Hardest job in America

[WalkingCarpet 1,379]

12 hours ago, twilli13 said:

The thing that sucks is if we win 10 games this year, Gus gets breathing room and the decision makers will start riding the'we have monument' wave, failing to see the roster deficiencies past this year (losing possibly top 3 d lineman) and all 5 senior starting o lineman. I dont care how good the other position players are, unless you can replace those lineman with little drop off, the team is in for a fall. Especially at o line, no way that's happening. We dont have the horses in the stable. I hope Allen Green, being a former athlete, is a little more realistic in his future analysis of Gus's worth. 

IMO as long as this defensive staff is in place we will be fine on that side of the ball. Recruiting and player development has been very good since Muschamp came in. It's hard to replace those guys but I really doubt we're going to regress to a 2014 style defense that couldn't stop a runny nose. If we win 8 games or fewer this year I think Greene realizes it's not going to get better in '20 and makes a move for Dino Babers or Lance Leipold. 

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

On 5/23/2019 at 5:44 AM, aujeff11 said:

The rankings may fall down the line over injuries and other things and that doesn’t concern me.

So it doesnt concern you that multiple times Gus plays OBVIOUSLY injured players because he hasnt gotten anyone else ready to play? Sean White vs UGA in 16 and KJ vs UGA2 in 17? Both of those games we could of won had someone else been ready to step up and play for injured players.

But i guess thats not something that concerns you?

On 5/23/2019 at 7:18 AM, auskip07 said:

It is the hardest schedule in the SEC.   

Is it? As much as Gus defenders like saying that (and im not saying what side of that coin you are on) we dont even have the most difficult schedule in the SEC for THIS season. That belongs to South Carolina. So all this hardest schedule in the SEC/nation talk needs to just stop. We dont even have the hardest schedule in the SEC this season... Muchless every year.

On 5/23/2019 at 9:00 AM, WalkingCarpet said:

The bad records against UGA and LSU is what drives people crazy, Or at least it's driving me crazy. We all know what Alabama is right now. There was no way we should have lost to UGA in '15 and '16, especially '16. If our offense kneels on the ball every play of the second half we win the game. If Gus pulls White and we play JJ or JF3 we probably win the game too. We at least get a few first downs and drain the clock. The last two losses to LSU are just inconceivable. We might have made the playoff as a two loss at large if we don't blow that lead in Red Stick in '17. 

I agree fully up to the last sentence. And forgive me for disagreeing with a BOOM from WDE but it wouldnt of mattered if we beat LSU in 17. We still lost the SEC Championship. When you lose matters just as much as if you lose. There is NO WAY we lose the SEC Championship, and become the first 2 loss team as well as having 3 out of 4 playoff teams SEC teams. There is 0 (ZERO) chance that happens. 

19 hours ago, WalkingCarpet said:

You can't just throw money at a problem and expect it to get better. Michigan has been doing since Lloyd Carr retired and their fans are going to start eating each other if they lose the Big 10 East to Ohio State again. If you pay a coach top 5 money and then turn around and fire him two years later your administration looks reactionary at best and like it can't evaluate a coach and manage its finances at worst. Auburn has money but you can't be begging the donors for cash to spend on coaches all the time when we have some VERY pressing facilities needs. Not to mention all this up and down is giving us fans whiplash. I heard a rumor that ticket sales are down this summer. if that's true and we have yet ANOTHER five loss season we almost have to make a change or fan apathy is REALLY going to set in.  

you must be new or havent come around in a while. That has been happening to a WHOLE LOT of us since the 2017 season. 

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

18 minutes ago, WalkingCarpet said:

Dino Babers or Lance Leipold

Sorry not trying to pile on, but these are the guys you want to compete against $aban, Kirby, and Jimbo? 

Were you around when Chizik was hired? Both of those coaches have losing records with less competition.

Why even make a change?

[aujeff11 6,243]

6 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

So it doesnt concern you that multiple times Gus plays OBVIOUSLY injured players because he hasnt gotten anyone else ready to play? 

Let’s be honest here: it does on my end but let’s also remember that we expected Pettway to still be on the roster. Somethings just don’t work out. See Auburn baseball yesterday. Kyle Guy. Some times we just have bad luck.

