Trump’s Attack On Black Athletes May Bring a League to Its Feet

[aujeff11 6,243]

 

http://m.steelers.com/news/article-1/National-Anthem-has-special-meaning-for-Villanueva/6d5b960d-53a5-430f-aafd-baf2fa573a4b

 

Quote

Villanueva said he takes great pride every time he hears the National Anthem: 

"I will stand very proudly, and I will sing every single line in the National Anthem every single time I hear it," said Villanueva. "I will stop whatever I am doing, because I recognize that I have to be very thankful to be in this country. They taught me that at West Point. It was one of the first lessons they teach you on day one. So I know the words. They mean a lot to me. It's a song they play at every military funeral and at every ceremony. It actually means a lot to me, but I don't expect people to have that feeling when they hear the National Anthem and whatnot. Obviously, my life has changed dramatically since I came to this country. And for me, it's great opportunity. I'm very grateful to be an American, I'm very blessed and I'm very appreciative of people who have sacrificed so much to provide me with this quality of life.

...

I agree that America is not perfect. I agree that there are a lot of issues with minorities in this country. And I agree that we should do something about it. But I don't know if the most effective way is to sit down when the National Anthem of a country that has provided you freedom and is providing you $60 million a year is the best way to do it, when there are black minorities that are dying in Iraq and Afghanistan that are protecting our freedom for less than $20,000 a year. So, it's his decision. Obviously he has brought up the issue in a great way, but I think if he encourages other players or other people in the stands to sit down, it's going to send the wrong message. And I think he has to be a little more careful and look at the big picture of the things that he is doing, because as a service member, I have to understand it. I have to understand that. But he's an athlete. He has a huge platform. He has to see the impact that he has on a lot of people's lives. I don't think it's the most effective way."

 

[auburnphan 6,050]

10 minutes ago, aujeff11 said:

An ultra/ overwhelming majority of vets are not conflicted at all. As a matter of fact, you should know this since a lib rag website accused the military of turning veterans racist and we discussed this on this very site.

You probably know a mere handful. Who are the “keyboard claimers?” Just curious...

 

Keyboard claimers are those that post on twitter, etc. claiming to be a veteran but there is no actual proof.  With all due respect I know a lot of veterans and have worked diligently on veterans causes for the last 20 years. 

[aujeff11 6,243]

1 minute ago, auburnphan said:

Keyboard claimers are those that post on twitter, etc. claiming to be a veteran but there is no actual proof.  With all due respect I know a lot of veterans and have worked diligently on veterans causes for the last 20 years. 

Well I can honestly say that I can’t think of  four SM’s that I served with that would be sympathetic to Kaepernicks vehicle of protest. 

[TitanTiger 20,511]

34 minutes ago, aujeff11 said:

Wow. Watch his interview. He clearly says it. He even used the words moral dilemma regarding wanting to stand for the Anthem even though the coach wanted 100 percent team participation in whatever COA they chose. 

I did.  And I heard him say this:

"Unfortunately, I threw (my teammates) under the bus, unintentionally," he said. "Every single time I see that picture of me standing by myself, I feel embarrassed."

It's not as you wish to portray it.  

[aujeff11 6,243]

7 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Unfortunately, I threw (my teammates) under the bus, unintentionally," he said. "Every single time I see that picture of me standing by myself, I feel embarrassed."

 

Of course he is embarrassed. He is used to being a team player. It’s pretty revealing that not protesting the flag is actively throwing others “under the bus” as well.

 

7 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

It's not as you wish to portray it.  

Irony. 

[Mims44 1,890]

3 hours ago, aujeff11 said:

Well I can honestly say that I can’t think of  four SM’s that I served with that would be sympathetic to Kaepernicks vehicle of protest. 

It's pretty split among my FB. It's crazy how similar the disconnects in arguments are to here at AUForums as well.

Some guys say it's disrespectful and they won't watch the NFL, other guys jump in and say it's OUR jobs to insure they have the freedoms to kneel in this country, the athletes are able to do so because we've done our jobs well so we should be happy for them.

Then I jump in and say Hey d-bags, you can agree to defend someones right to protest and still not like HOW they protest..... And I'm ignored.

People have fun bickering, and won't let go of this bone till they are given a new one to chew on.

[wdefromtx 3,159]

3 minutes ago, Mims44 said:

It's pretty split among my FB. It's crazy how similar the disconnects in arguments are to here at AUForums as well.

Some guys say it's disrespectful and they won't watch the NFL, other guys jump in and say it's OUR jobs to insure they have the freedoms to kneel in this country, the athletes are able to do so because we've done our jobs well so we should be happy for them.

