Trump: Americans who died in war are 'losers' and 'suckers'

[aubiefifty 16,924]

1 hour ago, SocialCircle said:

Unless you are Jussie or Schiff or .......

are you kidding me? those cats are amateurs compared with trump.

[SocialCircle 570]

54 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

are you kidding me? those cats are amateurs compared with trump.

Were you able to keep or lower the cost of your healthcare? 

[AUFAN78 3,926]

5 hours ago, Brad_ATX said:

Cool.  Now tell me about the AP, Fox, and others who independently verified the story with their own unique sources.  I'll wait.

Trump says crazy sh$# all the time. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he said something along the lines suggested.

I think Jennifer Griffin is above board corroborates what this former official said through her sources which are likely legit. I truly suspect they are.

But here is the hang up: this former official stated Trump was afraid he'd mess up his hair and that he drove all the time and simply did not want to go. This is contradicted by Bolton who stated:  

"Marine One's crew was saying that bad visibility could make it imprudent to chopper to the cemetery," Bolton wrote. "The ceiling was not too low for Marines to fly in combat, but flying POTUS was obviously something very different. If a motorcade were necessary, it could take between ninety and a hundred and twenty minutes each way, along roads that were not exactly freeways, posing an unacceptable risk that we could not get the President out of France quickly enough in case of an emergency. It was a straightforward decision to cancel the visit..."

Bolton later added: "The press turned canceling the cemetery visit into a story that Trump was afraid of the rain and took glee in pointing out that other world leaders traveled around during the day. Of course, none of them were the President of the United States, but the press didn't understand that rules for US Presidents are different from rules for 190 other leaders who don't command the world's greatest military forces."

Furthermore, Sources told Fox News the decision not to go to the cemetery was made by chief of staff John Kelly and his aide Zach Fuentes. Bolton further wrote that Kelly was the one who recommended the move, saying it was quite difficult for him to do because he is a Marine himself.

For me this just isn't adding up. Did the former staff member lie, misinterpret? Is Bolton lying? If one would lie about one part of the story would they lie about another? 

[TitanTiger 20,521]

10 hours ago, AUFAN78 said:

"So, when I read the anonymous allegations this week that President Trump spoke disparagingly of our troops, I knew they simply weren’t true — or were taken completely out of context in order to hurt him before the election..."

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-came-dover-after-my-wife-was-killed-fighting-isis-ncna1239425

Point - Counterpoint

 

Quote

 

My partner, Gunnery Sgt. Diego Pongo, was killed in action in Iraq on March 8 — one of the first two combat deaths of 2020, the first combat death in Iraq since August 2019 and, thankfully, of only eight service members killed in combat in Iraq and Afghanistan so far this year. His remains were returned to Dover Air Force Base on March 11. The secretary of the Navy showed up to pay his respects at Diego's dignified transfer, as did the commandant of the Marine Corps, Diego’s commanding general, his regimental commander and senior enlisted leaders.

President Donald Trump did not — even though Diego deserved his attention and recognition...

...But now, I guess I know: The Atlantic’s Jeffrey Goldberg reported this week, with corroboration from The New York Times, The Washington Post and The Associated Press, that the president said — many times, in various ways — that people like Diego were “losers” and “suckers” for giving their lives in service to their country.

And, perhaps, it explains more than that: The Huffington Post reported earlier this week that he attended only four of the 96 transfers at Dover Air Force Base, paying his personal respects to a total of nine service members who were killed during his presidency when they came home — though he claimed otherwise at the Republican National Convention.

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-s-suckers-military-insult-explains-what-he-did-after-ncna1239335

 

 

[AURex 2,034]

#1. Trump was a draft dodger -- fact
#2. Trump thinks it is stupid to die for your country -- fact
#3. Trump considers POWs like McCain "losers" -- fact
#4. Trump does not attend return of war dead from abroad -- fact
#5. Trump has undercut funding to VA hospitals -- fact
#6. Trump has complained about disability to veterans -- fact
#7. Trump complained about having a disabled veteran at a parade because it looked bad -- fact
#8. Trump referred to Americans who lost their lives in WW1 as losers -- fact

Even Trump's political mouthpiece Fox News confirms all these facts. I'm not sure why any Vet or active military would vote for this sh*thead MoFo.

 

[Mikey 16,751]

9 hours ago, Brad_ATX said:

A nothing burger that was confirmed to be real by the Republican led U.S. Senate.  Maybe you missed that.