7 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

Sean White vs UGA in 16

JJ was the starter that lost his job. Right? Gus worked with him all offseason assuming he was the starter. What else could he have done?

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

14 minutes ago, aujeff11 said:

1)  Let’s be honest here: it does on my end but let’s also remember that we expected Pettway to still be on the roster. Somethings just don’t work out. See Auburn baseball yesterday. Kyle Guy. Some times we just have bad luck.

2)  JJ was the starter that lost his job. Right? Gus worked with him all offseason assuming he was the starter. What else could he have done?

1. Bubba hadnt played pretty much the entire season. What he planned at the start of the season doesnt matter a hill of beans at the end. None. Zilch. The year before that he thought he would have Robinson and KJ. But Bubba is the one who emerged. What he thought he had at the start of the year means LESS THAN NOTHING at the end of the season. So does that mean since he expected Bubba to be a force that he shouldn't of gotten a 2nd RB ready during the season? I cant think of a single sane person ON THE ENTIRE PLANET who would suggest that as true.

2. What else could he have done? Oh, i dont know... Not played a QB with a broken arm? Play the QB he chose over Jerod Evans... JF3... or play JJ6. JJ6 was a huge let down but at 100% he was better than a clearly 40% White. Either of them would of been. But if he didnt think they were that all goes back to his questionable recruiting decisions (JF3 over Evans.)

 

Does either of those things guarantee we win those 2 games? No. But when announcers, fans, and little girls who hate football can see the issues... How a top 5 paid coach in college football couldn't is BEYOND me.

[I_M4_AU 8,004]

5 minutes ago, aujeff11 said:

JJ was the starter that lost his job. Right? Gus worked with him all offseason assuming he was the starter. What else could he have done?

To clarify your statement;  JJ was the starter in 2015 and lost his job.  Gus tried to resurrect his starting status by opening the starting QB race during the off week of that year.  JJ still couldn't win the job back.  Going into the 2016 season, it was rumored, Gus spent all offseason with JFIII assuming he was going to be the starter.  Gus waited until the week before the Clemson game to announce SW the starter and came up with the 5 QB rotation.  Gus played JFIII and SW until the T A&M game when SW became the real starter.

To your question; SW was hurt during the final minutes of the 2016 Ol’ Miss game.  He was held out of the Vandy game and JFIII started.  During the half, SW volunteered to play the second half and was able to pull of a win.  He didn’t look sharp and you could tell he was not 100%.  A typical Gus move.  During the 2016 UGA game, the first half was mostly running and somewhere in that half SW was injured.  What could he have done?  Gus could actually pay attention to his player’s performance to see if a previous injury is affecting his play.  If so (which it obviously was) have someone else ready to play.  After all, Gus was without SW for the rest of the season.  Gus just wanted to get through the game hoping (my God) SW could pull it off by relying on a player that was injured using the very skill he was deficient in.

The man has no in game sense at all.

[WalkingCarpet 1,379]

1 hour ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

Sorry not trying to pile on, but these are the guys you want to compete against $aban, Kirby, and Jimbo? 

Were you around when Chizik was hired? Both of those coaches have losing records. 

Why even make a change?

Pat Dye had one 6-5 season at Wyoming before Auburn hired him. Chiz was 5-19 at Iowa State and brought home a natty in year 2. Gus had 12 games of head coaching experience before we hired him. You can be a really good coach (or at least a coach that can have success) and not have a great record. Dennis Green once won Big 10 coach of the year after winning three games at Northwestern. They had won three games in their previous six seasons.

If I were king and I had a blank check to go get a coach I'd dump a pile of money in Matt Campbell's driveway and make him tell me no. Then I'd dump more money and ask if he wants to spend the next 10 years of his life at a program that can't win a championship. He's young and he's got Iowa State winning a hell of a lot more football games than the last coach we hired from there. Yes I've heard the rumor that Ohio State is his dream job because he's from Ohio, but unless Ryan Day gets caught with a body in his trunk that job isn't opening up any time soon. Chiz's first year was my freshman year and I remember people being baffled that we went with him instead of Turner Gill. 

