***Auburn 23 Vanderbilt 16 -- Post Game Thread***

[WinningTradition 95]

4 minutes ago, Charhair said:

Post game thoughts unfortunately include: 

man, it'd be nice to have Jovon right now

Negative

[johnnyAU 3,630]

So what is the club house consensus on Woody Barrett? I have heard nothing about him, but he has got to be as good of an option as JFIII at this point. 9 yds passing and a fumble in a half vs Vandy is obviously unacceptable. The coaches have shown no confidence in him in the passing game, so why not WB if SW can't go?

[Eagle-1 3,821]

14 hours ago, Mike4AU said:

If we don't have a reasonably healthy SW for the rest of the season, we will be in trouble.  I have zero confidence in the backup QBs. 

You guys haven't been paying attention. According to Gus the QB battle was neck, and neck. He couldn't decide who was going to be the starter until about a week before the start of the season, and then tried to play all three in the first game. I am about as disgusted as I have ever been with what I saw yesterday. You make a kid your backup quarterback that you will not let throw the ball, and call an entirely different offense when he is in the game, yet he is one play away from being your starter at any time. Now if Gus has made this young man the backup, and he is that big of a liability throwing the ball, then he has clearly failed in his job as head coach. This is not some Podunk high school in Arkansas, this is big time SEC football. Every one can pump sunshine all they want, but that was a total failure in coaching, and motivation we witnessed yesterday. If Franklin cannot throw the football with some reasonable success, then Gus better be finding him another option, because Sean does not look healthy to me. He gutted it out yesterday, but that shoulder is clearly bothering him, and limited his ability to get any real velocity on the ball.

[AubieAH3 238]

I totally agree that we need to just plan to burn the redshirt on Woody if Sean is not good to go. We are 2nd in the West with a serious shot at the SEC and an outside chance of a playoff spot. Time to throw everything but the kitchen sink at Jawja and Bammer. My 2 cents. 

It would be totally different if we were just trying to survive a mediocre season. This season has the potential to be great. 

[I_M4_AU 7,838]

24 minutes ago, Eagle-1 said:

You guys haven't been paying attention. According to Gus the QB battle was neck, and neck. He couldn't decide who was going to be the starter until about a week before the start of the season, and then tried to play all three in the first game. I am about as disgusted as I have ever been with what I saw yesterday. You make a kid your backup quarterback that you will not let throw the ball, and call an entirely different offense when he is in the game, yet he is one play away from being your starter at any time. Now if Gus has made this young man the backup, and he is that big of a liability throwing the ball, then he has clearly failed in his job as head coach. This is not some Podunk high school in Arkansas, this is big time SEC football. Every one can pump sunshine all they want, but that was a total failure in coaching, and motivation we witnessed yesterday. If Franklin cannot throw the football with some reasonable success, then Gus better be finding him another option, because Sean does not look healthy to me. He gutted it out yesterday, but that shoulder is clearly bothering him, and limited his ability to get any real velocity on the ball.

I feel your frustration, he picked up JFIII in the off season and a lot of pundits felt Gus was going the Dual Threat QB route.  I think Gus held onto that believe as long as he could, into the 3rd game of the season.  Gus does have a system that would suit either QB to run his offense this year, except (if appears) he doesn't trust JFIII to throw he ball.  All this you've stated, but to add to your observation, Gus was either arrogant enough or just too confident that he could develop JFIII into a SEC QB by the fall.  I believe Gus has had a "come to Jesus" meeting with himself and he is in a transition to becoming a better head coach, next week will tell a lot.

As for another option, where is Tyler Queen in his development?  No body mentions the young man, I know he had some shoulder issues, but he has taken a snap this year.

 

[Eagle-1 3,821]

12 minutes ago, AubieAH3 said:

I totally agree that we need to just plan to burn the redshirt on Woody if Sean is not good to go. We are 2nd in the West with a serious shot at the SEC and an outside chance of a playoff spot. Time to throw everything but the kitchen sink at Jawja and Bammer. My 2 cents. 

It would be totally different if we were just trying to survive a mediocre season. This season has the potential to be great. 

Seen this stated a few times before. Do not have any confidence in burning a redshirt, and inserting a young man who has never taken a snap in a college game. Anyway, when Auburn gets a new freshman QB, they are never ready, or can't seem to learn the offense fast enough. Freshman QB's only excel at other schools, never at Auburn. Jalen Hurts would take at least 2 years to learn the offense here.