The charge of collusion was a nothing burger. Three years and over 25 million dollars wasted because the Democrats are sore losers.

[SaturdayGT 719]

have you seriously convinced yourself of all this? Or are you trying to do your part on the Anti-Trump bit?

[SaturdayGT 719]

58 minutes ago, AURex said:

#1. Trump was a draft dodger -- fact
#2. Trump thinks it is stupid to die for your country -- fact
#3. Trump considers POWs like McCain "losers" -- fact
#4. Trump does not attend return of war dead from abroad -- fact
#5. Trump has undercut funding to VA hospitals -- fact
#6. Trump has complained about disability to veterans -- fact
#7. Trump complained about having a disabled veteran at a parade because it looked bad -- fact
#8. Trump referred to Americans who lost their lives in WW1 as losers -- fact

Even Trump's political mouthpiece Fox News confirms all these facts. I'm not sure why any Vet or active military would vote for this sh*thead MoFo.

 

have you seriously convinced yourself of all this? Or are you trying to do your part on the Anti-Trump bit?

[Mikey 16,751]

56 minutes ago, AURex said:

#1. Trump was a draft dodger -- fact
#2. Trump thinks it is stupid to die for your country -- fact
#3. Trump considers POWs like McCain "losers" -- fact
#4. Trump does not attend return of war dead from abroad -- fact
#5. Trump has undercut funding to VA hospitals -- fact
#6. Trump has complained about disability to veterans -- fact
#7. Trump complained about having a disabled veteran at a parade because it looked bad -- fact
#8. Trump referred to Americans who lost their lives in WW1 as losers -- fact

Even Trump's political mouthpiece Fox News confirms all these facts. I'm not sure why any Vet or active military would vote for this sh*thead MoFo.

 

We'll vote for him because his actions over the past three plus years and before indicate  strong support for our military. The Obiden regime did all they could do to destroy our military, President Trump has rebuilt it. Proof of the puddin' is in the eatin'. Well timed lies from anonymous sources aren't very compelling, except to reveal the liars.

[AURex 2,034]

If you actually Fact Check Trumps trumpeting, you'll find that (1) Congress allocates funding for the military as has always been the case, and the President just signs the bill, (2)) during the Great Recession, spending caps passed by the Republican-controlled congress were enacted that limited spending in ALL areas of government, including the military, (3) the amount actually spent under the trumpers administration, inflation adjusted, is no better than during the Obama administration, and (4) despite the liar in chief's claims, the majority of the money allocated for the military has not been spent ofn jets, ships, bombs, rockets, etc.

Fact Check that Trump has rebuilt the military is mostly False.

Fact Check #1

Fact Check #2

Fact is, the U.S. spends amazingly huge amounts of money -- FAR more than any other country -- on military. Much of it is unaccounted for, much of it is wasted, and most of it is a total waste.

But the budget is not the issue. His comments about our military and our veterans are the issue. And for that, he will be held accountable.

 

 

[jj3jordan 2,061]

13 hours ago, aubiefifty said:

what is funny is those trump decoder rings you guys use to try and turn trump lies into truths.............i bet they were made in china as well as all that maga gear.

Why do you say republicans should be held accountable but you aren’t interested in democrats being held accountable?  When I ask you just start talking about decoder rings.

[jj3jordan 2,061]

2 hours ago, AURex said:

#1. Trump was a draft dodger -- fact
#2. Trump thinks it is stupid to die for your country -- fact
#3. Trump considers POWs like McCain "losers" -- fact
#4. Trump does not attend return of war dead from abroad -- fact
#5. Trump has undercut funding to VA hospitals -- fact
#6. Trump has complained about disability to veterans -- fact
#7. Trump complained about having a disabled veteran at a parade because it looked bad -- fact
#8. Trump referred to Americans who lost their lives in WW1 as losers -- fact

Even Trump's political mouthpiece Fox News confirms all these facts. I'm not sure why any Vet or active military would vote for this sh*thead MoFo.

 

1. False. Medical deferment. Arrest his doctor if you don’t believe it.

2.  So did Patton.

3.  McCain is a loser. 
4.  He does this all the time.

5. He rebuilt and reorganized the VA and now it is actually functional.

6.  False. Obama wanted wounded veterans to pay for their own surgeries and prosthetics saying they knew what they signed up for.

