to win a national title in football ever.  Bring Louisville and Clemson in and there is your south conference.  Do an east, mid west, and west and poof there you have it.  

[AUld fAUx@ 2,584]

58 minutes ago, OnthePlains said:

So this is nothing new to our lives as Auburn fans but recently it seems to have gotten louder and more arrogant than ever.  There has been a theme on local sports radio lately where bama fans call in and remind Auburn fans how much better their program is and has been.  The hyperbole will make you vomit.  I've heard this stuff all of my life as an Auburn guy and most of the time I just blow it off.  Recently though it did get me thinking about what the numbers look like since Bear left.  Admittedly, Bear Bryant had his way with us for most of his tenure at bama so I thought lets look at where the rivalry has been in the last 34 years since his departure.  Below are the numbers and some commentary by me.  I plan on sending this to our local radio host to get his opinion (he is a bama grad). I would love to hear thoughts on this.  Thanks. 

 

Addressing the “Auburn just can’t compete with Bama” myth.

 

Since the end of the Bear Bryant era at Alabama in 1982, Auburn has competed at a very high level against its chief rival.  In fact, prior the juggernaut of Nick Saban’s arrival in 2007 and his subsequent unprecedented run beginning in 2008, Auburn had the advantage in most every category. Even with the recent run of Saban dominance (who incidentally is 7-3 against Auburn), Auburn still compares very favorably to one of college football’s so called “bluebloods” in the last 34 years.  The series is dead even at 17 to 17 which says a lot about Auburn’s ability to compete even with the Saban run.  Consider the numbers below and form your own opinion…

All numbers are since 1983, the first year without Bryant coaching at Bama…

Total Wins           UA 314       AU 282 – Difference of 32 wins. Do the math since 2008 when Saban hit his stride and it’s a difference of 39 wins to Bama meaning Auburn actually had a slight advantage before the current Saban run.

 

National Titles    UA 5            AU  1 – this one is of course one of Bama fan’s favorite arguments to point out in any conversation pertaining to these two teams.  Consider that 3 of those 5 came in the last 6 years though and when Auburn won in 2010 there was only a 2-1 difference.  Also consider how difficult it can be to win a national title under normal circumstances.  What Bama is doing now with Saban is unprecedented and will likely not be duplicated by any school in the near future.  While Auburn only has the one title, they have been very close on multiple occasions to others including ’83, ‘93, ‘04 and ’13.  Bama has had some other close calls as well but it shows the difficulty in judging these things solely on national titles.  Even blue bloods Ohio State, Michigan and USC only have a TOTAL of 5 between them in this time span. 

 

SEC Titles             UA 8            AU 7 – again, until the Saban run this was in favor of the Tigers and even with the run by Saban its still only a margin of one title.  Also consider that in this 34 year time span Florida would probably be considered the second most dominant program in the SEC and they are tied with Auburn at 7 SEC titles in that span. 

 

Unbeaten Seasons      AU 3     UA  2 – Even if you want to take away the unbeaten ’93 season for Auburn due to probation its still a tie.  Unbeaten seasons are extremely difficult in college football.  Just ask Steve Spurrier.  The Gators have exactly zero undefeated seasons during this time frame along with LSU.  Tennessee has just one themselves.

 

Wins head to head when both teams finish with 9 or more wins     AU  8   UA  2- of all the numbers, this one stands out most.  Over the last 34 years, when these two teams are both really good in the same season, Auburn has dominated the head to head matchups with both of Bama’s wins coming over 20 years ago. 

Let’s consider the series overall record which goes to Bama by 10 wins at 45-35 with one tie.  To hear some Bama fans talk this series has been as lopsided as Tennessee vs. Vanderbilt (75-31 UT).  Not even close to comparing.  Take the Michigan-Ohio State rivalry, the Wolverines own a 10 game series lead as well and that rivalry is frequently referred to as one of the most competitive in college football.  Georgia has a 24 game lead on Georgia Tech for more comparisons sake.

