The FBI raids Mar-A-Lago.

[Leftfield 2,625]

5 hours ago, Cardin Drake said:

I'm utterly disgusted by the malfeasance of the russian collusion investigation.

Of course you are, because you continue to focus only on the parts of the investigation that you wish to, and ignore things such as:

- "If we had had confidence that the president clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so."

- “We did not make a determination as to whether” Trump “did commit a crime,” said Mueller...

- In remarks lasting about nine minutes Wednesday, the special counsel cited a long-standing Justice Department policy barring the prosecution of a sitting president for a federal crime.

“That is unconstitutional,” Mueller said. “Charging the president with a crime was, therefore, not an option we could consider.”

- However, Mueller noted that there was another avenue for dealing with a sitting president who broke the law. He said that the internal Justice Department opinion barring the prosecution of a president also “says that the Constitution requires a process other than the criminal justice system to formally accuse a sitting president of wrongdoing.”

That “process,” which Mueller did not name, is impeachment.

The fact you say you would "happily" vote for Trump again (and apparently consider amorality and narcissism to be charismatic), betrays your viewpoint. You are incapable of looking at it objectively. It is entirely possible for both Trump and some within the FBI/DOJ to be corrupt, yet to you it's a certainty that the entire organization should be discarded.

6 hours ago, Cardin Drake said:

I see a similar problem here. I don't find it hard to believe that Trump is guilty of a careless process crime, but it's laughable to think he has stolen nuclear secrets to make a quick buck as so many have insinuated. 

Any more laughable than the Saudis giving two billion dollars to an equity firm that the fund's own advisors objected to? 

[Cardin Drake 1,851]

Leftfield, I could care less what Mueller has said. He was a hyperpartisan leading a team of hyper partisans in a corrupt enterprise. They used FISA to spy on a presidential campaign and a sitting President.  It was predicated on multiple lies and they knew it. When to their surprise, the witch hunt did not bear fruit, in desperation, they tried to create obstruction of justice out of nothing but Mueller's performance in front of Congress was so bad they knew it was a lost cause.

Kushner should NOT have taken the Saudi money, IMHO. Is that your answer to what was Trump's plan. Because I don't see the connection.

[I_M4_AU 7,912]

4 hours ago, AU9377 said:

You don't have to trust every report to understand testimony given under oath by members of the Trump campaign and Trump administration. When every member of the NSA testifies that Trump replaced the ambassador to Ukraine because the former ambassador would not "play ball" and pressure a foreign government to investigate his political rival or risk further delaying congressionally approved military aid, I accept that as fact.    When his first Secretary of State, every Secretary of Defense and every high ranking General that worked with him warns of the danger the man is to the country, I don't need ABC to show additional evidence before forming a well grounded opinion of him as an unhinged narcissistic moron.

Had there been nothing to acquire at Mar-a-lago, no warrant would have been signed.

Interesting you pick the Ukraine incident as investigating him investigating his political rival because that is exactly how Biden is using the DOJ.  Or at least that’s what it looks like publicly to the Republicans.

Please remember 51 high ranking intelligence officers swore Hunter’s laptop was Russian disinformation only to be proven wrong.  Could it be some of those high ranking Generals that declare Trump as dangerous are the same ones that are running our *woke* unprepared military now?  We don’t have Generals like Paton or Eisenhower anymore.  General Austin is as weak as Biden if the withdrawal from Afghanistan is any indication of his tenure as a Military leader.

Does a warrant automatically indicate a person is guilty?  Without a trial?

[Leftfield 2,625]

52 minutes ago, Cardin Drake said:

Leftfield, I could care less what Mueller has said. He was a hyperpartisan leading a team of hyper partisans in a corrupt enterprise. They used FISA to spy on a presidential campaign and a sitting President.  It was predicated on multiple lies and they knew it. When to their surprise, the witch hunt did not bear fruit, in desperation, they tried to create obstruction of justice out of nothing but Mueller's performance in front of Congress was so bad they knew it was a lost cause.

Kushner should NOT have taken the Saudi money, IMHO. Is that your answer to what was Trump's plan. Because I don't see the connection.

Not sure you could have written something better at proving my point if you had tried.

