Oregon to allow 15-yr olds to get sex-reassignment surgery w/o parental consent

[TitanTiger 20,472]

Because all common sense must bow to the idol of sexual matters.

The list of things 15-year-olds are not legally allowed to do in Oregon is long: Drive, smoke, donate blood, get a tattoo -- even go to a tanning bed.

But, under a first-in-the-nation policy quietly enacted in January that many parents are only now finding out about, 15-year-olds are now allowed to get a sex-change operation. Many residents are stunned to learn they can do it without parental notification -- and the state will even pay for it through its Medicaid program, the Oregon Health Plan.

"It is trespassing on the hearts, the minds, the bodies of our children," said Lori Porter of Parents' Rights in Education. "They're our children. And for a decision, a life-altering decision like that to be done unbeknownst to a parent or guardian, it's mindboggling."

In a statement, Oregon Health Authority spokeswoman Susan Wickstrom explained it this way: "Age of medical consent varies by state. Oregon law -- which applies to both Medicaid and non-Medicaid Oregonians -- states that the age of medical consent is 15."

While 15 is the medical age of consent in the state, the decision to cover sex-change operations specifically was made by the Health Evidence Review Commission (HERC).

Members are appointed by the governor and paid by the state of Oregon. With no public debate, HERC changed its policy to include cross-sex hormone therapy, puberty-suppressing drugs and gender-reassignment surgery as covered treatments for people with gender dysphoria, formally known as gender identity disorder.

HERC officials refused repeated requests by Fox News for an interview and even gave Fox News inaccurate information about the medical director's work schedule.

Oregon Health Authority officials directed Fox News to their website. It shows transgender policy was discussed at four meetings in 2014. It was passed without any opposition or even discussion about teenagers' new access to undergoing a sex change...

...Dr. Paul McHugh, who led the Johns Hopkins Psychiatry Department and still practices, said Oregon's policy amounts to child abuse. "We have a very radical and even mutilating treatment being offered to children without any evidence that the long-term outcome of this would be good," McHugh said.

Dr. Jack Drescher, a member of the APA who worked on the Sexual and Gender Identity Disorders Work Group, says treatment for gender dysphoria has received a lot more attention in recent years. He said this year New York changed its policy to cover cross-sex hormone drugs and sex-reassignment surgery for Medicaid recipients who are at least 18 years old. He thinks Oregon is offering the treatment too early.

"Children age 15 may not fully understand all the consequences of the procedures they are undergoing," he said.

Jenn Burleton disagrees. She underwent a sex-reassignment surgery and started the Portland non-profit group TransActive. She said requiring parental consent would lead to more suffering and teen suicide attempts.

"Parents may not be supportive," Burleton said. "They may not be in an environment where they feel the parent will affirm their identity, this may have been going on for years."

The science is unsettled. A 2010 Murad study concluded "very low quality evidence suggests sex reassignment ... improves gender dysphoria and overall quality of life." The authors admitted the evidence was "sparse and inconclusive."

Lisa Maloney, a parent and Scappoose, Ore., School Board member, is outraged.

"To know that taxpayers are now on the hook for that, that a child can do that without their parent's knowledge or information or consent, parents have absolutely no say, that's appalling," Maloney said.

The Oregon Health Authority could not say how many Medicaid recipients have been treated for gender dysphoria since the new policy took effect in January. Oregon has 935,000 people enrolled in the Oregon Health Plan. HERC assumes between 14 and 112 of them may be gender dysphoric. It estimates the total cost of adding cross-sex hormone therapy, puberty-suppressing drugs and sex reassignment surgeries to the coverage will be no more than $150,000 per year.

But HERC also believes the state will save money due to fewer suicide attempts. It estimates there will be one less suicide attempt per year. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates the average cost per suicide attempt in the U.S. is $7,234.

But Dr. McHugh says a sex-change operation, especially for young people with gender dysphoria, is never appropriate.

"We can help them if we begin to explore with them and their families what they're fearing about development, what they're fearing about being a young boy, a young adolescent appropriate to themselves."

Dan Springer joined Fox News Channel (FNC) in August 2001 as a Seattle-based correspondent.

http://www.foxnews.c...m_campaign=link

This is insane. Even if you believe sex reassignment surgery is a good thing for people with these feelings, 15 years old is WAY too young for a child to be able to make such a decision on their own without parental consent or guidance.

