Hardest job in America

[McLoofus 35,182]

42 minutes ago, Auctoritas said:

Technically, this data can also be as much an argument that all we will get if we change coaches is Gus or Gene. Quick success followed by years and years of everyone slowly beating their liver to death and single handedly keeping the makers of Pepto-Bismol afloat.

**********

(Edit to add: this is why, while I am not against a coaching change, I am against one that isn't done in a deliberate, considered manner. If we are going to roll the dice, I want to make sure they're loaded.)

Well, there was a Pat and a Tommy in there, too. And occasional quick success is better than permanent mediocrity.

Totally agree about loaded dice, of course. And not doing anything without knowing there's a good candidate available. Whenever it gets to that. Still a highly hypothetical conversation, I think we all agree.

[WalkingCarpet 1,379]

11 hours ago, DAG said:

The challenge isn’t the point because he hasn’t lived up to the challenge yet has been rewarded. Most people who don’t live up to the challenge get fired. 

I think he is 2-4 against LSU

2-4 against Bama

2-5 against UGA

4-2 against Texas A&M

3-3 against Mississippi state 

dominating Arkansas, Ole Miss. 

And 2-4 in bowl games. I don’t know if this is all accurate. Someone else can double check this.

The bad records against UGA and LSU is what drives people crazy, Or at least it's driving me crazy. We all know what Alabama is right now. There was no way we should have lost to UGA in '15 and '16, especially '16. If our offense kneels on the ball every play of the second half we win the game. If Gus pulls White and we play JJ or JF3 we probably win the game too. We at least get a few first downs and drain the clock. The last two losses to LSU are just inconceivable. We might have made the playoff as a two loss at large if we don't blow that lead in Red Stick in '17. 

[DAG 33,998]

3 minutes ago, WalkingCarpet said:

The bad records against UGA and LSU is what drives people crazy, Or at least it's driving me crazy. We all know what Alabama is right now. There was no way we should have lost to UGA in '15 and '16, especially '16. If our offense kneels on the ball every play of the second half we win the game. If Gus pulls White and we play JJ or JF3 we probably win the game too. We at least get a few first downs and drain the clock. The last two losses to LSU are just inconceivable. We might have made the playoff as a two loss at large if we don't blow that lead in Red Stick in '17. 

14,15 or 16 tbh. I was going to a long drawn out post about this but thought better against it lol.

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

1 hour ago, Gowebb11 said:

Because those schools don’t have fanbases that expect to consistently compete for championships against Bama, UGA, and LSU. 

That is why they are who they are. You don't think  AU should expect AU to compete with bama, uga and lsu? Damn right we should expect to compete with those three schools and UF. And A&M. We should also expect to not lose to Vandy, Ole Miss, Arkansas, MSU, or South Carolina.

[dyehardfanAU 2,117]

22 minutes ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

Kirby would have taken the AU job in a heart beat.

Of course he would've.   Historically AU is a Top 15 program and has shown in the past we're willing to play the recruiting game. 

[Gowebb11 9,345]

1 hour ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

That is why they are who they are. You don't think  AU should expect AU to compete with bama, uga and lsu? Damn right we should expect to compete with those three schools and UF. And A&M. We should also expect to not lose to Vandy, Ole Miss, Arkansas, MSU, or South Carolina.

I’m afraid you have taken my comments out of context. I never said we should not expect to compete with those teams. I was raised in the Pat Dye era where we learned that we should compete with anyone anytime anywhere.

[Tiger 8,829]

1 hour ago, WalkingCarpet said:

The bad records against UGA and LSU is what drives people crazy, Or at least it's driving me crazy. We all know what Alabama is right now. There was no way we should have lost to UGA in '15 and '16, especially '16. If our offense kneels on the ball every play of the second half we win the game. If Gus pulls White and we play JJ or JF3 we probably win the game too. We at least get a few first downs and drain the clock. The last two losses to LSU are just inconceivable. We might have made the playoff as a two loss at large if we don't blow that lead in Red Stick in '17. 

The 3-3 record vs Mississippi State is what drives me up a wall.

Auburn shouldn't always beat MSU, but we damn sure should never be .500 with them over any extended period of time. That itself should be hot seat material at AU IMO. Over any 6 year period we should always be 5-1 or 4-2 vs them at worst. Have we had any coach ever have such an ugly record vs them?

[The Freak 2,528]

3 hours ago, abw0004 said:

The main issue was he wanted full control of the program without any input from anyone.  Basically with no boss to report to.  No program is like that with maybe the exception of Alabama.  Kirby is even finding out the hard way at UGA that will not fly.  Per WDE, Kirby is finding out UGA takes grades seriously and they will not allow their players' grades to be inflated or outside help to interfere.  Another issue was the insane amount of money he demanded.  There were rumblings that Kirby did not ever have intentions of accepting the Auburn job, that he was just messing with Auburn and trying to get a pay raise at Alabama.

I thought he wanted some information concerning possible upcoming compliance issues or NCAA infractions.  Auburn obviously is not going to share that with a guy currently working for the arch enemy that may or may not get the job.