[AU64 10,122]

48 minutes ago, Eagle-1 said:

You guys haven't been paying attention. According to Gus the QB battle was neck, and neck. He couldn't decide who was going to be the starter until about a week before the start of the season, and then tried to play all three in the first game. I am about as disgusted as I have ever been with what I saw yesterday. You make a kid your backup quarterback that you will not let throw the ball, and call an entirely different offense when he is in the game, yet he is one play away from being your starter at any time. Now if Gus has made this young man the backup, and he is that big of a liability throwing the ball, then he has clearly failed in his job as head coach. This is not some Podunk high school in Arkansas, this is big time SEC football. Every one can pump sunshine all they want, but that was a total failure in coaching, and motivation we witnessed yesterday. If Franklin cannot throw the football with some reasonable success, then Gus better be finding him another option, because Sean does not look healthy to me. He gutted it out yesterday, but that shoulder is clearly bothering him, and limited his ability to get any real velocity on the ball.

I'm pretty sure they have JF3 run the offense he seems capable of running based on practice.   They rolled the dice of JF# when they brought him to AU because there was NOTHING in his past that said he could take the QB job here....yet fans and some media jumped all over him as the next Nick M.   Looks to me the coaches have done everything possible to help him but he still not ready for the SEC....which is not Podunk.  

Fully disagree about the failure in coaching comment.....JF3 was not a prime QB candidate when he arrived and was not going to become one in a few months.   And yes....it's been confirmed that JF3 cannot throw a football with reasonable success which was demonstrated again yesterday.   

The failure will occur if the coaching staff does not come up with a #2 by next week...'cause IMO, JF3, like JJ has eliminated himself from that position. 

[johnnyAU 3,630]

4 minutes ago, Eagle-1 said:

Seen this stated a few times before. Do not have any confidence in burning a redshirt, and inserting a young man who has never taken a snap in a college game. Anyway, when Auburn gets a new freshman QB, they are never ready, or can't seem to learn the offense fast enough. Freshman QB's only excel at other schools, never at Auburn. Jalen Hurts would take at least 2 years to learn the offense here.

Dude, Jalen is a RB that throws a little. He'd do very well in Auburn's offense. He isn't doing anything complicated at UAt. 

We need a viable 2nd option, and that's on the coaching staff whether it's failure in development, trust or recruiting if we don't have one by UGA. 

[Eagle-1 3,821]

2 minutes ago, AU64 said:

I'm pretty sure they have JF3 run the offense he seems capable of running based on practice.   They rolled the dice of JF# when they brought him to AU because there was NOTHING in his past that said he could take the QB job here....yet fans and some media jumped all over him as the next Nick M.   Looks to me the coaches have done everything possible to help him but he still not ready for the SEC....which is not Podunk.  

Fully disagree about the failure in coaching comment.....JF3 was not a prime QB candidate when he arrived and was not going to become one in a few months.   And yes....it's been confirmed that JF3 cannot throw a football with reasonable success which was demonstrated again yesterday.   

The failure will occur if the coaching staff does not come up with a #2 by next week...'cause IMO, JF3, like JJ has eliminated himself from that position. 

You may be right. I'm not going to say that the kid cannot do something based off hearsay. I would like to know however, if he is not an option to throw the ball, and run your entire offense, what the hell is he doing being the no.2 QB at a major SEC program? More of Gus's learning on the job?

[AU64 10,122]

1 minute ago, Eagle-1 said:

You may be right. I'm not going to say that the kid cannot do something based off hearsay. I would like to know however, if he is not an option to throw the ball, and run your entire offense, what the hell is he doing being the no.2 QB at a major SEC program? More of Gus's learning on the job?

It's not hearsay....the coaches see him at practice 5 or 6 days a week....they know what he can and can't do.   

[Eagle-1 3,821]

1 minute ago, johnnyAU said:

Dude, Jalen is a RB that throws a little. He'd do very well in Auburn's offense. He isn't doing anything complicated at UAt. 

We need a viable 2nd option, and that's on the coaching staff whether it's failure in development, trust or recruiting if we don't have one by UGA. 

Don't sell Hurts short, dude, he throws as much as he has to. Based off what we've seen from our secondary the last 2 weeks, I'm pretty sure you will get to see plenty of it in about three weeks.

[Eagle-1 3,821]

4 minutes ago, AU64 said:

It's not hearsay....the coaches see him at practice 5 or 6 days a week....they know what he can and can't do.   

Then Gus is dumber than I thought.

[cole256 17,080]

25 minutes ago, AU64 said:

I'm pretty sure they have JF3 run the offense he seems capable of running based on practice.   They rolled the dice of JF# when they brought him to AU because there was NOTHING in his past that said he could take the QB job here....yet fans and some media jumped all over him as the next Nick M.   Looks to me the coaches have done everything possible to help him but he still not ready for the SEC....which is not Podunk.  

Fully disagree about the failure in coaching comment.....JF3 was not a prime QB candidate when he arrived and was not going to become one in a few months.   And yes....it's been confirmed that JF3 cannot throw a football with reasonable success which was demonstrated again yesterday.   

