Chuck Person

[AUDub 11,155]

6 minutes ago, WeagleAU said:

This keeps being said,  is there information out there you know about that can substantiate auburn being implicated in wrong doing?  I have seen no sources pointing to auburn being involved in wrong doing by feds or NCAA.

They, the NCAA, got rid of plausible deniability 4 years ago. If they want to hammer us, they can. Rogue or not, we can be hammered for Chuck's actions.

But, again, if this blows up and many, many schools are implicated, what's the NCAA to do? Punish everybody? Fat chance, and if anyone will be made an example of, it's the 'ville with their repeat offender status.

[TigerFanAU 586]

6 minutes ago, Bigbens42 said:

Not on the federal side, on the NCAA side of things, however...

No one can seem to answer what Auburn should have been doing to stop Chuck Person's actions regarding an NCAA issue. The AD wasn't aware, the head coach wasn't aware. If you read FBI affidavit it clearly states CCP and the paid player(s) agreed to keep it quiet and between themselves.  I'm not sure what more our compliance department could have done. Was  Auburn supposed to audit his bank accounts or something? Monitor his deposits? He even used a burner cell phone if I read correctly.  I just don't see where the NCAA has a lead here with this being spread across several major universites and isolated to greedy assistance coaches.

[AU64 10,122]

Up until a few hours ago, Chuck Person was an employee in good standing at Auburn.   Hard to make the case that Auburn is not going to be held accountable to some extent in what he did.    Also....seems that one or maybe two players will no longer be eligible which will greatly change our prospects for the coming season and I guess could have some effect on the past season also.   

What looked like a promising basketball season has suddenly gone into the toilet IMO

[AUDub 11,155]

9 minutes ago, TigerFanAU said:

No one can seem to answer what Auburn should have been doing to stop Chuck Person's actions regarding an NCAA issue. The AD wasn't aware, the head coach wasn't aware. If you read FBI affidavit it clearly states CCP and the paid player(s) agreed to keep it quiet and between themselves.  I'm not sure what more our compliance department could have done. Was  Auburn supposed to audit his bank accounts or something? Monitor his deposits? He even used a burner cell phone if I read correctly.  I just don't see where the NCAA has a lead here with this being spread across several major universites and isolated to greedy assistance coaches.

It doesn't matter. As I said in the prior post, the plausible deniability defense doesn't hold water with the NCAA anymore. Our best hope is that this blows up too big for the NCAA to focus on only a handful of programs.

And there's no question that needs to happen. CBB is dirty as hell and has been for years.

[AU64 10,122]

2 minutes ago, Bigbens42 said:

It doesn't matter. As I said in the prior post, the plausible deniability defense doesn't hold water with the NCAA anymore. Our best hope is that this blows up too big for the NCAA to focus on only a handful of programs.

And there's no question that probably needs to happen. CBB is dirty as hell and has been for years.

Yep.....and notice somewhere in one of the reports was a link of one "agent" or whatever he is, to some AAU team also.    Unfortunately the AAU program has become corrupted by enough people that it's dangerous for a college coach to get very close to it..   Just me perhaps, but I always get nervous when I read of an AU prospect being touted by an AAU coach.

[IronMan70 3,277]

21 minutes ago, abw0004 said:

I can almost guarantee it started with the financial advisor.  Taking away what the advisor did, the SEC (through the FBI) would not have gotten involved.  It would have been just the NCAA.  Since the FBI was involved, they were the ones first in on this.  The FBI only cared about the advisor in this case because he was involved in a felony on an SEC level.  When you attain your Series 6 and 63, or Series 7 and 66 (what I have) you have to be registered with the SEC and on the FBI database, fingerprints and all.  This permits the SEC to track every single move you make and your firm is audited once or twice a year at random.  Chuck would not have been registered with the SEC so would only have been tracking him through the transactions of the advisor.

Right, right, but Chuck still could have been the one who made the first contact with the informant. If the informant did make the first contact you wonder why he picked Person. Sounds like the informant contacted a lot of people in this sting operation.

[TigerFanAU 586]

3 minutes ago, Bigbens42 said:

As I said in the prior post, the plausible deniability defense doesn't hold water with the NCAA anymore.

This isn't the same thing as boosters paying players to win games. It was an FBI investigation. From what I've read, neither Auburn nor the NCAA knew about it. Person's tendered money while the financial advisor was undercover for the FBI, therefore falling into their trap and committing a crime. I would think this is one of the more easier cases.  Even the mainstream media is running with the financial tycoon paying off NCAA coaches.

