Three 3rd graders, three adults killed by shooter at Nashville elementary school

[Mikey 16,714]

5 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

Those are private schools. There are more than 90,000 public schools, so that's at least 180,000, and likely more. You're willing to support that with your tax dollars, along with all the associated costs?

My personal choice is to arm every teacher that volunteers to be trained and armed. Had it been common knowledge that, say, 25% of the teachers at the school in question were armed it's clear that this madwoman would have gone elsewhere. Have enough armed teachers in every school and maybe school shootings would be a thing of the past.

Since my tax dollars are being wasted to weaponize the IRS with 87,000 new agents and according to legend last year $10 million was sent to Pakistan to support a study to determine why their male goats prefer to have sex with female goats I wouldn't object to placing armed guards in the schools. At least some positive benefit would come from additional security. Just cut back a billion or two dollars in foreign aid to nations that hate us anyway and we can afford school security.

[Leftfield 2,651]

1 minute ago, Mikey said:

My personal choice is to arm every teacher that volunteers to be trained and armed. .

So what happens at schools where no one volunteers?

2 minutes ago, Mikey said:

Had it been common knowledge that, say, 25% of the teachers at the school in question were armed it's clear that this madwoman would have gone elsewhere.

It's not even close to being clear. You assume rational thought in the mind of someone who is likely not rational.

You also assume a teacher will achieve a level of proficiency that matches a police officer, without the extensive training and certainly without any body armor.

This also ignores the concerns that police have about the increased number of people with guns if this scenario takes place, where police would have to distinguish between the good guys and bad guys before engaging.

8 minutes ago, Mikey said:

Just cut back a billion or two dollars in foreign aid to nations that hate us anyway and we can afford school security.

It would take much, much more than that.

[TexasTiger 13,003]

17 minutes ago, Mikey said:

My personal choice is to arm every teacher that volunteers to be trained and armed. Had it been common knowledge that, say, 25% of the teachers at the school in question were armed it's clear that this madwoman would have gone elsewhere. Have enough armed teachers in every school and maybe school shootings would be a thing of the past.

Since my tax dollars are being wasted to weaponize the IRS with 87,000 new agents and according to legend last year $10 million was sent to Pakistan to support a study to determine why their male goats prefer to have sex with female goats I wouldn't object to placing armed guards in the schools. At least some positive benefit would come from additional security. Just cut back a billion or two dollars in foreign aid to nations that hate us anyway and we can afford school security.

You’re the most misinformed person I kinda sorta know.

[Mikey 16,714]

10 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

It's not even close to being clear. You assume rational thought in the mind of someone who is likely not rational.

The Nashville police have stated that the shooter made attack plans for two different schools and chose the one that didn't have security. So yes, it's very clear that she was avoiding places that could bite back. She was rational enough to draw maps of the buildings and choose the school that didn't have security. Armed teachers would have sent her off in another direction.

12 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

It would take much, much more than that.

The money it would take isn't a drop in the bucket of the federal budget. Obama handed out a half-billion to Solyndra which folded and the money disappeared and nobody even batted an eye. https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/specialreports/solyndra-scandal/

 

[Mikey 16,714]

11 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

You’re the most misinformed person I kinda sorta know.

Well then, that makes you a very lucky person.

[gr82be 14,461]

6 hours ago, Mikey said:

60,000 should be no problem. Biden is in the process of hiring 87,000 new IRS agents. If he were concerned about school shootings hiring 60,000 retires would be a piece of cake. Sadly....

 

6 hours ago, Leftfield said:

Those are private schools. There are more than 90,000 public schools, so that's at least 180,000, and likely more. You're willing to support that with your tax dollars, along with all the associated costs?

On the surface and as the husband of a teacher I see the potential benefit of having a couple of armed guards/teachers in a school. The other side of that is that we have teachers in school that can't be trusted because of sexual misconduct so I don't know that placing a gun in some of their hands would make me feel any better. The same can be said about hiring armed guards for the schools. The problem is that a loose nut is going to fall through the cracks there too and somewhere one of them will go off against whatever cause they think broke them. There is a problem with the moral decay of this country. I'm fine with a ban on AR style weapons but the gun isn't the problem, the lunatic people with guns are the problem. Those same lunatics will just find some other ways to take an innocent life along with their pathetic life. That doesn't mean something doesn't need to be done about guns, just that it won't solve all of our violence issues. Violent and sick people will find other ways to strike out because their violent and sick. 

[DKW 86 7,440]

21 hours ago, TexasTiger said:

Most, if not all, articles I’ve seen since that’s been known have mentioned it. In regard to the paragraph in which it’s mentioned, at this point it’s unclear how relevant it was.

1) In the CNN Coverage, the word Trans came in the 39th Paragraph. That is how the narrative matters more than the facts. Here is a the headline: "A Transgender Woman with mental issues shot her way into an elementary school today and killed 6 people."

