Can Kam Martin be "The Guy" in 2018?

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

Will give props where props are do also............................... Joiner was 10x more physical than he was or has been in high school. Looked the part Saturday also. 

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

4 minutes ago, ellitor said:

 And the fumbles aren’t anything new with him. He had issues  fumbling the ball in high school as well.

Ouch. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

36 minutes ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

I'm going to go with a no OP. Kam is good but no way he is a every down back in the SEC. IMO. 

Is it a skill issue?

I need to go back and watch the game from the other night. 

[AidiAU 1,270]

57 minutes ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

Will give props where props are do also............................... Joiner was 10x more physical than he was or has been in high school. Looked the part Saturday also. 

He was one of the bright spots for me on Saturday. 

Sad to hear you mentioned attitude and work ethic for Asa. Ugh. 

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

32 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Is it a skill issue?

I need to go back and watch the game from the other night. 

He's more of a scat type back so skill issue I guess. Just isn't the type of back you can pound the ball with. IMO. 

[AUsince72 11,084]

30 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Is it a skill issue?

I need to go back and watch the game from the other night. 

I honestly feel like last yeat, when he got the ball, there was a burst and dynamic moves to go with it.

So far this year he reminds me more of a full back. Definitely tougher but more bullish and much less dynamic.

In contrast, when Boobee or Buzzsaw (I mean Worm) get the ball there's burst, dyamic moves & cuts and a feeling that they can break one any moment.

Just my view...

[logan adams 333]

As I've seen many people mention, I would like to see more of Joiner as well. Dude has the frame to bulk. I'm excited to see how big he will be next season.

[McLoofus 35,182]

6 minutes ago, AUsince72 said:

I honestly feel like last yeat, when he got the ball, there was a burst and dynamic moves to go with it.

So far this year he reminds me more of a full back. Definitely tougher but more bullish and much less dynamic.

Thanks. I wonder if all the preoccupation with changing him made him lose some of what made him so good in the first place. And some of it's on him. IIRC he said he's trying to emulate KJ emulating Le'Veon Bell. And all of it's unfortunate. All he needed to do was get better at pass blocking. He was already a damned good RB. 

 

 

[ellitor 33,092]

22 minutes ago, logan adams said:

As I've seen many people mention, I would like to see more of Joiner as well. Dude has the frame to bulk. I'm excited to see how big he will be next season.

He doesn’t need to bulk much. If he has the mindset to do so he can be physical with the body has now. He has some elusiveness and small back ability in terms of movement also. You risk losing that if you bulk him up too much.

[toddc 13,194]

13 hours ago, The Plainsman said:

Toddc has a point.  This is aufamily.    

Todd,. You did go from 7th to 2nd grade in reference,.  On your post,. So some consistency here might help..  (Kidding)

LSU game cannot get here soon enough.   

It was actually 7 year old and 2nd grade, which are the same, but I appreciate you backing me up on the other point.

[DAG 33,982]

2 hours ago, ellitor said:

He doesn’t need to bulk much. If he has the mindset to do so he can be physical with the body has now. He has some elusiveness and small back ability in terms of movement also. You risk losing that if you bulk him up too much.

Thank you! Not to mention he is a two sport athlete! He doesn’t need to bulk up too much and have to lose it for track season. That isn’t a very fun process and not super healthy for the body to be honest.

[Barnacle 9,064]

3 hours ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

He's more of a scat type back so skill issue I guess. Just isn't the type of back you can pound the ball with. IMO. 

I don't know why this type of point creates such a rub, either. Kam doesn't have to be an "every down" type of back in this offense to have success, and saying that he isn't doesn't degrade him. I understand the belief that he isn't or hasn't been properly utilized, but that's a different issue entirely. 

2 hours ago, McLoofus said:

Thanks. I wonder if all the preoccupation with changing him made him lose some of what made him so good in the first place. And some of it's on him. IIRC he said he's trying to emulate KJ emulating Le'Veon Bell. And all of it's unfortunate. All he needed to do was get better at pass blocking. He was already a damned good RB. 