There is no question that with Saban’s run of success Bama has had two dominant runs against Auburn.  Bear’s run in the 60’s and 70’s and now Saban’s.  Even so, during this current run by Bama the Tigers have managed a national title, 2 SEC titles and nearly a second national title.   Also consider that for much of the rivalry’s existence the Tigers had to play the Iron Bowl on one of Bama’s HOME FIELDS.  The fact is that since Dye resurrected the Auburn program and put it on even ground in the 80’s Auburn has competed head to head with the Tide about as well as any rival could hope for.  Alabama fans and media have done a fantastic job of building up a mythology around their program and making it seem as though the rivalry is very lopsided.  The numbers just don’t bare it out. 

Both teams have had coaching issues over these 34 years so neither get to make excuses on that front.  Nick Sabans don’t grow on trees and the likelihood of Auburn landing a comparable coach is slim but that goes for the rest of the SEC as well.  The Alabama program is and should be very respected for all of its accomplishments.  It has had the benefit of two of the greatest coaches to ever walk the sideline and that is to its credit.  However, for a school that for so long had so much less resources available and to this day has some built in disadvantages, the Auburn Tigers have done just fine. 

As a former editor - very well-written, if a tad apologetic. However, I suggest dropping the "Home Fields" down to lower-case, if you're sending it in writing. Besides, wasn't Legion Field declared, by law, a neutral field?

[OnthePlains 2,014]

Just now, AUld fAUx@ said:

As a former editor - very well-written, if a tad apologetic. However, I suggest dropping the "Home Fields" down to lower-case, if you're sending it in writing. Besides, wasn't Legion Field declared, by law, a neutral field?

Thanks for the feedback!  Honestly I was trying to write it in a somewhat apologetic tone but I was also trying my best to let the numbers speak for themselves as much as possible.  I will take your advice on the Home Fields comment....and neutral field my a@@. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

All due respect to the OP, way too many qualifiers. You're treading dangerously close to living in the past. You also sound like they did when Tuberville was kicking their sanctioned arses every season. Speaking of, if you're going to sidestep the current saban run, then you should probably drop that Tuberville run, too. 

Let's leave names out of it. The last 10 years, it's bama 7, Auburn 3. That's more than 2-1. That's pretty lopsided. What's even worse, is that they've outscored us 339-183 in those games. They're beating us 34-18 going back 10 years, and that includes our 3 wins in that time. They pitched a shutout in 2 of those games.

I don't care if saban is walking that far sideline with the ghost of paul bryant on one shoulder and Darth Vader on the other. They currently own us and we should be doing much better against him. 

[OnthePlains 2,014]

4 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

All due respect to the OP, way too many qualifiers. You're treading dangerously close to living in the past. You also sound like they did when Tuberville was kicking their sanctioned arses every season. Speaking of, if you're going to sidestep the current saban run, then you should probably drop that Tuberville run, too. 

Let's leave names out of it. The last 10 years, it's bama 7, Auburn 3. That's more than 2-1. That's pretty lopsided. What's even worse, is that they've outscored us 339-183 in those games. They're beating us 34-18 going back 10 years, and that includes our 3 wins in that time. They pitched a shutout in 2 of those games.

I don't care if saban is walking that far sideline with the ghost of paul bryant on one shoulder and Darth Vader on the other. They currently own us and we should be doing much better against him. 

I wasn't removing the last ten years at all. I specifically stated all the numbers include everything from 83-present.  I also wasn't trying to prove that the last ten years were not lopsided, they obviously are.  I am specifically responding to some bammers who call our local radio show and act as if the last ten years are indicative of the entire history of the rivalry. More than once I reference the fact that bama has had two lopsided runs under two of the best coaches ever but even with all of that Auburn has competed at a higher level with them than most of the casual fans or media would realize.  

I wholeheartedly agree with your statement that we should be doing everything we can to compete with them right now. 

[WFE12 9,191]

https://www.seccountry.com/auburn/auburn-football-alabama-rivalry-nick-saban-sec-media-days-respect/amp

Alabama coach Nick Saban doesn’t mention Auburn in list of SEC teams he respects

By Lauren Shute SEC Country staff 
July 12, 2017

HOOVER, Ala. — Nick Saban is more than willing to share how much he respects every SEC opponent Alabama will face in 2017.

Well, seemingly almost everyone.

