(Updated 11/18/16) 3* Juco Dual QB D.J. Gillins (SMU)

[ellitor 33,094]

3 hours ago, Potatooooooes!! said:

So, do we have any place from which we can get an actual qb from, and not an athlete/project? Or are we doomed in the future? Who else could we possibly be recruiting?

1. Don't know. 2. I think we are in a holding pattern unfortunately. 3. I don't know about others but I don't look for recruits that way. It feels like a waste of time to me to look for guys the staff is not interested in so I wait to see who they are interested in.

[ellitor 33,094]

Damn it! I just did some digging. De'Andre Johnson would seem to be a sure fire back up plan to Stidham if he had not struck a woman at a bar causing FSU to dismiss him. He is the #2 rated juco QB and is having a very good season at East Mississippi CC. They are undefeated with him playing. In 10 games he has passed for 2483 yards, 25 TDs, & 6 INTs plus rushed for 750 yards & 5 more TDs. He does not have any P5 offers and that's probably due to the domestic situation..

I'm not sure where AU will go for a QB but they want a guy who can compete immediately, likely a juco.

[Auskip 196]

On November 22, 2016 at 3:21 PM, mcgufcm said:

There's nothing about Sean's injury, at this point, that indicates it should be a problem in spring, much less beyond. If Barrett is good enough to beat Sean out, we're solid at QB next year. Sean is a legit, SEC-caliber QB. We can win the SEC with Sean White under center. If Barrett is better, we have a legit backup along with a guy the coaches think gives us a better chance to win.

I expect Sean to start next year with Woody behind him. The third QB battle will boil down to Queen and possibly a JUCO signee. I don't think John will be a factor in that race, but I do expect him to continue getting touches.

I think this is spot on. Particularly the point that if Barrett somehow beats out Sean, we will have no worries at QB next year. When he ain't hurt, Sean is pretty dang good.

[ellitor 33,094]

On 11/22/2016 at 2:21 PM, mcgufcm said:

There's nothing about Sean's injury, at this point, that indicates it should be a problem in spring, much less beyond. If Barrett is good enough to beat Sean out, we're solid at QB next year. Sean is a legit, SEC-caliber QB. We can win the SEC with Sean White under center. If Barrett is better, we have a legit backup along with a guy the coaches think gives us a better chance to win.

I expect Sean to start next year with Woody behind him. The third QB battle will boil down to Queen and possibly a JUCO signee. I don't think John will be a factor in that race, but I do expect him to continue getting touches.

You don't sign a juco QB & he does not sign with a school to battle for the #3 QB FWIW.

[Mikey 16,613]

13 minutes ago, ellitor said:

You don't sign a juco QB & he does not sign with a school to battle for the #3 QB FWIW.

Over the past four years, we have signed several JUCO players who "weren't signed to ride the bench" but ended up riding the bench. JF3 wasn't signed to ride the bench, yet that's exactly what he mostly did.  A team doesn't sign anybody to ride the bench, but over half if them end up doing just that.

[aujeff11 6,243]

2 hours ago, Mikey said:

Over the past four years, we have signed several JUCO players who "weren't signed to ride the bench" but ended up riding the bench. JF3 wasn't signed to ride the bench, yet that's exactly what he mostly did.  A team doesn't sign anybody to ride the bench, but over half if them end up doing just that.

Maurice Swain, Devaroe Lawrence, JF3, Jason Smith all are juco signees that either have roles or they are helping establish a strong second string depth chart.  Not sure what you're talking about. 

Cameron Toney was a high school signee and he rides the bench. Maurice Swain, Devaroe, JF3, not so much. 

[ellitor 33,094]

1 hour ago, Mikey said:

Over the past four years, we have signed several JUCO players who "weren't signed to ride the bench" but ended up riding the bench. JF3 wasn't signed to ride the bench, yet that's exactly what he mostly did.  A team doesn't sign anybody to ride the bench, but over half if them end up doing just that.

I know all that but I'm just saying specifically jucos QBs you don't sign for that purpose so it is pointless to expect them there even though it's possible and has happened.

With our current situation of Sean not being durable for a full season, Woody showing potential but needing more development, & Q struggling because of arm injury we can't afford to sign a juco QB that is battling to be QB3.

[augolf1716 21,197]

4 hours ago, Auskip said:

I think this is spot on. Particularly the point that if Barrett somehow beats out Sean, we will have no worries at QB next year. When he ain't hurt, Sean is pretty dang good.

