Will we see JJ at QB vs. UK?

[PoetTiger 1,897]

If an AD is over stepping his boundaries it can impact how a coach does his job. In most if not all organizations there is a hierarchy, and the boss has a right to offer advice, input etc. But there has to be a trust factor, and the boss has to trust his guy to do the job without micromanaging. In this hypothetical scenario we are discussing, if Gus told Jay he was going with Jeremy, maybe he was hoping Jay could keep this info between them and not tell anyone, u know not to tip the other team or maybe he wanted to keep SW/JJ in a competitive mindset. Everyone wants an answer for the early struggles of this season, many believe Gus is clueless, stubborn, can't lead, etc. but no one can argue the success his system has not only had at Auburn but every where he has been. I just don't buy he woke up in 2015 and became a bad football coach, can't control his locker room, etc.,

[Strychnine 1,802]

If Gus is not doing the job Jacobs should fire Gus, just like he did with Chizic. No question. As to assisting, the owner should not tell the manager what to do, but ask him what he needs to do his job. This opens a dialog between the two and gives the manager a sense that the owner believes in him and that they are in this together. As the dialog continues the owner can interject ideas that he would like implemented, but the final decision is the managers. If that manager make a bad decision, he and only he, is responsible. I have no idea if this has happened in this case, but never should any of the content discussed be leaked out to anyone. And that is where I have a problem. Gus' credibility would be damaged with the coaches and the team. I'm not even sure 101's source is correct, I guess we'll see tonight.

I doubt very seriously that anything was "leaked". The people in the Athletic Department are Auburn fans too, and they have friends that are Auburn fans. They also happen to hear scuttlebutt from people that are far closer to the program than the press or regular fans. They discuss said scuttlebutt with their friends. It's internal chatter about a college football program, not sensitive compartmented information.

[PoetTiger 1,897]

It's different in football because the players need to see their leadership in charge. If there is a culture that needs to be stopped it's micromanaging "if that's what is going on." Should Gus be held accountable? Absolutely! but not at the expense of an AD coming in in a panicked state and making some type of knee jerk reaction "IF that's what is happening."

Meddling may not affect player development but it absolutely would affect player performance. Attitude reflects leadership. If the leadership is in question, it will flow down to the players.

Quite the jump to conclusions that any "meddling" would be panicked and knee-jerk. And I ABSOLUTELY agree that attitude reflects leadership. Funny that the Gus supporters have said that (and I'm paraphrasing) Attitude is solely up to the players on game day AND attitude reflects leadership -but apparently only when that leadership is being undermined. Which is it? If Gus is, in fact, being " undermined" I assure you it's in closed door meetings and not in full view of the players. I highly doubt Jacobs is out on the field with a whistle.

Not sure if this is a contradiction or not, but trusted folks did report that there were off field staff in defensive meetings every year after Tubs left. Wayne Bolt, maybe? And I think I remember folks saying that Tim Jackson overstepped his bounds a lot, too, but I might be wrong.

People say VanGorder through someone out of a defensive players meeting...how true..I don't know

[PoetTiger 1,897]

This idea of "meddling" IMO is just a cop out used by people to cover for Gus's failures....every success is because of his genius and every failure is because someone is meddling? Hard to believe that adults on this board could be so self-delusional about things like that.

I don't think anyone insinuated that or even said it. If anything it's been youth, QB losing his head, injuries, new DC, etc. for the struggles thus far.

[bigbird 60,525]

It's different in football because the players need to see their leadership in charge. If there is a culture that needs to be stopped it's micromanaging "if that's what is going on." Should Gus be held accountable? Absolutely! but not at the expense of an AD coming in in a panicked state and making some type of knee jerk reaction "IF that's what is happening."

Meddling may not affect player development but it absolutely would affect player performance. Attitude reflects leadership. If the leadership is in question, it will flow down to the players.

Quite the jump to conclusions that any "meddling" would be panicked and knee-jerk. And I ABSOLUTELY agree that attitude reflects leadership. Funny that the Gus supporters have said that (and I'm paraphrasing) Attitude is solely up to the players on game day AND attitude reflects leadership -but apparently only when that leadership is being undermined. Which is it? If Gus is, in fact, being " undermined" I assure you it's in closed door meetings and not in full view of the players. I highly doubt Jacobs is out on the field with a whistle.