7.  Source extremely doubtful.

8.  That’s insane and obviously not true.

Trump has supported the military above and beyond.  That’s not even debatable. 

[SaturdayGT 719]

32 minutes ago, jj3jordan said:

1. False. Medical deferment. Arrest his doctor if you don’t believe it.

2.  So did Patton.

3.  McCain is a loser. 
4.  He does this all the time.

5. He rebuilt and reorganized the VA and now it is actually functional.

6.  False. Obama wanted wounded veterans to pay for their own surgeries and prosthetics saying they knew what they signed up for.

7.  Source extremely doubtful.

8.  That’s insane and obviously not true.

Trump has supported the military above and beyond.  That’s not even debatable. 

😎 says it all....Trump has been all military all the way....if your desperate, you can find  what look like chips to dig at, but its nothing but a little fodder for the anti Trump folk to trumpet as something significant....

[Auburnfan91 1,407]

When a story sounds too good to be true, it probably is

The trip was indeed cancelled because of bad weather as seen in the FOIA records from the Dept of the Navy. 

The start of the Atlantic article:

Quote

When President Donald Trump canceled a visit to the Aisne-Marne American Cemetery near Paris in 2018, he blamed rain for the last-minute decision, saying that “the helicopter couldn’t fly” and that the Secret Service wouldn’t drive him there. Neither claim was true.

The "sources" fail a basic fact check.

[TitanTiger 20,521]

7 hours ago, Auburnfan91 said:

When a story sounds too good to be true, it probably is

The trip was indeed cancelled because of bad weather as seen in the FOIA records from the Dept of the Navy. 

The start of the Atlantic article:

The "sources" fail a basic fact check.

A couple of things:

1.  Perhaps I'm missing it but I don't see in there where the Secret Service wouldn't drive him.  I see a lot about low cloud ceilings and limited visibility as it pertains to flying a helicopter in.

2.  The article does not fail a "basic fact check."  It didn't say they made up the excuses out of whole cloth.  It's saying that the reasons given aren't the real underlying reasons he didn't go.  In other words, they were "cover."  Now, you don't have to believe them and can accept the official version if you want, but to say that there's some slam dunk thing out there showing that the accusation is false is wishful thinking.

[aubiefifty 16,924]

8 hours ago, jj3jordan said:

Why do you say republicans should be held accountable but you aren’t interested in democrats being held accountable?  When I ask you just start talking about decoder rings.

the dems are not in power. but you know that. you have nothing so you just take shots like always. i am pretty sure you got your degree from trump university...............

[jj3jordan 2,061]

2 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

the dems are not in power. but you know that. you have nothing so you just take shots like always. i am pretty sure you got your degree from trump university...............

Even you should be able to decipher where I got my degree.  My fault I missed your posts regarding accountability between 2008 and 2016. I'm sure you were all over it.  

 

[aubiefifty 16,924]

15 minutes ago, jj3jordan said:

Even you should be able to decipher where I got my degree.  My fault I missed your posts regarding accountability between 2008 and 2016. I'm sure you were all over it.  

 

i am not even sure i was aware of the political boards until a handful of years ago. but thanx for trying.

[homersapien 11,456]

11 hours ago, Mikey said:

The charge of collusion was a nothing burger. Three years and over 25 million dollars wasted because the Democrats are sore losers.

First, there is no such thing as a legal charge of "collusion", which in fact did happen.  It was a charge of "criminal conspiracy" that Miller failed to assert. 

And Miller never even considered the counter-intelligence aspects of Trump's relationship with Putin and the Russians as the interview with Peter Strzok I posted in the "serious" thread made clear:

 

Peter Strzok: In counterintelligence, when we say somebody is “compromised,” that doesn’t necessarily mean they are a Manchurian candidate or a spy who has been wittingly recruited. I don’t think that Trump, when he meets with Putin, receives a task list for the next quarter. But I do think the president is compromised, that he is unable to put the interests of our nation first, that he acts from hidden motives, because there is leverage over him, held specifically by the Russians but potentially others as well. For example, when he is on the campaign trail saying I have no financial relationships with Russia, while at the very same time, his lawyer Michael Cohen is in Moscow negotiating a deal for a Trump Tower, there are people who know that. Vladimir Putin knows that. As it happened, the FBI knew it. But nobody in the American public knew it. So the moment that he says it, everybody who knows about that lie has leverage over him.

