Why Southern Baptists must aid Liberia

[AUUSN 823]

My my at those who were on these board screaming that we have a responsibility to do something (rightfully so) in Northern Iraq because they are christians now want to claim no responsibility because *gasp* they might have cooties.

From Secretary Rice's book:

2003: Sent warships to force Liberian president to resign

Called "the Milosevic of Africa," [Liberia President] Charles Taylor became intolerable, and the international community demanded the formation of a transitional government in Liberia in 2003.

The President wanted to know what his options were in dealing with the Liberian crisis. "Why should I do something in Liberia?" he asked Colin and I.

"Because Liberia is ours," I replied. We talked about the history of the country that had been founded by freed American slaves. "Even the Liberian flag imitates the Stars and Stripes," Colin added.

The President was determined to do something about Liberia. The President reiterated that Taylor had to leave and said that the US would "participate with troops." Ad-libbing the last part of the statement, the President had committed the US to a military role.

In the face of international pressure and US resolve, Charles Taylor resigned the presidency of Liberia as three US warships drifted into view and two US helicopters hovered overhead.

Source: No Higher Honor, by Condoleezza Rice, p.230-232 , Nov 1, 2011

I was on one of those ships that raced at high speed from the East coast to the West coast of Africa and went ashore as part of the port assessment team so please excuse my animated posture on this subject.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

AUUSN......apparently you don't know what a fact is. It is not a FACT that Southern Baptists have a responsibility to help Liberia. It is just your OPNION along with the author of the article you link. As you can see, other folks here disagree with your OPINION.

[DKW 86 7,423]

Where are you going with this?

Liberia needs our help and because we as Americans have a special relationship with that country, have a duty to help. They urgently need medical gear, gloves, hazmat suits, body bags and many other items.

But hey, as long as someone brings doughnuts to sunday school, all is right in the world!

AUUSN, you are sssooo right. In most SBC churches, just bringing some doughnuts might get you a Mother Theresa Award. The US does indeed have a special relationship with Liberia. We, as Christians should honor that relationship. And bringing doughnuts aint crap, unless it is to feed the folks while they package the care packages for Liberia.

I thank God that some small amount of SBC churches are stepping up to house the immigrant kids. We need far more of that tho.

My own church is meeting a need in Swaziland. Tonight my family is going to Buffalo Wild Wings to help raise funds to send 172 on mission in Swaziland.

[Mikey 16,600]

My my at those who were on these board screaming that we have a responsibility to do something (rightfully so) in Northern Iraq because they are christians now want to claim no responsibility because *gasp* they might have cooties.

From Secretary Rice's book:

2003: Sent warships to force Liberian president to resign

Called "the Milosevic of Africa," [Liberia President] Charles Taylor became intolerable, and the international community demanded the formation of a transitional government in Liberia in 2003.

The President wanted to know what his options were in dealing with the Liberian crisis. "Why should I do something in Liberia?" he asked Colin and I.

"Because Liberia is ours," I replied. We talked about the history of the country that had been founded by freed American slaves. "Even the Liberian flag imitates the Stars and Stripes," Colin added.

The President was determined to do something about Liberia. The President reiterated that Taylor had to leave and said that the US would "participate with troops." Ad-libbing the last part of the statement, the President had committed the US to a military role.

In the face of international pressure and US resolve, Charles Taylor resigned the presidency of Liberia as three US warships drifted into view and two US helicopters hovered overhead.

Source: No Higher Honor, by Condoleezza Rice, p.230-232 , Nov 1, 2011

I was on one of those ships that raced at high speed from the East coast to the West coast of Africa and went ashore as part of the port assessment team so please excuse my animated posture on this subject.

"Because Liberia is ours" ???? That's BS. We are no more responsible for Liberia than we are for Bulgaria. After nearly 200 years it's past time for the Liberians to pull their own little red wagon. If we want to help because of humanitarian reasons, fine, but it's not because we have any sort of obligation to do so.

[icanthearyou 4,462]

My my at those who were on these board screaming that we have a responsibility to do something (rightfully so) in Northern Iraq because they are christians now want to claim no responsibility because *gasp* they might have cooties.

From Secretary Rice's book:

2003: Sent warships to force Liberian president to resign

Called "the Milosevic of Africa," [Liberia President] Charles Taylor became intolerable, and the international community demanded the formation of a transitional government in Liberia in 2003.

The President wanted to know what his options were in dealing with the Liberian crisis. "Why should I do something in Liberia?" he asked Colin and I.

"Because Liberia is ours," I replied. We talked about the history of the country that had been founded by freed American slaves. "Even the Liberian flag imitates the Stars and Stripes," Colin added.

The President was determined to do something about Liberia. The President reiterated that Taylor had to leave and said that the US would "participate with troops." Ad-libbing the last part of the statement, the President had committed the US to a military role.

In the face of international pressure and US resolve, Charles Taylor resigned the presidency of Liberia as three US warships drifted into view and two US helicopters hovered overhead.

Source: No Higher Honor, by Condoleezza Rice, p.230-232 , Nov 1, 2011

I was on one of those ships that raced at high speed from the East coast to the West coast of Africa and went ashore as part of the port assessment team so please excuse my animated posture on this subject.

"Because Liberia is ours" ???? That's BS. We are no more responsible for Liberia than we are for Bulgaria. After nearly 200 years it's past time for the Liberians to pull their own little red wagon. If we want to help because of humanitarian reasons, fine, but it's not because we have any sort of obligation to do so.

Interesting sense of responsibility. If we are who we think we are, if we are who we claim to be, we do have an obligation, because of humanitarian reasons.

[TheBlueVue 177]

My my at those who were on these board screaming that we have a responsibility to do something (rightfully so) in Northern Iraq because they are christians now want to claim no responsibility because *gasp* they might have cooties.