[wdefromtx 3,159]

1 minute ago, IronMan70 said:

Right, right, but Chuck still could have been the one who made the first contact with the informant. If the informant did make the first contact you wonder why he picked Person. Sounds like the informant contacted a lot of people in this sting operation.

The informant was in contact with Michel (the NY suit guy), who already knew Person. He hooked them up knowing that Person would be willing to be bribed. 

[PowerOfDixieland 3,226]

2 hours ago, TigerFanAU said:

this is not the time nor the situation to fire JJ. 

You're so right.  This is just another time for him to be fired.  This is the time he should have the absolute crap kicked out of him.  How do you let the program being run by the coach that you hired and waited to finish a show cause sanction allow this to happen????  Of all the offices that should be cleaned with bleach daily, it' basketball.  Good God how do people not see just how stupid and unqualified Jay Jacobs is?   Something like this was bound to happen, it was only a matter of time.

[AUDub 11,155]

Just now, TigerFanAU said:

This isn't the same thing as boosters paying players to win games. It was an FBI investigation. From what I've read, neither Auburn nor the NCAA knew about it. Person's tendered money while the financial advisor was undercover for the FBI, therefore falling into their trap and committing a crime. I would think this is one of the more easier cases.  Even the mainstream media is running with the financial tycoon paying off NCAA coaches.

The NCAA will simply term the money paid to the players impermissible benefits and nail us anyway. Only difference is this time the NCAA doesn't have to do their own investigation. The FBI handed them the evidence on a silver platter.

Once again, it doesn't really matter if we knew or not. That doesn't fly with the NCAA anymore.

The fact that it's so widespread will hopefully benefit us, but if the investigation doesn't go beyond the schools currently implicated, get ready to get hit hard.

[selias 2,398]

13 minutes ago, Bigbens42 said:

It doesn't matter. As I said in the prior post, the plausible deniability defense doesn't hold water with the NCAA anymore. Our best hope is that this blows up too big for the NCAA to focus on only a handful of programs.

And there's no question that needs to happen. CBB is dirty as hell and has been for years.

This isn't plausible deniability. If I've been following the story correctly, this is a case of the feds having CCP on wiretaps talking about keeping it quiet and between only CCP and the player in question. There's a reason CCP was immediately suspended without pay and CBP is still on campus. There's nothing AU could have done about this short of auditing the personal bank accounts of all coaches in all sports.

[monsterdb 3]

NCAA Division I Bylaw 11.1.1.1 states that a head coach is presumed to be responsible for the actions of all staff members who report, directly or indirectly, to the head coach. The head coach will be held accountable for violations in the program unless he or she can rebut the presumption of responsibility.Feb 8, 2016

[tigerbrotha12 2,362]

So what're we looking at if we do get hit 

[selias 2,398]

Just now, monsterdb said:

NCAA Division I Bylaw 11.1.1.1 states that a head coach is presumed to be responsible for the actions of all staff members who report, directly or indirectly, to the head coach. The head coach will be held accountable for violations in the program unless he or she can rebut the presumption of responsibility.Feb 8, 2016

The FBI saying the schools were defrauded is a pretty solid rebuttal to go along with the wiretaps.

[AUDub 11,155]

Just now, tigerbrotha12 said:

So what're we looking at if we do get hit 

It will be better than whatever Louisville gets, so take comfort in that.

[AUIH1 1,515]

16 minutes ago, TigerFanAU said:

This isn't the same thing as boosters paying players to win games. It was an FBI investigation. From what I've read, neither Auburn nor the NCAA knew about it. Person's tendered money while the financial advisor was undercover for the FBI, therefore falling into their trap and committing a crime. I would think this is one of the more easier cases.  Even the mainstream media is running with the financial tycoon paying off NCAA coaches.

This is worse because it was an employee of AU paying players and families while representing AU.

wde

[TigerFanAU 586]

6 minutes ago, AUIH1 said:

This is worse because it was an employee of AU paying players and families while representing AU.

Look at the motive. The motive was for Chuck Person to get richer. He didn't care about wins or the program. He cared about himself only. The FBI has called the schools the victims.

[AU64 10,122]

13 minutes ago, PowerOfDixieland said:

You're so right.  This is just another time for him to be fired.  This is the time he should have the absolute crap kicked out of him.  How do you let the program being run by the coach that you hired and waited to finish a show cause sanction allow this to happen????  Of all the offices that should be cleaned with bleach daily, it' basketball.  Good God how do people not see just how stupid and unqualified Jay Jacobs is?   Something like this was bound to happen, it was only a matter of time.

Funny....thought I was about the only person on this forum who was against the hiring of Bruce.... who seemed to have almost unanimous approval from this forum.   AU seems to have affinity for coaches with baggage perhaps. 