IMO if you elevate a program above its historical mean you are a good candidate for a higher profile job. Syracuse has been a raging dumpster fire since Paul Pasquoloni got run off. Dino has 'Cuse's only 10 win season in the last 15 years, they have had some terrible seasons over the last decade+. I don't know if you watched any games of theirs last year but they were dramatically improved from where they've been. He's been the coach at three programs, all have improved under his watch. If Syracuse has another 9+ win season there are going to be teams after him. Leipold has Buffalo moving in the right direction too with a 10 win season last year. Buffalo has quietly become a mid major power in football and basketball over the last 18 months. Leipold has like 6 D3 nattys from coaching at Wisconsin-Whitewater, if he has another good year in 2019 he's going to have people like Rutgers or Indiana or Illinois calling him. I didn't say "Go out and hire one of these guys right now!" I was insinuating that Allen Greene has worked with Leipold and is probably familiar with Babers given they were both in upstate New York at the same time.

[aujeff11 6,243]

13 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

1. Bubba hadnt played pretty much the entire season. What he planned at the start of the season doesnt matter a hill of beans at the end. None. Zilch

Well that doesn’t matter if there are no more capable all purpose backs on the roster. 

13 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

The year before that he thought he would have Robinson and KJ. But Bubba is the one who emerged

There was no Bubba on the roster to emerge. If so, who? Robinson is another case of players unfortunately working out. And he was my guy. He was a five tool running back that lacked the sixth tool: good attitude. 

13 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

So does that mean since he expected Bubba to be a force that he shouldn't of gotten a 2nd RB ready during the season?

We have had two or more all purpose backs on opening day roster every since Gus has been here. 

14 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

What else could he have done? Oh, i dont know... Not played a QB with a broken arm? Play the QB he chose over Jerod Evans... JF3... or play JJ6

What’s with the love for Jerod Evans? He did nothing in college and is playing for the arena league. JJ did play. He completed like 80 percent of his passes for a grand total of maybe 60 yards that game. 

 

18 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

Does either of those things guarantee we win those 2 games? No. But when announcers, fans, and little girls who hate football can see the issues...

Those are superficial issues. lol When issues compound and all the little girl sees is what is apparent, she doesn’t know what she doesn’t know and I wouldn’t put much thought into what they say or see. 

[aujeff11 6,243]

14 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

He was held out of the Vandy game and JFIII started.

Yikes. Forgot about that half on purpose. Eugene, this is why JF3 didn’t start against Georgey. 

[aujeff11 6,243]

16 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Gus could actually pay attention to his player’s performance to see if a previous injury is affecting his play.  If so (which it obviously was) have someone else ready to play.  

We cannot just sign free agents in the middle of the season. Can’t answer for why we wanted JF3, but once the season starts, the QBs on the roster are what we have to work with.

Once White got hurt again, well we had a project that never matured in JF3 and a QB in Johnson that also didn’t work out despite being given plenty of time to prepare as the starter.  None worked out by the end of the year two years in a row which is why Gus chose to grab Stidham. 

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

26 minutes ago, WalkingCarpet said:

Pat Dye had one 6-5 season at Wyoming before Auburn hired him. Chiz was 5-19 at Iowa State and brought home a natty in year 2. Gus had 12 games of head coaching experience before we hired him. You can be a really good coach and not have a great record. Dennis Green once won Big 10 coach of the year after winning three games at Northwestern. They had won three games in their previous six seasons.

If I were king and I had a blank check to go get a coach I'd dump a pile of money in Matt Campbell's driveway and make him tell me no. Then I'd dump more money and ask if he wants to spend the next 10 years of his life at a program that can't win a championship. He's young and he's got Iowa State winning a hell of a lot more football games than the last coach we hired from there. Yes I've heard the rumor that Ohio State is his dream job because he's from Ohio, but unless Ryan Day gets caught with a body in his trunk that job isn't opening up any time soon. Chiz's first year was my freshman year and I remember people being baffled that we went with him instead of Turner Gill. 

IMO if you elevate a program above its historical mean you are a good candidate for a higher profile job. Syracuse has been a raging dumpster fire since Paul Pasquoloni got run off. Dino has 'Cuse's only 10 win season in the last 15 years, they have had some terrible seasons over the last decade+. I don't know if you watched any games of theirs last year but they were dramatically improved from where they've been. He's been the coach at three programs, all have improved under his watch. If Syracuse has another 9+ win season there are going to be teams after him. Leipold has Buffalo moving in the right direction too with a 10 win season last year. Buffalo has quietly become a mid major power in football and basketball over the last 18 months. Leipold has like 6 D3 nattys from coaching at Wisconsin-Whitewater, if he has another good year in 2019 he's going to have people like Rutgers or Indiana or Illinois calling him. I didn't say "Go out and hire one of these guys right now!" I was insinuating that Allen Greene has worked with Leipold and is probably familiar with Babers given they were both in upstate New York at the same time.