(Conor Friedersdorf: Donald Trump gave Russia leverage over his presidency)

But that one incident is part of a pervasive pattern of conduct. Look at Trump’s failure to disclose his taxes, look at the story of his telephone call with the president of Ukraine. Time and time again, Trump is fighting tooth and nail to avoid things becoming public. If you’re a foreign intelligence service and you are able to use all of your tools to collect information—to intercept emails, intercept phone calls, recruit people or place people in the president’s orbit who can supply information—you are going to find out about the things that Trump is trying so hard to conceal because they would be damaging to him. That gives you coercive leverage. And that begins to explain why he has time and time again done these inexplicable things that have no positive outcome for U.S. national interests.

Applebaum: For example?

Strzok: Like, for example, why did he not take stronger action against the Russians for placing bounties on American soldiers in Afghanistan? Why has he, for no apparent reason, moved 11,000 American troops out of Germany? Or here’s an obscure one: Why did he parrot Russian propaganda and call Montenegro a “very aggressive” nation when that country had just joined NATO? Everybody knows damn well that Donald Trump couldn’t find Montenegro on a map. Who’s putting these ideas in his head?

Applebaum: Or why doesn’t he speak out against the poisoning of the Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny, or why hasn’t he spoken up for the democracy movement in Belarus? Do you think that there are other ways in which Trump is beholden to foreign powers?

Strzok: It seems clear to me from public reporting that there are more.

 

Bottom line, there is more to find out and it will eventually come to light.

 

 

[Auburnfan91 1,407]

5 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

A couple of things:

1.  Perhaps I'm missing it but I don't see in there where the Secret Service wouldn't drive him.  I see a lot about low cloud ceilings and limited visibility as it pertains to flying a helicopter in.

2.  The article does not fail a "basic fact check."  It didn't say they made up the excuses out of whole cloth.  It's saying that the reasons given aren't the real underlying reasons he didn't go.  In other words, they were "cover."  Now, you don't have to believe them and can accept the official version if you want, but to say that there's some slam dunk thing out there showing that the accusation is false is wishful thinking.

There's actual e-mails that disprove that it was just because Trump blamed the rain. His transport was cancelled. You can argue he should have still tried to go by car but the article doesn't say the word 'cover'. That's your word for this discussion.

The Atlantic article states Trump claiming the "helicopter couldn't fly" was not true. The Navy FOIA records refute the articles claim.

[TitanTiger 20,521]

40 minutes ago, Auburnfan91 said:

There's actual e-mails that disprove that it was just because Trump blamed the rain. His transport was cancelled. You can argue he should have still tried to go by car but the article doesn't say the word 'cover'. That's your word for this discussion.

There are emails verifying that the helicopter was cancelled, not that the SS wouldn't drive him.

 

40 minutes ago, Auburnfan91 said:

The Atlantic article states Trump claiming the "helicopter couldn't fly" was not true. The Navy FOIA records refute the articles claim.

I think the article is saying that "the helicopter couldn't fly" is not the reason he didn't go.  In other words, the claim that he wasn't able to get there due to weather is what isn't true.

[jj3jordan 2,061]

4 hours ago, homersapien said:

First, there is no such thing as a legal charge of "collusion", which in fact did happen.  It was a charge of "criminal conspiracy" that Miller failed to assert. 

And Miller never even considered the counter-intelligence aspects of Trump's relationship with Putin and the Russians as the interview with Peter Strzok I posted in the "serious" thread made clear:

 

Peter Strzok: In counterintelligence, when we say somebody is “compromised,” that doesn’t necessarily mean they are a Manchurian candidate or a spy who has been wittingly recruited. I don’t think that Trump, when he meets with Putin, receives a task list for the next quarter. But I do think the president is compromised, that he is unable to put the interests of our nation first, that he acts from hidden motives, because there is leverage over him, held specifically by the Russians but potentially others as well. For example, when he is on the campaign trail saying I have no financial relationships with Russia, while at the very same time, his lawyer Michael Cohen is in Moscow negotiating a deal for a Trump Tower, there are people who know that. Vladimir Putin knows that. As it happened, the FBI knew it. But nobody in the American public knew it. So the moment that he says it, everybody who knows about that lie has leverage over him.

