Do we care about budget deficits / national debt anymore?

[homersapien 11,382]

2 hours ago, bigbird said:

I'm not disagreeing.  I am saying it goes both ways.  '09-'11 Dems controlled the Senate 56-42 with two independents, Bernie Sanders and Joe Lieberman. They also controlled the house 255-179.  Nothing was done.

 

Look, I think both parties are corrupt and are run by the fringe. That said, there will never be a compromise to balance the budget because Dems won't cut spending and Repubs won't raise taxes.  I'm for doing both...

This had little to do do with fiscal policy.  One cannot balance the budget while responding to the worst recession and banking crisis short of the great depression.

And the parties aren't run by the "fringe", they are run by powerful moneyed interests.  The fringe is only deployed for winning elections.

[bigbird 60,549]

1 minute ago, homersapien said:

This had little to do do with fiscal policy.  One cannot balance the budget while responding.

And the parties aren't run by the "fringe", they are run by powerful moneyed interests.  The fringe is only deployed for winning elections.

Okay

[homersapien 11,382]

On 10/4/2018 at 10:29 AM, bigbird said:

Okay

Sorry, but I left off part of my first sentence.

But what I said is true.  Modern politics is all about raising money for campaigning.  The choices for a given politician - of either party - is to do the right thing and be voted out of office or to raise enough money to stay in office by doing whatever it takes. 

Money talks, period.  The whole system is corrupt and will remain so until we seriously limit the power of money in the election process.

 

[bigbird 60,549]

2 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Sorry, but I left off part of my first sentence.

But what I said is true.  Modern politics is all about raising money for campaigning.  The choices for a given politician - of either party - is to do the right thing or be voted out of office. 

Money talks, period.  The whole system is corrupt and will remain so until we seriously limit the power of money in the election process.

 

Okay

[RunInRed 16,422]

Federal budget deficit surges to highest level in 6 years at $779 billion

Economy Oct 15, 2018 4:15 PM EDT

WASHINGTON — The federal budget deficit has surged to $779 billion in fiscal 2018, its highest level in six years as President Donald Trump’s tax cuts caused the government to borrow more heavily in order to cover its spending.

The Treasury Department said Monday that the deficit climbed $113 billion from fiscal 2017. Debt will likely worsen in the coming years with the Trump administration expecting the deficit to top $1 trillion in 2019, nearly matching the $1.1 trillion imbalance from 2012.

The deficit worsened because tax revenues are not keeping pace with government spending. The government’s fiscal year runs from October to September, unlike calendar years that begin in January. Tax revenues were essentially flat in fiscal 2018, while spending increased 3.2 percent as Congress gave more funds for military and domestic programs.

 

The deficit worsened because tax revenues are not keeping pace with government spending.

Revenues generally tumbled after December when Trump signed into law $1.5 trillion of tax cuts over the next decade. The tax cuts have caused economic growth to accelerate this year with Federal Reserve officials anticipating gains of 3.1 percent. But the Trump administration initially promised that the tax cuts would pay for themselves through stronger growth — and there is no sign so far of that happening.

“The budget numbers make very clear that the faster growth isn’t stopping the deficit from increasing,” said Marc Goldwein, senior policy director for the Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget, a group that advocates for lower deficits.

Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin suggested in a statement that the underlying source of the widening deficit was growth in government spending, rather than the tax cuts.

“Going forward the President’s economic policies that have stimulated strong economic growth, combined with proposals to cut wasteful spending, will lead America toward a sustainable financial path,” Mnuchin said.

But William Gale, a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, noted that the tax cuts are unlikely to generate a long-term bump in economic growth. More importantly, most estimates suggest that the deficit will worsen as spending on Social Security, Medicare and other programs increase with the aging baby boomer population.

Gale said it’s generally better to reduce the deficit when the economy has improved, which can minimize the sting of any changes to spending and prevent steeper cuts to spending in the future.

The cost of financing the deficit have increased following Trump’s tax cuts, with the interest charged on the 10-year U.S. Treasury note rising to roughly 3.15 percent from 2.46 percent at the start of the calendar year.

“By cutting taxes in 2017 when the economy was already quite strong, Congress and the administration not only missed a golden opportunity to begin to address the fiscal problem, they actually made the problem worse,” he said.

The Trump administration in July sharply revised higher its deficit estimates for coming years when it released its mid-session budget review.

It projected the 2019 deficit will hit $1.09 trillion and will total $1.08 trillion in 2020 and $1.01 trillion in 2021 before once again dipping slightly below the $1 trillion mark in 2021 with a projected deficit of $952 billion.

The only other period when the federal government has run deficits above $1 trillion was for four years from 2009 through 2011. That’s when the Obama administration was using tax cuts and increased spending, along with support for the banking system, to combat the 2008 financial crisis and Great Recession, the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression of the 1930s.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/federal-budget-deficit-surges-to-highest-level-in-6-years-at-779-billion

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

^^^^ It's worth it to get Kavanaugh on the SCOTUS

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

56 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

^^^^ It's worth it to get Kavanaugh on the SCOTUS

The future thanks your support of fiscal irresponsibility.

[TitanTiger 20,495]

8 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

^^^^ It's worth it to get Kavanaugh on the SCOTUS

^^^^^Full-on Kool Aid Drinker

At least it lays bare the lie that conservatives care about fiscal responsibility. They’d sell their souls for a SCOTUS justice. Or to defend, minimize, or excuse whatever rotten thing Trump says or does. 