During his appearance at SEC Media Days in Hoover, Saban emphasized the “parity” across the conference rather than focusing on Alabama’s dominance. Though Auburn may be one of the teams with a chance to upset the Tide later this fall, the Tigers didn’t come to mind.

“Well, I have a tremendous amount of respect for a lot of teams in our league,” Saban said on Wednesday. “I mean, LSU is very, very good. Ole Miss has beaten us a couple times in the last few years. Mississippi State has got a good quarterback coming back. Arkansas’s got a good quarterback coming back. A&M’s always a very challenging team.”

After mentioning every SEC West team besides Auburn, Saban switched over to the SEC East and named several of his former assistants.

“I think Kirby (Smart) is doing a great job at Georgia. Jim McElwain is doing a good job at Florida,” Saban said. “Tennessee has gotten better and better every year.”

Of course, Alabama has defeated Auburn in three consecutive Iron Bowls and seven of the last 10 since 2007. The Crimson Tide have also won the last three SEC championships, with Auburn’s 2013 upset marking the last time Alabama hasn’t won the conference.

Still, though Saban didn’t mention Alabama’s in-state rival when he was center stage, he did make an effort to acknowledge SEC teams he didn’t specifically name.

“I am trying to think of somebody in our league that I don’t have a tremendous amount of respect for,” Saban said. “Vanderbilt went to a bowl game last year and had a winning season.”

The Iron Bowl is set for Nov. 25 and at Jordan-Hare Stadium.

[McLoofus 35,182]

17 minutes ago, WFE12 said:

https://www.seccountry.com/auburn/auburn-football-alabama-rivalry-nick-saban-sec-media-days-respect/amp

Alabama coach Nick Saban doesn’t mention Auburn in list of SEC teams he respects

By Lauren Shute SEC Country staff 
July 12, 2017

HOOVER, Ala. — Nick Saban is more than willing to share how much he respects every SEC opponent Alabama will face in 2017.

Well, seemingly almost everyone.

During his appearance at SEC Media Days in Hoover, Saban emphasized the “parity” across the conference rather than focusing on Alabama’s dominance. Though Auburn may be one of the teams with a chance to upset the Tide later this fall, the Tigers didn’t come to mind.

“Well, I have a tremendous amount of respect for a lot of teams in our league,” Saban said on Wednesday. “I mean, LSU is very, very good. Ole Miss has beaten us a couple times in the last few years. Mississippi State has got a good quarterback coming back. Arkansas’s got a good quarterback coming back. A&M’s always a very challenging team.”

After mentioning every SEC West team besides Auburn, Saban switched over to the SEC East and named several of his former assistants.

“I think Kirby (Smart) is doing a great job at Georgia. Jim McElwain is doing a good job at Florida,” Saban said. “Tennessee has gotten better and better every year.”

Of course, Alabama has defeated Auburn in three consecutive Iron Bowls and seven of the last 10 since 2007. The Crimson Tide have also won the last three SEC championships, with Auburn’s 2013 upset marking the last time Alabama hasn’t won the conference.

Still, though Saban didn’t mention Alabama’s in-state rival when he was center stage, he did make an effort to acknowledge SEC teams he didn’t specifically name.

“I am trying to think of somebody in our league that I don’t have a tremendous amount of respect for,” Saban said. “Vanderbilt went to a bowl game last year and had a winning season.”

The Iron Bowl is set for Nov. 25 and at Jordan-Hare Stadium.

And just like that, the bulletin board overfloweth. First positive thing to come out of that prick's mouth in 10 years. 

 

[WFE12 9,191]

2 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

And just like that, the bulletin board overfloweth. First positive thing to come out of that prick's mouth in 10 years. 

 

Ran out of likes but yeah. It's time to show him that it's Our Time whether he wants to admit or not.

[AUwent 3,748]

Pretty sure the rivalry since 1982 is us by 1.

[AU80cruiser 1,102]

Finebaum came to the rescue to say Saban mentioned Auburn the second time he was asked the question.....too late though haha!