[arein0 973]

8 hours ago, Cardin Drake said:

I'm utterly disgusted by the malfeasance of the russian collusion investigation. And now, instead of an apology and cleansing of the FBI, they just move on to the next accusation.  I'm a realist about Trump though. I'm shocked that once they were able to investigate him with 18 full time prosecutors for 2 years, they couldn't find a crime. He must be the cleanest billionaire on the planet. I'm sure they were shocked too. They knew russian collusion was a sham going in, but they figured they could find something. The FBI and DOJ are corrupt, but not stupid. I won't be surprised if they have something on him.  I won't be surprised if it's all bs too.  We will see. I take it as a good sign that they are leaking with anonymous sources.  Doesn't strike me as confident, and it's straight out of their unethical playbook.   If they get Trump though, so be it.  I'm fine with Desantis as our candidate. Trump is deeply flawed as a candidate and alienates too many soccer moms.  I like his policies, and I like his charisma, but geez, that man needs some discipline.  I'll happily vote for him if he is our candidate, but I'd prefer someone who won't get in a twitter war with every 2nd rate actress in hollywood. And I don't like the fact that he is not a fiscal conservative.

I notice nobody has responded to my challenge to lay out Trump's russian collusion plan. I see a similar problem here. I don't find it hard to believe that Trump is guilty of a careless process crime, but it's laughable to think he has stolen nuclear secrets to make a quick buck as so many have insinuated.  I also don't find it hard to believe that the FBI has simply retrieved documents that paint them in a bad light over spygate. At this point, we know less than nothing.

So no comment on the second question. Does that mean you would still be disgusted with the malfeasance of the russian collusion investigation if the target of the investigation was Obama or Biden instead of Trump?

[TexasTiger 12,974]

8 hours ago, Cardin Drake said:

I'm utterly disgusted by the malfeasance of the russian collusion investigation. And now, instead of an apology and cleansing of the FBI, they just move on to the next accusation.  I'm a realist about Trump though. I'm shocked that once they were able to investigate him with 18 full time prosecutors for 2 years, they couldn't find a crime. He must be the cleanest billionaire on the planet. I'm sure they were shocked too. They knew russian collusion was a sham going in, but they figured they could find something. The FBI and DOJ are corrupt, but not stupid. I won't be surprised if they have something on him.  I won't be surprised if it's all bs too.  We will see. I take it as a good sign that they are leaking with anonymous sources.  Doesn't strike me as confident, and it's straight out of their unethical playbook.   If they get Trump though, so be it.  I'm fine with Desantis as our candidate. Trump is deeply flawed as a candidate and alienates too many soccer moms.  I like his policies, and I like his charisma, but geez, that man needs some discipline.  I'll happily vote for him if he is our candidate, but I'd prefer someone who won't get in a twitter war with every 2nd rate actress in hollywood. And I don't like the fact that he is not a fiscal conservative.

I notice nobody has responded to my challenge to lay out Trump's russian collusion plan. I see a similar problem here. I don't find it hard to believe that Trump is guilty of a careless process crime, but it's laughable to think he has stolen nuclear secrets to make a quick buck as so many have insinuated.  I also don't find it hard to believe that the FBI has simply retrieved documents that paint them in a bad light over spygate. At this point, we know less than nothing.

If you want to get over being shocked, seek better sources of information. That investigation was far more limited than the media indicated. There were a number of area Mueller wasn’t allowed to touch. His business dealings have not been closely scrutinized at all. Some are currently in NY. You’re choosing ignorance.

[Cardin Drake 1,851]

24 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

If you want to get over being shocked, seek better sources of information. That investigation was far more limited than the media indicated. There were a number of area Mueller wasn’t allowed to touch. His business dealings have not been closely scrutinized at all. Some are currently in NY. You’re choosing ignorance.

You are still ignoring the corrupt initiation of the russian collusion hoax.  They set up a volunteer Trump staffer in order to spy on his campaign for 9 months. Think about that.  There is no trust in their integrity about anything after that.

And don't tell me they wouldn't have used anything they "happened" to stumble across.  They squeezed everybody they could think of, including Trump's personal attorney, who did turn out to be running a criminal enterprise himself, but still couldn't save his ass by giving them anything on Trump.

[TexasTiger 12,974]

9 minutes ago, Cardin Drake said:

You are still ignoring the corrupt initiation of the russian collusion hoax.  They set up a volunteer Trump staffer in order to spy on his campaign for 9 months. Think about that.  There is no trust in their integrity about anything after that.