Being a Transgender woman may not mean anything at all. The fact that CNN waited until the 39th paragraph to talk about it is VERY VERY TELLING.

https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/nashville-tennessee-covenant-school-shooting-3-28-23/index.html

Today on CNN, Trans does not appear until well into the 200th+ Paragraph. Why are they hiding facts?

Edited March 29, 2023 by DKW 86

[DKW 86 7,440]

19 hours ago, CoffeeTiger said:

I'm pretty sure TexasTiger was saying that in sarcasm. 

 

Every country on earth has depressed and mentally unstable people. 

The US is one of the only countries that gives it's population easy and legal access to a  large variety of guns and ammo. 

The US is one of the only countries where mass murders and school massacre's are common. These massacre's are committed with guns in 99% of occurrences. 

Conservatives will argue all day long that Guns have NOTHING to do with the situation.

It's the true American paradox. 

As you say, the problem is two parts. 1) Culture and Gun Culture, 2) Availability of guns to anyone.

The Trans woman was being treated for mental illness and managed to buy, at last report seven guns?

[DKW 86 7,440]

19 hours ago, Leftfield said:

You're right, our culture is a problem. So how do we change it?

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/06/ar-15-rifle-mass-shootings-gun-control/661275/

You've said that those of us advocating for severe restrictions are only focused on guns, not any of the other root problems, but that's not correct. We're all for changing the culture, but you can't do that with widespread proliferation and a capitalist economy that has every interest in pushing sales.

And what are you doing about criminals with guns that do most of the killings? Nothing.

 

[DKW 86 7,440]

17 hours ago, icanthearyou said:

No.  Access to, and efficiency of, guns has obviously changed.

If I go dove hunting, I am restricted to three rounds.  Point being, we now have guns with capacity and fire rates that are good for nothing but efficiently, killing humans in mass.  Why is this allowed?

I agree with you. How many rounds in the magazine before your dick feels big enough?

[DKW 86 7,440]

17 hours ago, AU9377 said:

The attitude toward guns has certainly changed.  We didn't have guns at school in Georgia in the late 80s early 1990s, but we also didn't have people wearing guns walking down the street regularly either.  One gun that was not present years ago was the AK style military weapons.  In fact, they were illegal to own at the time due to the assault weapons ban.  There is no need to own that weapon. Period.  It isn't a toy.  It is a weapon used for one purpose, to kill people in a combat type environment.  From a practical point, it is much easier to rush someone carrying a weapon that they will need to reload or at the very least re-trigger than it is one that they do not.

There is no one answer, but we cannot let perfect be the enemy of good.  There is no harm in regulating the purchase of the most deadly of those weapons.  There is nothing unconstitutional about it at all.  We are simply allowing politics to direct the entire conversation instead of good sense. 

I am 100% for regulating fire rates, who can buy, etc. But what are you going to do about criminals with guns?

[DKW 86 7,440]

21 hours ago, arein0 said:

Can someone help me understand why it matters if the shooter was or was not trans? The school shooting happened regardless of the shooters gender and I feel like people are more interested in their gender than the actual shooting.

Why would you feel the need to hide cold hard facts of the case?

According to ABC the shooter was using He/Him Pronouns because they found one reference that showed He/Him usage.

So ABC has now found a way back to the narrative... Cant make this s*** up.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/multiple-patients-reported-amid-active-aggressor-nashville-school/story?id=98152651

 

[DKW 86 7,440]

17 hours ago, CoffeeTiger said:

This is THE PROBLEM. We need Radical Change in the Mental Health service area.

 

[TexasTiger 13,003]

8 hours ago, Mikey said:

60,000 should be no problem. Biden is in the process of hiring 87,000 new IRS agents. If he were concerned about school shootings hiring 60,000 retires would be a piece of cake. Sadly....

That’s another Mikey lie.

[Leftfield 2,651]

44 minutes ago, DKW 86 said:

And what are you doing about criminals with guns that do most of the killings? Nothing.

 

Can you please follow the conversation? This entire thread was begun in response to a mass shooting with an AR-15, and that style of gun has increasingly been the weapon of choice for mass shootings. The discussion was about issues pertaining to those weapons, not all guns.

Certainly crimes with guns in general has to be addressed, but that is a much larger scope and the issue has many other complications. I would also argue that some of the steps taken to reverse the trend in assault rifles will have a positive effect in overall gun culture. In the meantime, stop acting like I and others don't give a damn about it. 

[TexasTiger 13,003]

1 hour ago, DKW 86 said:

As you say, the problem is two parts. 1) Culture and Gun Culture, 2) Availability of guns to anyone.

The Trans woman was being treated for mental illness and managed to buy, at last report seven guns?

What’s the most relevant concerning issue in that statement? And btw, they were apparently a trans man.

[Leftfield 2,651]

8 hours ago, Mikey said:

The Nashville police have stated that the shooter made attack plans for two different schools and chose the one that didn't have security. So yes, it's very clear that she was avoiding places that could bite back. She was rational enough to draw maps of the buildings and choose the school that didn't have security. Armed teachers would have sent her off in another direction.