Then I jump in and say Hey d-bags, you can agree to defend someones right to protest and still not like HOW they protest..... And I'm ignored.

People have fun bickering, and won't let go of this bone till they are given a new one to chew on.

 

Sorry, couldn't resist!

[TitanTiger 20,511]

Eric Reid, teammate of Colin Kaepernick, on why they chose to kneel as their protest:

 

Quote

...We also discussed how we could use our platform, provided to us by being professional athletes in the N.F.L., to speak for those who are voiceless.

After hours of careful consideration, and even a visit from Nate Boyer, a retired Green Beret and former N.F.L. player, we came to the conclusion that we should kneel, rather than sit, the next day during the anthem as a peaceful protest. We chose to kneel because it’s a respectful gesture. I remember thinking our posture was like a flag flown at half-mast to mark a tragedy.

It baffles me that our protest is still being misconstrued as disrespectful to the country, flag and military personnel. We chose it because it’s exactly the opposite. It has always been my understanding that the brave men and women who fought and died for our country did so to ensure that we could live in a fair and free society, which includes the right to speak out in protest.

It should go without saying that I love my country and I’m proud to be an American. But, to quote James Baldwin, “exactly for this reason, I insist on the right to criticize her perpetually.”

I can’t find words that appropriately express how heartbroken I am to see the constant smears against Colin, a person who helped start the movement with only the very best of intentions. We are talking about a man who helped to orchestrate a commercial planeful of food and supplies for famine-stricken Somalia. A man who has invested his time and money into needy communities here at home. A man I am proud to call my brother, who should be celebrated for his courage to seek change on important issues. Instead, to this day, he is unemployed and portrayed as a radical un-American who wants to divide our country...

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/25/opinion/colin-kaepernick-football-protests.html

 

[aujeff11 6,243]

The myth of the martyr continues. 

[DKW 86 7,441]

8 hours ago, homersapien said:

Come on DKW, you're better than that.

I am asking a real question. We are talking about Police on Black issues here that are nowhere that level.

[japantiger 4,051]

9 hours ago, homersapien said:

You implied they weren't entitled to protest against the disproportionate use of violence against black people by the police - presumably because they are rich  - then you showed contempt for the issue,  declaring it to be a false one.

That "implies inherent racism" which it does.  It reflects your lack of empathy toward black people and this issue that concerns them.

Try to be honest with yourself.  

Homey, you're really getting tiring...racism, racism, racism...it's all you've got.    I didn't imply anything....it would be really helpful if you actually read for comprehension.  What I have actually, literally, in words on this forum said; is they are entitled to protest anything they want to....it's their right....I just want them to do it away from my ******* football game ... I don't know how to make this any simpler....you're the one that keep trying to make it a cause celeb and something deep ...... I don't give a s*** about what they think of the flag or the anthem or, well anything actually....I just want to watch them play football....these guys doing this are clowns...have you seen the latest NFL statements...they don't have any ******* idea what they're protesting....they thought this was cool...like holding signs while someone takes your picture and putting it on social media...it's pretty clear they didn't have a thought in their heads about the implications....and now the league doesn't have to courage to do what it did any other time something like this came up....

My empathy toward black people is the same as my empathy toward any people....just for the record, for tools like CK, I have no empathy...he's a witless tool that had the world layed at his feet and pissed it away in his arrogance...he's also a hypocrite based on his own statements...he walked out on his contract and couldn't get a free agent contract...suddenly he's a victim of racism?...funny how when he signed his $126m deal that wasn't racist....For the 500 blacks murdered in Chicago this year; I have a great deal of empathy and I don't understand why the black leadership in that city or these NFLers don't....the reality is, per the FBI crime database stats, it's safer to be a black man in police custody than it is to be a black man in his neighborhood in the top 25 US metros....how about you get some empathy for that .... where is the outrage over that?.  There's no political gain  in that is there?   this is the great scandal in all this...black men continue to be murdered in their youth at a record pace and not one single leader in the black community has anything to say.  How about getting some empathy for the fact that 75% of all black pregnancies end in abortion.....how about getting some empathy for the fact that 75% of all black births are out of wedlock; thus ensuring another generation of dependence and poverty....

Drop your smug faux caring for the black community and your pseudo intellectual psycho babble about inherent racism.... it's about as genuine and effective as CK's kneeling at solving anything....I don't believe in symbols....I believe in what people actually do.  when these NFLers come out with a plan and effort to help make a differnce with any of the three items above; then we can talk...until then, #stop****ingupnflfootball ...

 

[TitanTiger 20,511]

15 hours ago, japantiger said:

I don't believe in symbols

Yet you're mad that they are 'disrespecting' a symbol.