(Conor Friedersdorf: Donald Trump gave Russia leverage over his presidency)

But that one incident is part of a pervasive pattern of conduct. Look at Trump’s failure to disclose his taxes, look at the story of his telephone call with the president of Ukraine. Time and time again, Trump is fighting tooth and nail to avoid things becoming public. If you’re a foreign intelligence service and you are able to use all of your tools to collect information—to intercept emails, intercept phone calls, recruit people or place people in the president’s orbit who can supply information—you are going to find out about the things that Trump is trying so hard to conceal because they would be damaging to him. That gives you coercive leverage. And that begins to explain why he has time and time again done these inexplicable things that have no positive outcome for U.S. national interests.

Applebaum: For example?

Strzok: Like, for example, why did he not take stronger action against the Russians for placing bounties on American soldiers in Afghanistan? Why has he, for no apparent reason, moved 11,000 American troops out of Germany? Or here’s an obscure one: Why did he parrot Russian propaganda and call Montenegro a “very aggressive” nation when that country had just joined NATO? Everybody knows damn well that Donald Trump couldn’t find Montenegro on a map. Who’s putting these ideas in his head?

Applebaum: Or why doesn’t he speak out against the poisoning of the Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny, or why hasn’t he spoken up for the democracy movement in Belarus? Do you think that there are other ways in which Trump is beholden to foreign powers?

Strzok: It seems clear to me from public reporting that there are more.

 

Bottom line, there is more to find out and it will eventually come to light.

 

 

Thats funny.  Strzok calling ANYBODY compromised. 🙄

[homersapien 11,456]

1 hour ago, Auburnfan91 said:

There's actual e-mails that disprove that it was just because Trump blamed the rain. His transport was cancelled. You can argue he should have still tried to go by car but the article doesn't say the word 'cover'. That's your word for this discussion.

The Atlantic article states Trump claiming the "helicopter couldn't fly" was not true. The Navy FOIA records refute the articles claim.

The Atlantic didn't claim the helicopter couldn't fly.  They said Trump claimed that as his excuse for not going.  He could have been driven (obviously). 

Any POTUS - who wasn't a narcissistic psychopath - would have been driven, because he/she would naturally understand and appreciate the need to represent the country by going.

[Auburnfan91 1,407]

1 hour ago, TitanTiger said:

There are emails verifying that the helicopter was cancelled, not that the SS wouldn't drive him.

 

I think the article is saying that "the helicopter couldn't fly" is not the reason he didn't go.  In other words, the claim that he wasn't able to get there due to weather is what isn't true.

"I think" doesn't explain the wording of the article. The article s CLEARLY words it as:
 

Quote

When President Donald Trump canceled a visit to the Aisne-Marne American Cemetery near Paris in 2018, he blamed rain for the last-minute decision, saying that “the helicopter couldn’t fly” and that the Secret Service wouldn’t drive him there. Neither claim was true.

It says neither claim was true. There's no clarification anywhere in the article to state that the helicopter indeed couldn't fly but they decided against driving. Instead, the article says "the helicopter couldn't fly" claim wasn't true. That's a heck of a 'what he really meant was' spin to dismiss the actual wording of the article. Jeffrey Goldberg can stand by this story all he wants but it's sloppy and has a glaringly inaccurate claim. It's hard to take an article serious that makes basic factual errors. This also makes his "sources" worthless if they can't get basic aspects of a story right.

[AUFAN78 3,926]

On 9/6/2020 at 7:36 PM, AUFAN78 said:

Bolton stated:  

"Marine One's crew was saying that bad visibility could make it imprudent to chopper to the cemetery," Bolton wrote. "The ceiling was not too low for Marines to fly in combat, but flying POTUS was obviously something very different. If a motorcade were necessary, it could take between ninety and a hundred and twenty minutes each way, along roads that were not exactly freeways, posing an unacceptable risk that we could not get the President out of France quickly enough in case of an emergency. It was a straightforward decision to cancel the visit..."

Bolton later added: "The press turned canceling the cemetery visit into a story that Trump was afraid of the rain and took glee in pointing out that other world leaders traveled around during the day. Of course, none of them were the President of the United States, but the press didn't understand that rules for US Presidents are different from rules for 190 other leaders who don't command the world's greatest military forces."

Furthermore, Sources told Fox News the decision not to go to the cemetery was made by chief of staff John Kelly and his aide Zach Fuentes. Bolton further wrote that Kelly was the one who recommended the move, saying it was quite difficult for him to do because he is a Marine himself.