I'm a little confused by this comment, Loof, or maybe I'm confused by the comment made by @AUsince72. Aren't we all of the understanding that Kam is still no. 1 on the depth chart until further notice? At what point did Kam "lose" anything? Certainly not a spot on the depth chart. He still has the quickness and speed, and I think he's running with more physicality than he has in the past. 

If Kam get's passed up at some point during this season, it won't be because he lost a step, and I certainly don't think it will be because of any preoccupation with changing whatever got him here. It's going to be because another running back on the roster beats him out. It's just interesting to me that there may be a narrative created whereby Kam not getting playing time becomes other people's fault for trying to change him. I don't see that at all. 

[McFU 205]

22 hours ago, toddc said:

Make all the silly and childish jokes you want to, but don’t make it look like I’m participating with editing my posts. 

Lighten Up Francis

https://tenor.com/view/stripes-lighten-up-gif-10400684

[ellitor 33,092]

54 minutes ago, DAG said:

Thank you! Not to mention he is a two sport athlete! He doesn’t need to bulk up too much and have to lose it for track season. That isn’t a very fun process and not super healthy for the body to be honest.

Didn't know he was running track?

[DAG 33,982]

14 minutes ago, ellitor said:

Didn't know he was running track?

Aww crap I thought we were talking about Anthony! Wrong quote. Someone else stated him being too lean 

[McLoofus 35,182]

41 minutes ago, Barnacle said:

I don't know why this type of point creates such a rub, either. Kam doesn't have to be an "every down" type of back in this offense to have success, and saying that he isn't doesn't degrade him. 

How do you think he would respond if you told him that directly?

Quote

Aren't we all of the understanding that Kam is still no. 1 on the depth chart until further notice?

Yes. Why do you ask?

Quote

At what point did Kam "lose" anything? 

In @AUsince72's estimation and possibly mine, after I get a chance to re-watch the ASU game, he's lost some "burst and dynamic moves". 

Quote

He still has the quickness and speed, and I think he's running with more physicality than he has in the past. 

I never noticed a lack of physicality before, and I don't notice any more of it now. Maybe that's perceived/assumed since he's bigger now. 

Quote

If Kam get's passed up at some point during this season, it won't be because he lost a step

How can you be sure? 

47 minutes ago, Barnacle said:

I certainly don't think it will be because of any preoccupation with changing whatever got him here. 

It's not the preoccupation itself. It's the fact that the preoccupation might have been realized. 

49 minutes ago, Barnacle said:

It's going to be because another running back on the roster beats him out.

Well, yeah. But if another running back beats him out, it might have something to do with a dip in his own performance. I know that's not the case in your opinion, but is it at least a possibility?

51 minutes ago, Barnacle said:

It's just interesting to me that there may be a narrative created whereby Kam not getting playing time becomes other people's fault for trying to change him.

Because this staff has such a great record on developing offensive skill players? Starting with Tim Horton, who has said a couple times now how surprised he is that Shaun Shivers is a physical running back. 

[Linayus 676]

I wanted to see more Kam Martin last year - but after seeing our freshmen come in and light it up I won't be too disappointed if Kam drops to #2 again. But that's more due to my excitement for what's in store for us than any knock on KMart!

Who was it that was running the Wildcat now? Joiner? Not bad at all but he looked to be running too "tall" at the point of impact. With his size he should lower that shoulder and run through the impact.

Also - Cox is still blocking poorly half the time but I think it's because he's somewhat launching himself and looking for a big "hit" instead of squaring up the defender and properly driving him out of the play. Very frustrating to see that still being an issue with him.

[Barnacle 9,064]

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

How do you think he would respond if you told him that directly?

Fair enough. My point is that whatever role a running back fills, it doesn't make him any less valuable to the success of our football team. The problem with the conversation and this thread in particular is how the question is being framed. It's all or nothing. Either you back him as the unquestioned "man" or you are somehow cutting him short. I don't think Kam necessarily needs to be an "every down back" to make the best possible contribution to our team. Therefore, I don't understand why anything other than that is so offensive. 