Not sure if this is a contradiction or not, but trusted folks did report that there were off field staff in defensive meetings every year after Tubs left. Wayne Bolt, maybe? And I think I remember folks saying that Tim Jackson overstepped his bounds a lot, too, but I might be wrong.

People say VanGorder through someone out of a defensive players meeting...how true..I don't know

Very

[Tiger 8,826]

If Gus feels he's getting pressured by the AD in any way regarding how the program is being run then I think he will voluntarily leave AU after this year

[AUIH1 1,515]

It's different in football because the players need to see their leadership in charge. If there is a culture that needs to be stopped it's micromanaging "if that's what is going on." Should Gus be held accountable? Absolutely! but not at the expense of an AD coming in in a panicked state and making some type of knee jerk reaction "IF that's what is happening."

Meddling may not affect player development but it absolutely would affect player performance. Attitude reflects leadership. If the leadership is in question, it will flow down to the players.

Quite the jump to conclusions that any "meddling" would be panicked and knee-jerk. And I ABSOLUTELY agree that attitude reflects leadership. Funny that the Gus supporters have said that (and I'm paraphrasing) Attitude is solely up to the players on game day AND attitude reflects leadership -but apparently only when that leadership is being undermined. Which is it? If Gus is, in fact, being " undermined" I assure you it's in closed door meetings and not in full view of the players. I highly doubt Jacobs is out on the field with a whistle.

Not sure if this is a contradiction or not, but trusted folks did report that there were off field staff in defensive meetings every year after Tubs left. Wayne Bolt, maybe? And I think I remember folks saying that Tim Jackson overstepped his bounds a lot, too, but I might be wrong.

People say VanGorder through someone out of a defensive players meeting...how true..I don't know

Very

This, wasn't it Bolt?

[Strychnine 1,802]

It's different in football because the players need to see their leadership in charge. If there is a culture that needs to be stopped it's micromanaging "if that's what is going on." Should Gus be held accountable? Absolutely! but not at the expense of an AD coming in in a panicked state and making some type of knee jerk reaction "IF that's what is happening."

Meddling may not affect player development but it absolutely would affect player performance. Attitude reflects leadership. If the leadership is in question, it will flow down to the players.

Quite the jump to conclusions that any "meddling" would be panicked and knee-jerk. And I ABSOLUTELY agree that attitude reflects leadership. Funny that the Gus supporters have said that (and I'm paraphrasing) Attitude is solely up to the players on game day AND attitude reflects leadership -but apparently only when that leadership is being undermined. Which is it? If Gus is, in fact, being " undermined" I assure you it's in closed door meetings and not in full view of the players. I highly doubt Jacobs is out on the field with a whistle.

Not sure if this is a contradiction or not, but trusted folks did report that there were off field staff in defensive meetings every year after Tubs left. Wayne Bolt, maybe? And I think I remember folks saying that Tim Jackson overstepped his bounds a lot, too, but I might be wrong.

People say VanGorder through someone out of a defensive players meeting...how true..I don't know

Very

This, wasn't it Bolt?

If it was, Bolt came with Chizik from Iowa State. At least Chizik had the good sense not to keep him as a DC.

[chimesAU 89]

If Gus feels he's getting pressured by the AD in any way regarding how the program is being run then I think he will voluntarily leave AU after this year

I disagree. You don't turn down $14 million because of boss interference. You suck it up, coach your tail off and retire to the lake/beach/mountains when your contract is up.

[tigerbrotha12 2,362]

I just don't get why you pull White now. White's been fine/hasn't turned ball over; going to ruin confidence of freshman QB.

[Tiger 8,826]

If Gus feels he's getting pressured by the AD in any way regarding how the program is being run then I think he will voluntarily leave AU after this year

I disagree. You don't turn down $14 million because of boss interference. You suck it up, coach your tail off and retire to the lake/beach/mountains when your contract is up.

I'm basing what I said on why Gus left Arky (Nutt wouldn't let him run the O the way he wanted to apparently) and also that he took a lesser job at Arky St because Chiz wanted him to slow down, etc

But Idk about the Chiz thing anymore though honestly because it looks like our O is a carbon copy of the 2011 offense. So idk who was making the O slower. I think, and this is my personal opinion from afar, that Gus is a control freak. He controls what gets fed to the media, he controls his offense the way he wants to wherever he is, he even controls the damn zone reads before the ball is snapped. I think if he doesn't have control like he wants that he's perfectly happy to leave and get into a situation that he does have full control.