And of course the "parents may not be supportive" and rightly so. You're talking about major and largely irreversible surgery on a minor you idiots. In three years, the child will be 18 years old and can make such decisions for themselves. Even though I find it terribly misguided at any age, at least they are considered in most things (outside of alcohol and tobacco purchases) an adult. They can vote, they can enlist in the military, work full time hours, etc.

What the hell is wrong with people?

[autigeremt 6,589]

I posted this yesterday. I guess I didn't get it?

[icanthearyou 4,462]

Because all common sense must bow to the idol of sexual matters.

The list of things 15-year-olds are not legally allowed to do in Oregon is long: Drive, smoke, donate blood, get a tattoo -- even go to a tanning bed.

But, under a first-in-the-nation policy quietly enacted in January that many parents are only now finding out about, 15-year-olds are now allowed to get a sex-change operation. Many residents are stunned to learn they can do it without parental notification -- and the state will even pay for it through its Medicaid program, the Oregon Health Plan.

"It is trespassing on the hearts, the minds, the bodies of our children," said Lori Porter of Parents' Rights in Education. "They're our children. And for a decision, a life-altering decision like that to be done unbeknownst to a parent or guardian, it's mindboggling."

In a statement, Oregon Health Authority spokeswoman Susan Wickstrom explained it this way: "Age of medical consent varies by state. Oregon law -- which applies to both Medicaid and non-Medicaid Oregonians -- states that the age of medical consent is 15."

While 15 is the medical age of consent in the state, the decision to cover sex-change operations specifically was made by the Health Evidence Review Commission (HERC).

Members are appointed by the governor and paid by the state of Oregon. With no public debate, HERC changed its policy to include cross-sex hormone therapy, puberty-suppressing drugs and gender-reassignment surgery as covered treatments for people with gender dysphoria, formally known as gender identity disorder.

HERC officials refused repeated requests by Fox News for an interview and even gave Fox News inaccurate information about the medical director's work schedule.

Oregon Health Authority officials directed Fox News to their website. It shows transgender policy was discussed at four meetings in 2014. It was passed without any opposition or even discussion about teenagers' new access to undergoing a sex change...

...Dr. Paul McHugh, who led the Johns Hopkins Psychiatry Department and still practices, said Oregon's policy amounts to child abuse. "We have a very radical and even mutilating treatment being offered to children without any evidence that the long-term outcome of this would be good," McHugh said.

Dr. Jack Drescher, a member of the APA who worked on the Sexual and Gender Identity Disorders Work Group, says treatment for gender dysphoria has received a lot more attention in recent years. He said this year New York changed its policy to cover cross-sex hormone drugs and sex-reassignment surgery for Medicaid recipients who are at least 18 years old. He thinks Oregon is offering the treatment too early.

"Children age 15 may not fully understand all the consequences of the procedures they are undergoing," he said.

Jenn Burleton disagrees. She underwent a sex-reassignment surgery and started the Portland non-profit group TransActive. She said requiring parental consent would lead to more suffering and teen suicide attempts.

"Parents may not be supportive," Burleton said. "They may not be in an environment where they feel the parent will affirm their identity, this may have been going on for years."

The science is unsettled. A 2010 Murad study concluded "very low quality evidence suggests sex reassignment ... improves gender dysphoria and overall quality of life." The authors admitted the evidence was "sparse and inconclusive."

Lisa Maloney, a parent and Scappoose, Ore., School Board member, is outraged.

"To know that taxpayers are now on the hook for that, that a child can do that without their parent's knowledge or information or consent, parents have absolutely no say, that's appalling," Maloney said.

The Oregon Health Authority could not say how many Medicaid recipients have been treated for gender dysphoria since the new policy took effect in January. Oregon has 935,000 people enrolled in the Oregon Health Plan. HERC assumes between 14 and 112 of them may be gender dysphoric. It estimates the total cost of adding cross-sex hormone therapy, puberty-suppressing drugs and sex reassignment surgeries to the coverage will be no more than $150,000 per year.