I dont disagree they are GOOD coaches. However, we already have a GOOD coach. 

Our main rivals have ELITE coaches or at the very least elite recruiters. Is Kirby an elite coach? Who knows but he sure is stockpiling elite talent like he is an elite coach. And while i know without question EddieO isnt an elite coach he sure as hell is an elite recruiter. 

If we are going to swing for a good coach and not an elite one, like i said before, why even make a change? 

About the only coach who isnt considered elite yet that i would even consider a splash hire is little Stoops from Kentucky. If he can win at Kentucky like he has imagine what he could do at Auburn. Yes i know the other coaches you named have done extremely well at their current respective schools, but lets not pretend the ACC and whatever conference Buffalo is in compares to the SEC. They dont. Little Stoops has proven he can win in the SEC. Thats significantly different than doing it in the ACC and at a mid-major.

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

Jesus H Christ... Where to begin...

43 minutes ago, aujeff11 said:

1)Well that doesn’t matter if there are no more capable all purpose backs on the roster. 

2)There was no Bubba on the roster to emerge. If so, who? Robinson is another case of players unfortunately working out. And he was my guy. He was a five tool running back that lacked the sixth tool: good attitude. 

3)We have had two or more all purpose backs on opening day roster every since Gus has been here. 

4)What’s with the love for Jerod Evans? He did nothing in college and is playing for the arena league. JJ did play. He completed like 80 percent of his passes for a grand total of maybe 60 yards that game. 

 

5)Those are superficial issues. lol When issues compound and all the little girl sees is what is apparent, she doesn’t know what she doesn’t know and I wouldn’t put much thought into what they say or see. 

1. Whos fault is it that there were no other capable backs? Mine? Yours? No thats on Gus. 

2. I was clearly talking about 2016 hence "the year before that"...the year Bubba DID emerge. You were the one who brought him up anyway. 

3. AGAIN JEFF, what he THINKS he has at the start of the year DOES NOT MATTER about what he DOES have at the end of the year. When it was clear that bubba wouldnt be a factor in 2017, IT IS MALZAHNS JOB TO GET ANOTHER PLAYER READY TO STEP UP. He did not. He ran KJ into the ground even in games that were in hand. Those carries SHOULD of been given to whoever he was making RB2. Then we would of had a back with at least some experience carrying the load against UGA2. 

4. Whats with the love for Evans? ARE YOU FREAKING SERIOUS JEFF? Gus could of had Evans. He chose to recruit and sign JF3 over Evans. All Evans did was turn into a 1 and done QB who threw for more passing yards in that one season than ANY Auburn QB in our 100+ years of playing football and threw 1 less TD than our all time season record. I seriously cant believe you said that... Lets compare 2016 stats between the two:

Evans 63.5% 3552 yards with 29 TDs

JF3 53.8% 204 yards with 1 TD

And Gus signed JF3 over Evans. That is what the love for Evans is about. Gus chose a QB who couldnt hit the broad side of a barn over a QB who in 1 season at VT threw for more yards than ANYONE in our history and 1 less TD than ANYONE in our history. 

I could give a crap less about what he did after college. Fact is Evans was a SIGNIFICANTLY better college QB than JF3. #ButGus

5. It doesnt matter what my 10 year old little girl knows vs what she doesnt know. She knows NOTHING about football. She HATES it. But she could see glaring issues that Gus could not. A 10 year old little girl could see what our top 5 paid coach couldnt... That matters. A LOT.

[Rednilla 5,397]

On 5/22/2019 at 7:48 AM, dyehardfanAU said:

How is the AU job tougher than Vandy, Ole Miss, Arkansas, MSU, or South Carolina?  How is it tougher than the bottom half of any P5 conference?

Because the expectations of the fan base are that we are not in the bottom half of the best conference in America, but rather that we hang with the best, winning our fair share of conference and national titles along the way.