[chimesAU 89]

If Gus feels he's getting pressured by the AD in any way regarding how the program is being run then I think he will voluntarily leave AU after this year

I disagree. You don't turn down $14 million because of boss interference. You suck it up, coach your tail off and retire to the lake/beach/mountains when your contract is up.

I'm basing what I said on why Gus left Arky (Nutt wouldn't let him run the O the way he wanted to apparently) and also that he took a lesser job at Arky St because Chiz wanted him to slow down, etc

But Idk about the Chiz thing anymore though honestly because it looks like our O is a carbon copy of the 2011 offense. So idk who was making the O slower

I hear you. I was more saying what I would do than what I expect Gus to do.

[cole256 17,068]

I just don't get why you pull White now. White's been fine/hasn't turned ball over; going to ruin confidence of freshman QB.

He hasn't done anything to lose the job but he hasn't been just fine. He had a few questionable throws but the ball security probably is what the coaches are worried the most about. The fumbles are a problem because you can't say oh well we got it back so it's not a big deal. We were fortunate but those are potentially turnovers as well. I imagine the first thing they want to fix is the qb's turning the ball over

[Strychnine 1,802]

If Gus feels he's getting pressured by the AD in any way regarding how the program is being run then I think he will voluntarily leave AU after this year

I disagree. You don't turn down $14 million because of boss interference. You suck it up, coach your tail off and retire to the lake/beach/mountains when your contract is up.

I'm basing what I said on why Gus left Arky (Nutt wouldn't let him run the O the way he wanted to apparently) and also that he took a lesser job at Arky St because Chiz wanted him to slow down, etc

But Idk about the Chiz thing anymore though honestly because it looks like our O is a carbon copy of the 2011 offense. So idk who was making the O slower. I think, and this is my personal opinion from afar, that Gus is a control freak. He controls what gets fed to the media, he controls his offense the way he wants to wherever he is, he even controls the damn zone reads before the ball is snapped. I think if he doesn't have control like he wants that he's perfectly happy to leave and get into a situation that he does have full control.

The problem there is that one does not produce a season like this one has been (considering the recruiting and expectations), and then leave for greener pastures. I'm not buying that there is Athletic Department pressure to keep Gus from running everything exactly how he wants, unless whatever it is he wants to do is something that even they know is a bad idea, or they have reason to believe that he is doing a bad job. I can't imagine that Jay Jacobs wants anything other than a bunch of 10+ win seasons and championships, or that he thinks his input is more likely to achieve that than Gus would on his own.

[McLoofus 35,182]

If Gus feels he's getting pressured by the AD in any way regarding how the program is being run then I think he will voluntarily leave AU after this year

I disagree. You don't turn down $14 million because of boss interference. You suck it up, coach your tail off and retire to the lake/beach/mountains when your contract is up.

I'll bring a ton of liquor, meat for the grill and gas money for the boat.

[McLoofus 35,182]

I just don't get why you pull White now. White's been fine/hasn't turned ball over; going to ruin confidence of freshman QB.

Has White been as good as what we thought JJ would be? Absolutely not. Not even close. So we hope that JJ's head has gotten right and that he comes back out as the QB he can be instead of the QB that he was through the first 3 games.

All of this "shattering White's/JJ's confidence" talk is bizarre to me. JJ's confidence was already shattered. If he goes back out and doesn't perform again, then he's not going to make it work at Auburn and it's time to make a permanent change. If he goes back out and fails, then White knows that it's his job and he'll proceed accordingly. He will not be broken because we gave the presumptive Heisman candidate with 2 years' seniority on him another shot.

As somebody else said, it's a good thing that these players are a lot tougher and more reasonable than the fans.

[McLoofus 35,182]

^Sorry, that was rude.

I just don't understand the assumption that Sean White would think that the job would be "taken away" from him if JJ went back in. I fully believe that he never assumed it was his to lose, because he's a football player who has an idea of how sports work. It would be different if he were a junior or a senior watching his last shot go out the door, but he's not. He's still very much in line to be a 2-year starter after Johnson is gone (at worst). He went into this expecting to not start until 2017. Why's he going to freak out now?

[PoetTiger 1,897]

^Sorry, that was rude.