But HERC also believes the state will save money due to fewer suicide attempts. It estimates there will be one less suicide attempt per year. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates the average cost per suicide attempt in the U.S. is $7,234.

But Dr. McHugh says a sex-change operation, especially for young people with gender dysphoria, is never appropriate.

"We can help them if we begin to explore with them and their families what they're fearing about development, what they're fearing about being a young boy, a young adolescent appropriate to themselves."

Dan Springer joined Fox News Channel (FNC) in August 2001 as a Seattle-based correspondent.

http://www.foxnews.c...m_campaign=link

This is insane. Even if you believe sex reassignment surgery is a good thing for people with these feelings, 15 years old is WAY too young for a child to be able to make such a decision on their own without parental consent or guidance.

And of course the "parents may not be supportive" and rightly so. You're talking about major and largely irreversible surgery on a minor you idiots. In three years, the child will be 18 years old and can make such decisions for themselves. Even though I find it terribly misguided at any age, at least they are considered in most things (outside of alcohol and tobacco purchases) an adult. They can vote, they can enlist in the military, work full time hours, etc.

What the hell is wrong with people?

What do you believe their motives are?

[WarTim 3,456]

liberalism pushing the bounds of society.

[japantiger 4,051]

Because all common sense must bow to the idol of sexual matters.

The list of things 15-year-olds are not legally allowed to do in Oregon is long: Drive, smoke, donate blood, get a tattoo -- even go to a tanning bed.

But, under a first-in-the-nation policy quietly enacted in January that many parents are only now finding out about, 15-year-olds are now allowed to get a sex-change operation. Many residents are stunned to learn they can do it without parental notification -- and the state will even pay for it through its Medicaid program, the Oregon Health Plan.

"It is trespassing on the hearts, the minds, the bodies of our children," said Lori Porter of Parents' Rights in Education. "They're our children. And for a decision, a life-altering decision like that to be done unbeknownst to a parent or guardian, it's mindboggling."

In a statement, Oregon Health Authority spokeswoman Susan Wickstrom explained it this way: "Age of medical consent varies by state. Oregon law -- which applies to both Medicaid and non-Medicaid Oregonians -- states that the age of medical consent is 15."

While 15 is the medical age of consent in the state, the decision to cover sex-change operations specifically was made by the Health Evidence Review Commission (HERC).

Members are appointed by the governor and paid by the state of Oregon. With no public debate, HERC changed its policy to include cross-sex hormone therapy, puberty-suppressing drugs and gender-reassignment surgery as covered treatments for people with gender dysphoria, formally known as gender identity disorder.

HERC officials refused repeated requests by Fox News for an interview and even gave Fox News inaccurate information about the medical director's work schedule.

Oregon Health Authority officials directed Fox News to their website. It shows transgender policy was discussed at four meetings in 2014. It was passed without any opposition or even discussion about teenagers' new access to undergoing a sex change...

...Dr. Paul McHugh, who led the Johns Hopkins Psychiatry Department and still practices, said Oregon's policy amounts to child abuse. "We have a very radical and even mutilating treatment being offered to children without any evidence that the long-term outcome of this would be good," McHugh said.

Dr. Jack Drescher, a member of the APA who worked on the Sexual and Gender Identity Disorders Work Group, says treatment for gender dysphoria has received a lot more attention in recent years. He said this year New York changed its policy to cover cross-sex hormone drugs and sex-reassignment surgery for Medicaid recipients who are at least 18 years old. He thinks Oregon is offering the treatment too early.

"Children age 15 may not fully understand all the consequences of the procedures they are undergoing," he said.

Jenn Burleton disagrees. She underwent a sex-reassignment surgery and started the Portland non-profit group TransActive. She said requiring parental consent would lead to more suffering and teen suicide attempts.

"Parents may not be supportive," Burleton said. "They may not be in an environment where they feel the parent will affirm their identity, this may have been going on for years."

The science is unsettled. A 2010 Murad study concluded "very low quality evidence suggests sex reassignment ... improves gender dysphoria and overall quality of life." The authors admitted the evidence was "sparse and inconclusive."

Lisa Maloney, a parent and Scappoose, Ore., School Board member, is outraged.

"To know that taxpayers are now on the hook for that, that a child can do that without their parent's knowledge or information or consent, parents have absolutely no say, that's appalling," Maloney said.