From Secretary Rice's book:

2003: Sent warships to force Liberian president to resign

Called "the Milosevic of Africa," [Liberia President] Charles Taylor became intolerable, and the international community demanded the formation of a transitional government in Liberia in 2003.

The President wanted to know what his options were in dealing with the Liberian crisis. "Why should I do something in Liberia?" he asked Colin and I.

"Because Liberia is ours," I replied. We talked about the history of the country that had been founded by freed American slaves. "Even the Liberian flag imitates the Stars and Stripes," Colin added.

The President was determined to do something about Liberia. The President reiterated that Taylor had to leave and said that the US would "participate with troops." Ad-libbing the last part of the statement, the President had committed the US to a military role.

In the face of international pressure and US resolve, Charles Taylor resigned the presidency of Liberia as three US warships drifted into view and two US helicopters hovered overhead.

Source: No Higher Honor, by Condoleezza Rice, p.230-232 , Nov 1, 2011

I was on one of those ships that raced at high speed from the East coast to the West coast of Africa and went ashore as part of the port assessment team so please excuse my animated posture on this subject.

"Because Liberia is ours" ???? That's BS. We are no more responsible for Liberia than we are for Bulgaria. After nearly 200 years it's past time for the Liberians to pull their own little red wagon. If we want to help because of humanitarian reasons, fine, but it's not because we have any sort of obligation to do so.

The bleeding heart do-gooders among us simply refuse to grasp the difference. Like I opined earlier, helping them out is an honorable thing but I do accept the idea that we have an incumbent responsibility to the Liberian people. This is no way compares to the situation in Iraq because our response there was not a function of Christians being treated badly. SH was hated world wide because of the ruthlessness of his regime and it wasn't limited to the Christians in that country.

[AUUSN 823]

John Day, Jr.: Missionary to the InteriorAfrican Americans in Liberia were frequently called "white men" by the West Africans whom they encountered. This was partly because many of them were mulatto, but also because they brought nineteenth-century American values to Africa with them. Many settlers seldom ventured far from the coastal towns and river settlements unless leading a militia force. African American missionaries, however, moved to be near the groups they hoped to convert to Christianity, and John Day, Jr. was remarkable among these, both for his dedication to the people of Grand Bassa and the story of his origins in Virginia. Day took himself to Grand Bassa to work closely among the Africans as a teacher and missionary for both the American and Southern Baptist Conventions. His decades among the Bassa increased his appreciation for them. Although he served in governmental positions, including a Supreme Court appointment, his chief work was with the Bassa people. Day set up a school called Day's Hope at Bexley.John Day, Jr., a Baptist minister, was born in Hicks Ford [now Emporia], Virginia, in 1797 into a family of free blacks. The Days had a family story, perhaps embellished, that was a variant on the many multiracial unions that created Virginia's early free mulatto class. He described his father as "the illegitimate grandson of an R. Day of S. Carolina whose daughter humbled herself to her coach driver" and was sent to Virginia to have the child. He noted that the woman left money for the child's education. Day added, "My mother [Mourning Stewart] was the daughter of a colored man of Dinwiddie County Virginia whose name was Thomas Stewart, a medical doctor, but whence he obtained his education in that profession, I know not." John Day's grandfather, Thomas Stewart, owned a large Dinwiddie County plantation. In his will, he freed at least 17 slaves [see http://www.usu.edu/h...ls/manumissions]. But the 17th and 18th century Virginia that gave rise to such mixed families began to end even before the Revolution as enslaved Africans lost legal status compared to indentured whites.The elder John Day, a skilled cabinetmaker, saw his status decline and he fell back among the common lot of free blacks. The father took to drink, lost his business and property and left the state. He left behind John Day, Jr., who had been schooled and socialized with his white age mates, to work off his father's debts. A brother, Thomas Day, became a legendary cabinetmaker in North Carolina, and John Day, Jr., became a Baptist minister. He felt his calling to be a missionary in Haiti. But he received little or no support from Virginia Baptists in this endeavor and turned his attention to Liberia, leaving Hicks Ford, Virginia for that colony in 1830. His wife, Polly Wickham, and their four children died soon after the family arrived in Liberia. A generation later, in 1854, he wrote an open letter to free blacks in America saying, " I have noticed the prohibitory and oppressive laws enacted in many of the states in regard to you, I have wept and wondered whether every manly aspiration of soul had been crushed in the colored man, or does he pander to the notion that he belongs to an inferior race?"² Until his death, John Day continued to believe that Liberia offered more opportunity for free black families than did the United States, and that one of those opportunities was for Christianizing Africa.

____________________________________

John Day (1797-1859)

“Often played on my imagination, hosts of poor heathen sinking to flames, nerving my very soul to action. Often have I left my sick bed , staggering as I walked, to carry the Word of Life to dying heathen.” – John Day

John Day was the first African American appointed by the Foreign Missions Board of the Southern Baptist Convention. He had originally served as a missionary under the appointment of the Boston Board from the North, and in 1847 accepted appointment from the South to continue mission work in Liberia.

The scope of Reverend Day’s ministry included setting up schools, churches, and in 1856 he completed the set up of a seminary in Monrovia, Liberia. As you can see from the quote above, John Day was dedicated to his work among the people of Liberia. He often persevered through the most difficult times and nearing the end of his life he was in a constant battle with a chronic lung disease that caused the coughing up of blood. This was not enough to slow down Rev. Day, as the very thought of people perishing in the flames of hell motivated him to leave his bed and preach the Gospel.