And don't tell me they wouldn't have used anything they "happened" to stumble across.  They squeezed everybody they could think of, including Trump's personal attorney, who did turn out to be running a criminal enterprise himself, but still couldn't save his ass by giving them anything on Trump.

There was and is ample reason to suspect inappropriate Trump ties with Russia. Anyone who can’t see that is ignorant, moronic, delusional or all three.

[I_M4_AU 7,912]

26 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

There was and is ample reason to suspect inappropriate Trump ties with Russia. Anyone who can’t see that is ignorant, moronic, delusional or all three.

If there was ample reason to suspect Trump of ties with Russia, why did they try to frame him?  It’s like lying on a warrant to investigate someone (Breonna Taylor) which is against the law.

[Cardin Drake 1,851]

28 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

There was and is ample reason to suspect inappropriate Trump ties with Russia. Anyone who can’t see that is ignorant, moronic, delusional or all three.

Anybody who can't see that russian collusion began with Hillary's disinformation and was just a pretext for spying on Trump's campaign is just hopelessly partisan.  Once again, what was Trump's corrupt plan to enlist the aid of the Russians?

[icanthearyou 4,463]

When a president's very own DOJ appoints special counsel to investigate,,,, how can you possibly believe there is a grand conspiracy?

Wait, wait, don't tell me,,, all of those people including Comey and Mueller are rhinos.

There are Republicans and,,, there is a cult.  When you join the cult, screw America, it's all about the cult.

Several of you are truly disgusting "citizens". 

A man lies to you thousands of times and,,, you continue to believe and defend him.  Void of any real character.

[SaltyTiger 7,837]

13 hours ago, TexasTiger said:

Mar a Lago SCIF you suggested.

Then yes, a temporary MAL SCIF could be installed. Been involved with two of the areas during construction. Amazing the specifications and layering to prevent electronic surveillance and physical access that I was privy. Sure much more on top of what I learned.  
 

Just trying to wrap my mind around how and why. We all know Trump more than likely does care for reviewing documents. This is a big, big deal. Those things did not get packed away by mistake on a move from DC to Florida.

[SaltyTiger 7,837]

11 hours ago, homersapien said:

(But not a majority.  )

[Leftfield 2,625]

3 hours ago, Cardin Drake said:

Leftfield, I could care less what Mueller has said. He was a hyperpartisan leading a team of hyper partisans in a corrupt enterprise. They used FISA to spy on a presidential campaign and a sitting President.  It was predicated on multiple lies and they knew it. When to their surprise, the witch hunt did not bear fruit, in desperation, they tried to create obstruction of justice out of nothing but Mueller's performance in front of Congress was so bad they knew it was a lost cause.

Also, I'm curious....do you believe James Comey was corrupt? Or do you believe he was perfectly justified in the way he handled the Clinton e-mail situation, which may have cost her the election?

3 hours ago, Cardin Drake said:

Kushner should NOT have taken the Saudi money, IMHO. 

...because if someone waived $2 billion at you (for no reason, right?), I'm sure you'd say "thanks, but no thanks."

[Didba 5,256]

mueller? hyper-partisan? He has been a republican career LEO/beaurocrat his entire time as a government employee.

[I_M4_AU 7,912]

28 minutes ago, icanthearyou said:

Several of you are truly disgusting "citizens". 

Very nice ICHY.  I disagree with 90% of what you post, but would not call you disgusting.  The modern Democratic Party is the cult.

[Didba 5,256]

3 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Very nice ICHY.  I disagree with 90% of what you post, but would not call you disgusting.  The modern Democratic Party is the cult.

 

[icanthearyou 4,463]

3 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Very nice ICHY.  I disagree with 90% of what you post, but would not call you disgusting.  The modern Democratic Party is the cult.

I am sorry you took that personally.

The modern Democratic Party is highly compromised.  Without the money of organized labor, they have made the choice to seek financing from major capital sources.  Consequently, they are further right than ever before.  At least, enough of them to make a real difference. 

It's funny, when I think about when it is that MAGA people want to return to, I think about the late 40s, 50s, and early 60s.  Those years were the direct results of predominantly Democratic power, legislation and policy.  They are defined by social programs that promoted broad opportunity, equality and, taxing excessive personal gain.

The real answers to our problems are not really political.  The answers are more about balancing the interests of society and capital.  We need to restore some balance.  The level of inequality has become unsustainable.  The economy is too narrow, opportunity is too limited.

[I_M4_AU 7,912]

11 minutes ago, icanthearyou said:

I am sorry you took that personally.