The Oregon Health Authority could not say how many Medicaid recipients have been treated for gender dysphoria since the new policy took effect in January. Oregon has 935,000 people enrolled in the Oregon Health Plan. HERC assumes between 14 and 112 of them may be gender dysphoric. It estimates the total cost of adding cross-sex hormone therapy, puberty-suppressing drugs and sex reassignment surgeries to the coverage will be no more than $150,000 per year.

But HERC also believes the state will save money due to fewer suicide attempts. It estimates there will be one less suicide attempt per year. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates the average cost per suicide attempt in the U.S. is $7,234.

But Dr. McHugh says a sex-change operation, especially for young people with gender dysphoria, is never appropriate.

"We can help them if we begin to explore with them and their families what they're fearing about development, what they're fearing about being a young boy, a young adolescent appropriate to themselves."

Dan Springer joined Fox News Channel (FNC) in August 2001 as a Seattle-based correspondent.

http://www.foxnews.c...m_campaign=link

This is insane. Even if you believe sex reassignment surgery is a good thing for people with these feelings, 15 years old is WAY too young for a child to be able to make such a decision on their own without parental consent or guidance.

And of course the "parents may not be supportive" and rightly so. You're talking about major and largely irreversible surgery on a minor you idiots. In three years, the child will be 18 years old and can make such decisions for themselves. Even though I find it terribly misguided at any age, at least they are considered in most things (outside of alcohol and tobacco purchases) an adult. They can vote, they can enlist in the military, work full time hours, etc.

What the hell is wrong with people?

What do you believe their motives are?

Who gives a s*** what their motivation is...it's called child abuse. What, are you Hillary Clinton now; you need to know the motivation of the screwed up?

[icanthearyou 4,462]

Because all common sense must bow to the idol of sexual matters.

The list of things 15-year-olds are not legally allowed to do in Oregon is long: Drive, smoke, donate blood, get a tattoo -- even go to a tanning bed.

But, under a first-in-the-nation policy quietly enacted in January that many parents are only now finding out about, 15-year-olds are now allowed to get a sex-change operation. Many residents are stunned to learn they can do it without parental notification -- and the state will even pay for it through its Medicaid program, the Oregon Health Plan.

"It is trespassing on the hearts, the minds, the bodies of our children," said Lori Porter of Parents' Rights in Education. "They're our children. And for a decision, a life-altering decision like that to be done unbeknownst to a parent or guardian, it's mindboggling."

In a statement, Oregon Health Authority spokeswoman Susan Wickstrom explained it this way: "Age of medical consent varies by state. Oregon law -- which applies to both Medicaid and non-Medicaid Oregonians -- states that the age of medical consent is 15."

While 15 is the medical age of consent in the state, the decision to cover sex-change operations specifically was made by the Health Evidence Review Commission (HERC).

Members are appointed by the governor and paid by the state of Oregon. With no public debate, HERC changed its policy to include cross-sex hormone therapy, puberty-suppressing drugs and gender-reassignment surgery as covered treatments for people with gender dysphoria, formally known as gender identity disorder.

HERC officials refused repeated requests by Fox News for an interview and even gave Fox News inaccurate information about the medical director's work schedule.

Oregon Health Authority officials directed Fox News to their website. It shows transgender policy was discussed at four meetings in 2014. It was passed without any opposition or even discussion about teenagers' new access to undergoing a sex change...

...Dr. Paul McHugh, who led the Johns Hopkins Psychiatry Department and still practices, said Oregon's policy amounts to child abuse. "We have a very radical and even mutilating treatment being offered to children without any evidence that the long-term outcome of this would be good," McHugh said.

Dr. Jack Drescher, a member of the APA who worked on the Sexual and Gender Identity Disorders Work Group, says treatment for gender dysphoria has received a lot more attention in recent years. He said this year New York changed its policy to cover cross-sex hormone drugs and sex-reassignment surgery for Medicaid recipients who are at least 18 years old. He thinks Oregon is offering the treatment too early.

"Children age 15 may not fully understand all the consequences of the procedures they are undergoing," he said.