The failure will occur if the coaching staff does not come up with a #2 by next week...'cause IMO, JF3, like JJ has eliminated himself from that position. 

How was it demonstrated that he can't throw? And what is all the things coaches have done to help him. This was his first start, first year in the offense he got three throws, one was dropped the other he decided not to risk it and threw it away.....

[80Tiger 899]

3 minutes ago, cole256 said:

How was it demonstrated that he can't throw? And what is all the things coaches have done to help him. This was his first start, first year in the offense he got three throws, one was dropped the other he decided not to risk it and threw it away.....

Give it up Cole. According to most on here JF can't throw. I mean 9 yds says everything. Forget 4 passes and forget the drop (even though every other game we have to read about all of our receivers drops and how our receivers ran the wrong route when there is a incomplete). Forget that he has completed over 60% of his passes this year even though there hasn't been many throws. I hope my sarcasm is coming through. 

Dont get me wrong I am not advocating any QB change. SW is our QB and he is doing a good job. We need him to play. But I have about had it with the inconsistencies of how many on this board talk about our QB and their play. Many comments are just dumb without any knowledge or fact. To say JF3 can't throw or is wildly inaccurate is just stupid because we haven't seen enough to know. Then to read that some actually advocate playing Woody Barret at this point in the season is just beyond discussion. 

Anyway that is my rant and before anyone says it I know, I don't have to be here. I have noticed that those seem to have some knowledge are posting less and less. 

[Mike4AU 1,739]

Let's face it guys, yesterday's performance by JF3 showed that he is a project.  He is very fast, obviously, but his running ability is straight line only.  He lacks vision, lacks the moves of a true DT QB and has questionable judgment.  His passing ability can be described as timid.  At this point in his career, he has no business playing QB in the SEC.  Will he get better?  Beats me.  I'm sorry, but to me he looks like a HS QB.

If Gus had done a decent job of recruiting QB's, JF3 would be at a different position.  Given the choice between JJ and JF3, I'm going with JJ.

[bigbird 60,529]

41 minutes ago, 80Tiger said:

 To say JF3 can't throw or is wildly inaccurate is just stupid because we haven't seen enough to know.

 

Just because fans haven't seen it during a Saturday doesn't mean that he can or can't. However, the coaches, whose jobs are on the line, have. Logically, if he could throw effectively, then he would be given the chance during games. Conversely, if he was not effective passing, then he would be limited during games to minimize his exposure.  I have personally spoken to many that have been at practices throughout spring and this fall. They have expressed their opinions and they match up to what we are seeing when JF3 is in games. TIFWIW.

[Charhair 345]

1 hour ago, Eagle-1 said:

Then Gus is dumber than I thought.

The coaches brought jf3 to give him a chance to start and be a dynamic runner at QB. When they realized he wasn't very far along, they decided to postpone the QB race as long as possible to give jf3 every chance. 

As bigbird just mentioned, if the coaches had confidence in his throwing, when JF3 comes in he would throw the ball fairly often. 

Since he doesn't and 80-90% of the plays are runs when he is in, we can't believe much else other than he is a project at QB. Personally, I think he should look into changing positions at the years end and let woody or someone take over qb2. 

 

[80Tiger 899]

28 minutes ago, bigbird said:

Just because fans haven't seen it during a Saturday doesn't mean that he can or can't. However, the coaches, whose jobs are on the line, have. Logically, if he could throw effectively, then he would be given the chance during games. Conversely, if he was not effective passing, then he would be limited during games to minimize his exposure.  I have personally spoken to many that have been at practices throughout spring and this fall. They have expressed their opinions and they match up to what we are seeing when JF3 is in games. TIFWIW.

I understand that, you have a justification for what you say. That said those that I have talked to and attended practice everyday do not convey those same thoughts. 

To me though the issue was not as much yesterday than earlier in the year giving him more opportunities to throw in games to hone those skills if possible. The point is, he is our backup QB, to change to JJ or Woody Barrett would seem not logical at this point. 

[jAUSon 2,836]

how many games has jf3 played the entire 4th qtr without 1 pass attemp?t If he's your backup qb you get him back-up reps. this thing with playing jf3 and pulling out the playbook is a total coaching fail. we don't know as fans if we have a backup qb because we've not seen the staff call an actual game plan with him in, including yesterday, including clemson. admittedly he didn't perform well for aTm, but lets face it, these coaches have put us deep into the season without giving our back-up an opportunity to gain experience in all these appearances, and none of us have any business declaring he can't throw, because he has almost 2 hours of game experience this season alone during which the coaches didn't call for him to. I'm down with s.w.. I'm down with crl, and cgm, but this stuff looks to be handled wrong, and this staff has developed a reputation for letting injuries and necessity dictate our means of finding out our true strengths (pettway/o'line..etc). I'm just glad we got painted into the corner that allowed us to discover pettway. war eagle.