By 1857, two years before his death, John Day had grown a church with 220 members and had baptized 34 new members between the years of 1855-1857. On Jan 30, 1859, while attempting to preach a sermon, Mr. Day had to be removed from the pulpit due to a palpitation of the heart that incapacitated him. A few days later on February 15, 1859 this great missionary died. The account of his death is given to us by Rev. J.T. Richardson:

Every attention was paid to him, both by his doctor and the brethren to stop the progress of the complaint; yet it continued to weaken him down until he was helpless or nearly so; and after all, he came to the close of life on the 15

^th

inst, at 4 o’clock P.M. I had the extreme pleasure, after watching with great anxiety, the various movements of the complaint, to hear from his quivering lips, being asked by him as I approached his bedside, on the morning of the afternoon in which he died, if I was well, I answered him, “Yes.” Question by me: “How are you?” His reply: “If I speak with regard to the union subsisting between me and Christ, I am well, too.” Thus his faith in Christ continued even down to the Jordan of death, and without a struggle or groan he fell asleep in the arms of Jesus.

Until his death Rev. Day pursued the Gospel with the utmost passion and vigor. We should pray that God continue to raise up Southern Baptist missionaries with the devotion and dedication exhibited by this special man in SBC History.

The source for this information is the collection of numerous letters of Rev. John Day and others, archived at archives.imb.org.

http://sbcheritage.com/missionary-monday-john-day-1797-1859/

[DKW 86 7,423]

So quoting Dwight Shrute:

A Baptist minister started the Liberian colony.

The LEADING abolutionist was against the idea.

Today's Baptist have a responsibility to help the people of Liberia.

You go with that. I think you're nucking futs.

Yes I am and while people across the country file into their posh churches full of coffee bars, gyms and rec centers this Sunday, our brothers and sisters in Christ are left to rot. So yeah, I'll "go with that."

[cooltigger21 0]

I don't disagree with the idea of Baptists or anyone else helping. It's the right thing to do simply on humanitarian grounds. We are to minister to people in need and help them. However the idea that we OWE them is absurd. The United States isn't responsible for this. This country, like most of the countries of Africa have been run by despots who have kept the people in squalor and they have been involved in conflict for all these many years. The fact that this country was started by putting former slaves there doesn't men this is our fault. It doesn't help that they are denied access to cheap affordable electricity and clean drinking water because somebody is afraid of the earth warming by 1 degree. It reminds me of the ban on DDT. Millions have died from Malaria because they were denied an effective method of dealing with mosquitoes.

[AUUSN 823]

So, while the governmnet post civil war was interested in relocating freed slaves, the initiative died on the vine. The Baptists however did not give up and continued its work in Liberia and are in part responsible in providing assistance to our fellow christian brothers and sisters.

Wither Liberia? Civil War Emancipation and Freedmen Resettlement in West Africa

The Mary Caroline Stevens

On a late October morning in 1862 the U.S. Treasury department received a visit from Robert J. Walker. The former Mississippi senator was something of an enigma in war-torn Washington—an adoptive southerner and architect of the antebellum free trade movement, a staunch unionist, and an anti-slavery man who believed in gradual emancipation. Walker was no stranger to the Treasury department, having previously served at its helm under President Polk. In 1857 James Buchanan appointed him Governor of the Kansas Territory—a position he soon resigned in protest against the pro-slavery Lecompton Constitution. As with many southern moderates of the previous generation, Walker had long advocated the gradual elimination of slavery by way of colonizing the former slaves abroad in Liberia, and such was the purpose of his visit.

The Treasury department clerks listened attentively as Walker read a passage from his latest composition, an article set to appear in the upcoming issue of the Continental Monthly. He praised President Lincoln’s own embrace of colonization as a means of placing slavery on the path to extinction and offered approving words for a project, recently announced, to settle freedmen on the Central American isthmus. Yet Walker had come to press the administration on Liberia, the small republic founded by American ex-slaves on the eastern coast of Africa and a favored resettlement locale of its patron organization, the American Colonization Society. “Liberia has already contributed to the decline of the African slave trade,” he continued reading. “Let us purchase for Liberia the great adjacent coast and interior of Africa” as both a home for the freed slaves of the impending Emancipation Proclamation and a strategic foothold in the region. “Liberia would thus expand and become the great Afric-American Republic, and the dominant nation of that immense continent.”

This was Manifest Destiny writ large and a “moderate” solution to the slavery problem all in one.¹

Abraham Lincoln was no stranger to colonization or Liberia. “My first impulse,” he stated in his famous Peoria address of 1854, “would be to free all the slaves, and send them to Liberia, to their own native land.” In 1862 he extended diplomatic recognition to the African nation. Along with Haiti it was the first majority-black government to receive this acknowledgement and the president’s diplomacy was at least in part motivated by the potential for each to receive black settlers.

Indeed Lincoln’s first legislative strike against slavery seemed to anticipate a Liberian colonizationist corollary. On April 17, 1862—one day after signing the District of Columbia Emancipation Act, which included $100,000 for resettlement purposes—the president met with Alexander Crummell and J.D. Johnson, two African-American “emigration commissioners” acting on behalf of the Liberian government. Per Johnson’s recollection, Lincoln indicated he “would be glad to put the money appropriated by congress” toward Liberia. No further plans came of the meeting though, and the government quickly turned its sites elsewhere. “The expense of colonizing Liberia,” noted Interior Secretary Caleb B. Smith, “would be greater than at any other point named” with transit costs far exceeding nearby Panama. Furthermore the Colonization Society—a likely partner in any Liberian venture—had yet to provide any substantial list of prospective emigrants, whereas the isthmian scheme’s backers claimed a population of recruits ready to sail.²

Walker’s October visit caught the attention of Donald MacLeod, a bookkeeper in the Treasury Department and Colonization Society supporter in his own right. In a week’s time MacLeod would have an opportunity to press the Liberian case with Abraham Lincoln directly. He called upon the president on October 23 with a paper in hand from a Colonization Society official, espousing Liberia’s strategic advantage of an established government. The president then “read the letter and the extract with attention, and turning to me, said with great emphasis”:

I am perfectly willing that these colored people should be sent to Liberia, provided they are willing to go, but there’s the rub. I cannot coerce them if they prefer some other locality. Central America was designated because they showed a willingness to go there. But I would just as soon, and a little rather, send them to Liberia. But where are the people who wish to go there?

