Surge of illegal homemade machine guns has helped fuel gun violence in the US

[Auburn85 432]

https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/surge-illegal-homemade-machine-guns-helped-fuel-gun-107960210

 

 

Quote

 

By LINDSAY WHITEHURST Associated Press

March 9, 2024, 6:49 AM

 

WASHINGTON -- Eleven-year-old Domonic Davis was not far from his mom's Cincinnati home when a hail of gunfire sprayed out from a passing car. Nearly two dozen rounds hurtled through the night at a group of children in the blink of an eye.

Four other children and a woman were hurt in the November shooting that killed Domonic, who had just made his school basketball team.

“What happened? How does this happen to an 11-year-old? He was only a few doors down,” his father, Issac Davis, said.

The shooting remains under investigation. But federal investigators believe the 22 shots could be fired off with lightning speed because the weapon had been illegally converted to fire like a machine gun.

Communities around the U.S. have seen shootings carried out with weapons converted to fully automatic in recent years, fueled by a staggering increase in small pieces of metal or plastic made with a 3D printer or ordered online. Laws against machine guns date back to the bloody violence of Prohibition-era gangsters. But the proliferation of devices known by nicknames such as Glock switches, auto sears and chips has allowed people to transform legal semi-automatic weapons into even more dangerous guns, helping fuel gun violence, police and federal authorities said.

“Police officers are facing down fully automatic weapon fire in amounts that haven’t existed in this country since the days of Al Capone and the Tommy gun,” said Steve Dettelbach, director of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, or ATF. "It’s a huge problem.”

The agency reported a 570% increase in the number of conversion devices collected by police departments between 2017 and 2021, the most recent data available.

Guns with conversion devices have been used in several mass shootings, including one that left four dead at a Sweet Sixteen party in Alabama last year and another that left six people dead at a bar district in Sacramento, California, in 2022. In Houston, police officer William Jeffrey died in 2021 after being shot with a converted gun while serving a warrant. In cities such as Indianapolis, police have seized them every week.

The devices that can convert legal semi-automatic weapons can be made on a 3D printer in about 35 minutes or ordered from overseas online for less than $30. They’re also quick to install.

Once in place, they modify the gun's machinery. Instead of firing one round each time the shooter squeezes the trigger, a semi-automatic weapon with a conversion device starts firing as soon as the trigger goes down and doesn’t stop until the shooter lets go or the weapon runs out of ammunition.

“You're seeing them a lot in stunning numbers, particularly in street violence,” said David Pucino, deputy chief counsel at Giffords Law Center.

In a demonstration by ATF agents, the firing of a semi-automatic outfitted with a conversion device was nearly indistinguishable from an automatic weapon. Conversion devices with differing designs can fit a range of different guns, enabling guns to fire at a rate of 800 or more bullets per minute, according to the ATF.

“It takes two or three seconds to put in some of these devices into a firearm to make that firearm into a machine gun instantly,” Dettelbach said.

Between 2012 and 2016, police departments in the U.S. found 814 conversion devices and sent them to the ATF. That number grew to more than 5,400 between 2017 and 2021, according to the agency's most recent data.

They took hold in Minneapolis in 2021, and helped fuel record-breaking gun violence that year, said police Chief Brian O'Hara. Along with spraying out bullets at a dizzying speed, switches make a gun much more difficult for the shooter to control, so more people can be hit by accident.

“The thing is shaking as it’s firing, so we wind up getting multiple victims, people hit in extremities during the same shooting incident, because the person cannot control the weapon," O'Hara said.

The city has seen a decline in their use since the September 2022 arrest of a man charged with selling switches that he had ordered from Russia and Taiwan or made himself, O'Hara said. But “it's still a very, very real problem,” he said. “This is having a really deep impact on families, on neighborhoods and communities.”

While the devices are considered illegal machine guns under federal law, many states don't have their own specific laws against them. In Indiana, police were finding them so often — multiple times a week in the state's capital — that the state changed the law to ensure it included switches.

