How do Gus and Rhett teach their QBs?

[slipadeedoodah 24]

Do you consider Alex Smith an elite QB?

No, but your post never said anything about developing "elite QB's". You straight up said that Tebow was the closest thing to "an NFL ready QB" that Meyer has developed; which is obviously completely false. Alex Smith is an above-average NFL starter (in fact I'd argue that he is better than Matt Ryan who you posted on your "list") who went #1 overall. Meyer has therefore developed a good NFL QB, and he did it at Utah with a kid that wasn't highly recruited (or highly ranked) at all. With Cardale Jones he's got another that has realistic 1st round upside. He's doing pretty damn well in the QB department.

Alex Smith was considered to be a bust for the first half of his career. By the time Alex Smith started to really "develop" he hadn't been coached by Meyer in years.

[AUIH1 1,515]

"I've been to practices in the past, and have seen Nick Marshall ask DC for pointers."

You call this concrete evidence of Lashlee's incompetence?

Sounds like you're taking this very personally.

I do take it personally because I like to watch this team play. Win or lose. We aren't paying our coach Nick Saban money or Jim Harbaugh money. Say what you want about proven commodities. You get what you pay for. Malzahn is paid an average SEC salary. He makes less than Sumlin and has accomplished more. So why you guys expect this team to not have off years like this is beyond me. If Malzahn made 10 mil a year I would expect an SEC title every year. Otherwise y'all need to accept this isn't our year and enjoy the games we do win.

LOL. Gus' salary is fair based on his first two seasons as HC (1 very good year that exceeded expectations followed by a year that failed to meet expectations. Should we not win at least 9 regular season games this season with a win over spuat or uga included in those 9 wins then Gus needs to give part of his salary back to AU.

wde

Does that mean we owe him backpay for winning the SEC in 2013 on a pitiful $2.3 m?

Are you seriously calling a salary of 2.3 million dollars to coach a football team (many of which would never get admitted or would want to attend AU based on their academic accomplishments} pttiful! To placate your simple mind, based on last years results (embarrassing loses to Miss State, Texas A&M, uga, and Wisxonsin) I am comfortable in posting that Gus was overpaid last season which would make the success in 2013 a wash.

wde

[AUIH1 1,515]

"I've been to practices in the past, and have seen Nick Marshall ask DC for pointers."

You call this concrete evidence of Lashlee's incompetence?

Sounds like you're taking this very personally.

I do take it personally because I like to watch this team play. Win or lose. We aren't paying our coach Nick Saban money or Jim Harbaugh money. Say what you want about proven commodities. You get what you pay for. Malzahn is paid an average SEC salary. He makes less than Sumlin and has accomplished more. So why you guys expect this team to not have off years like this is beyond me. If Malzahn made 10 mil a year I would expect an SEC title every year. Otherwise y'all need to accept this isn't our year and enjoy the games we do win.

LOL. Gus' salary is fair based on his first two seasons as HC (1 very good year that exceeded expectations followed by a year that failed to meet expectations. Should we not win at least 9 regular season games this season with a win over spuat or uga included in those 9 wins then Gus needs to give part of his salary back to AU.

wde

OK, lets get back on track and address the coaching issue and not how much they make; but how well they coach.

Ok, lets do that. Thus far; at the same time in their respective time as HCs of the AU football team, Gus has done less than Gene Chizik.

wde

[chimesAU 89]

"I've been to practices in the past, and have seen Nick Marshall ask DC for pointers."

You call this concrete evidence of Lashlee's incompetence?

Sounds like you're taking this very personally.

I do take it personally because I like to watch this team play. Win or lose. We aren't paying our coach Nick Saban money or Jim Harbaugh money. Say what you want about proven commodities. You get what you pay for. Malzahn is paid an average SEC salary. He makes less than Sumlin and has accomplished more. So why you guys expect this team to not have off years like this is beyond me. If Malzahn made 10 mil a year I would expect an SEC title every year. Otherwise y'all need to accept this isn't our year and enjoy the games we do win.

So because Gus only makes almost 4 million/year we should all be resigned to mediocrity? Jesus, dude...