[dyehardfanAU 2,117]

4 minutes ago, Rednilla said:

Because the expectations of the fan base are that we are not in the bottom half of the best conference in America, but rather that we hang with the best, winning our fair share of conference and national titles along the way.

A losing record against our 3 biggest rivals and going 3-3 against MSU is "holding our on"?  As to the National Titles, Gus has zero.  He also has one SEC Championship which was six years ago.  As to the fan base, from reading this forum and others, there are plenty of AU fans who are ok with being in the bottom half of the "best conference in America" , or at least they're ok with accepting 5 losses a season.

[aujeff11 6,243]

5 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

1. Whos fault is it that there were no other capable backs? Mine? 

Hey. I’m not the one attributing fault to anyone.  That is your prerogative if you must. 

9 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

2. I was clearly talking about 2016 hence "the year before that"...the year Bubba DID emerge. You were the one who brought him up anyway

So was I. I referenced 2016 Bubba to say that there was no Bubba that could emerge from our roster in 2017

11 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

AGAIN JEFF, what he THINKS he has at the start of the year DOES NOT MATTER about what he DOES have at the end of the year. 

Are you saying that he forgot how to recruit? Are you saying that he doesn’t recruit? Get to to the point dude. I’m sorry he couldn’t turn scrawny Kam Martin into an APB that year. He had backs transfer. He had players kicked off the team, etc. I’m sorry he doesn’t have a horses stable for you to salivate over. 

 

16 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

4. Whats with the love for Evans? ARE YOU FREAKING SERIOUS JEFF? Gus could of had Evans

What has Evans done? We could’ve had Lamar Jackson too. But you wanna bitch about Evans?

18 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

All Evans did was turn into a 1 and done QB who threw for more passing yards in that one season than ANY Auburn QB in our 100+ years of playing football and threw 1 less TD than our all time season record

One and done to the arena league? Sounds amazing. 

19 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

I could give a crap less about what he did after college

Well then do it. Don’t just tell me what you can do without actually doing it. 

[Rednilla 5,397]

1 minute ago, dyehardfanAU said:

A losing record against our 3 biggest rivals and going 3-3 against MSU is "holding our on"?  As to the National Titles, Gus has zero.  He also has one SEC Championship which was six years ago.  As to the fan base, from reading this forum and others, there are plenty of AU fans who are ok with being in the bottom half of the "best conference in America" , or at least they're ok with accepting 5 losses a season.

1. It's "own," not "on."

2. Why are you using quotation marks when it's not something I said?

3. No Auburn fans are okay with accepting 5 losses per season. I could live with 4 two years ago because one was in a rematch in the SEC Championship Game and one was a let down in a bowl game, but many (if not most) Auburn fans were sour with that.

4. I answered your question as to why Auburn is a harder job than any team in the bottom half of a Power 5 conference. I see no mention of that in your reply, just bitching about how nothing is the way you want it to be so you're going to be a baby about it.

[WarTim 3,457]

Hmmm. Who recruited those....uh.....never mind. 

[WalkingCarpet 1,379]

10 minutes ago, Auburn2Eugene said:

I dont disagree they are GOOD coaches. However, we already have a GOOD coach. 

Our main rivals have ELITE coaches or at the very least elite recruiters. Is Kirby an elite coach? Who knows but he sure is stockpiling elite talent like he is an elite coach. And while i know without question EddieO isnt an elite coach he sure as hell is an elite recruiter. 

If we are going to swing for a good coach and not an elite one, like i said before, why even make a change? 

About the only coach who isnt considered elite yet that i would even consider a splash hire is little Stoops from Kentucky. If he can win at Kentucky like he has imagine what he could do at Auburn. Yes i know the other coaches you named have done extremely well at their current respective schools, but lets not pretend the ACC and whatever conference Buffalo is in compares to the SEC. They dont. Little Stoops has proven he can win in the SEC. Thats significantly different than doing it in the ACC and at a mid-major.