[TitanTiger 20,511]

[DKW 86 7,441]

1 hour ago, TitanTiger said:

This is exactly what I am afraid of. That disrespecting The Flag, Nation, and the Govt will become the new go-to protest. Soon, every nutjob with an axe to grind will be in the "DisRespect Until I Get My Way Business."

[TitanTiger 20,511]

7 minutes ago, DKW 86 said:

This is exactly what I am afraid of. That disrespecting The Flag, Nation, and the Govt will become the new go-to protest. Soon, every nutjob with an axe to grind will be in the "DisRespect Until I Get My Way Business."

I think the point is, people's notion of what is "disrespect" tends to be a lot more flexible than they care to admit.

[DKW 86 7,441]

Definition: One Death is a death too many. 
But we should ALSO be having a national discourse on the far larger issues.

If you do the math, the Problem on the right is almost exactly 70X worse.

 

[cptau 169]

6 minutes ago, DKW 86 said:

This is exactly what I am afraid of. That disrespecting The Flag, Nation, and the Govt will become the new go-to protest. Soon, every nutjob with an axe to grind will be in the "DisRespect Until I Get My Way Business."

Protesting is already a national industry.  Businesses ban protests on their property and by their employees on company time.  If they want to protest go on strike,  do it on your own time in the street, of rent a auditorium.  No business should allow the protests or the free speech the NFL is allowing.  The NFL is afraid of it players.

But the NFL will fine a player for free expression that  they deemed objectionable to the NFL customers or wearing unauthorized items on their uniforms. 

Pittsburgh Steelers wide receiver Antonio Brown was fined $11,576 for jumping on the goal post to celebrate a touchdown in a 2015 game against the Indianapolis Colts. Brown received an unsportsmanlike penalty for using the goalpost as a prop. (AP Photo/Fred Vuich, File)

 

[DKW 86 7,441]

Hard Data, Hollow Protests

Quote

 

The FBI released its official crime tally for 2016 today, and the data flies in the face of the rhetoric that professional athletes rehearsed in revived Black Lives Matter protests over the weekend.  Nearly 900 additional blacks were killed in 2016 compared with 2015, bringing the black homicide-victim total to 7,881. Those 7,881 “black bodies,” in the parlance of Ta-Nehisi Coates, are 1,305 more than the number of white victims (which in this case includes most Hispanics) for the same period, though blacks are only 13 percent of the nation’s population. The increase in black homicide deaths last year comes on top of a previous 900-victim increase between 2014 and 2015.

Who is killing these black victims? Not whites, and not the police, but other blacks. In 2016, the police fatally shot 233 blacks, the vast majority armed and dangerous, according to the Washington Post. The Post categorized only 16 black male victims of police shootings as “unarmed.” That classification masks assaults against officers and violent resistance to arrest. Contrary to the Black Lives Matter narrative, the police have much more to fear from black males than black males have to fear from the police. In 2015, a police officer was 18.5 times more likely to be killed by a black male than an unarmed black male was to be killed by a police officer. Black males have made up 42 percent of all cop-killers over the last decade, though they are only 6 percent of the population. That 18.5 ratio undoubtedly worsened in 2016, in light of the 53 percent increase in gun murders of officers—committed vastly and disproportionately by black males. Among all homicide suspects whose race was known, white killers of blacks numbered only 243. 

Violent crime has now risen by a significant amount for two consecutive years. The total number of violent crimes rose 4.1 percent in 2016, and estimated homicides rose 8.6 percent. In 2015, violent crime rose by nearly 4 percent and estimated homicides by nearly 11 percent. The last time violence rose two years in a row was 2005–06.  The reason for the current increase is what I have called the Ferguson Effect. Cops are backing off of proactive policing in high-crime minority neighborhoods, and criminals are becoming emboldened. Having been told incessantly by politicians, the media, and Black Lives Matter activists that they are bigoted for getting out of their cars and questioning someone loitering on a known drug corner at 2 AM, many officers are instead just driving by. Such stops are discretionary; cops don’t have to make them. And when political elites demonize the police for just such proactive policing, we shouldn’t be surprised when cops get the message and do less of it. Seventy-two percent of the nation’s officers say that they and their colleagues are now less willing to stop and question suspicious persons, according to a Pew Research poll released in January. The reason is the persistent anti-cop climate. 

 

 

[homersapien 11,453]

The fact that a disproportionate amount of blacks live in conditions that promote gangs and black on black crime has NOTHING to do with the issue of the disproportionate number of innocent black people that are detained - or even killed - by representatives our collective government.

Two SEPARATE issues.    

Making such a contrast to denigrate the amount of concern black people have about how they are treated by the police is a way of simply dismissing valid concerns regarding law enforcement.  It's dispicable.