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

Yes. Why do you ask?

Just making sure I hadn't missed something posted elsewhere. The question you posed about him losing what made him so good in the first place made me wonder whether a coach had alluded to something. 

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

In @AUsince72's estimation and possibly mine, after I get a chance to re-watch the ASU game, he's lost some "burst and dynamic moves". 

I hadn't noticed that, which again made me wonder whether there was news I was missing. Obviously, people see things differently. I haven't noticed any lack of burst or dynamism. 

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

I never noticed a lack of physicality before, and I don't notice any more of it now. Maybe that's perceived/assumed since he's bigger now. 

Like I said, people see things differently. An increase in physicality is just something I've noticed. But, I don't attribute it to weight. I'm speaking to attitude - I've noticed him taking on more tacklers than I have in the past. Whether that's the case, I can't be sure. Either way, I think it's fantastic. 

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

How can you be sure? 

I guess I can't be certain. I just don't think he has lost a step, which is why I'm making that leap. 

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

It's not the preoccupation itself. It's the fact that the preoccupation might have been realized. But if another running back beats him out, it might have something to do with a dip in his own performance. I know that's not the case in your opinion, but is it at least a possibility?

It's possible. But again, I think Kam Martin 2018 is a better back than he was in 2017.

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

Because this staff has such a great record on developing offensive skill players? Starting with Tim Horton, who has said a couple times now how surprised he is that Shaun Shivers is a physical running back. 

To be fair, we've had pretty good success at the RB position. About Shivers though...Can't believe Horton said that - you know I'm an admitted size queen when it comes to RBs, but even I've been head over heels excited about Shivers since he committed. At least he's realizing it now. 

Edit: Is there a better way to parse out quotes from a post than requoting the entire post, and then deleting the parts that aren't relevant each and every time? Feel like that took me forever. 

[cole256 17,056]

Imo kam is easily the best back, at least as far as what we have seen in the game. Boobe to me is good but still too raw. He has tendencies he does that a linebacker that watches film will eat him up. Shivers looks awesome. I watched alot of Asa in high school in person. He probably is still working on getting comfortable. It's no exaggeration that he was just as good as Johnson in high school. I saw many of his games, and all of the big games against quality competition, I think saying he had fumble issues is exaggerated. And also weigh that on his high number of carries. Unfortunately with these situations it's just as bad as everyone saying the back up QB is the best player on the team. People trying to rally evaluate who isbetter at running back from just a few runs in one game is impossible really. 

[AUsince72 11,084]

37 minutes ago, Barnacle said:

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

In @AUsince72's estimation and possibly mine, after I get a chance to re-watch the ASU game, he's lost some "burst and dynamic moves". 

I hadn't noticed that, which again made me wonder whether there was news I was missing. Obviously, people see things differently. I haven't noticed any lack of burst or dynamism. 

For my part, and I do qualify this by admitting that it's still a VERY small sample but here's my observation...

What impressed me so much with Kam last year was his vision to find a hole and quickness to find an "alternate" hole if his first target was blocked.  I thought, regardless of his size, that would serve him well with the dynamic ability to cut out of a tackle.

What I felt like in the UDub game especially, there were runs where instead of using those same attributes he used last year, he literally would bull into a pile like a full back where just a slight lateral move, inside or outside, would have probably netted 5 more yards or even been the breakaway he needed.

It's not that I think he's lost any ability and I'm not sure if the extra bulk has hurt his speed or not, but rather it strikes me that he took it upon himself to make the bullish play.  I doubt that he lost his "vision" but I could be wrong...

Again, it's only game 2 ....well game 1-1/2 considering last weekend's opponent... so I'm not giving up on him but I just feel Boobee & Worm have both shown the form I expected from Kam. ...so far...

LSU's D is going to separate the wheat from the chaff.  I believe AU will have a bonafide RB pecking order after this weekend.