Logical fallacy. If a person chooses the easier of two targets, that does not mean they wouldn't have attacked the other target if it was the only option. By this I mean that if she was only interested in shooting up the other school, the fact it had security does not mean she wouldn't have. 

Mass shooters have targeted schools with security guards. Why do you suddenly think arming teachers would stop them all?

 

8 hours ago, Mikey said:

The money it would take isn't a drop in the bucket of the federal budget. Obama handed out a half-billion to Solyndra which folded and the money disappeared and nobody even batted an eye. https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/specialreports/solyndra-scandal/

You really love spouting about the way government spends money, but all I asked was if you were willing to have your tax dollars go to supplying security for all government schools. It was a simple question, needing only a yes or no.

[I_M4_AU 7,957]

10 hours ago, AU9377 said:

Do you realize that they did, in fact, pass the first regulations that have been passed in decades by way of a bi partisan bill.  You can't simply demand it so and it magically happen.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/biden-signs-bipartisan-gun-safety-package-law/story?id=85692952

It wasn’t an assault weapons ban as I specifically said in my post and what Biden has wanted since day one.  He knows he can’t get it passed because it is unconstitutional.  Yet, the man wants to have the public believe he can.

[I_M4_AU 7,957]

23 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

And btw, they were apparently a trans man.

You really buy into that ideology, don’t you?  If they do an autopsy I will guarantee the body will show XX chromosomes and SHE will still be dead.

[TexasTiger 13,003]

39 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

You really buy into that ideology, don’t you?  If they do an autopsy I will guarantee the body will show XX chromosomes and SHE will still be dead.

I don’t buy into any ideology. You can’t track a simple conversation. The shooter was a biological woman who used male pronouns on a social media website and apparently had fairly recently identified as a trans man. David said trans woman. There’s nothing ideological or non-factual  about my post. You’re so ideological, it’s keeping you from seeing that.

[CoffeeTiger 5,166]

2 hours ago, DKW 86 said:

As you say, the problem is two parts. 1) Culture and Gun Culture, 2) Availability of guns to anyone.

The Trans woman was being treated for mental illness and managed to buy, at last report seven guns?

Yes, the shooter had no criminal record and was legally allowed to buy as many guns as they wanted. 

Apparently, his/her parents didn't think they should have guns because of his/her mental state but Tennessee (like most Conservative States) do not have Red Flag laws that could have stopped the shooter from buying them. 

Edited March 29, 2023 by CoffeeTiger

[TitanTiger 20,510]

9 hours ago, Mikey said:

The Nashville police have stated that the shooter made attack plans for two different schools and chose the one that didn't have security. So yes, it's very clear that she was avoiding places that could bite back. She was rational enough to draw maps of the buildings and choose the school that didn't have security. Armed teachers would have sent her off in another direction.

In THIS case.  The issue is, not all mass shooters are so logical.  Some don't care if they die and in fact hope to kill as many as they can and then die so they don't have to face the victims' family or other consequences.  They WANT to go out in a blaze of infamy.

 

[Mikey 16,714]

1 hour ago, TexasTiger said:

That’s another Mikey lie.

Thanks to the Pubbies taking over the House, Biden's plan to hire 87,000 new IRS agents may not come to fruition. However, it not because Biden didn't try. And to the point: If hiring 87,000 new IRS agents is something to be casually accomplished, hiring enough security personnel for schools shouldn't be a problem. The federal budget would hardly notice. https://lamborn.house.gov/media/press-releases/house-republicans-rescind-funding-87000-new-irs-agents

[Mikey 16,714]

1 hour ago, Leftfield said:

Mass shooters have targeted schools with security guards. Why do you suddenly think arming teachers would stop them all?

While it might not stop them all, it would stop the majority. Also, the armed teachers could kill the criminal before extreme damage was done. Unarmed teachers have died protecting their students. Had they been armed they would have had a decent chance to stop the carnage.

1 hour ago, Leftfield said:

You really love spouting about the way government spends money, but all I asked was if you were willing to have your tax dollars go to supplying security for all government schools. It was a simple question, needing only a yes or no.

Obviously, yes. Anybody should have understood that.

If there's money for multi-billions in foreign aid to nations that hate us, if there's money to drop a ton or so of gold on a tarmac in Iran then there's plenty of money to make our schools secure. Lack of money isn't a problem.

[TexasTiger 13,003]

10 minutes ago, Mikey said:

Thanks to the Pubbies taking over the House, Biden's plan to hire 87,000 new IRS agents may not come to fruition. However, it not because Biden didn't try. And to the point: If hiring 87,000 new IRS agents is something to be casually accomplished, hiring enough security personnel for schools shouldn't be a problem. The federal budget would hardly notice. https://lamborn.house.gov/media/press-releases/house-republicans-rescind-funding-87000-new-irs-agents

Utterly moronic lie. Pure idiocy.

https://time.com/6260075/irs-87000-agents-republican-lie/

It took 5 months to get my tax refund last year because of staffing shortages. This isn’t 87k auditors. This is the kind of crazy lie they know their weak-minded base will lap up. Step away from the trough.