Golden calves are not always literally made of gold and in the form of a calf. 

[homersapien 11,382]

12 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

^^^^ It's worth it to get Kavanaugh on the SCOTUS

Because of Roe v. Wade?

 

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

5 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

^^^^^Full-on Kool Aid Drinker

At least it lays bare the lie that conservatives care about fiscal responsibility. They’d sell their souls for a SCOTUS justice. Or to defend, minimize, or excuse whatever rotten thing Trump says or does. 

Golden calves are not always literally made of gold and in the form of a calf. 

Trump made Kool Aid great again

[TitanTiger 20,495]

3 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

Trump made Kool Aid great again

That's the most expensive Kool Aid in the history of the world.  And my kids and grandkids will suffer the consequences - all because rubes like you will let this oaf get away with anything.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

24 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

That's the most expensive Kool Aid in the history of the world.  And my kids and grandkids will suffer the consequences - all because rubes like you will let this oaf get away with anything.

And your family will benefit from a conservative SCOTUS long after you are old and more mature, maybe being able to make posts here without the little insults.

Surely you know that Congress has as much, if not more, to do with the debt than the President.

[TitanTiger 20,495]

19 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

And your family will benefit from a conservative SCOTUS long after you are old and more mature, maybe being able to make posts here without the little insults.

Surely you know that Congress has as much, if not more, to do with the debt than the President.

Trump can veto anything he wants to.  He pushed for the tax cuts without corresponding cuts in spending and what he signed is pretty much what he asked for.  Don't pawn this off on Congress.  

Truth of the matter is, he's not a conservative.  And neither are you.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

11 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Trump can veto anything he wants to.  He pushed for the tax cuts without corresponding cuts in spending and what he signed is pretty much what he asked for.  Don't pawn this off on Congress.  

Truth of the matter is, he's not a conservative.  And neither are you.

Truth is often in the eye of the beholder.

[TitanTiger 20,495]

Just now, Proud Tiger said:

Truth is often in the eye of the beholder.

In this case it isn't.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

1 hour ago, TitanTiger said:

In this case it isn't.

Sure it is because we disagree. But I agree with the words of George Roof, Chief Master Sgt. USAF (retired) who wrote:

"The debt is important but Trump has done more more in his short time than any Pres. before him. And best of all, he prevented Hillary Clinton from becoming Pres. and likely a soaring debt with her liberal ways."

[TitanTiger 20,495]

1 minute ago, Proud Tiger said:

No surprise we disagree. But I agree withe the words of George Root, Chief Master Sgt. (retired) who wrote:

"The debt is important but Trump has done more more in his short time than any Pres. before him. And best of all, he prevented Hillary Clinton from becoming Pres. and likely a soaring debt with her liberal ways."

This is idiotic.  She couldn't have done any worse than he's done with debt.  Maybe that bedtime story comforts you, but anyone with functioning brain cells sees it for the fairyland bull**** that it is.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

5 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

This is idiotic.  She couldn't have done any worse than he's done with debt.  Maybe that bedtime story comforts you, but anyone with functioning brain cells sees it for the fairyland bull**** that it is.

Well I guess you just have a higher (false) opinion of yourself than the highest ranking civilian in the USAF that I quoted. Of course I doubt you are even familiar with the rank.

[TitanTiger 20,495]

1 minute ago, Proud Tiger said:

Well I guess you just have a higher false opinion of yourself than the highest ranking civilian in the USAF that I quoted.

I don't care who you quoted.  He's no more of an economist than I am a quantum physicist.  You might be easily swayed by the logical fallacy of arguments from authority, but I'm not.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

1 minute ago, TitanTiger said:

I don't care who you quoted.  He's no more of an economist than I am a quantum physicist.  You might be easily swayed by the logical fallacy of arguments from authority, but I'm not.

Maybe that's one of your problems. Carry on with them and enjoy.

[TitanTiger 20,495]

7 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

Maybe that's one of your problems. Carry on with them and enjoy.

Yes, my problem is that I don't fall for logical fallacies.  Good grief. 

All this exchange tells me is that you don't know what a logical fallacy is.

[AUDub 11,153]

35 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

Sure it is because we disagree. But I agree with the words of George Root, Chief Master Sgt. USAF (retired) who wrote:

"The debt is important but Trump has done more more in his short time than any Pres. before him. And best of all, he prevented Hillary Clinton from becoming Pres. and likely a soaring debt with her liberal ways."

I'm sorry, but who? 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chief_Master_Sergeant_of_the_Air_Force

[homersapien 11,382]

2 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

And your family will benefit from a conservative SCOTUS long after you are old and more mature, maybe being able to make posts here without the little insults.

Surely you know that Congress has as much, if not more, to do with the debt than the President.

How so?

[TitanTiger 20,495]

1 hour ago, AUDub said:

I'm sorry, but who? 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chief_Master_Sergeant_of_the_Air_Force

He's not listed as every being the Chief Master Sgt of the USAF, @Proud Tiger.  Who is this guy?

[TexasTiger 12,940]

4 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

He's not listed as every being the Chief Master Sgt of the USAF, @Proud Tiger.  Who is this guy?

More fake news from Proud.