Don't let the facts that we have some of the highest paid assistant coaches in the country and one of the highest football operating budgets in the country go over your head.

I don't care if we've got some bubba making $75,000/year coaching our team. I expect him to have our team prepared to play week in and week out.

The real question is why do you watch football? We've had what 3 good years in the past 2 decades? That means 17 combined years of indigestion and whining on message boards about how we need a new HC, a new OC, a new DC, a new QB. Sounds like a miserable existence to me.

Ummm...what?

[CleCoTiger 1,957]

From what I understand about Gus' offense, it's predicated on the QB being able to run. So far we haven't seen much from J.J. along those lines.

I don't know where people come up with that "understanding." I guess watching Cam in 2010 and Nick Marshall for two seasons has sort of made some folks think that was the only version of "Gus's offense." It isn't. The "Malzahn offense" is run/play action built on a lot of old Wing-T principles like motion, deception and a vertical threat. (Wayyyyy over simplified description.) Malzahn tailors his offense du jour to the skillset of the players he has, including the QB. When he has a true dual threat QB who is better with his legs than his arm, that's where the offense goes. When has a QB that can play lights out in the passing game -- which is what I think he has expected of JJ -- then that's where it goes.

Check Malzahn's offense pre-Auburn at Arkansas, Tulsa and Arkansas State. At Tulsa they completely rewrote their record books in the passing game, and they ran very effectively also. But the QB's were not "running QB's."

All "the Malzahn offense" needs to work is a QB that the defense has to account for in the running game. The QB doesn't need to be especially fleet of foot or shifty or otherwise really good at it, they just need to not be a statue that the defense can ignore. (Witness Chris Todd 2009.)

The offense is predicated on the run (as in "run/play action"), but that doesn't mean a running QB in the mold of a Newton or a Marshall.

[slipadeedoodah 24]

From what I understand about Gus' offense, it's predicated on the QB being able to run. So far we haven't seen much from J.J. along those lines.

I don't know where people come up with that "understanding." I guess watching Cam in 2010 and Nick Marshall for two seasons has sort of made some folks think that was the only version of "Gus's offense." It isn't. The "Malzahn offense" is run/play action built on a lot of old Wing-T principles like motion, deception and a vertical threat. (Wayyyyy over simplified description.) Malzahn tailors his offense du jour to the skillset of the players he has, including the QB. When he has a true dual threat QB who is better with his legs than his arm, that's where the offense goes. When has a QB that can play lights out in the passing game -- which is what I think he has expected of JJ -- then that's where it goes.

Check Malzahn's offense pre-Auburn at Arkansas, Tulsa and Arkansas State. At Tulsa they completely rewrote their record books in the passing game, and they ran very effectively also. But the QB's were not "running QB's."

All "the Malzahn offense" needs to work is a QB that the defense has to account for in the running game. The QB doesn't need to be especially fleet of foot or shifty or otherwise really good at it, they just need to not be a statue that the defense can ignore. (Witness Chris Todd 2009.)

The offense is predicated on the run (as in "run/play action"), but that doesn't mean a running QB in the mold of a Newton or a Marshall.

We don't care about facts here. Take those elsewhere.

[slipadeedoodah 24]

"I've been to practices in the past, and have seen Nick Marshall ask DC for pointers."

You call this concrete evidence of Lashlee's incompetence?

Sounds like you're taking this very personally.

I do take it personally because I like to watch this team play. Win or lose. We aren't paying our coach Nick Saban money or Jim Harbaugh money. Say what you want about proven commodities. You get what you pay for. Malzahn is paid an average SEC salary. He makes less than Sumlin and has accomplished more. So why you guys expect this team to not have off years like this is beyond me. If Malzahn made 10 mil a year I would expect an SEC title every year. Otherwise y'all need to accept this isn't our year and enjoy the games we do win.

LOL. Gus' salary is fair based on his first two seasons as HC (1 very good year that exceeded expectations followed by a year that failed to meet expectations. Should we not win at least 9 regular season games this season with a win over spuat or uga included in those 9 wins then Gus needs to give part of his salary back to AU.

wde

OK, lets get back on track and address the coaching issue and not how much they make; but how well they coach.