MacLeod then suggested converting Senator Samuel Pomeroy of Kansas to the project. As the official agent of the competing scheme to settle the Chiriqui region of Panama, Pomeroy purported to have a list of several thousand persons ready to emigrate, although its reliability was in doubt and persistent rumors of his corruption had combined with opposition from other Central American governments to place that project on hold. Signifying his openness to other options, Lincoln authorized MacLeod to share the contents of their conversation. “You may say that I will aid them with all the means in my control to send these people to Liberia, provided they are willing to go.”³

The next morning MacLeod conveyed the president’s message to Rev. Ralph R. Gurley, secretary of the Colonization Society. To MacLeod’s surprise the longtime promoter of Liberian colonization responded with caution. The Society’s board was reluctant to become involved with the transport of “contrabands”—those slaves freed as a product of northern military movements —in the event that their former masters might try to reclaim their “property” should the Confederacy emerge victorious from the raging Civil War. Gurley was nonetheless willing to seek former slaves from the District of Columbia under its separate emancipation laws.

The turn of Lincoln’s interest toward Liberia nonetheless quickly spread through the Colonization Society’s state chapters, with one agent from Pennsylvania sending his gratification to Gurley: “Our part now is to get the emigrants.” Prompted by Gurley, George W. Samson of the Society’s New York chapter proceeded to the White House on November 1 with the object of introducing the president to Rev. Chauncey Leonard, the African-American pastor of Washington’s 19th Street Baptist Church. With the offer of federal funding on the table, Leonard proposed an investigative mission to Liberia in order to report back upon its suitability for colonization to the black residents of the District. Before they departed Lincoln announced that “he could have 50” settlers ready to emigrate by the next sailing of the Mary Caroline Stevens, a Colonization Society-owned transport vessel based in Baltimore. The following day Caleb Smith offered to supply $100 per emigrant passenger.⁴

Curiously, the same afternoon a delegation of nine African-Americans who had signed on to Pomeroy’s stalled Panama venture appeared at the White House to press for the project’s resumption. Perhaps signaling a shift in preference toward Liberia, Lincoln’s secretary John G. Nicolay replied that the president “could not now see the deputation” though he “was anxious as he ever was for their departure” to a suitable locale. Within a month’s time several members of this delegation had signed on to the Colonization Society’s next packet to Liberia and its leader, the black abolitionist poet

John Willis Menard, had been hired as a clerk in the Interior Department’s colonization office.⁵

True to his promise, Lincoln met with Leonard and another Colonization Society agent on January 30, 1863, and provided the pastor with passage on the brig Samuel Cook, departing for Monrovia a week later. With this presidential nod of approval, the government’s offer to direct settlers to Liberia showed initial promise as well. James Mitchell, the president’s colonization commissioner, provided Gurley with a list of 160 names to be financed from the colonization account and Menard, the African-American poet turned emigrationist, offered to recruit and lead a group of settlers from the freed slave “contraband camps” around Washington and Fortress Monroe in Virginia.⁶

By late May though, administrative infighting in Lincoln’s cabinet combined with the Colonization Society’s cautionary conservatism to scuttle the plan. In addition to bureaucrats jockeying for control of the government’s sizable colonization account, one culprit was a lingering cloud of suspicion within the African American community. Many blacks justifiably questioned the wisdom of placing their funding and futures in the hands of a white colonizationist organization whose motives and sometimes strained relationship with the Liberian government had long spawned distrust. J.D. Johnson, the Liberian emigration agent, informed Lincoln in April 1863 that “many freed persons are now waiting to go” but “not under the care of the American Colonization Society.” He suggested an alternative arrangement administered directly by Mitchell in partnership with the Liberian government in its stead.⁷

Little else came of Robert Walker’s visions for a broad American imprint on the African coast, and Lincoln’s attention shifted elsewhere even as he clung to colonization beyond the point that many historians acknowledge. Plagued by emigration speculators of widely varying repute, the president turned in early 1863 to partnerships with the “stable” powers of Great Britain and the Netherlands to attempt the colonization of their Caribbean holdings. When the Mary Caroline Stevens finally set sail for Monrovia on May 25 she carried only 26 passengers, including but one single family that qualified for the promised federal subsidy. The prospect of a Liberian partnership with the American government quietly withered away, becoming a little-known “path not taken” in our complex and intertwined histories.⁸

^{http://www.civilwarmonitor.com/front-line/wither-liberia-civil-war-emancipation-and-freedmen-resettlement-in-east-africa}

[TheBlueVue 177]

So, while the governmnet post civil war was interested in relocating freed slaves, the initiative died on the vine. The Baptists however did not give up and continued its work in Liberia and are in part responsible in providing assistance to our fellow christian brothers and sisters.

Wither Liberia? Civil War Emancipation and Freedmen Resettlement in West Africa

The Mary Caroline Stevens

On a late October morning in 1862 the U.S. Treasury department received a visit from Robert J. Walker. The former Mississippi senator was something of an enigma in war-torn Washington—an adoptive southerner and architect of the antebellum free trade movement, a staunch unionist, and an anti-slavery man who believed in gradual emancipation. Walker was no stranger to the Treasury department, having previously served at its helm under President Polk. In 1857 James Buchanan appointed him Governor of the Kansas Territory—a position he soon resigned in protest against the pro-slavery Lecompton Constitution. As with many southern moderates of the previous generation, Walker had long advocated the gradual elimination of slavery by way of colonizing the former slaves abroad in Liberia, and such was the purpose of his visit.