This is my biggest concern I don't think SW has the durability to last an entire season

[Potatooooooes!! 1,375]

6 hours ago, ellitor said:

1. Don't know. 2. I think we are in a holding pattern unfortunately. 3. I don't know about others but I don't look for recruits that way. It feels like a waste of time to me to look for guys the staff is not interested in so I wait to see who they are interested in.

I gotch ya. Didn't know if we had a fifth or sixth option (said with a hint of sarcasm) that you were possibly aware of or not. Frustrating to watch for sure

[DAG 33,990]

14 hours ago, SumterAubie said:

What makes you think I have insider info?

Well I figured with your response you had something relevant to add. I guess not .

[Mikey 16,613]

5 hours ago, aujeff11 said:

Maurice Swain, Devaroe Lawrence, JF3, Jason Smith all are juco signees that either have roles or they are helping establish a strong second string depth chart.  Not sure what you're talking about.

Cameron Toney was a high school signee and he rides the bench. Maurice Swain, Devaroe, JF3, not so much. 

Unfortunately, the threads listing past years signees are no longer at the top of this page so I don't have the list of JUCO guys that rode the bench right at hand. Moncrief is one name, couple of other LB and DB's. Maybe an Ol or two. None were signed to ride the bench.

[aujeff11 6,243]

Can anybody pull up a list of jucos that Malzahn recruited?  I do remember we have had some duds. Moncrief really wasn't a dud because I believe he would've had some kind of role if he stayed.  One linebacker, Kenny Flowers, was a dud though. Seems that most of the juco recruits he recruited at least earned their schollys:

Maurice Swain

Devaroe Lawrence

xavier dampeer- has been on

JF3

Jason Smith

*First two has been key players in our DL rotation. They are serviceable and allow our starters to get rest. Jason Smith and JF3 have obviously done plenty the past two years.

Lastly other previous juco players to have some kind of positive impact:

Davante Lambert

Duke

Cameron Artis Payne

Jovon

Nick Marshall

Cam

 

 

 

[aujeff11 6,243]

25 minutes ago, Mikey said:

Unfortunately, the threads listing past years signees are no longer at the top of this page so I don't have the list of JUCO guys that rode the bench right at hand

This is unfortunate. I've appreciated those links.

[aufan57 922]

Kevin Phillips, punter, JUCO

Paul James, III DE out with leg injury

Quote

How often do JUCO players pan out?

For this article I took a look at every Big 12 and SEC JUCO transfer in 2014 and checked what kind of "immediate impact" they were able to bring to their new school. In terms of judging whether these players actually offered "immediate help" I checked which players actually ended up starting at least three games in their first season after transferring. Here were the results for the Big 12:

School	Immediate starters	Incoming JUCO transfers
Kansas	3	9
Kansas State	2	9
Texas Tech	3	8
Iowa State	0	7
West Virginia	1	6
Baylor	1	4
TCU	0	4
Oklahoma State	1	3
Oklahoma	1	2
Texas	0	1

It was generally the more desperate Big 12 schools that turned to the JUCO ranks in 2014 and they did not see that investment pay off in terms of immediate help in the starting lineup. Overall the Big 12 went 12 for 53, good for a 23% hit rate.

Now, many of these players redshirted as they adjusted to their new homes and schemes and may well have an impact down the road but in terms of matching typical media expectations for bringing immediate help...they largely failed to do so.

And now the SEC:

School	Immediate starters	Incoming JUCO transfers
Auburn	2	6
Ole Miss	2	5
Tennessee	1	4
Alabama	1	4
Arkansas	2	3
Kentucky	2	3
Texas A&M	1	3
Mississippi State	1	3
South Carolina	0	2
LSU	0	2
Missouri	1	1
Georgia	0	1
Vanderbilt	0	0

The SEC was more choosy than their Big 12 brethren and had a higher overall hit rate with 12 of the 38 JUCOs starting three games or more, good for 31%.

Nevertheless, only about a quarter of the JUCOs signed by teams actually ended up fulfilling the offseason hopes that they'd become starters for their teams. Many of them redshirted or even failed to last long on campus. Auburn got solid production out of Derrick Moncrief only to see him immediately transfer again to Oklahoma State.

Junior college players have lots of talent and much of it is worth investing in for the big time programs. However, stocking up on JUCO players was not an efficient way to patch holes in the starting lineup for 2014 Big 12 or SEC programs. Be wary of offseason hopes, not all JUCOs are alike and only about a quarter of them are going to make a difference this year.