This is a good discussion. I also like what Mark Stoops is doing at Kentucky and we could do a lot worse than him if we make a move. The bottom line for me and a lot of other people is that we have a big enough sample size of Gus Malzahn to know what he is and what he isn't. You're right, Gus is a GOOD coach but he will probably never become an ELITE coach. At least not at this stage of his career. When his teams put it together they can beat anyone in football. When his teams don't have it together it is incredibly brutal to watch. You and I could write dissertations on poor gameplanning, personnel decisions, recruiting blunders et al that has factored into at least a dozen different humiliating or completely bungled losses that make you wonder what in the hell is going on. Those other guys, the Campbells, Babers, Leipolds, Stoopsss (how many S's do I put?) of the coaching world have the potential to become ELITE coaches. Many programs would be ok with a good coach winning 7 or 8 games every year but that's not Auburn. We don't have limits on us because we're in the middle of nowhere and can't recruit kids to our school. We don't have prohibitive academic requirements that halve who we can get on campus. We're not under sanctions because some moron coach was calling hookers. You can compete for championships here, and coaches know it.

I guess it depends how risk averse you are. We currently have a good coach who will not become an elite coach unless something amazing happens. We are not winning the important games on our schedule, and many of the losses are inexplicable, embarrassing, or were just plain thrown away. This isn't acceptable for a program that styles itself the way ours does. If you could hire a coach, a good coach who could become an elite coach, who could win these games wouldn't you do it? If he doesn't, hey, you've still got a good coach. I think it's pretty doubtful we have another Chizik situation with Allen Greene at the helm. 

[I_M4_AU 8,004]

1 hour ago, aujeff11 said:

We cannot just sign free agents in the middle of the season. Can’t answer for why we wanted JF3, but once the season starts, the QBs on the roster are what we have to work with.

Once White got hurt again, well we had a project that never matured in JF3 and a QB in Johnson that also didn’t work out despite being given plenty of time to prepare as the starter.  None worked out by the end of the year two years in a row which is why Gus chose to grab Stidham. 

I don’t disagree here, but the point is JFIII or JJ would have been better in the 2nd half of the UGA 2016 game than SW due to his injury.  Gus just continued to play an ineffective player when he had other options (not good options, I agree).  Gus’ excuse of SW didn’t tell him he was hurt just points to the fact Gus doesn’t pay attention.

[toddc 13,194]

This is a fun read! 😝 

[WalkingCarpet 1,379]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

I don’t disagree here, but the point is JFIII or JJ would have been better in the 2nd half of the UGA 2016 game than SW due to his injury.  Gus just continued to play an ineffective player when he had other options (not good options, I agree).  Gus’ excuse of SW didn’t tell him he was hurt just points to the fact Gus doesn’t pay attention.

When he shot putted that pick six to the linebacker that should have been his last play. I know I appreciated him trying to gut it out but you just can't leave a guy in if he's obviously injured and it's affecting his play like that. 

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

2 hours ago, aujeff11 said:

Hey. I’m not the one attributing fault to anyone.  That is your prerogative if you must. 

So was I. I referenced 2016 Bubba to say that there was no Bubba that could emerge from our roster in 2017

Are you saying that he forgot how to recruit? Are you saying that he doesn’t recruit? Get to to the point dude. I’m sorry he couldn’t turn scrawny Kam Martin into an APB that year. He had backs transfer. He had players kicked off the team, etc. I’m sorry he doesn’t have a horses stable for you to salivate over. 

 

What has Evans done? We could’ve had Lamar Jackson too. But you wanna bitch about Evans?

One and done to the arena league? Sounds amazing. 

Well then do it. Don’t just tell me what you can do without actually doing it. 

It IS Gus' fault that no other RB was ready when KJ was CLEARLY not even 50%. Thats on Gus. No one else. If Gus didnt have a plan for the likes of KMart or Barrett (who was recruited as a RB and was at RB at the time) then why recruit them? 

No im not saying Gus forgot how to recruit. Anyone who says that is lying, or selling something. He has signed close to a top 10 class every season. Player development and retention are two different stories though. As far as getting to tge point, my point is clear. It isnt my fault if you cant comprehend what im saying. I can see from reactions on the post you are quoting that others get what im saying. 

We could of had Jackson true. But Gus didnt hand pick Jackson over Evans like he did JF3. But you already know that. AND AGAIN what someone does after college has NOTHING to do with who is the better college QB. Nick Marshall didnt get a SNIFF at the NFL as a QB. Does that mean he wasnt a good QB for us? COME ON!