Jenn Burleton disagrees. She underwent a sex-reassignment surgery and started the Portland non-profit group TransActive. She said requiring parental consent would lead to more suffering and teen suicide attempts.

"Parents may not be supportive," Burleton said. "They may not be in an environment where they feel the parent will affirm their identity, this may have been going on for years."

The science is unsettled. A 2010 Murad study concluded "very low quality evidence suggests sex reassignment ... improves gender dysphoria and overall quality of life." The authors admitted the evidence was "sparse and inconclusive."

Lisa Maloney, a parent and Scappoose, Ore., School Board member, is outraged.

"To know that taxpayers are now on the hook for that, that a child can do that without their parent's knowledge or information or consent, parents have absolutely no say, that's appalling," Maloney said.

The Oregon Health Authority could not say how many Medicaid recipients have been treated for gender dysphoria since the new policy took effect in January. Oregon has 935,000 people enrolled in the Oregon Health Plan. HERC assumes between 14 and 112 of them may be gender dysphoric. It estimates the total cost of adding cross-sex hormone therapy, puberty-suppressing drugs and sex reassignment surgeries to the coverage will be no more than $150,000 per year.

But HERC also believes the state will save money due to fewer suicide attempts. It estimates there will be one less suicide attempt per year. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates the average cost per suicide attempt in the U.S. is $7,234.

But Dr. McHugh says a sex-change operation, especially for young people with gender dysphoria, is never appropriate.

"We can help them if we begin to explore with them and their families what they're fearing about development, what they're fearing about being a young boy, a young adolescent appropriate to themselves."

Dan Springer joined Fox News Channel (FNC) in August 2001 as a Seattle-based correspondent.

http://www.foxnews.c...m_campaign=link

This is insane. Even if you believe sex reassignment surgery is a good thing for people with these feelings, 15 years old is WAY too young for a child to be able to make such a decision on their own without parental consent or guidance.

And of course the "parents may not be supportive" and rightly so. You're talking about major and largely irreversible surgery on a minor you idiots. In three years, the child will be 18 years old and can make such decisions for themselves. Even though I find it terribly misguided at any age, at least they are considered in most things (outside of alcohol and tobacco purchases) an adult. They can vote, they can enlist in the military, work full time hours, etc.

What the hell is wrong with people?

What do you believe their motives are?

Who gives a s*** what their motivation is...it's called child abuse. What, are you Hillary Clinton now; you need to know the motivation of the screwed up?

No but, I do believe their basis for and, motivation is important to a meaningful discussion. Unless, you believe this can simply be explained by partisan politics. Perhaps we could go a little deeper than, "it aint rite".

I do appreciate you not making up your own "facts", though. Why the profanity and anger over a simple question?

[homersapien 11,357]

Who gives a s*** what their motivation is...it's called child abuse. What, are you Hillary Clinton now; you need to know the motivation of the screwed up?

Child abuse?

Many think forcing a kid to conform to a sexual identity that is alien to them is abusive, including professionals in the field.

While you may disagree simply dismissing them as "screwed up" is not exactly an informed argument against the policy.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

What do you believe their motives are?

I couldn't say for sure. At best they *think* they are being compassionate. At worst they are pushing an agenda based on their views of human sexuality and of family. But they are overstepping their bounds. It should not be up to the state to grant permission for a minor to do something so drastic and irreversible to themselves with not only no permission from parents, but not even any input. It's a warped idea of what their domain is and the rights of parents.

Until this child is of age to make grown up decisions legally, they have no business sticking their noses into a family like this and overriding or going behind the parents' backs.

[japantiger 4,051]

What do you believe their motives are?

I couldn't say for sure. At best they *think* they are being compassionate. At worst they are pushing an agenda based on their views of human sexuality and of family. But they are overstepping their bounds. It should not be up to the state to grant permission for a minor to do something so drastic and irreversible to themselves with not only no permission from parents, but not even any input. It's a warped idea of what their domain is and the rights of parents.

Until this child is of age to make grown up decisions legally, they have no business sticking their noses into a family like this and overriding or going behind the parents' backs.

You are being way to generous...compassion hell... I don't give a s*** what their reason is...it is government sponsored child abuse....let's just go back to Eugenics...you guys are seriously ****** up if you think this is anything other than completely screwed up.