“We have to update the laws regarding machine guns to deal with the problems of today," Indianapolis police Chief Chris Bailey said.

Only 15 states have their own laws against the possession, sale or manufacture of automatic-fire weapons, according to Giffords. Indiana was one of many states that have regulations with exceptions. Five states have no state-level machine-gun regulations at all.

But long before any prosecution, police have to find the conversion devices. Often about the size of a quarter, they can easily go unnoticed by the untrained eye after being installed, said Dettelbach.

He recalled visiting a Texas police department after the ATF hosted a training on conversion devices. Afterwards, the chief searched the weapons in the evidence room and found several with previously undetected conversion devices.

“These items don’t always look as dangerous as they are," he said. “If you see some of them, they're pieces of plastic and metal, and sometimes it’s even hard to recognize them when they’re actually on or in the firearm because they blend in.”

They're also increasingly a fixture online, in social media and rap lyrics, Davis said. “Everyone is talking about switches,” he said. “It’s a scary trend.”

Davis struggles to talk about the loss of his son. Domonic would often come with his dad on Fridays to get a haircut at the barber shop where Issac Davis works. The shooting also fell on a Friday, making the end of the week an especially tough time.

Davis hopes to start a foundation called For Every Eleven to fight gun violence and honor his son's memory.

“I still want to keep his name going," he said. "He deserved to be still relevant. So I have to keep going. No matter how much grief I grieve him in private.”

 

 

[DKW 86 7,439]

14 hours ago, Auburn85 said:

https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/surge-illegal-homemade-machine-guns-helped-fuel-gun-107960210

 

 

 

Last I read, handguns accounted for about 95+% of all gun deaths. Gun deaths is about 50% Suicides. So, the amount of gun deaths for SMGs is just about nil. 

[homersapien 11,427]

Hey, if assault rifles are ideal for home defense, auto conversions should be even better, right?

[homersapien 11,427]

6 hours ago, DKW 86 said:

Last I read, handguns accounted for about 95+% of all gun deaths. Gun deaths is about 50% Suicides. So, the amount of gun deaths for SMGs is just about nil. 

Are you serious?!

That's a crazy take even for you.

[DKW 86 7,439]

19 hours ago, homersapien said:

Are you serious?!

That's a crazy take even for you.

Here it comes Narrative Monkey...

And no, I do not expect you to believe PEW Research nor any other facts put forth here on this forum. I expect you to act like the loon you have always been and deny facts. Let me do the math for you. If we allow that all of the "other guns" were SMGs, they arent, but I am feeling very very very generous today, then we have

422/17000+ deaths = .025% of all deaths

or 422/14800 = .029% of gun deaths

AND hand gun deaths 17000-1149/17000 = 93.2%

Facts are indeed glorious things.

https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/04/26/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/

https://www.statista.com/statistics/195325/murder-victims-in-the-us-by-weapon-used/#:~:text=Murder victims by weapon used in the U.S 2022&text=Handguns are by far the,5%2C704 cases in that year.

Edited March 12 by DKW 86

[Gowebb11 9,362]

Guns, knives, rocks, fists: we are just way too violent, period. 

[CoffeeTiger 5,164]

32 minutes ago, Gowebb11 said:

Guns, knives, rocks, fists: we are just way too violent, period. 

I agree, humans are violent. Best solution I can think of is to just make guns easily available to everyone. 

What could possibly go wrong? 

[Mikey 16,711]

5 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said:

I agree, humans are violent. Best solution I can think of is to just make guns easily available to everyone. 

What could possibly go wrong? 

*sigh* For the umpteenth time: When guns are illegal, only criminals will have guns. That's true by definition.

If you favor gun control, the first thing you have to do is figure out how to get guns out of the hands of robbers, gang bangers and so forth. So far I haven't seen a workable solution to this. Anything that's been proposed simply makes the honest citizen a more attractive target for armed bad guys.

[CoffeeTiger 5,164]

11 minutes ago, Mikey said:

*sigh* For the umpteenth time: When guns are illegal, only criminals will have guns. That's true by definition.

