Gus being set up for failure?

[AU64 10,122]

On ‎6‎/‎18‎/‎2019 at 11:33 AM, DAG said:

which is filled with top ten caliber players then

But it's not filled with top ten caliber players......folks like to think we are but just check how they were rated when they were signed.   Got a few top ten players scattered around a lots of very good players filling out most positions.  But even having top ten players when your primary opponents have top 1 or 2 or 3 players......kind of makes a difference....JMO

[DAG 33,998]

58 minutes ago, AU64 said:

But it's not filled with top ten caliber players......folks like to think we are but just check how they were rated when they were signed.   Got a few top ten players scattered around a lots of very good players filling out most positions.  But even having top ten players when your primary opponents have top 1 or 2 or 3 players......kind of makes a difference....JMO

https://247sports.com/Season/2017-Football/CollegeTeamTalentComposite/

This was the cumulative four year ranking from 247 at the beginning of the 2017 year mark. We were #8

https://247sports.com/Season/2018-Football/CollegeTeamTalentComposite/

#14 at the beginning of 2018 

 

https://247sports.com/Season/2016-Football/CollegeTeamTalentComposite/

were #7 at the beginning of 2016 

https://247sports.com/Season/2015-Football/CollegeTeamTalentComposite/

#7 in 2015

Where is your source, so we can have an healthy debate 

 

Now, I have heard you say , well we are playing teams of greater talent. Yes 3 of those teams will always pull more talent than us for now on a consistent basis. However, Gus is getting paid top dollar to figure it out. If the rationale is , “well it’s okay to be where we are because those teams are more talented than us” then we don’t need a high paying coach. Let’s get a cheaper coach like Coach Bill and have him win 8 games a year.  Heck, people are going at Brohm, but I think he could muster up 8 wins a season with top ten talent for half the cost. I am fine with people making that argument but then we should cut some salary payments too. I mean I think that is only fair.

[DAG 33,998]

2 hours ago, keesler said:

Both Uat & AU played 7 common opponents last season OM/aTm/Arky/Tennessee/LSU/MSU/UGA.  

AU's record was 3-4, UAT's record was 7-0 vs the same teams.

 

 

 

 

Doesn’t count. UA just out talented those teams .

[AU64 10,122]

24 minutes ago, DAG said:

Where is your source, so we can have an healthy debate 

https://n.rivals.com/team_rankings/2015/all-teams/football

Just check this site and pick any year and you will find  that UGa, Bama, LSU, TAMU and UF are often ahead of us and a couple times UT and OM also....but bama, LSU, TAMU and UGa about every recent year.  We are typically 3rd to 5th in the SEC …...which is about the best AU has done in forever.  The nice thing about the link is you can go back as far as you wish...to Chiz, and Tubs though Tubs made the top 10 a time or two, if you were around then, you are aware that it was common practice that our best recruits did not qualify and often never made it to AU. 

So...yep it's Gus's job to recruit the talent but do you honestly think that anyone else coming in here is gonna out-recruit those teams on a regular basis?  The comments about BS doing better in my view were BS......cause he's never been a noted recruiter and not gonna start against the machines at the big state names schools in the SEC. 

And of course UAT out-talented AU the couple times we beat them lately and UGa certainly out-talented us the year they were #1 and lost to AU. 

So ...you are thinking just any coach,  like Clark for example,  is gonna be able to recruit against the machines....with any success ?   I hope that was intended as a joke. 

[dyehardfanAU 2,117]

1 hour ago, DAG said:

https://247sports.com/Season/2017-Football/CollegeTeamTalentComposite/

This was the cumulative four year ranking from 247 at the beginning of the 2017 year mark. We were #8

https://247sports.com/Season/2018-Football/CollegeTeamTalentComposite/

#14 at the beginning of 2018 

 

https://247sports.com/Season/2016-Football/CollegeTeamTalentComposite/

were #7 at the beginning of 2016 

https://247sports.com/Season/2015-Football/CollegeTeamTalentComposite/

#7 in 2015

Where is your source, so we can have an healthy debate 

 

Now, I have heard you say , well we are playing teams of greater talent. Yes 3 of those teams will always pull more talent than us for now on a consistent basis. However, Gus is getting paid top dollar to figure it out. If the rationale is , “well it’s okay to be where we are because those teams are more talented than us” then we don’t need a high paying coach. Let’s get a cheaper coach like Coach Bill and have him win 8 games a year.  Heck, people are going at Brohm, but I think he could muster up 8 wins a season with top ten talent for half the cost. I am fine with people making that argument but then we should cut some salary payments too. I mean I think that is only fair.

'crootin points do not equal good recruiting.  Good recruiting is when you fill your future needs with talented players.

[gr82b4au 5,568]

2 hours ago, DAG said:

Even in 2016, going into the UGA game were were #9 in the nation. The media was already hyping the Iron Bowl, even though I knew that team was very shaky. We lose to UGA, spiral down, still get a chance to play OU in the sugar bowl, with 4 losses. The schedule is a red herring. I think we need to concentrate on the games we should be winning first and foremost. 