[McLoofus 35,182]

41 minutes ago, OnthePlains said:

I wasn't removing the last ten years at all. I specifically stated all the numbers include everything from 83-present.  I also wasn't trying to prove that the last ten years were not lopsided, they obviously are.  I am specifically responding to some bammers who call our local radio show and act as if the last ten years are indicative of the entire history of the rivalry. More than once I reference the fact that bama has had two lopsided runs under two of the best coaches ever but even with all of that Auburn has competed at a higher level with them than most of the casual fans or media would realize.  

I wholeheartedly agree with your statement that we should be doing everything we can to compete with them right now. 

Gotcha. Mea culpa. 

[OnthePlains 2,014]

Just now, AUwent said:

Pretty sure the rivalry since 1982 is us by 1.

Yep it is.  I started with 83 since it was the first year without Bear.  

[AUwent 3,748]

I think the greater point is just how much of a turning point Bo Over the Top was, namely how much more even the rivalry has been since then.

[oracle79 3,569]

Somebody remind me.  Who was the last team the Bear lost against?

[AUwent 3,748]

Didn't we generally do better against Bear than most other teams in the SEC? I know both us and LSU have the most wins against Saban at UAT of anyone in the SEC.

[OnthePlains 2,014]

9 minutes ago, AUwent said:

Didn't we generally do better against Bear than most other teams in the SEC? I know both us and LSU have the most wins against Saban at UAT of anyone in the SEC.

Eh, unfortunately I believe Shug was only like 6-19 against him and of course Barfield never beat him Dye was 1-1. 

[AUGoo 2,664]

6 hours ago, WFE12 said:

https://www.seccountry.com/auburn/auburn-football-alabama-rivalry-nick-saban-sec-media-days-respect/amp

Alabama coach Nick Saban doesn’t mention Auburn in list of SEC teams he respects

By Lauren Shute SEC Country staff 
July 12, 2017

HOOVER, Ala. — Nick Saban is more than willing to share how much he respects every SEC opponent Alabama will face in 2017.

Well, seemingly almost everyone.

During his appearance at SEC Media Days in Hoover, Saban emphasized the “parity” across the conference rather than focusing on Alabama’s dominance. Though Auburn may be one of the teams with a chance to upset the Tide later this fall, the Tigers didn’t come to mind.

“Well, I have a tremendous amount of respect for a lot of teams in our league,” Saban said on Wednesday. “I mean, LSU is very, very good. Ole Miss has beaten us a couple times in the last few years. Mississippi State has got a good quarterback coming back. Arkansas’s got a good quarterback coming back. A&M’s always a very challenging team.”

After mentioning every SEC West team besides Auburn, Saban switched over to the SEC East and named several of his former assistants.

“I think Kirby (Smart) is doing a great job at Georgia. Jim McElwain is doing a good job at Florida,” Saban said. “Tennessee has gotten better and better every year.”

Of course, Alabama has defeated Auburn in three consecutive Iron Bowls and seven of the last 10 since 2007. The Crimson Tide have also won the last three SEC championships, with Auburn’s 2013 upset marking the last time Alabama hasn’t won the conference.

Still, though Saban didn’t mention Alabama’s in-state rival when he was center stage, he did make an effort to acknowledge SEC teams he didn’t specifically name.

“I am trying to think of somebody in our league that I don’t have a tremendous amount of respect for,” Saban said. “Vanderbilt went to a bowl game last year and had a winning season.”

The Iron Bowl is set for Nov. 25 and at Jordan-Hare Stadium.

BFD.

i don't blame him.

we haven't earned respect.

hoping this year is different, but one season in a row can be an anomaly. Two seasons a trend, three a reliable pattern. Then you get respect.

[WFE12 9,191]

Minkah Fitzpatrick also said today that he feels LSU is a bigger rival than Auburn. It is true that they have been more of a test for them recently but I still hate that. More bulletin board material.

[AUwent 3,748]

^You know, I always wished we put up more "bulletin board" material, but that's just me.

[Beaker 2,457]

A storm is brewing.

[DAG 33,982]

Half of this board is afraid of the hype that comes with being competitive with the king of the hill . Want respect ? Earn it and quit vying for the underdog role . Too much little brother syndrome , IMO. Act like you belong then show it .