I just don't understand the assumption that Sean White would think that the job would be "taken away" from him if JJ went back in. I fully believe that he never assumed it was his to lose, because he's a football player who has an idea of how sports work. It would be different if he were a junior or a senior watching his last shot go out the door, but he's not. He's still very much in line to be a 2-year starter after Johnson is gone (at worst). He went into this expecting to not start until 2017. Why's he going to freak out now?

I agree.....

[chimesAU 89]

If Gus feels he's getting pressured by the AD in any way regarding how the program is being run then I think he will voluntarily leave AU after this year

I disagree. You don't turn down $14 million because of boss interference. You suck it up, coach your tail off and retire to the lake/beach/mountains when your contract is up.

I'll bring a ton of liquor, meat for the grill and gas money for the boat.

" Some place warm... A place where the beer flows like wine...Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Assspen."

I'll meet you there, bud.

[McLoofus 35,182]

If Gus feels he's getting pressured by the AD in any way regarding how the program is being run then I think he will voluntarily leave AU after this year

I disagree. You don't turn down $14 million because of boss interference. You suck it up, coach your tail off and retire to the lake/beach/mountains when your contract is up.

I'll bring a ton of liquor, meat for the grill and gas money for the boat.

" Some place warm... A place where the beer flows like wine...Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Assspen."

I'll meet you there, bud.

[Tiger 8,826]

If Gus feels he's getting pressured by the AD in any way regarding how the program is being run then I think he will voluntarily leave AU after this year

I disagree. You don't turn down $14 million because of boss interference. You suck it up, coach your tail off and retire to the lake/beach/mountains when your contract is up.

I'm basing what I said on why Gus left Arky (Nutt wouldn't let him run the O the way he wanted to apparently) and also that he took a lesser job at Arky St because Chiz wanted him to slow down, etc

But Idk about the Chiz thing anymore though honestly because it looks like our O is a carbon copy of the 2011 offense. So idk who was making the O slower. I think, and this is my personal opinion from afar, that Gus is a control freak. He controls what gets fed to the media, he controls his offense the way he wants to wherever he is, he even controls the damn zone reads before the ball is snapped. I think if he doesn't have control like he wants that he's perfectly happy to leave and get into a situation that he does have full control.

The problem there is that one does not produce a season like this one has been (considering the recruiting and expectations), and then leave for greener pastures. I'm not buying that there is Athletic Department pressure to keep Gus from running everything exactly how he wants, unless whatever it is he wants to do is something that even they know is a bad idea, or they have reason to believe that he is doing a bad job. I can't imagine that Jay Jacobs wants anything other than a bunch of 10+ win seasons and championships, or that he thinks his input is more likely to achieve that than Gus would on his own.

You're right, but I think greener pastures are a subjective thing. Some think greener pastures mean a "better/bigger" program. I don't think Gus feels this way. He had a very good offense he put together with Nutt breathing down his neck and then went to Tulsa. Gus took a step down in the name of control. I was purely speculating though. And for the record, I don't know what to believe. It's just so weird to me that a Gus offense looks like this. I can't imagine an Art Briles offense's wheels just falling off before the halfway point of the season.

I also felt that way about Oregon and it looks like they are having a rough start to the year just like us.

[TitanTiger 20,482]

[SCTiger2011 1,277]

So, I was surprised they didn't announce it last night, but my friend in the AD is saying it's JJ starting tomorrow night. Interesting conversation I had with him as well. He said some people in the AD are very unhappy, and he's very perplexed about the QB situation and the team as a whole. Funny someone on this thread brought it up, because my friend and I said the same thing. How far have we fallen where the coaches are trying to keep KENTUCKY guessing who our starting QB is. I'm sorry, I have no words for that, and my friend said that's one of the reasons people in the AD are in disbelief of the state of our program right now, resorting to mind games with Kentucky, TIFWIW...

bump

[wareagleguy 1,393]

You mean, not counting warm-ups?

Yes, I think he will play, but evidently will not be starting.

[AuburnNTexas 7,148]

What a thread this has become. we started out with a discussion on whether JJ or SW would start people on both sides had legitimate reasons why they picked one way or the other especially since neither QB when given the chance just went out and won the job with the type of game that sealed that QB as the "MAN". Now based on very little information we are having a disagreement on whether AD Department is usurping Gus role as coach versus just being a concerned boss making sure everything is ok.

Six o'clock can't get here fast enough so we actually have something real to talk about.