In your opinion which games should we win this year?

[DAG 33,998]

5 hours ago, gr82b4au said:

In your opinion which games should we win this year?

Every game except UGA/Bama is winnable. We have 6 games that should be automatics. 

[DAG 33,998]

8 hours ago, AU64 said:

https://n.rivals.com/team_rankings/2015/all-teams/football

Just check this site and pick any year and you will find  that UGa, Bama, LSU, TAMU and UF are often ahead of us and a couple times UT and OM also....but bama, LSU, TAMU and UGa about every recent year.  We are typically 3rd to 5th in the SEC …...which is about the best AU has done in forever.  The nice thing about the link is you can go back as far as you wish...to Chiz, and Tubs though Tubs made the top 10 a time or two, if you were around then, you are aware that it was common practice that our best recruits did not qualify and often never made it to AU. 

So...yep it's Gus's job to recruit the talent but do you honestly think that anyone else coming in here is gonna out-recruit those teams on a regular basis?  The comments about BS doing better in my view were BS......cause he's never been a noted recruiter and not gonna start against the machines at the big state names schools in the SEC. 

And of course UAT out-talented AU the couple times we beat them lately and UGa certainly out-talented us the year they were #1 and lost to AU. 

So ...you are thinking just any coach,  like Clark for example,  is gonna be able to recruit against the machines....with any success ?   I hope that was intended as a joke. 

So one: that is class individual rankings of rivals. Not a cumulative ranking, you get that right? I pulled a 4 year cumulative ranking of players by 247 which is considered a premier ranking site. The nice thing about that link? Lol. But let’s play your game and use your rival link:

2013 : 8

2014: 9

2015: 7

2016: 8

2017: 14

2018:12

so four out of the six years Gus has been here according to rivals , he has had a national class of top ten talent. I am at work so I will dig a little bit deeper in your source to see how often some of these schools are ahead of us, but I can tell you right now, the aggies don’t seem to be consistently ahead of us. You might want to recheck your source. 

Two: Clark isn’t just any coach and yes I definitely think he can wIn 8 games a year like Gus. You know Gene chizik won a NC here and he is average as hell. So yeah. 

Now, I don’t know if Clarke or Stoops can recruit at an high level . I don’t know if they can be successful here. What I do know is Gus is getting paid top tier money and he is both losing to his rivals and not consistently beating teams with less talent. Yet, you are rationalizing since Gene and Tubs didn’t do it, then why expect him to do it? Well, seeing as he is getting paid a higher standard then I expect those standards to match field play.

[DAG 33,998]

3 hours ago, dyehardfanAU said:

'crootin points do not equal good recruiting.  Good recruiting is when you fill your future needs with talented players.

Never said it was. Definitely said we had top ten talent though which we do. 

[Dual-Threat Rigby 8,686]

On 6/17/2019 at 12:39 AM, Auburn2Eugene said:

Gus doesnt need anyone setting himself up for failure. He has done a FINE job of that on his own.

I dont think I replied to this earlier but it demeaned my entire post lol. I even mentioned what he's done on his own end. You certainly exacerbate the problem when you try to limit his mess-ups, if you (that force meddling) are less capable than he is to handle the program.

[Dual-Threat Rigby 8,686]

This Bill Clark thing is cool, but when it comes time to replace people...let's think a little bit higher

[Dual-Threat Rigby 8,686]

7 hours ago, DAG said:

Doesn’t count. UA just out talented those teams .

They definitely didnt just out talent MSU and UGA. UGA looked like the vastly better team until, like all things UGA, they just couldnt handle a curve ball. Jalen, a functioning QB, shocked them at the pace they were going. MSU had an ideal defensive plan to wear down Tua, Fitzgerald just cant throw a football. They had some opportunities to make it look respectable 

[DAG 33,998]

1 hour ago, Dual-Threat Rigby said:

They definitely didnt just out talent MSU and UGA. UGA looked like the vastly better team until, like all things UGA, they just couldnt handle a curve ball. Jalen, a functioning QB, shocked them at the pace they were going. MSU had an ideal defensive plan to wear down Tua, Fitzgerald just cant throw a football. They had some opportunities to make it look respectable 

Yellow font man. You’re 0-2 right now. 

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

4 hours ago, Dual-Threat Rigby said:

I dont think I replied to this earlier but it demeaned my entire post lol. I even mentioned what he's done on his own end. You certainly exacerbate the problem when you try to limit his mess-ups, if you (that force meddling) are less capable than he is to handle the program.

I dont have to be capable of running a SEC program to see and easily point out his shortcomings as a coach. 

Nor do i think there are many who could of done better under the circumstances.

But just imagine the success we could of had if Gus was able to learn from his mistakes...

Not everyone is a Gus lover or a Gus hater. Some people can see the good and the bad without letting personal feelings cloud their judgement.

[abw0004 10,125]

7 hours ago, DAG said:

Every game except UGA/Bama is winnable. We have 6 games that should be automatics. 