Ok, lets do that. Thus far; at the same time in their respective time as HCs of the AU football team, Gus has done less than Gene Chizik.

wde

Good one. I guess this would be an inconvenient time to point out that as a head coach Chizik was 30-10 with Malzahn on staff and 8-28 without him.

[AUIH1 1,515]

"I've been to practices in the past, and have seen Nick Marshall ask DC for pointers."

You call this concrete evidence of Lashlee's incompetence?

Sounds like you're taking this very personally.

I do take it personally because I like to watch this team play. Win or lose. We aren't paying our coach Nick Saban money or Jim Harbaugh money. Say what you want about proven commodities. You get what you pay for. Malzahn is paid an average SEC salary. He makes less than Sumlin and has accomplished more. So why you guys expect this team to not have off years like this is beyond me. If Malzahn made 10 mil a year I would expect an SEC title every year. Otherwise y'all need to accept this isn't our year and enjoy the games we do win.

LOL. Gus' salary is fair based on his first two seasons as HC (1 very good year that exceeded expectations followed by a year that failed to meet expectations. Should we not win at least 9 regular season games this season with a win over spuat or uga included in those 9 wins then Gus needs to give part of his salary back to AU.

wde

OK, lets get back on track and address the coaching issue and not how much they make; but how well they coach.

Ok, lets do that. Thus far; at the same time in their respective time as HCs of the AU football team, Gus has done less than Gene Chizik.

wde

Good one. I guess this would be an inconvenient time to point out that as a head coach Chizik was 30-10 with Malzahn on staff and 8-28 without him.

It could be that Gus is a much better OC than HC. I think we will know when this season is over.

wde

[AU64 10,122]

"I've been to practices in the past, and have seen Nick Marshall ask DC for pointers."

You call this concrete evidence of Lashlee's incompetence?

Sounds like you're taking this very personally.

I do take it personally because I like to watch this team play. Win or lose. We aren't paying our coach Nick Saban money or Jim Harbaugh money. Say what you want about proven commodities. You get what you pay for. Malzahn is paid an average SEC salary. He makes less than Sumlin and has accomplished more. So why you guys expect this team to not have off years like this is beyond me. If Malzahn made 10 mil a year I would expect an SEC title every year. Otherwise y'all need to accept this isn't our year and enjoy the games we do win.

LOL. Gus' salary is fair based on his first two seasons as HC (1 very good year that exceeded expectations followed by a year that failed to meet expectations. Should we not win at least 9 regular season games this season with a win over spuat or uga included in those 9 wins then Gus needs to give part of his salary back to AU.

wde

OK, lets get back on track and address the coaching issue and not how much they make; but how well they coach.

Ok, lets do that. Thus far; at the same time in their respective time as HCs of the AU football team, Gus has done less than Gene Chizik.

wde

Good one. I guess this would be an inconvenient time to point out that as a head coach Chizik was 30-10 with Malzahn on staff and 8-28 without him.

It could be that Gus is a much better OC than HC. I think we will know when this season is over.

wde

Not an uncommon situation......can think of lots of Coordinators who did not make it as HC.....and most returned to their roles as Coordinator. Hope that's not the case here because if would be an expensive problem to solve....but I would not be amazed if that turned out to be the case.

[AURealist 2,185]

OK, lets get back on track and address the coaching issue and not how much they make; but how well they coach.

Ok, lets do that. Thus far; at the same time in their respective time as HCs of the AU football team, Gus has done less than Gene Chizik.

wde

Good one. I guess this would be an inconvenient time to point out that as a head coach Chizik was 30-10 with Malzahn on staff and 8-28 without him.

Or 3-9 without Gus. Apples-Apples

Maybe Chizik made a better choice of OC/QB coach?

[chimesAU 89]

"I've been to practices in the past, and have seen Nick Marshall ask DC for pointers."

You call this concrete evidence of Lashlee's incompetence?

Sounds like you're taking this very personally.