[cooltigger21 0]

They are giving puberty blocking drugs to kids younger than ten years old. If they are having surgery at 15 them they have been on HRT for a year at least. When I was 15 I thought I knew it all. I didn't know squat. No kid that age is in any way capable of that kind of decision. These doctors that go along with it should lose their license at the very minimum.

[icanthearyou 4,462]

What do you believe their motives are?

I couldn't say for sure. At best they *think* they are being compassionate. At worst they are pushing an agenda based on their views of human sexuality and of family. But they are overstepping their bounds. It should not be up to the state to grant permission for a minor to do something so drastic and irreversible to themselves with not only no permission from parents, but not even any input. It's a warped idea of what their domain is and the rights of parents.

Until this child is of age to make grown up decisions legally, they have no business sticking their noses into a family like this and overriding or going behind the parents' backs.

You are being way to generous...compassion hell... I don't give a s*** what their reason is...it is government sponsored child abuse....let's just go back to Eugenics...you guys are seriously ****** up if you think this is anything other than completely screwed up.

I do not understand your position. Perhaps more profanity will help.

[japantiger 4,051]

What do you believe their motives are?

I couldn't say for sure. At best they *think* they are being compassionate. At worst they are pushing an agenda based on their views of human sexuality and of family. But they are overstepping their bounds. It should not be up to the state to grant permission for a minor to do something so drastic and irreversible to themselves with not only no permission from parents, but not even any input. It's a warped idea of what their domain is and the rights of parents.

Until this child is of age to make grown up decisions legally, they have no business sticking their noses into a family like this and overriding or going behind the parents' backs.

You are being way to generous...compassion hell... I don't give a s*** what their reason is...it is government sponsored child abuse....let's just go back to Eugenics...you guys are seriously ****** up if you think this is anything other than completely screwed up.

I do not understand your position. Perhaps more profanity will help.

How about this; you're a screwed up bastard if you think this is anything other than sick.

[Mims44 1,867]

It is pretty silly when you think of it in certain ways.

They are not deemed mature enough to buy Straight Outta Compton, but can undergo this procedure.

Not deemed mature or smart enough to vote, decide if they want to smoke or drink, or serve in the military.

Not deemed mature enough to decide if they want a tattoo.

You would also hope for those few that Homer were talking about with the actual problems, that their parents would be supportive.

I could see this causing lot's of problems for people in Oregon.

[icanthearyou 4,462]

What do you believe their motives are?

I couldn't say for sure. At best they *think* they are being compassionate. At worst they are pushing an agenda based on their views of human sexuality and of family. But they are overstepping their bounds. It should not be up to the state to grant permission for a minor to do something so drastic and irreversible to themselves with not only no permission from parents, but not even any input. It's a warped idea of what their domain is and the rights of parents.

Until this child is of age to make grown up decisions legally, they have no business sticking their noses into a family like this and overriding or going behind the parents' backs.

Thank you for a serious answer. I tend to agree with you. However, I do understand how some may feel if the parents are "less than understanding". I do believe 15 is approaching an age when parental rights begin to slowly transfer to individual rights. Still, the parents are responsible. I do not agree with it, just understand it.

How do you feel about the drugs that block puberty until such time that a decision can be made? This is where it gets complicated in my opinion.

I

[TitanTiger 20,472]

I don't think any of those things should be given to a child without parental permission. A prepubescent child is not mature enough to make that call and that child is not the domain of the state.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

Put it this way, if it were my child and they wanted to give them hormone blocking drugs or surgery, I would take my child and leave the state. I'd leave the country if necessary. This is completely screwed up.

[WarTim 3,456]

I don't think any of those things should be given to a child without parental permission. A prepubescent child is not mature enough to make that call and that child is not the domain of the state.

Everything you have stated is correct. Sadly we have moved at light speed to the current status.....Big (liberal) govt KNOWS what is best for YOUR child and they will inform you of what you WILL DO.

[icanthearyou 4,462]

What do you believe their motives are?

I couldn't say for sure. At best they *think* they are being compassionate. At worst they are pushing an agenda based on their views of human sexuality and of family. But they are overstepping their bounds. It should not be up to the state to grant permission for a minor to do something so drastic and irreversible to themselves with not only no permission from parents, but not even any input. It's a warped idea of what their domain is and the rights of parents.