And to your last comment... I dont even know how to respond. How does "Well then do it. Don’t just tell me what you can do without actually doing it" have ANYTHING to do with saying that i dont care what he did after college? 

You feeling ok Jeff? You normally make more sense then this. Your last few comments to me have just about put you on par with Mikey, 64, and the other defend at all costs crowd...

1 hour ago, WalkingCarpet said:

This is a good discussion. I also like what Mark Stoops is doing at Kentucky and we could do a lot worse than him if we make a move. The bottom line for me and a lot of other people is that we have a big enough sample size of Gus Malzahn to know what he is and what he isn't. You're right, Gus is a GOOD coach but he will probably never become an ELITE coach. At least not at this stage of his career. When his teams put it together they can beat anyone in football. When his teams don't have it together it is incredibly brutal to watch. You and I could write dissertations on poor gameplanning, personnel decisions, recruiting blunders et al that has factored into at least a dozen different humiliating or completely bungled losses that make you wonder what in the hell is going on. Those other guys, the Campbells, Babers, Leipolds, Stoopsss (how many S's do I put?) of the coaching world have the potential to become ELITE coaches. Many programs would be ok with a good coach winning 7 or 8 games every year but that's not Auburn. We don't have limits on us because we're in the middle of nowhere and can't recruit kids to our school. We don't have prohibitive academic requirements that halve who we can get on campus. We're not under sanctions because some moron coach was calling hookers. You can compete for championships here, and coaches know it.

I guess it depends how risk averse you are. We currently have a good coach who will not become an elite coach unless something amazing happens. We are not winning the important games on our schedule, and many of the losses are inexplicable, embarrassing, or were just plain thrown away. This isn't acceptable for a program that styles itself the way ours does. If you could hire a coach, a good coach who could become an elite coach, who could win these games wouldn't you do it? If he doesn't, hey, you've still got a good coach. I think it's pretty doubtful we have another Chizik situation with Allen Greene at the helm. 

Great post. See people can have discussions while not agreeing completely without it turing into an argument. 

I just dont want any more of this hiring coaches who MAY become a top tier coach. If our rivals didnt already have established top notch coaches we could afford to take a chance on a coach. We did that with Chizik and Gus. While both took us to heights rarely seen at Auburn, Chizik let the bottom fall out. And Gus while he may have a great year this year, he has never been able to recreate his first years success, which took two of the most incredible plays in college football history to even obtain. That doesn't even take the 4th and long semi miricle play earlier in the season. With Bama being what bama is now, UGA turning into Bama East, A&M hiring one of the few active coaches in football to ever win a national title (and while he left FSU in shambles he is certainly not having the least bit of trouble getting elite recruits to college station,) and crazy EddieO is keeping LSU at elite talent... In my opinion, we just can not risk the chance with a coach who has not shown they can play the recruiting game with the big dogs. 

Gus has kept us consistently around 10th in the recruiting ratings, the problem is each of those coaches i named above are consistently having their squads above ours.

It is paramount we hire someone who can either get us higher than we are with Gus, OR get someone who can both maintain an average around 10, but can actually develop the talent. 

Thats why i dont see anyone better right at this moment than little stoops. And im not even a stoops fan. But he has shown what he can do in the SEC. 

[aujeff11 6,243]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

I don’t disagree here, but the point is JFIII or JJ would have been better in the 2nd half of the UGA 2016 game than SW due to his injury.

That’s speculation. I think Gus used the best candidate that could help us win. We already saw what JF3 could do against Vanderbilt.  

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

10 minutes ago, aujeff11 said:

That’s speculation. I think Gus used the best candidate that could help us win. 

 

[auburnphan 6,050]

4 hours ago, WalkingCarpet said:

IMO as long as this defensive staff is in place we will be fine on that side of the ball. Recruiting and player development has been very good since Muschamp came in. It's hard to replace those guys but I really doubt we're going to regress to a 2014 style defense that couldn't stop a runny nose. If we win 8 games or fewer this year I think Greene realizes it's not going to get better in '20 and makes a move for Dino Babers or Lance Leipold. 

Minus a disaster season, I believe Gus will be around another season.  Sexton will try to control the conversation of starting a freshman quarterback in the media.  He will smear Auburn through National Media types complicating our job search  If they don't have the perfect coach lined up the hit the Auburn brand could take might not be worth it.