I do take it personally because I like to watch this team play. Win or lose. We aren't paying our coach Nick Saban money or Jim Harbaugh money. Say what you want about proven commodities. You get what you pay for. Malzahn is paid an average SEC salary. He makes less than Sumlin and has accomplished more. So why you guys expect this team to not have off years like this is beyond me. If Malzahn made 10 mil a year I would expect an SEC title every year. Otherwise y'all need to accept this isn't our year and enjoy the games we do win.

LOL. Gus' salary is fair based on his first two seasons as HC (1 very good year that exceeded expectations followed by a year that failed to meet expectations. Should we not win at least 9 regular season games this season with a win over spuat or uga included in those 9 wins then Gus needs to give part of his salary back to AU.

wde

OK, lets get back on track and address the coaching issue and not how much they make; but how well they coach.

Ok, lets do that. Thus far; at the same time in their respective time as HCs of the AU football team, Gus has done less than Gene Chizik.

wde

Good one. I guess this would be an inconvenient time to point out that as a head coach Chizik was 30-10 with Malzahn on staff and 8-28 without him.

Correlation does not imply causation.

[slipadeedoodah 24]

"I've been to practices in the past, and have seen Nick Marshall ask DC for pointers."

You call this concrete evidence of Lashlee's incompetence?

Sounds like you're taking this very personally.

I do take it personally because I like to watch this team play. Win or lose. We aren't paying our coach Nick Saban money or Jim Harbaugh money. Say what you want about proven commodities. You get what you pay for. Malzahn is paid an average SEC salary. He makes less than Sumlin and has accomplished more. So why you guys expect this team to not have off years like this is beyond me. If Malzahn made 10 mil a year I would expect an SEC title every year. Otherwise y'all need to accept this isn't our year and enjoy the games we do win.

LOL. Gus' salary is fair based on his first two seasons as HC (1 very good year that exceeded expectations followed by a year that failed to meet expectations. Should we not win at least 9 regular season games this season with a win over spuat or uga included in those 9 wins then Gus needs to give part of his salary back to AU.

wde

OK, lets get back on track and address the coaching issue and not how much they make; but how well they coach.

Ok, lets do that. Thus far; at the same time in their respective time as HCs of the AU football team, Gus has done less than Gene Chizik.

wde

Good one. I guess this would be an inconvenient time to point out that as a head coach Chizik was 30-10 with Malzahn on staff and 8-28 without him.

Correlation does not imply causation.

That is some really, REALLY strong correlation.

[chimesAU 89]

"I've been to practices in the past, and have seen Nick Marshall ask DC for pointers."

You call this concrete evidence of Lashlee's incompetence?

Sounds like you're taking this very personally.

I do take it personally because I like to watch this team play. Win or lose. We aren't paying our coach Nick Saban money or Jim Harbaugh money. Say what you want about proven commodities. You get what you pay for. Malzahn is paid an average SEC salary. He makes less than Sumlin and has accomplished more. So why you guys expect this team to not have off years like this is beyond me. If Malzahn made 10 mil a year I would expect an SEC title every year. Otherwise y'all need to accept this isn't our year and enjoy the games we do win.

LOL. Gus' salary is fair based on his first two seasons as HC (1 very good year that exceeded expectations followed by a year that failed to meet expectations. Should we not win at least 9 regular season games this season with a win over spuat or uga included in those 9 wins then Gus needs to give part of his salary back to AU.

wde

OK, lets get back on track and address the coaching issue and not how much they make; but how well they coach.

Ok, lets do that. Thus far; at the same time in their respective time as HCs of the AU football team, Gus has done less than Gene Chizik.

wde

Good one. I guess this would be an inconvenient time to point out that as a head coach Chizik was 30-10 with Malzahn on staff and 8-28 without him.

Correlation does not imply causation.

That is some really, REALLY strong correlation.

Maybe, maybe not. There are a ton of variables at play. Not even sure how you could compare his time at Iowa State, a perennial bottom-dweller. Malzahn could've seen the ship sinking *cough2011cough* and got out just before it all went to hell.

And I'm not defending Chiz's goofy a** or Loeffler...just saying there are WAY more variables at play than you seem to acknowledge.

[slipadeedoodah 24]

"I've been to practices in the past, and have seen Nick Marshall ask DC for pointers."