But...with all the mess today,   I'm not holding JJ or BP accountable until a whole lot more information comes out on the issue.     Funny thing of course is that lots of people lobbied for CP as our HC during the hiring process and now look where we are.

Guess maybe the lesson ..or at least one of them is.....nobody in the school administration should pay a lick of attention to what people who populate these kinds of sports blogs and forums have to say when they are in the mode of hiring or firing a coach. .

Meanwhile....glad to see thus far that Dr Leath is the voice of Auburn on this matter.    We are going to need a really good reputation rehabilitation expert before this is all over. JMO

[OnthePlains 2,014]

I don't think this is gonna be as bad with the NCAA as some are but it will definitely hurt from the standpoint of potentially losing two important players this year.  This was supposed to be the year Pearl made his run to the tournament and without the two (presumed) players we all think it will probably sink those hopes.  This puts BP another year back in his rebuild and maybe having to start all over again depending on what happens.  So frustrating for Auburn on so many levels.  One sport we were all so proud of and enjoying watching(softball) has been hurt with scandal and now a program we had high hopes for is getting rocked by another scandal.  I'm getting scared to even turn on a computer to see whats next.

[AUIH1 1,515]

3 minutes ago, TigerFanAU said:

Look at the motive. The motive was for Chuck Person to get richer. He didn't care about wins or the program. He cared about himself only. The FBI has called the schools the victims.

The FBI is not the NCAA when it comes to assigning fault.  The NCAA is going in deep and hard on AU.  We hired a guy who had been given a show cause timeout by the NCAA as our HC the virtual minute he came off of show cause.  Now, that HC's associate head coach has just been arrested by the FBI.  What world do you live in to not think AU is likely to get our ass kicked by the NCAA.  I agree about the motive of Person and his character.  I would bet, had anyone told you before today, that Person was a cheating POS, you would have blindly defended him because he was an "Auburn Man".  LOL

[AlaskanFAN 1,666]

The FBI says the whole investigation is still ongoing and gave out a tip # and said call us before we call you. I know other school mentioned that are being looked at are Louisville and Miami what are some of the others?

(Heard this on ESPN talk radio discussion shortly after the FBI announcement).

[AUIH1 1,515]

I am encouraged that Leath seems to have stuck a sock in Jay Jacob's mouth regarding this.  After the embarassing memo/letter JJ sent out about the softball situation, Leath is probably asking for a raise to have to deal with the idiocracy that is our AD.

wde

[keesler 5,924]

29 minutes ago, TigerFanAU said:

No one can seem to answer what Auburn should have been doing to stop Chuck Person's actions regarding an NCAA issue. The AD wasn't aware, the head coach wasn't aware. If you read FBI affidavit it clearly states CCP and the paid player(s) agreed to keep it quiet and between themselves.  I'm not sure what more our compliance department could have done. Was  Auburn supposed to audit his bank accounts or something? Monitor his deposits? He even used a burner cell phone if I read correctly.  I just don't see where the NCAA has a lead here with this being spread across several major universites and isolated to greedy assistance coaches.

What can any school Administration do to stop representatives acting on their behalf from choosing to break the law or NCAA rules? 

Educate the coaches, educate the student-athletes and their parents/legal guardians?  That's about all an institution can do.  That doesn't change the fact that people act on their own free will and choose to break the law and the rules of their employer.  Athletes get paid, and the damn parents of athletes knowingly sell their kid to the highest bidder and take a money grab at the first opportunity.  That doesn't change the fact that a school may employ a greedy coach looking out for himself, or a pervert coach preying on female student-athletes in order to satisfy his own lust and ego.   That doesn't change the fact that student-athletes and their parents have their hand out at the first sign they have the athletic talent to cash in on that talent. 

Stuff happens, bad/illegal stuff happens.  Unfortunately Auburn seems to be in the negative spotlight with more than one of our athletic programs.

[DAG 33,997]

What a freaking idiot . How selfish can you be? And how terrible do you have to be at bribing with the assortment of players we have . 

[SCTiger2011 1,281]

4 minutes ago, AUIH1 said:

I am encouraged that Leath seems to have stuck a sock in Jay Jacob's mouth regarding this.  After the embarassing memo/letter JJ sent out about the softball situation, Leath is probably asking for a raise to have to deal with the idiocracy that is our AD.

wde

While his response was strong and needed, let's not raise Leath to the almighty standard of propriety and leadership...still disagree extremely with both the process of his hiring and his hiring, but I digress...

back to our regularly scheduled Auburn Soap Opera of Self-Imposed Foot-Shooting ?