[Dan-0 479]

1 hour ago, Mike4AU said:

If Gus had done a decent job of recruiting QB's, JF3 would be at a different position.  Given the choice between JJ and JF3, I'm going with JJ.

That´s what I say, the choice seems clear to me. With the running game we have now, we need a backup QB who at least makes the defense respect the pass. With JF3 at QB they are just going to load the box, dare us to pass, and shut down the run. JJ has had his issues, but he has led the offense to some big wins; Arkansas 2014, Louisville 2015, and aTm 2015. I don´t think JF3´s passing will ever get there.

[AU64 10,122]

36 minutes ago, Dan-0 said:

That´s what I say, the choice seems clear to me. With the running game we have now, we need a backup QB who at least makes the defense respect the pass. With JF3 at QB they are just going to load the box, dare us to pass, and shut down the run. JJ has had his issues, but he has led the offense to some big wins; Arkansas 2014, Louisville 2015, and aTm 2015. I don´t think JF3´s passing will ever get there.

If finding and developing a QB to play at a high level in the SEC were as easy as some folks seem to think, UF, LSU, Georgia and several other schools would not be stuck where they are and even the great bama having to depend on a freshman?  who would have believed it ?  IMO, Hurts is made to look good by his surrounding cast and I expect JF3  might look pretty good over there too.

Quarterback seems to be a unique position in sports.....about the only position I know where there is only one player at the position who sees active time....where the starter plays every game of the season, typically without a comparably skilled back-up.     Shoot, even the NFL with all of the money it has....many teams don't have a good starter and barely a single team has a decent back-up QB.  And it is a rare college team that is not in serious trouble if the starter goes down.  

Blame our problem on Gus if it makes you feel good....but some of the commentary makes me wonder whether some posters even know what goes on at other schools as far as player development and QBs are concerned.....or how difficult it is to find even one QB who can play at the SEC level.    

[johnnyAU 3,630]

I do hope we see the arrival of Stidham to the Plains next season. Should make for a good QB battle, and hopefully a few capable options behind center. 

Having said that, I really like what Sean has done this season. The team seems to rally behind him.

[cole256 17,080]

1 hour ago, 80Tiger said:

I understand that, you have a justification for what you say. That said those that I have talked to and attended practice everyday do not convey those same thoughts. 

To me though the issue was not as much yesterday than earlier in the year giving him more opportunities to throw in games to hone those skills if possible. The point is, he is our backup QB, to change to JJ or Woody Barrett would seem not logical at this point. 

Also we can look at sw himself. Remember everybody saying he can do more why doesn't Gus use him different? Or during the spring the fact that there was even a qb battle? And how sw was brought along in general, remember when we played San Jose st?  They only gave him something like ten attempts? 

And actually even if that is true with the plays called he didn't do anything wrong besides that fumble....And as far as that fumble NOBODY has brought up Cox in that play....

But unless they put him out there and wr are running wide open and he's not hitting them no you can't tell me that last game showed that he shouldn't even be at the qb spot

[homersapien 11,373]

Our offense will not work against good defenses without an effective passing game.  

If JF3 is not capable of effective passing, then our backup QB has to be JJ.  Alabama will eat us alive without a passing threat.

[Eagle-1 3,821]

7 hours ago, AU64 said:

If finding and developing a QB to play at a high level in the SEC were as easy as some folks seem to think, UF, LSU, Georgia and several other schools would not be stuck where they are and even the great bama having to depend on a freshman?  who would have believed it ?  IMO, Hurts is made to look good by his surrounding cast and I expect JF3  might look pretty good over there too.

Quarterback seems to be a unique position in sports.....about the only position I know where there is only one player at the position who sees active time....where the starter plays every game of the season, typically without a comparably skilled back-up.     Shoot, even the NFL with all of the money it has....many teams don't have a good starter and barely a single team has a decent back-up QB.  And it is a rare college team that is not in serious trouble if the starter goes down.  

Blame our problem on Gus if it makes you feel good....but some of the commentary makes me wonder whether some posters even know what goes on at other schools as far as player development and QBs are concerned.....or how difficult it is to find even one QB who can play at the SEC level.    

Good points, but does not excuse the fact that at a big time SEC program like Auburn we have a backup QB who is incapable of completing just a few timely passes, especially one who is a threat to break a touchdown run any time he touches the ball. We heard the same things about NM, and his passing, he did miss some big passing opportunities, but he did prove that he did not need to be Tom Brady to be effective. Just the threat that he may throw deep at any time kept the defense somewhat honest. I will not believe that JF3 cannot at least be a serviceable backup until I see him given the opportunity to run the complete playbook. Basically what I have seen from Lashlee when he has played is just a variation of the wildcat.  Say what you want, but if JF3 cannot throw at all, and is your backup QB, you have failed miserably as a coach.