You call this concrete evidence of Lashlee's incompetence?

Sounds like you're taking this very personally.

I do take it personally because I like to watch this team play. Win or lose. We aren't paying our coach Nick Saban money or Jim Harbaugh money. Say what you want about proven commodities. You get what you pay for. Malzahn is paid an average SEC salary. He makes less than Sumlin and has accomplished more. So why you guys expect this team to not have off years like this is beyond me. If Malzahn made 10 mil a year I would expect an SEC title every year. Otherwise y'all need to accept this isn't our year and enjoy the games we do win.

LOL. Gus' salary is fair based on his first two seasons as HC (1 very good year that exceeded expectations followed by a year that failed to meet expectations. Should we not win at least 9 regular season games this season with a win over spuat or uga included in those 9 wins then Gus needs to give part of his salary back to AU.

wde

OK, lets get back on track and address the coaching issue and not how much they make; but how well they coach.

Ok, lets do that. Thus far; at the same time in their respective time as HCs of the AU football team, Gus has done less than Gene Chizik.

wde

Good one. I guess this would be an inconvenient time to point out that as a head coach Chizik was 30-10 with Malzahn on staff and 8-28 without him.

It could be that Gus is a much better OC than HC. I think we will know when this season is over.

wde

Not an uncommon situation......can think of lots of Coordinators who did not make it as HC.....and most returned to their roles as Coordinator. Hope that's not the case here because if would be an expensive problem to solve....but I would not be amazed if that turned out to be the case.

I was under the impression that we brought in Gus Malzahn because our offense was broken without him. So far we have had elite offenses in 2013 and 2014, so I have no complaints. The defense has been bad at times, but we brought in Muschamp to address that. Now Muschamp defenses usually don't gel until year 2 so I'm not expecting much this year especially with us having to play so many TFresh, but I'm optimistic. Historically, what have we seen in the past that would not engender optimism for this coaching staff. You say all you want is someone who can develop QBs? Well maybe we should shut down the team and just open up "Manning's Passing Academy Sattelite Campus in Auburn" Meanwhile, I am perfectly fine with Gus, Rhett, Craig and Co. consistently producing elite offenses.

[slipadeedoodah 24]

I do remember 2011 though. we had a ton of new guys on both sides of the ball. Our offense was producing for the first few games. Our defense looked bad against Clemson and I remember the next game we took Spurrier completely by surprise by slowing our offense WAAAAY down and won the game. However, after that game it seems like everyone adjusted to our new style and we didn't produce for the rest of the year. Also, I believe Trotter injured his shoulder. I don't know if Chizik made Gus slow it down or it was just a really bad year for him. I do know that this was pretty much the only year Malzahn struggled to put a good offense on the field. Regardless, Gus brought in Marshall to fix the QB issue in 2013. There's no reason he couldn't have gone QB shopping in 2012 if TrotterFrazierMoseley wasn't going to cut it.

[chimesAU 89]

"I've been to practices in the past, and have seen Nick Marshall ask DC for pointers."

You call this concrete evidence of Lashlee's incompetence?

Sounds like you're taking this very personally.

I do take it personally because I like to watch this team play. Win or lose. We aren't paying our coach Nick Saban money or Jim Harbaugh money. Say what you want about proven commodities. You get what you pay for. Malzahn is paid an average SEC salary. He makes less than Sumlin and has accomplished more. So why you guys expect this team to not have off years like this is beyond me. If Malzahn made 10 mil a year I would expect an SEC title every year. Otherwise y'all need to accept this isn't our year and enjoy the games we do win.

LOL. Gus' salary is fair based on his first two seasons as HC (1 very good year that exceeded expectations followed by a year that failed to meet expectations. Should we not win at least 9 regular season games this season with a win over spuat or uga included in those 9 wins then Gus needs to give part of his salary back to AU.

wde

OK, lets get back on track and address the coaching issue and not how much they make; but how well they coach.

Ok, lets do that. Thus far; at the same time in their respective time as HCs of the AU football team, Gus has done less than Gene Chizik.

wde

Good one. I guess this would be an inconvenient time to point out that as a head coach Chizik was 30-10 with Malzahn on staff and 8-28 without him.