Until this child is of age to make grown up decisions legally, they have no business sticking their noses into a family like this and overriding or going behind the parents' backs.

You are being way to generous...compassion hell... I don't give a s*** what their reason is...it is government sponsored child abuse....let's just go back to Eugenics...you guys are seriously ****** up if you think this is anything other than completely screwed up.

I do not understand your position. Perhaps more profanity will help.

How about this; you're a screwed up bastard if you think this is anything other than sick.

What is sick? The feelings of the child or, parents who would ignore those feelings, or a state that would honor them above the rights of the parents?

[homersapien 11,357]

What do you believe their motives are?

I couldn't say for sure. At best they *think* they are being compassionate. At worst they are pushing an agenda based on their views of human sexuality and of family. But they are overstepping their bounds. It should not be up to the state to grant permission for a minor to do something so drastic and irreversible to themselves with not only no permission from parents, but not even any input. It's a warped idea of what their domain is and the rights of parents.

Until this child is of age to make grown up decisions legally, they have no business sticking their noses into a family like this and overriding or going behind the parents' backs.

You are being way to generous...compassion hell... I don't give a s*** what their reason is...it is government sponsored child abuse....let's just go back to Eugenics...you guys are seriously ****** up if you think this is anything other than completely screwed up.

I do not understand your position. Perhaps more profanity will help.

How about this; you're a screwed up bastard if you think this is anything other than sick.

I take it you have complete disdain for the field of psychiatry.

[homersapien 11,357]

Put it this way, if it were my child and they wanted to give them hormone blocking drugs or surgery, I would take my child and leave the state. I'd leave the country if necessary. This is completely screwed up.

Titan, I think you totally misunderstand the situation. I don't believe that anyone is forcing anything on minor patients or their families.

And the professionals involved don't have an agenda. They are offering treatment for those patients for whom it is appropriate. I am sure there is a qualification process that probably involves months of therapy and every professional involved probably has to sign off on the process.

I am also guessing that very, very few minor patients qualify without the consent of their parents. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if such a case involved a patient that was already institutionalized or otherwise divorced from the parents.

Now I grant you, I am speculating but I am willing to bet that my paradigm is more accurate than yours. We will see as we educate ourselves about the reality.

[icanthearyou 4,462]

Put it this way, if it were my child and they wanted to give them hormone blocking drugs or surgery, I would take my child and leave the state. I'd leave the country if necessary. This is completely screwed up.

Titan, I think you totally misunderstand the situation. I don't believe that anyone is forcing anything on minor patients or their families.

And the professionals involved don't have an agenda. They are offering treatment for those patients for whom it is appropriate. I am sure there is a qualification process that probably involves months of therapy and every professional involved probably has to sign off on the process.

I am also guessing that very very few minor patients qualify without the consent of their parents. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if such a case involved a patient that was already institutionalized or otherwise divorced from the parents.

Now I grant you, I am speculating but I am willing to bet that my paradigm is more accurate than yours. We will see as we educate ourselves about the reality.

But, but, it was on the FOX News. I aint gonna listen to none of that there fancified phony liberal logic. I got to be out raged. Them 3 kids in Orgeron need to just be like everbody else is. Sum body needs to slap sum since into them em.

BTW, did you catch the Frontline a couple of weeks ago. Very informative on this subject. Some of these children become absolutely distraught over the prospect of going through puberty and becoming the very person they do not wish to be.

[homersapien 11,357]

Put it this way, if it were my child and they wanted to give them hormone blocking drugs or surgery, I would take my child and leave the state. I'd leave the country if necessary. This is completely screwed up.

Titan, I think you totally misunderstand the situation. I don't believe that anyone is forcing anything on minor patients or their families.

And the professionals involved don't have an agenda. They are offering treatment for those patients for whom it is appropriate. I am sure there is a qualification process that probably involves months of therapy and every professional involved probably has to sign off on the process.

I am also guessing that very very few minor patients qualify without the consent of their parents. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if such a case involved a patient that was already institutionalized or otherwise divorced from the parents.

Now I grant you, I am speculating but I am willing to bet that my paradigm is more accurate than yours. We will see as we educate ourselves about the reality.