I love this part.  You try to defuse by blaming me for taking it personal.  I don’t really take it personally as I am used to the slings and arrows of the left leaning crowd.  If I took it personally, I would have given up by now.

I know exactly how you feel about my thoughts as your reactions are face palms and down votes

Edited August 15, 2022 by I_M4_AU

[wdefromtx 3,159]

29 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Very nice ICHY.  I disagree with 90% of what you post, but would not call you disgusting.  The modern Democratic Party is the cult.

I think both sides have some type of cult going on. That is part of the problem.

[icanthearyou 4,463]

2 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

I love this part.  You try to defuse by blaming me for taking it personal.  I don’t really take it personally as I am used to the slings and arrows of the left leaning crowd.  If I took it personally, I would have given up by now.

I know exactly how you feel about my thoughts as your reactions are face palms and down votes

You are a trained victim.  I am very sorry for what has been done to you.

[Cardin Drake 1,851]

34 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Very nice ICHY.  I disagree with 90% of what you post, but would not call you disgusting.  The modern Democratic Party is the cult.

Well, the general rule of bulletin boards is to get personal when you are losing, so not surprising. 

Everyone wants to talk in grand generalities, when we know very specifically why crossfire hurricane was initiated. And the reasons were corrupt to the core.  There were "ample reason to suspect inappropriate Trump ties with Russia"  What does that mean, specifically? Was he trying to help Russian companies buy U.S. uranium, for example. And Trump's DOJ-don't make me laugh. It was still Obama's; the only change was Sessions who promptly recused himself.

You guys can gaslight yourselves and us all you want, but the corruption, partisanship, and double standard of justice is hiding right there in plain sight. . And yes, it goes back to Comey. His first meeting with President Trump, Comey tells Trump "I don't leak, and I don't do weasel moves", then promptly leaks to the Post that he briefed the President on the pee tape, putting that lie into the public domain. A leak and a weasel move all in one. Comey was in an impossible situation with Hillary's emails.  His job was to exonerate her somehow, but it was tough because she was so clearly guilty, .  So he gives immunity to all of her confederates, including the guy who wiped the drive AFTER it was under subpoena. His excuse "Well, that's the only way I could get him to talk to us"   The problem is there was no proffer exchanging his immunity for testimony against the target. Can you name a single other case that was handled that way. It's like offering immunity to the mob hitman, and then he tells you. Yeah, I killed him all on my own.   Contrast that with the way all of Mueller's targets were treated and squeezed  And no matter what you and the media say, we see it. Instead of giving them immunity to talk, he gave them immunity for not talking.

And you guys can't lay out Trump's plan to enlist Russia in his campaign because it sounds stupid even to you guys when you try.

Edited August 15, 2022 by Cardin Drake

[icanthearyou 4,463]

Just now, Cardin Drake said:

Everyone wants to talk in grand generalities, when we know very specifically why crossfire hurricane was initiated. And the reasons were corrupt to the core. 

This is a total lie.  Again, you should do some research.  You should think about the number of Republicans involved.  You should consider that if the FBI truly wanted Clinton over Trump, all they had to do was announce the Trump investigation and not the Clinton investigation.

 

[I_M4_AU 7,912]

5 minutes ago, icanthearyou said:

You are a trained victim.  I am very sorry for what has been done to you.

This is hilarious coming from you.  Talk about irony.

[icanthearyou 4,463]

3 minutes ago, Cardin Drake said:

You guys can gaslight us all you want, but the corruption, partisanship, and double standard of justice is hiding right there in plain sight. . And yes, it goes back to Comey. His first meeting with President Trump, Comey tells Trump "I don't leak, and I don't do weasel moves", then promptly leaks to the Post that he briefed the President on the pee tape, putting that lie into the public domain. A leak and a weasel move all in one. Comey was in an impossible situation with Hillary's emails.  His job was to exonerate her somehow, but it was tough because she was so clearly guilty,

This also is a total lie.  Comey did not leak the dossier.  It was already in the "public domain".  It was never a government document.  Trump himself did more to publicize the "pee tape" than perhaps anyone else.

Comey is a life long Republican. 

Yes, she was guilty.  Comey even said so but,,, he and others in the DOJ all agreed that she would not be convicted based on the evidence they had.  This is where I have a problem.  Why is it so difficult to prosecute those at the top of society and, so easy to prosecute those at the bottom?