The Treasury department clerks listened attentively as Walker read a passage from his latest composition, an article set to appear in the upcoming issue of the Continental Monthly. He praised President Lincoln’s own embrace of colonization as a means of placing slavery on the path to extinction and offered approving words for a project, recently announced, to settle freedmen on the Central American isthmus. Yet Walker had come to press the administration on Liberia, the small republic founded by American ex-slaves on the eastern coast of Africa and a favored resettlement locale of its patron organization, the American Colonization Society. “Liberia has already contributed to the decline of the African slave trade,” he continued reading. “Let us purchase for Liberia the great adjacent coast and interior of Africa” as both a home for the freed slaves of the impending Emancipation Proclamation and a strategic foothold in the region. “Liberia would thus expand and become the great Afric-American Republic, and the dominant nation of that immense continent.”

This was Manifest Destiny writ large and a “moderate” solution to the slavery problem all in one.¹

Abraham Lincoln was no stranger to colonization or Liberia. “My first impulse,” he stated in his famous Peoria address of 1854, “would be to free all the slaves, and send them to Liberia, to their own native land.” In 1862 he extended diplomatic recognition to the African nation. Along with Haiti it was the first majority-black government to receive this acknowledgement and the president’s diplomacy was at least in part motivated by the potential for each to receive black settlers.

Indeed Lincoln’s first legislative strike against slavery seemed to anticipate a Liberian colonizationist corollary. On April 17, 1862—one day after signing the District of Columbia Emancipation Act, which included $100,000 for resettlement purposes—the president met with Alexander Crummell and J.D. Johnson, two African-American “emigration commissioners” acting on behalf of the Liberian government. Per Johnson’s recollection, Lincoln indicated he “would be glad to put the money appropriated by congress” toward Liberia. No further plans came of the meeting though, and the government quickly turned its sites elsewhere. “The expense of colonizing Liberia,” noted Interior Secretary Caleb B. Smith, “would be greater than at any other point named” with transit costs far exceeding nearby Panama. Furthermore the Colonization Society—a likely partner in any Liberian venture—had yet to provide any substantial list of prospective emigrants, whereas the isthmian scheme’s backers claimed a population of recruits ready to sail.²

Walker’s October visit caught the attention of Donald MacLeod, a bookkeeper in the Treasury Department and Colonization Society supporter in his own right. In a week’s time MacLeod would have an opportunity to press the Liberian case with Abraham Lincoln directly. He called upon the president on October 23 with a paper in hand from a Colonization Society official, espousing Liberia’s strategic advantage of an established government. The president then “read the letter and the extract with attention, and turning to me, said with great emphasis”:

I am perfectly willing that these colored people should be sent to Liberia, provided they are willing to go, but there’s the rub. I cannot coerce them if they prefer some other locality. Central America was designated because they showed a willingness to go there. But I would just as soon, and a little rather, send them to Liberia. But where are the people who wish to go there?

MacLeod then suggested converting Senator Samuel Pomeroy of Kansas to the project. As the official agent of the competing scheme to settle the Chiriqui region of Panama, Pomeroy purported to have a list of several thousand persons ready to emigrate, although its reliability was in doubt and persistent rumors of his corruption had combined with opposition from other Central American governments to place that project on hold. Signifying his openness to other options, Lincoln authorized MacLeod to share the contents of their conversation. “You may say that I will aid them with all the means in my control to send these people to Liberia, provided they are willing to go.”³

The next morning MacLeod conveyed the president’s message to Rev. Ralph R. Gurley, secretary of the Colonization Society. To MacLeod’s surprise the longtime promoter of Liberian colonization responded with caution. The Society’s board was reluctant to become involved with the transport of “contrabands”—those slaves freed as a product of northern military movements —in the event that their former masters might try to reclaim their “property” should the Confederacy emerge victorious from the raging Civil War. Gurley was nonetheless willing to seek former slaves from the District of Columbia under its separate emancipation laws.

The turn of Lincoln’s interest toward Liberia nonetheless quickly spread through the Colonization Society’s state chapters, with one agent from Pennsylvania sending his gratification to Gurley: “Our part now is to get the emigrants.” Prompted by Gurley, George W. Samson of the Society’s New York chapter proceeded to the White House on November 1 with the object of introducing the president to Rev. Chauncey Leonard, the African-American pastor of Washington’s 19th Street Baptist Church. With the offer of federal funding on the table, Leonard proposed an investigative mission to Liberia in order to report back upon its suitability for colonization to the black residents of the District. Before they departed Lincoln announced that “he could have 50” settlers ready to emigrate by the next sailing of the Mary Caroline Stevens, a Colonization Society-owned transport vessel based in Baltimore. The following day Caleb Smith offered to supply $100 per emigrant passenger.⁴

Curiously, the same afternoon a delegation of nine African-Americans who had signed on to Pomeroy’s stalled Panama venture appeared at the White House to press for the project’s resumption. Perhaps signaling a shift in preference toward Liberia, Lincoln’s secretary John G. Nicolay replied that the president “could not now see the deputation” though he “was anxious as he ever was for their departure” to a suitable locale. Within a month’s time several members of this delegation had signed on to the Colonization Society’s next packet to Liberia and its leader, the black abolitionist poet

John Willis Menard, had been hired as a clerk in the Interior Department’s colonization office.⁵

True to his promise, Lincoln met with Leonard and another Colonization Society agent on January 30, 1863, and provided the pastor with passage on the brig Samuel Cook, departing for Monrovia a week later. With this presidential nod of approval, the government’s offer to direct settlers to Liberia showed initial promise as well. James Mitchell, the president’s colonization commissioner, provided Gurley with a list of 160 names to be financed from the colonization account and Menard, the African-American poet turned emigrationist, offered to recruit and lead a group of settlers from the freed slave “contraband camps” around Washington and Fortress Monroe in Virginia.⁶