Correlation does not imply causation.

That is some really, REALLY strong correlation.

Maybe, maybe not. There are a ton of variables at play. Not even sure how you could compare his time at Iowa State, a perennial bottom-dweller. Malzahn could've seen the ship sinking *cough2011cough* and got out just before it all went to hell.

And I'm not defending Chiz's goofy a** or Loeffler...just saying there are WAY more variables at play than you seem to acknowledge.

So Malzahn left because he knew things were going to be bad in 2012, yet he willingly came back one year later and won the SEC?

You seem to be skipping the part where he got an enormous pay raise and was bumped to "head coach". It's been widely acknowledged by many close to the program that Chiz's tenure was a smoldering dumpster fire.

[AURealist 2,185]

Chizik

1st year with Gus w/o Cam:.........8-5 : 3-5

2nd year with Gus with Cam:.......14-0 : 8:0

3rd year with Gus w/o Cam..........8-5 : 4-4

4th year with no Gus...............3-9 : 0-8

Malzahn

1st Year w/NM.....................12-2 : 7-1

2nd Year w/NM......................8-5 : 4-4

3rd Year w/JJ......................2-0 : 0-0

--------------------------------------------

Gus running the Offense seems to be a factor.

A solid QB seems to be a factor. (8-5)

A solid QB playing well seems to be a factor.

Defense playing well seems to be a factor.

A great QB playing well seems to be a big factor.

I'd prefer Gus call the Offense as much as possible.

I'd get the absolute best QB coach I could find.

If JJ gets solid + first year DC: 8-5?

These observations are not statistically based and are for entertainment / discussion purposes only!

[slipadeedoodah 24]

I'd prefer Gus call the Offense as much as possible.

I'd get the absolute best QB coach I could find.

That's fair, but I would insist on letting the season play out before we start handing out job evaluations.

Our offense has been very good the past 2 years with the current staff at the helm.

[AURealist 2,185]

I'd prefer Gus call the Offense as much as possible.

I'd get the absolute best QB coach I could find.

That's fair, but I would insist on letting the season play out before we start handing out job evaluations.

Our offense has been very good the past 2 years with the current staff at the helm.

Meant that as a general statement. This staff may very well get the QB play worked out, which would require no changes.

[AU64 10,122]

I'd prefer Gus call the Offense as much as possible.

I'd get the absolute best QB coach I could find.

That's fair, but I would insist on letting the season play out before we start handing out job evaluations.

Our offense has been very good the past 2 years with the current staff at the helm.

QB development has not been a strong point at AU in recent years....we've been fortunate to have some good recruits but it's hard to say that any were significantly better after their time at AU. I exclude Cam because he was as much a running back as a QB and his QB skills were not much improved in the year he was here.

JJ has ton of talent....has already been here two years.....but it's not too late to make sure his talent is fully developed .....

[slipadeedoodah 24]

I'd prefer Gus call the Offense as much as possible.

I'd get the absolute best QB coach I could find.

That's fair, but I would insist on letting the season play out before we start handing out job evaluations.

Our offense has been very good the past 2 years with the current staff at the helm.

QB development has not been a strong point at AU in recent years....we've been fortunate to have some good recruits but it's hard to say that any were significantly better after their time at AU. I exclude Cam because he was as much a running back as a QB and his QB skills were not much improved in the year he was here.

JJ has ton of talent....has already been here two years.....but it's not too late to make sure his talent is fully developed .....

Marshall improved drastically as a passer from his time at JUCO.

[keesler 5,924]

AU already has one of the best QB coaches in the conference on staff. I don't understand why he is utilized primarily for recruiting purposes?

[Auburn06 76]

They need to start by letting jj know that our Wr's are the ones in navy blue..

[AURealist 2,185]

AU already has one of the best QB coaches in the conference on staff. I don't understand why he is utilized primarily for recruiting purposes?

That's the question. If the current QB coach can't make this work, Gus need only swap a couple of job titles to try someone else.

[au75 75]

WOW Auburn has the wrong coaches in the wrong jobs. Everyone's an expert head coach now.