But who knows, maybe the ones that do will have quite the immediate impact.

http://www.footballstudyhall.com/2015/8/12/9143015/how-much-immediate-help-do-juco-transfers-actually-bring-Auburn-Kansas-State

 

[fredst 9,064]

Quarterback is a totally different situation than really any other position. If you sign a JUCO qb you're expecting him to be the starter because of the nature of the position. Other positions, maybe you sign JUCO to provide quality depth, i.e. DL, OL, ,WR. Just because they aren't starters doesn't mean those JUCO signees were a wasted scholly.

[mcgufcm 4,101]

A quality backup QB is far far from a wasted scholarship. 

[fredst 9,064]

48 minutes ago, mcgufcm said:

A quality backup QB is far far from a wasted scholarship. 

Agreed, but I don't think you go after JUCOs for that. To me, if you sign a JUCO to be a backup qb.....you've wasted a scholarship. That's why you sign and (hopefully coach up) high school QBs. JMO.

[ellitor 33,094]

There is no day to day use reason for the old class threads to stay pinned by year. Keeping them pinned just creates too many pinned threads. Maybe @RunInRed  can create a pinned Archived Classes thread with a link to each class in the OP? Til then here is Malzahn's first class as HC on 247 for a good starting point.

[ellitor 33,094]

1 hour ago, mcgufcm said:

A quality backup QB is far far from a wasted scholarship. 

Yeah but not 3rd string for a juco as stated earlier.

[Mikey 16,613]

1 hour ago, ellitor said:

There is no day to day use reason for the old class threads to stay pinned by year. Keeping them pinned just creates too many pinned threads. Maybe @RunInRed  can create a pinned Archived Classes thread with a link to each class in the OP? Til then here is Malzahn's first class as HC on 247 for a good starting point.

I think you'd be surprised how many times different people referenced those threads. To me, removing them was a definite minus. Was those threads taking up a few lines at the top of the page really such a problem?

[ellitor 33,094]

7 hours ago, Mikey said:

I think you'd be surprised how many times different people referenced those threads. To me, removing them was a definite minus. Was those threads taking up a few lines at the top of the page really such a problem?

It was very annoying to see 10 or more pinned threads at any given time when you combine them with other current pinned threads. Like I said. It can be solved by 1 archived class pinned thread with all the links in 1 spot. I understand your POV though and I will make a thread using WEAU's recruiting thread links. I don't know what happened to RIRs lists that were at the top of the Recruiting Forum but I have not seen them since the site upgrade months ago.

[SumterAubie 3,031]

On 11/24/2016 at 0:26 PM, DAG said:

Well I figured with your response you had something relevant to add. I guess not .

No. I had nothing relevant to add. I opened the thread to read updates on the Gillins recruitment.And saw few relevant posts through almost three full pages of posts. Yours included.

[DAG 33,990]

3 hours ago, SumterAubie said:

No. I had nothing relevant to add. I opened the thread to read updates on the Gillins recruitment.And saw few relevant posts through almost three full pages of posts. Yours included.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Going four pages strong 

[DAG 33,990]

21 hours ago, fredst said:

Quarterback is a totally different situation than really any other position. If you sign a JUCO qb you're expecting him to be the starter because of the nature of the position. Other positions, maybe you sign JUCO to provide quality depth, i.e. DL, OL, ,WR. Just because they aren't starters doesn't mean those JUCO signees were a wasted scholly.

 

This is exactly. I highly doubt many JUCO QB's our signing to teams expecting to add depth. Hopefully. Gus and Co find the right one.

[DAG 33,990]

On 11/24/2016 at 6:20 AM, ellitor said:

Damn it! I just did some digging. De'Andre Johnson would seem to be a sure fire back up plan to Stidham if he had not struck a woman at a bar causing FSU to dismiss him. He is the #2 rated juco QB and is having a very good season at East Mississippi CC. They are undefeated with him playing. In 10 games he has passed for 2483 yards, 25 TDs, & 6 INTs plus rushed for 750 yards & 5 more TDs. He does not have any P5 offers and that's probably due to the domestic situation..

I'm not sure where AU will go for a QB but they want a guy who can compete immediately, likely a juco.

 

 

You are forgetting the most important factor...listed as a PRO style QB. Scratch him off the list.

Edit: At least to 247 recruiting.