If you favor gun control, the first thing you have to do is figure out how to get guns out of the hands of robbers, gang bangers and so forth. So far I haven't seen a workable solution to this. Anything that's been proposed simply makes the honest citizen a more attractive target for armed bad guys.

I agree. Like I said, the best solution I can think of is to just give everyone a gun and make the illegal guns easy to get. 

If we have enough Good Guys with GunsTM    on the streets then all this gun violence will have to eventually stop. 

The fact that we keep having gun violence problems is proof that we still don't have enough guns in America. 

I'm with you Mikey. 

[auburnatl1 5,007]

It’s not about guns,  it’s about the types and capabilities.

[Gowebb11 9,362]

1 hour ago, CoffeeTiger said:

I agree, humans are violent. Best solution I can think of is to just make guns easily available to everyone. 

What could possibly go wrong? 

I get the sense that you took my post out of context. Two things can be true at the same time. A person (like me) can believe we should have more sensible approaches to gun control while also believe that our society is too prone to violent solutions to problems. 

[homersapien 11,427]

2 hours ago, CoffeeTiger said:

I agree, humans are violent. Best solution I can think of is to just make guns easily available to everyone. 

What could possibly go wrong? 

And who cares if they've been converted to full auto?  It's only a small percentage. And so far, relatively few people have been killed by them. 

Edited March 12 by homersapien

[homersapien 11,427]

On 3/11/2024 at 7:12 AM, DKW 86 said:

Last I read, handguns accounted for about 95+% of all gun deaths. Gun deaths is about 50% Suicides. So, the amount of gun deaths for SMGs is just about nil. 

So, in your mind, that means proliferation of automatic weapons is not a problem at all. 

After  all, a problem is not a problem unless it's worse than every other problem. We can only address - or even be concerned about - one problem at a time - at least until it becomes comparable to a worse problem. 

There are more guns than there are people in this country.  What does it matter that more and more people are converting more and more guns to fully automatic?

That's quite a narrative you have going there, oh exalted one.

 

 

Edited March 12 by homersapien

[DKW 86 7,439]

3 hours ago, homersapien said:

So, in your mind, that means proliferation of automatic weapons is not a problem at all. 

After  all, a problem is not a problem unless it's worse than every other problem. We can only address - or even be concerned about - one problem at a time - at least until it becomes comparable to a worse problem. 

There are more guns than there are people in this country.  What does it matter that more and more people are converting more and more guns to fully automatic?

That's quite a narrative you have going there, oh exalted one.

I am correctly pointing out that some could not care less about the truth nor about gun deaths. The vast majority of that advocate group would be going after handguns. 

They arent because that was never the purpose.

[homersapien 11,427]

19 hours ago, DKW 86 said:

I am correctly pointing out that some could not care less about the truth nor about gun deaths. The vast majority of that advocate group would be going after handguns.

 

Well, your post sounded like you "could not care less" about the specific issue of converting guns to full automatic - what the OP was actually about.  And you cited statistics implying why why no one should care.  Go back an read it.

Then you went into full blown A hole snit mode. ("narrative monkey" )

Don't know why I ever respond to you.  You are so inconsistent in your responses.  Sometimes rational, other times you are a complete jerk.

I should have left you on ignore.

[DKW 86 7,439]

1 hour ago, homersapien said:

Well, your post sounded like you "could not care less" about the specific issue of converting guns to full automatic - what the OP was actually about.  And you cited statistics implying why why no one should care.  Go back an read it.

Then you went into full blown A hole snit mode. ("narrative monkey" )

Don't know why I ever respond to you.  You are so inconsistent in your responses.  Sometimes rational, other times you are a complete jerk.

I should have left you on ignore.

love you too buddy...

But guns that fire automatic are such a small part of the problem that they are negligible.

Edited March 13 by DKW 86

[homersapien 11,427]

8 minutes ago, DKW 86 said:

love you too buddy...

But guns that fire automatic are such a small part of the problem that they are negligible.

Not to the LEO's who may have to face them, or to the victims of the next mass shooting, or to the "collateral" damage in the next gang related shoot out - or their families.