By late May though, administrative infighting in Lincoln’s cabinet combined with the Colonization Society’s cautionary conservatism to scuttle the plan. In addition to bureaucrats jockeying for control of the government’s sizable colonization account, one culprit was a lingering cloud of suspicion within the African American community. Many blacks justifiably questioned the wisdom of placing their funding and futures in the hands of a white colonizationist organization whose motives and sometimes strained relationship with the Liberian government had long spawned distrust. J.D. Johnson, the Liberian emigration agent, informed Lincoln in April 1863 that “many freed persons are now waiting to go” but “not under the care of the American Colonization Society.” He suggested an alternative arrangement administered directly by Mitchell in partnership with the Liberian government in its stead.⁷

Little else came of Robert Walker’s visions for a broad American imprint on the African coast, and Lincoln’s attention shifted elsewhere even as he clung to colonization beyond the point that many historians acknowledge. Plagued by emigration speculators of widely varying repute, the president turned in early 1863 to partnerships with the “stable” powers of Great Britain and the Netherlands to attempt the colonization of their Caribbean holdings. When the Mary Caroline Stevens finally set sail for Monrovia on May 25 she carried only 26 passengers, including but one single family that qualified for the promised federal subsidy. The prospect of a Liberian partnership with the American government quietly withered away, becoming a little-known “path not taken” in our complex and intertwined histories.⁸

^{http://www.civilwarm...-in-east-africa}

The relocation of freed slaves to the western Africa actually began in 1821. Subsequently, over the ensuing years Methodists and other Christians were involved with helping them. Why isn't incumbent upon the Methodists or any other denomination to help the Liberian people. This whole thread is a joke. I cannot believe a sane person could be so totally consumed with a topic with such flimsy basis for it.

[quietfan 233]

Whether or not Southern Baptists have a special relationship with Liberia is, to me, a moot point.

As I read the Bible, there is no doubt that Jesus commanded us to care for the sick and the poor...period! I see nothing in His words that makes any distinctions based on nationality, race, history, or church denomination. We Christians have an obligation/duty to help (i.e., "owe") the poor and sick wherever we find them. In my opinion, that includes electing and supporting leaders that work to help the poor and the sick.

Personally, I don't see how anyone can make distinctions based on race, history, religion, or nationality when in comes to caring for the less fortunate and still call oneself Christian. But that is, of course, my interpretation and my opinion--I cannot speak for others and their interpretations/opinions.

[AUUSN 823]

The relocation of freed slaves to the western Africa actually began in 1821. Subsequently, over the ensuing years Methodists and other Christians were involved with helping them.

Link?

[cptau 169]

My my at those who were on these board screaming that we have a responsibility to do something (rightfully so) in Northern Iraq because they are christians now want to claim no responsibility because *gasp* they might have cooties.

From Secretary Rice's book:

2003: Sent warships to force Liberian president to resign

Called "the Milosevic of Africa," [Liberia President] Charles Taylor became intolerable, and the international community demanded the formation of a transitional government in Liberia in 2003.

The President wanted to know what his options were in dealing with the Liberian crisis. "Why should I do something in Liberia?" he asked Colin and I.

"Because Liberia is ours," I replied. We talked about the history of the country that had been founded by freed American slaves. "Even the Liberian flag imitates the Stars and Stripes," Colin added.

The President was determined to do something about Liberia. The President reiterated that Taylor had to leave and said that the US would "participate with troops." Ad-libbing the last part of the statement, the President had committed the US to a military role.

In the face of international pressure and US resolve, Charles Taylor resigned the presidency of Liberia as three US warships drifted into view and two US helicopters hovered overhead.

Source: No Higher Honor, by Condoleezza Rice, p.230-232 , Nov 1, 2011

I was on one of those ships that raced at high speed from the East coast to the West coast of Africa and went ashore as part of the port assessment team so please excuse my animated posture on this subject.

Your discussion has been about southern baptists being responsible for Liberia. No one has said that we should not help Liberia or any other west African country.

[TheBlueVue 177]

The relocation of freed slaves to the western Africa actually began in 1821. Subsequently, over the ensuing years Methodists and other Christians were involved with helping them.

Link?

Dude, really you should just quit. The actual date is 1817.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2003/07/was_liberia_founded_by_freed_us_slaves.html

"When the first settlers were relocated to Liberia in 1822, the plan drew immediate criticism on several fronts. Many leaders in the black community publicly attacked it, asking why free blacks should have to emigrate from the country where they, their parents, and even their grandparents were born. Meanwhile, slave owners in the South vigorously denounced the plan as an assault on their slave economy."

[TheBlueVue 177]

My my at those who were on these board screaming that we have a responsibility to do something (rightfully so) in Northern Iraq because they are christians now want to claim no responsibility because *gasp* they might have cooties.

From Secretary Rice's book:

2003: Sent warships to force Liberian president to resign

Called "the Milosevic of Africa," [Liberia President] Charles Taylor became intolerable, and the international community demanded the formation of a transitional government in Liberia in 2003.

The President wanted to know what his options were in dealing with the Liberian crisis. "Why should I do something in Liberia?" he asked Colin and I.

"Because Liberia is ours," I replied. We talked about the history of the country that had been founded by freed American slaves. "Even the Liberian flag imitates the Stars and Stripes," Colin added.

The President was determined to do something about Liberia. The President reiterated that Taylor had to leave and said that the US would "participate with troops." Ad-libbing the last part of the statement, the President had committed the US to a military role.

In the face of international pressure and US resolve, Charles Taylor resigned the presidency of Liberia as three US warships drifted into view and two US helicopters hovered overhead.

Source: No Higher Honor, by Condoleezza Rice, p.230-232 , Nov 1, 2011

I was on one of those ships that raced at high speed from the East coast to the West coast of Africa and went ashore as part of the port assessment team so please excuse my animated posture on this subject.

Your discussion has been about southern baptists being responsible for Liberia. No one has said that we should not help Liberia or any other west African country.