[Barnacle 9,064]

11 minutes ago, cole256 said:

Imo kam is easily the best back, at least as far as what we have seen in the game. Boobe to me is good but still too raw. He has tendencies he does that a linebacker that watches film will eat him up. Shivers looks awesome. I watched alot of Asa in high school in person. He probably is still working on getting comfortable. It's no exaggeration that he was just as good as Johnson in high school. I saw many of his games, and all of the big games against quality competition, I think saying he had fumble issues is exaggerated. And also weigh that on his high number of carries. Unfortunately with these situations it's just as bad as everyone saying the back up QB is the best player on the team. People trying to rally evaluate who isbetter at running back from just a few runs in one game is impossible really. 

Completely agree, and I'm very excited about where Whitlow's upside may take him. 

[Barnacle 9,064]

12 minutes ago, AUsince72 said:

For my part, and I do qualify this by admitting that it's still a VERY small sample but here's my observation...

What impressed me so much with Kam last year was his vision to find a hole and quickness to find an "alternate" hole if his first target was blocked.  I thought, regardless of his size, that would serve him well with the dynamic ability to cut out of a tackle.

What I felt like in the UDub game especially, there were runs where instead of using those same attributes he used last year, he literally would bull into a pile like a full back where just a slight lateral move, inside or outside, would have probably netted 5 more yards or even been the breakaway he needed.

It's not that I think he's lost any ability and I'm not sure if the extra bulk has hurt his speed or not, but rather it strikes me that he took it upon himself to make the bullish play.

Again, it's only game 2 ....well game 1-1/2 considering last weekend's opponent... so I'm not giving up on him but I just feel Boobee & Worm have both shown the form I expected from Kam. ...so far...

LSU's D is going to separate the wheat from the chaff.  I believe AU will have a bonafide RB pecking order after this weekend.

Yeah, I just haven't noticed any drop in quickness or burst. Washington state was a tough defense for all of our running backs to go against. I think last week was about getting Whitlow and Shivers more experience. Whitlow is very, very talented, but still very raw. Kam is going to get his, I think. Don't know if you've had the time to go back and watch him against UDub, either. Some of his runs look a little better under further inspection. Just my opinion. 

[AUsince72 11,084]

8 minutes ago, Barnacle said:

Yeah, I just haven't noticed any drop in quickness or burst. Washington state was a tough defense for all of our running backs to go against. I think last week was about getting Whitlow and Shivers more experience. Whitlow is very, very talented, but still very raw. Kam is going to get his, I think. Don't know if you've had the time to go back and watch him against UDub, either. Some of his runs look a little better under further inspection. Just my opinion. 

Yeah, I actually watched a second time because of the "low" rushing output and yes, Kam had some good runs but I feel he left a lot of yards on the field by either missing or choosing to miss a cut (which I felt was his greatest asset).

Again, just a couple games and it's not lost on me that Boobee & Worm did what they did against ASU.  I'm pulling for Kam to keep me believing.

I don't care who the best running backs are as long as they're wearing an AU helmet!

[Barnacle 9,064]

1 minute ago, AUsince72 said:

I don't care who the best running backs are as long as they're wearing an AU helmet!

That's the truth!

[bigbird 60,518]

2018

Kam

29att   120ydd  4.1ypc

Boobee

22att   150yds   6.8ypc

 

Game splits

UW

Kam      22att   88yds  3.6 ypc

Boobee   8att   28yds  3.5 ypc

 

AS

Kam        7att   40yds     5.7ypc

Boobee   14att   122yds  8.7ypc

 

Consider the competition...

Also...

6rec  47yds   7.8ypc

1rec   5yds     5ypc

 

There is a reason Kam received the majority of the carries in game 1 and was quickly pulled in game 2.  The coaches know the answer. Some on this site refuse to acknowledge it though.  Boobee shows a lot of potential, but is still doing some very HS things. If it were me, SS would be taking carries away from both backs.