 

[DKW 86 7,439]

2 hours ago, homersapien said:

Not to the LEO's who may have to face them, or to the victims of the next mass shooting, or to the "collateral" damage in the next gang related shoot out - or their families.

 

Dude, they are like 200X more likely to get killed by a random handgun. Maybe we should be far more worried about that than something they will likely never see on the job. You want to worry about things that really are not a problem, or are least many multiples less a problem.

[aubiefifty 16,879]

1 hour ago, DKW 86 said:

Dude, they are like 200X more likely to get killed by a random handgun. Maybe we should be far more worried about that than something they will likely never see on the job. You want to worry about things that really are not a problem, or are least many multiples less a problem.

dk they are spraying folks with gunfire on 120. shooting kids. shooting folks at gas stations. it is out of control to the point i will never go to birmingham again . hell they have had gun batttles at the galleria as well as football and basketball games. the problem got worse when they gave every fool a gun who wanted one. it is tragic. so is the fact you think they are all hand guns. hell they shot up a school bus on noble street a few months back in anniston. it was pure luck no kids were on the bus.it has gotten so bad the police and county both have stated you are a fool if you go to certain parts of town at night. between guns and fentanyl we are killing kids at an alarming rate. i do not understand why fentanyl is not outlawed..................

[DKW 86 7,439]

18 hours ago, aubiefifty said:

dk they are spraying folks with gunfire on 120. shooting kids. shooting folks at gas stations. it is out of control to the point i will never go to birmingham again . hell they have had gun batttles at the galleria as well as football and basketball games. the problem got worse when they gave every fool a gun who wanted one. it is tragic. so is the fact you think they are all hand guns. hell they shot up a school bus on noble street a few months back in anniston. it was pure luck no kids were on the bus.it has gotten so bad the police and county both have stated you are a fool if you go to certain parts of town at night. between guns and fentanyl we are killing kids at an alarming rate. i do not understand why fentanyl is not outlawed..................

I am not just being a contrarian. I do not want one child hurt at all. I am simply pointing out what should be obvious. Go for the category with the most deaths first. That seems obvious to me. Going for the extraneous things on the planet does no one any good. We should be gunning for the biggest impact right now and moving on down the line.

The PoWN (Party of the White Nationalists) seem to be so ignorant that they are not even listening to their own voters who do want reasonable background checks, wait periods, and even added psychological help. We do need all that. We wont get it as long as PoWN is running anything. 

On the other hand we have the SOMTBHFOP (So Open Minded Their Brain Has Fallen Out Party) that want cashless bail, crimeless retail theft, DTP, etc.

Gavin Newsom had to push the NG into Oakland recently to clean up a huge crime problem. The mayor would take no action. 

We can write 10,000 more laws, but if we wont enforce any of them we are really doing nothing. If we enforced the laws we have on the books now, we probably would not have half the problems we have.

 

[aubiefifty 16,879]

4 minutes ago, DKW 86 said:

I am not just being a contrarian. I do not want one child hurt at all. I am simply pointing out what should be obvious. Go for the category with the most deaths first. That seems obvious to me. Going for the extraneous things on the planet does no one any good. We should be gunning for the biggest impact right now and moving on down the line.

The PoWN (Party of the White Nationalists) seem to be so ignorant that they are not even listening to their own voters who do want reasonable background checks, wait periods, and even added psychological help. We do need all that. We wont get it as long as PoWN is running anything. 

On the other hand we have the SOMTBHFOP (So Open Minded Their Brain Has Fallen Out Party) that want cashless bail, crimeless retail theft, DTP, etc.

Gavin Newsom had to push the NG into Oakland recently to clean up a huge crime problem. The mayor would take no action. 

We can write 10,000 more laws, but if we wont enforce any of them we are really doing nothing. If we enforced the laws we have on the books now, we probably would not have half the problems we have.

 

i know dk i am just picking. i have no problem at all with you and i really do like you. take most of what i say with a grain of salt because i am not that funny at times.............manly hugs and a butt pat...........