Evidently, he's so consumed with "being right" he's lost sight of the original topic which is the supposed incumbent responsibility of taking care of Liberia being squarely on Southern Baptists which is patently absurd.

[AUUSN 823]

My my at those who were on these board screaming that we have a responsibility to do something (rightfully so) in Northern Iraq because they are christians now want to claim no responsibility because *gasp* they might have cooties.

From Secretary Rice's book:

2003: Sent warships to force Liberian president to resign

Called "the Milosevic of Africa," [Liberia President] Charles Taylor became intolerable, and the international community demanded the formation of a transitional government in Liberia in 2003.

The President wanted to know what his options were in dealing with the Liberian crisis. "Why should I do something in Liberia?" he asked Colin and I.

"Because Liberia is ours," I replied. We talked about the history of the country that had been founded by freed American slaves. "Even the Liberian flag imitates the Stars and Stripes," Colin added.

The President was determined to do something about Liberia. The President reiterated that Taylor had to leave and said that the US would "participate with troops." Ad-libbing the last part of the statement, the President had committed the US to a military role.

In the face of international pressure and US resolve, Charles Taylor resigned the presidency of Liberia as three US warships drifted into view and two US helicopters hovered overhead.

Source: No Higher Honor, by Condoleezza Rice, p.230-232 , Nov 1, 2011

I was on one of those ships that raced at high speed from the East coast to the West coast of Africa and went ashore as part of the port assessment team so please excuse my animated posture on this subject.

Your discussion has been about southern baptists being responsible for Liberia. No one has said that we should not help Liberia or any other west African country.

I merely posted an article written by a pastor to this organization's website:

The Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission is an entity of the Southern Baptist Convention. The ERLC is dedicated to engaging the culture with the gospel of Jesus Christ and speaking to issues in the public square for the protection of religious liberty and human flourishing. Our vision can be summed up in three words: kingdom, culture and mission.

The ERLC has offices in Nashville, Tenn., and Washington, D.C.

They tend to believe the thesis and I agreed, thus I posted it for discussion.

Some on here went off topic and I responded in kind.

[AUUSN 823]

Evidently, he's so consumed with "being right" he's lost sight of the original topic which is the supposed incumbent responsibility of taking care of Liberia being squarely on Southern Baptists which is patently absurd.

"Squarely on" is a far cry from responsible. You won't find where I stated they were SOLEY RESPONSIBLE.

Why are you so upset? Debate is healthy.

[cptau 169]

John Day, Jr.: Missionary to the InteriorAfrican Americans in Liberia were frequently called "white men" by the West Africans whom they encountered. This was partly because many of them were mulatto, but also because they brought nineteenth-century American values to Africa with them. Many settlers seldom ventured far from the coastal towns and river settlements unless leading a militia force. African American missionaries, however, moved to be near the groups they hoped to convert to Christianity, and John Day, Jr. was remarkable among these, both for his dedication to the people of Grand Bassa and the story of his origins in Virginia. Day took himself to Grand Bassa to work closely among the Africans as a teacher and missionary for both the American and Southern Baptist Conventions. His decades among the Bassa increased his appreciation for them. Although he served in governmental positions, including a Supreme Court appointment, his chief work was with the Bassa people. Day set up a school called Day's Hope at Bexley.John Day, Jr., a Baptist minister, was born in Hicks Ford [now Emporia], Virginia, in 1797 into a family of free blacks. The Days had a family story, perhaps embellished, that was a variant on the many multiracial unions that created Virginia's early free mulatto class. He described his father as "the illegitimate grandson of an R. Day of S. Carolina whose daughter humbled herself to her coach driver" and was sent to Virginia to have the child. He noted that the woman left money for the child's education. Day added, "My mother [Mourning Stewart] was the daughter of a colored man of Dinwiddie County Virginia whose name was Thomas Stewart, a medical doctor, but whence he obtained his education in that profession, I know not." John Day's grandfather, Thomas Stewart, owned a large Dinwiddie County plantation. In his will, he freed at least 17 slaves [see http://www.usu.edu/h...ls/manumissions]. But the 17th and 18th century Virginia that gave rise to such mixed families began to end even before the Revolution as enslaved Africans lost legal status compared to indentured whites.The elder John Day, a skilled cabinetmaker, saw his status decline and he fell back among the common lot of free blacks. The father took to drink, lost his business and property and left the state. He left behind John Day, Jr., who had been schooled and socialized with his white age mates, to work off his father's debts. A brother, Thomas Day, became a legendary cabinetmaker in North Carolina, and John Day, Jr., became a Baptist minister. He felt his calling to be a missionary in Haiti. But he received little or no support from Virginia Baptists in this endeavor and turned his attention to Liberia, leaving Hicks Ford, Virginia for that colony in 1830. His wife, Polly Wickham, and their four children died soon after the family arrived in Liberia. A generation later, in 1854, he wrote an open letter to free blacks in America saying, " I have noticed the prohibitory and oppressive laws enacted in many of the states in regard to you, I have wept and wondered whether every manly aspiration of soul had been crushed in the colored man, or does he pander to the notion that he belongs to an inferior race?"² Until his death, John Day continued to believe that Liberia offered more opportunity for free black families than did the United States, and that one of those opportunities was for Christianizing Africa.

____________________________________

John Day (1797-1859)

“Often played on my imagination, hosts of poor heathen sinking to flames, nerving my very soul to action. Often have I left my sick bed , staggering as I walked, to carry the Word of Life to dying heathen.” – John Day

John Day was the first African American appointed by the Foreign Missions Board of the Southern Baptist Convention. He had originally served as a missionary under the appointment of the Boston Board from the North, and in 1847 accepted appointment from the South to continue mission work in Liberia.