[WalkingCarpet 1,379]

5 minutes ago, Tiger said:

The 3-3 record vs Mississippi State is what drives me up a wall.

Auburn shouldn't always beat MSU, but we damn sure should never be .500 with them over any extended period of time. That itself should be hot seat material at AU IMO. Over any 6 year period we should always be 5-1 or 4-2 vs them at worst. Have we had any coach ever have such an ugly record vs them?

People don't like Dan Mullen because he's a skeezy Urban Meyer disciple, but what he did at Mississippi State was incredible. I didn't like losing to the clangers in '14 but it's not that bad when you realize that was their best team in a century and they were #1 for half the season. In 10 years them being #1 in the first ever playoff rankings is going to be a stumper at every trivia night. I was at the game when we lost to them in '15, that was when I realized we were in real trouble. 

[abw0004 10,125]

11 minutes ago, The Freak said:

I thought he wanted some information concerning possible upcoming compliance issues or NCAA infractions.  Auburn obviously is not going to share that with a guy currently working for the arch enemy that may or may not get the job.

Never heard about that although I could be wrong.

[dyehardfanAU 2,117]

9 minutes ago, The Freak said:

I thought he wanted some information concerning possible upcoming compliance issues or NCAA infractions.  Auburn obviously is not going to share that with a guy currently working for the arch enemy that may or may not get the job.

It was a reasonable request and one that any HC candidate would want to know.

[Tiger 8,829]

3 minutes ago, WalkingCarpet said:

People don't like Dan Mullen because he's a skeezy Urban Meyer disciple, but what he did at Mississippi State was incredible. I didn't like losing to the clangers in '14 but it's not that bad when you realize that was their best team in a century and they were #1 for half the season. In 10 years them being #1 in the first ever playoff rankings is going to be a stumper at every trivia night. I was at the game when we lost to them in '15, that was when I realized we were in real trouble. 

'14 is forgivable. And like I said, in a 6 year period losing once to them, maybe even twice, is also forgivable. They're also competing after all. But to split over a 6 year period is just not acceptable. We have more resources, more talent, more history, pay more for coaching, and we are working with better facilities. They should be happy with winning 1-2 against us over 6 years. We are at MSU's unattainable level. They should never be more than a mosquito we squash with ease. Of course a mosquito will bite you every now and then but most of the time we should be splattering them. We are dead even with them. AU has higher expectations than that. 3-3 with Miss State and losing records to the teams we compare ourselves to - including 0-2 vs Orgeron - is just unacceptable.. 

Yuck.

[AU64 10,122]

40 minutes ago, Gowebb11 said:

I’m afraid you have taken my comments out of context. I never said we should not expect to compete with those teams. I was raised in the Pat Dye era where we learned that we should compete with anyone anytime anywhere.

Compete ?   true but you recall that the SEC was a different conference and the bear was gone from bama and SEC east was the strong side of the conference and we could not beat florida or tennessee regularly?   .

[weagl1 1,785]

3 hours ago, GwillMac6 said:

1 of them I know was he wanted to coach Bama in the 2012 National Title game. 

What kind of coach would bail on his team and go over to their rival when they had reached the championship game?   Specifying that he be allowed to coach that game with his team wasn’t much of a concession I would have expected that of any coach that had any class.  

[DAG 33,998]

https://247sports.com/college/auburn/Article/Why-Kirby-Smart-was-not-hired-as-Auburns-head-coach-110246938/

https://www.al.com/auburnfootball/2017/11/its_critical_for_gus_malzahn_t.html

 

Here is some articles in regards to Kirby and Auburn

[WalkingCarpet 1,379]

12 minutes ago, DAG said:

https://247sports.com/college/auburn/Article/Why-Kirby-Smart-was-not-hired-as-Auburns-head-coach-110246938/

https://www.al.com/auburnfootball/2017/11/its_critical_for_gus_malzahn_t.html

 

Here is some articles in regards to Kirby and Auburn

It's amazing JJ hung on as long as he did. Yikes. 

[ellitor 33,111]

2 hours ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

I can tell you that no recruit has ever ever gone to another school because of bellyaching fans. This isn't just an AU thing with fans and bellyaching. Biggest MEH of MEH in recruiting. This and negative stuff of message boards.

I never said, implied, nor claimed that it did. Do you honestly think I'm that stupid or naive??? All I said was Keith said it's an additional challenge on the trail. Things can be challenges without being deciding factor. For example, I have cerebral palsy but it does not affect my life or decisions on a real level. As I said before. It's on the HC to win more so there isn't the added challenge of our fans' bellyaching on the trail.Pick it up @WarDamnEagleWDE. Your reading interpretation skills are usually better than that.

[AU64 10,122]

15 minutes ago, DAG said:

https://247sports.com/college/auburn/Article/Why-Kirby-Smart-was-not-hired-as-Auburns-head-coach-110246938/

https://www.al.com/auburnfootball/2017/11/its_critical_for_gus_malzahn_t.html

 

Here is some articles in regards to Kirby and Auburn

I have a hard time understanding the love affair and remorse over KS.  The guy AU talked with in 2011 was not the guy the dawgs hired in 2015...or else he wasted four years at bama and learned nothing from Saban during that time....which is hard to believe.   He was still green as grass when AU talked with him but already had the Saban arrogance. .    