That sort of logic is like saying black people have no right to protest unwarranted police violence because so many more of them die due to heart disease.  

[Mims44 1,890]

34 minutes ago, homersapien said:

The fact that a disproportionate amount of blacks live in conditions that promote gangs and black on black crime has NOTHING to do with the issue of the disproportionate number of innocent black people that are detained - or even killed - by representatives our collective government.

Two SEPARATE issues.    

Making such a contrast to denigrate the amount of concern black people have about how they are treated by the police is a way of simply dismissing valid concerns regarding law enforcement.  It's dispicable.

That sort of logic is like saying black people have no right to protest unwarranted police violence because so many more of them die due to heart disease.  

I gotta disagree with you there man.

Everywhere you go, EVERYWHERE. Police get more nervous thus more brutal and more likely to make snap judgements when they are in the poverty stricken area of their jurisdiction. This is true with white deaths by cop as well, while per capita it's lower than black deaths, when you look through the stories a lot of times the similarity is being poor. Poor blacks and poor whites and poor Hispanics have a much larger target on their back than others.

[aujeff11 6,243]

2 hours ago, homersapien said:

The fact that a disproportionate amount of blacks live in conditions that promote gangs and black on black crime

He admits this but if a black man is killed by a white cop, the media acts appalled that a cop might’ve been put into situations where they had to pull the trigger.

And then. said cop will be put on a list more appropriate for Facebook memes, labeling him as the next killer found not guilty sparking new protests.

[DKW 86 7,441]

15 hours ago, homersapien said:

The fact that a disproportionate amount of blacks live in conditions that promote gangs and black on black crime has NOTHING to do with the issue of the disproportionate number of innocent black people that are detained - or even killed - by representatives our collective government.

Two SEPARATE issues.    

Making such a contrast to denigrate the amount of concern black people have about how they are treated by the police is a way of simply dismissing valid concerns regarding law enforcement.  It's dispicable.

That sort of logic is like saying black people have no right to protest unwarranted police violence because so many more of them die due to heart disease.  

My point is that the other is a 70X bigger issue and gets no mention today. If "Black lives Matter" really means it, then lets work on the whole picture. Lets Unify and fix the whole picture not just what is the most convenient tool to whip the other side with. homey, i am not calling YOU out, I am calling for the whole nation to start working on the whole problem and find a whole solution.

 

By the way, if you read the whole stats on this, White Folks commit suicide by Cop more frequently than Blacks. I say let us unify and fix the problem, not just the issue that benefits one side of the aisle.

[aujeff11 6,243]

They could protest the number of black babies that are slaughtered each year, too. 

[japantiger 4,051]

5 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

Yet you're mad that they are 'disrespecting' a symbol.

This is why we can't have nice things...discussing anything with you guys is like talking about Brawndo...read the words dude....I don't care what they are doing to a symbol...they could be protesting the chafing that the tag in the back of their jock causes...I don't care what it is they're protesting....I just want it away from the game.......

 I am never surprised when leftist disrespect the flag; or any institution, it's their MO...just do it somewhere I'm not paying for entertainment....how about this, do it during Grey's Anatomy....that way it would be a bunch of people that give a s*** all having a big love fest and commiserating how awful their millionaire lives are...#justplaythedamngame #stopyourmillionairewhining #itswhyilovehighschoolandcollegefootball

[aujeff11 6,243]

2 minutes ago, japantiger said:

I don't care what it is they're protesting....I just want it away from the game....

Titan will never get this. When the majority of the people only want football and/or want players standing, the business model ultimately rules. Great “protest” guys, see y’all next Trump tweet. 

Denver Broncos will be standing for now on: 

Last week, members of our team joined their brothers around the NFL in a powerful display of unity.  

"It was an emotional time for everyone, including the fans who support us each and every week. As controversial as it appeared, we needed to show our collective strength and resolve.

"Our voices needed to be heard loud and clear.  

"Make no mistake — our actions were in no way a protest of the military, the flag or those who keep us safe. We have nothing but the deepest love and respect for those who protect our way of life and the freedoms we enjoy as Americans. 

"While there’s no greater country, it’s not perfect. Inequalities still exist, and we have work to do in ALL forms of social justice. We can all do better.  

"It starts with us. We need to do our part and use our platform as NFL players to continue driving that positive change.  

"Our locker room is one diverse place, and that’s what makes it so special. It’s where thoughtful, intelligent leaders from all different races, religions and backgrounds come together.  

"We may have different values and beliefs, but there’s one thing we all agree on:  

"We’re a team and we stand together — no matter how divisive some comments and issues can be, nothing should ever get in the way of that.  

"Starting Sunday, we’ll be standing together."