The scope of Reverend Day’s ministry included setting up schools, churches, and in 1856 he completed the set up of a seminary in Monrovia, Liberia. As you can see from the quote above, John Day was dedicated to his work among the people of Liberia. He often persevered through the most difficult times and nearing the end of his life he was in a constant battle with a chronic lung disease that caused the coughing up of blood. This was not enough to slow down Rev. Day, as the very thought of people perishing in the flames of hell motivated him to leave his bed and preach the Gospel.

By 1857, two years before his death, John Day had grown a church with 220 members and had baptized 34 new members between the years of 1855-1857. On Jan 30, 1859, while attempting to preach a sermon, Mr. Day had to be removed from the pulpit due to a palpitation of the heart that incapacitated him. A few days later on February 15, 1859 this great missionary died. The account of his death is given to us by Rev. J.T. Richardson:

Every attention was paid to him, both by his doctor and the brethren to stop the progress of the complaint; yet it continued to weaken him down until he was helpless or nearly so; and after all, he came to the close of life on the 15

^th

inst, at 4 o’clock P.M. I had the extreme pleasure, after watching with great anxiety, the various movements of the complaint, to hear from his quivering lips, being asked by him as I approached his bedside, on the morning of the afternoon in which he died, if I was well, I answered him, “Yes.” Question by me: “How are you?” His reply: “If I speak with regard to the union subsisting between me and Christ, I am well, too.” Thus his faith in Christ continued even down to the Jordan of death, and without a struggle or groan he fell asleep in the arms of Jesus.

Until his death Rev. Day pursued the Gospel with the utmost passion and vigor. We should pray that God continue to raise up Southern Baptist missionaries with the devotion and dedication exhibited by this special man in SBC History.

The source for this information is the collection of numerous letters of Rev. John Day and others, archived at archives.imb.org.

http://sbcheritage.c...-day-1797-1859/

It would be more appropriate for registered Democrats to help Liberians. Slave holders in the south were typically rich Democrats that had the best land and used slave labor to farm it. Republicans where typically poor southern farmers living on rocky hilly land in remote areas of the south and could not afford expensive slave labor.

[TheBlueVue 177]

Evidently, he's so consumed with "being right" he's lost sight of the original topic which is the supposed incumbent responsibility of taking care of Liberia being squarely on Southern Baptists which is patently absurd.

"Squarely on" is a far cry from responsible. You won't find where I stated they were SOLEY RESPONSIBLE.

Why are you so upset? Debate is healthy.

Evidently, he's so consumed with "being right" he's lost sight of the original topic which is the supposed incumbent responsibility of taking care of Liberia being squarely on Southern Baptists which is patently absurd.

"Squarely on" is a far cry from responsible. You won't find where I stated they were SOLEY RESPONSIBLE.

Why are you so upset? Debate is healthy.

Upset? Are you serious? I think you've taken the debate to an unhealthy extreme. Nobody is advocating ignoring the needs of the people in Liberia I simply do not agree that it is incumbent upon anyone almost 200 years later to do anything. Thats the same brand of tacit racism of low expectations the left(inferring Liberians have been helpless the entire time)embraces on a daily basis. Now if someone chooses to help them, like I have opined in several responses, I think that is an honorable thing but should not be expected because of something that happened almost 200 years ago.

[TheBlueVue 177]

Evidently, he's so consumed with "being right" he's lost sight of the original topic which is the supposed incumbent responsibility of taking care of Liberia being squarely on Southern Baptists which is patently absurd.

"Squarely on" is a far cry from responsible. You won't find where I stated they were SOLEY RESPONSIBLE.

Why are you so upset? Debate is healthy.

Upset? Are you serious? I think you've taken the debate to an unhealthy extreme. Nobody is advocating ignoring the needs of the people in Liberia I simply do not agree that it is incumbent upon anyone almost 200 years later to do anything. Thats the same brand of tacit racism of low expectations the left(inferring Liberians have been helpless the entire time)embraces on a daily basis. Now if someone chooses to help them, like I have opined in several responses, I think that is an honorable thing but should not be expected because of something that happened almost 200 years ago.

[AUUSN 823]

The relocation of freed slaves to the western Africa actually began in 1821. Subsequently, over the ensuing years Methodists and other Christians were involved with helping them.

Link?

Dude, really you should just quit. The actual date is 1817.

http://www.slate.com..._us_slaves.html

"When the first settlers were relocated to Liberia in 1822, the plan drew immediate criticism on several fronts. Many leaders in the black community publicly attacked it, asking why free blacks should have to emigrate from the country where they, their parents, and even their grandparents were born. Meanwhile, slave owners in the South vigorously denounced the plan as an assault on their slave economy."

That link was trash. You stated, "Subsequently, over the ensuing years Methodists and other Christians were involved with helping them."

I've already provided proof that the government sponsored initiative to relocate the freed slaves died but the Baptists continued to emigrate people to Liberia.

Where is the link that Methodists did the same?

[AUUSN 823]

Upset? Are you serious?

Yes I am.

You go with that. I think you're nucking futs.

[cooltigger21 0]

Whether or not Southern Baptists have a special relationship with Liberia is, to me, a moot point.

As I read the Bible, there is no doubt that Jesus commanded us to care for the sick and the poor...period! I see nothing in His words that makes any distinctions based on nationality, race, history, or church denomination. We Christians have an obligation/duty to help (i.e., "owe") the poor and sick wherever we find them. In my opinion, that includes electing and supporting leaders that work to help the poor and the sick.

Personally, I don't see how anyone can make distinctions based on race, history, religion, or nationality when in comes to caring for the less fortunate and still call oneself Christian. But that is, of course, my interpretation and my opinion--I cannot speak for others and their interpretations/opinions.

We owe it to our fellow man to help them because that is the commandment given to us by God. That is not a matter for dispute. People want to say we owe them because of slavery or some such thing, which is absurd. That is the point most of us try to make here.

[Weegle777 78]

AUUSN, are you a follower of Christ?