Plus, even now, other than recruiting where he has no in-state competition, he's not an elite game coach. A record of 32-10 with all that NFL talent and two blown games in the playoffs.  

IMO , what makes him a "recruiting genius" is that he has it even better than LSU .....no major instate rival of significance and barely any second level universities to worry about.  KS made the best choice for him...went to the weak side of the SEC and has an open field to instate talent.

[DAG 33,998]

4 minutes ago, AU64 said:

I have a hard time understanding the love affair and remorse over KS.  The guy AU talked with in 2011 was not the guy the dawgs hired in 2015...or else he wasted four years at bama and learned nothing from Saban during that time....which is hard to believe.   He was still green as grass when AU talked with him but already had the Saban arrogance. .    

Plus, even now, other than recruiting where he has no in-state competition, he's not an elite game coach. A record of 32-10 with all that NFL talent and two blown games in the playoffs.  

IMO , what makes him a "recruiting genius" is that he has it even better than LSU .....no major instate rival of significance and barely any second level universities to worry about.  KS made the best choice for him...went to the weak side of the SEC and has an open field to instate talent.

I am only providing information 

[AU64 10,122]

1 minute ago, DAG said:

I am only providing information 

Thanks.....I understand....was addressing some earlier comments and stuff that has been tossed out by a number of folks over and over....and even earlier in this thread...

[keesler 5,926]

Kirby wouldn't have been a good "fit" for Auburn at the time.  I have zero remorse about AU not hiring him.

Auburn got serious, they stepped up their game when they forked out that contract for CGM in '17.  They ponied up and made him a top 5 paid HC, and they better be see a decent return on that investment or changes will be made.

[dyehardfanAU 2,117]

4 minutes ago, keesler said:

Kirby wouldn't have been a good "fit" for Auburn at the time.  I have zero remorse about AU not hiring him.

Auburn got serious, they stepped up their game when they forked out that contract for CGM in '17.  They ponied up and made him a top 5 paid HC, and they better be see a decent return on that investment or changes will be made.

Auburn didn't step up their game, they made a huge blunder.  Luckily Jacobs is gone and Leath seems to have been put in his place.

[WalkingCarpet 1,379]

1 hour ago, keesler said:

Kirby wouldn't have been a good "fit" for Auburn at the time.  I have zero remorse about AU not hiring him.

Auburn got serious, they stepped up their game when they forked out that contract for CGM in '17.  They ponied up and made him a top 5 paid HC, and they better be see a decent return on that investment or changes will be made.

You can't just throw money at a problem and expect it to get better. Michigan has been doing since Lloyd Carr retired and their fans are going to start eating each other if they lose the Big 10 East to Ohio State again. If you pay a coach top 5 money and then turn around and fire him two years later your administration looks reactionary at best and like it can't evaluate a coach and manage its finances at worst. Auburn has money but you can't be begging the donors for cash to spend on coaches all the time when we have some VERY pressing facilities needs. Not to mention all this up and down is giving us fans whiplash. I heard a rumor that ticket sales are down this summer. if that's true and we have yet ANOTHER five loss season we almost have to make a change or fan apathy is REALLY going to set in.  

[keesler 5,926]

17 minutes ago, WalkingCarpet said:

You can't just throw money at a problem and expect it to get better. Michigan has been doing since Lloyd Carr retired and their fans are going to start eating each other if they lose the Big 10 East to Ohio State again. If you pay a coach top 5 money and then turn around and fire him two years later your administration looks reactionary at best and like it can't evaluate a coach and manage its finances at worst. Auburn has money but you can't be begging the donors for cash to spend on coaches all the time when we have some VERY pressing facilities needs. Not to mention all this up and down is giving us fans whiplash. I heard a rumor that ticket sales are down this summer. if that's true and we have yet ANOTHER five loss season we almost have to make a change or fan apathy is REALLY going to set in.  

The Auburn Administration most definitely looks reactionary after Gus & Jimmy Sexton bent them over a barrel in '17 and fleeced them for a $49MM/7yr contract.  

Hopefully now that he's the official OC & play caller he will be totally unencumbered to run this thing to the top of the mountain or straight into the ground.  Yet again, it's put up or shut up time and there are no excuses. (I said the same damn thing in '15, '16, etc.)

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

5 hours ago, WalkingCarpet said:

The bad records against UGA and LSU is what drives people crazy, Or at least it's driving me crazy. We all know what Alabama is right now. There was no way we should have lost to UGA in '15 and '16, especially '16. If our offense kneels on the ball every play of the second half we win the game. If Gus pulls White and we play JJ or JF3 we probably win the game too. We at least get a few first downs and drain the clock. The last two losses to LSU are just inconceivable. We might have made the playoff as a two loss at large if we don't blow that lead in Red Stick in '17. 

Boom.