I still think both of those are winnable, especially UGA.  Remember they had an exodus of players leaving this offseason.  Many declaring for the draft way too early like Nauta and Holifield. 

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

Our rivals (except LSU) have superstar coaches...and Coach O is showing to be no slouch... 

But they for the most part have superstar coaches. I can NOT believe so many people want to counter the $abans and $marts of the worlds with Bill friggin Clark... Another high school coach who has only coached lower tier NCAA football. Clark may be the best thing since sliced bread, but he needs to show he can win in a major conference before we hire him in my opinion. 

Personally i dont want another on the job training scenario. 

The thinking that Bill Clark would be our best hire is along the same line of thinking that is ok with... 8-5 because... hey... its what we have alway been. 

 

To anyone who thinks you cant change the bar at Auburn look no further than Clemson. Not too long ago Clemson would of killed to be where we are as a program. However they took advantage of their good seasons. Yes...their schedule is kindergarten compared to ours, but champions overcome....they dont make excuses.

And they (Clemson) certainly wouldnt hire a coach no one outside the state of South Carolina had ever heard of...

I could totally see TWill being our Dabo more than Clark. However... hiring either would be a last resort and generally be considered a failure of a coaching search. 

But in the event of a coaching search in the near future... in my opinion... we need to set the bar highet than its ever been set at Auburn and hire a superstar coach to compete with the other superstar coaches in the league. I mean building a 60 million dollar football only facility wont matter a hill of beans if we have an 8-5 coach. Just sayin.

[McLoofus 35,182]

14 hours ago, DAG said:

I don’t think most of these fans understand that the reason SEC recruitment is so high is due to the high level of competition. That’s why schools like Mississippi State, ole miss , heck even Kentucky are getting guys drafted in early rounds even though the records might not reflect. Majority of other conferences don’t have that unless you are the big dog of that conference or a blue blood school. 

Yep. That's my response to the saban thing. He's not the source of Auburn's problems. He's the reason why we consistently recruit in the top 10 now and, as you say, why the entire conference recruits at a higher level. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

8 hours ago, DAG said:

 The nice thing about that link? Lol. But let’s play your game

64 is like Mikey. He'll never admit to taking an L and he never stops moving the goalposts. 

[DAG 33,998]

1 hour ago, abw0004 said:

I still think both of those are winnable, especially UGA.  Remember they had an exodus of players leaving this offseason.  Many declaring for the draft way too early like Nauta and Holifield. 

I actually agree with that. I guess I should say I wouldn’t be POd as much in regards to UGA as they are Uber talented even after the exodus. But those other games, they are definitely winnable. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

7 minutes ago, DAG said:

I actually agree with that. I guess I should say I wouldn’t be POd as much in regards to UGA as they are Uber talented even after the exodus. But those other games, they are definitely winnable. 

Yeah. Every game is winnable. But some are pretty unlikely. I would qualify Amen Corner as such this year. And Gus has a georgia problem, period. 

 

[DAG 33,998]

5 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Yeah. Every game is winnable. But some are pretty unlikely. I would qualify Amen Corner as such this year. And Gus has a georgia problem, period. 

 

I just think some of our fans like 64 are so funny . He wants to brag about UF, but when I bragged about Dan Mullen being a quality coach , he ripped him for his top 25 record with Mississippi State talent . Yet he overlooks Gus’s record . 

[McLoofus 35,182]

2 minutes ago, DAG said:

I just think some of our fans like 64 are so funny . He wants to brag about UF, but when I bragged about Dan Mullen being a quality coach , he ripped him for his top 25 record with Mississippi State talent . Yet he overlooks Gus’s record . 

Okay, yep, that's the same 64 I know, lol.

I bet 64 gives Gus full credit for developing Cam Newton but Dan Mullen doesn't get any credit for turning Dak Prescott into a 4th rounder, Tim Tebow into a 2-time Heisman winner, Chris Leak into a national champion, Alex Smith, Josh Harris....

[TigerFanAU 586]

I disagree with some of the comments in the video. Gus isn't being set up for failure, he's had years to earn trust. And if people really are hesitant to donate money because of Gus, then its unfortunate that negative stigma is going around. Donors should be viewed as supporting Auburn football and not Gus Malzahn. Gus's coaching career and the football complex are 2 separate things. Coaches come and go, but facilities have a much longer life span. And if we want Auburn football recruiting to remain competitive, then we need to get this thing built.

 

[aujeff11 6,243]

4 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Okay, yep, that's the same 64 I know, lol.

I bet 64 gives Gus full credit for developing Cam Newton but Dan Mullen doesn't get any credit for turning Dak Prescott into a 4th rounder, Tim Tebow into a 2-time Heisman winner, Chris Leak into a national champion, Alex Smith, Josh Harris....

 Are we done talking about 64 yet?

Let’s talk about how you have been hiding under faulty ignore filters ever since you tried to call Jason Smith a troublemaker. 

[DAG 33,998]

1 minute ago, aujeff11 said:

 Are we done talking about 64 yet?

Let’s talk about how you have been hiding under faulty ignore filters ever since you tried to call Jason Smith a troublemaker.