But, but, it was on the FOX News. I aint gonna listen to none of that there fancified phony liberal logic. I got to be out raged. Them 3 kids in Orgeron need to just be like everbody else is. Sum body needs to slap sum since into them em.

BTW, did you catch the Frontline a couple of weeks ago. Very informative on this subject. Some of these children become absolutely distraught over the prospect of going through puberty and becoming the very person they do not wish to be.

Yes I did. Glad you brought it up. It was a very revealing of the mental and emotional anguish that effects everyone in these cases.

For those who missed it: http://www.pbs.org/w...owing-up-trans/

[TitanTiger 20,472]

Put it this way, if it were my child and they wanted to give them hormone blocking drugs or surgery, I would take my child and leave the state. I'd leave the country if necessary. This is completely screwed up.

Titan, I think you totally misunderstand the situation. I don't believe that anyone is forcing anything on minor patients or their families.

And the professionals involved don't have an agenda. They are offering treatment for those patients for whom it is appropriate. I am sure there is a qualification process that probably involves months of therapy and every professional involved probably has to sign off on the process.

I am also guessing that very very few minor patients qualify without the consent of their parents. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if such a case involved a patient that was already institutionalized or otherwise divorced from the parents.

Now I grant you, I am speculating but I am willing to bet that my paradigm is more accurate than yours. We will see as we educate ourselves about the reality.

But, but, it was on the FOX News. I aint gonna listen to none of that there fancified phony liberal logic. I got to be out raged. Them 3 kids in Orgeron need to just be like everbody else is. Sum body needs to slap sum since into them em.

BTW, did you catch the Frontline a couple of weeks ago. Very informative on this subject. Some of these children become absolutely distraught over the prospect of going through puberty and becoming the very person they do not wish to be.

Your snark regarding the ritually impure source aside, I'm sorry but a prepubescent child is still in no position or maturity of mind to be deciding (or pressuring/guilting their parents to allow them) to get on hormone suppressing drugs. Especially considering that most prepubescent children who have gender dysphoria will not remain dysphoric after puberty. So in essence the very thing they are distraught over actually resolves their problems naturally.

[icanthearyou 4,462]

Put it this way, if it were my child and they wanted to give them hormone blocking drugs or surgery, I would take my child and leave the state. I'd leave the country if necessary. This is completely screwed up.

Titan, I think you totally misunderstand the situation. I don't believe that anyone is forcing anything on minor patients or their families.

And the professionals involved don't have an agenda. They are offering treatment for those patients for whom it is appropriate. I am sure there is a qualification process that probably involves months of therapy and every professional involved probably has to sign off on the process.

I am also guessing that very very few minor patients qualify without the consent of their parents. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if such a case involved a patient that was already institutionalized or otherwise divorced from the parents.

Now I grant you, I am speculating but I am willing to bet that my paradigm is more accurate than yours. We will see as we educate ourselves about the reality.

But, but, it was on the FOX News. I aint gonna listen to none of that there fancified phony liberal logic. I got to be out raged. Them 3 kids in Orgeron need to just be like everbody else is. Sum body needs to slap sum since into them em.

BTW, did you catch the Frontline a couple of weeks ago. Very informative on this subject. Some of these children become absolutely distraught over the prospect of going through puberty and becoming the very person they do not wish to be.

Your snark regarding the ritually impure source aside, I'm sorry but a prepubescent child is still in no position or maturity of mind to be deciding (or pressuring/guilting their parents to allow them) to get on hormone suppressing drugs. Especially considering that most prepubescent children who have gender dysphoria will not remain dysphoric after puberty. So in essence the very thing they are distraught over actually resolves their problems naturally.

Sorry for the snark but, you do realize the FOX style of reporting and, the target audience, don't you? Did you acutally read the report you are citing? Do those results and conclusion convince you?

30% Not traceable

27% Still identify as transgender

The remainder are almost all homosexual or bisexual

Does that really sound like resolution?

Do you have personal experience that reinforces your definitive statements? Children aren't at all capable of mature, honest thoughts and emotions? You make it sound like they are coercing their parents into buying them a toy.

[Weegle777 78]

autigeremt posted this yesterday. Shouldn't this thread be locked?