* Official Auburn vs. Houston Game Thread *

[Clayboau 0]

The Bo Nix experiment failed. We're trying to fix it now. Coach Harsin is having to pick-up the pieces from a kid only interested in going pro. Good luck Ducks! You're gonna need it. He's bringing daddy too. FYI, I was there when we won the National Championship in 2010 season. 

[Barnacle 9,064]

10 minutes ago, cole256 said:

I don't see how most of you were all wait on Bo but are so tj isn't it.......he'sliterally Bo his first 2 years as far as inconsistent throwing

I don’t think we are in a position to be waiting on a QB to improve anymore. Frankly, we weren’t this season either, but you have to play the card you are dealt with. Time to get a portal QB and hope you can develop the other guys in a hurry.

[cole256 17,065]

8 minutes ago, johnnyAU said:

He has Bo's inconsistencies, but none of the mobility or toughness. He is built like a TE, but looks like he's afraid of contact. I'd say he is JJ 2.0, but I'm not yet sure he's as good as JJ. 

I just have to disagree. What he did and went thru at bammer is more than I've seen any QB go thru recently

[cole256 17,065]

2 minutes ago, Barnacle said:

I don’t think we are in a position to be waiting on a QB to improve anymore. Frankly, we weren’t this season either, but you have to play the card you are dealt with. Time to get a portal QB and hope you can develop the other guys in a hurry.

I agree, but that's also what should've been said back then as well

[Barnacle 9,064]

1 minute ago, cole256 said:

I agree, but that's also what should've been said back then as well

I thought Bo might take a big step forward under Harsin and Bobo, but I think I underestimated the other problems we were going to face with this offense. Had I fully appreciated it, I think I would have been much more concerned about the position heading into 2021 than I was. We weren’t/aren’t in a position to be developing a QB on the job. Not with this offensive line and receiving corps. I never anticipated being so mediocre at WR especially. Bo wasn’t the guy to transcend all of that, but I’m certain Finley isn’t either. Maybe Geriner is, but that shouldn’t be our plan A. Bottom line is whoever we put out there is going to need more help around him than what Bo and TJ were provided with.

[Old fan 47 770]

1 hour ago, Eagle Eye 7 said:

Why do you think LSU hit the portal and brought someone in over TJ? You reckon they might have realized the guy is just not cutout to be an SEC QB?

Of course, what’s your point here? TJ is not a starting caliber QB in the SEC, but as much as Nix tried,  did he bring AU to prominence? Let’s watch him at Orgegon, if he can beat out some other talent. As I’ve said in a few other posts today, Harsin is well on the clock for installing what he believes in to be his way. This year in my opinion is not on him, because this is not the program he’s trying to build. He deserves at least 2 more years considering what the prior coach was given based upon one season, meaning, Gus was the result of a deficient AD and President, therefore leading to an enormous buyout/ waste of money. 

[Old fan 47 770]

30 minutes ago, cole256 said:

I don't see how most of you were all wait on Bo but are so tj isn't it.......he'sliterally Bo his first 2 years as far as inconsistent throwing

Good point you just made. Neither are top tier or would ever be top SEC QB’s.  Bo was so inaccurate as a passer. I mean Nick Marshall, a defensive guy in most of his college career was more accurate than Nix ever was. I hope Nix does well at Oregon, but I for one am not convinced he beats out a couple of guys on their roster. 

[cole256 17,065]

6 minutes ago, Barnacle said:

I thought Bo might take a big step forward under Harsin and Bobo, but I think I underestimated the other problems we were going to face with this offense. Had I fully appreciated it, I think I would have been much more concerned about the position heading into 2021 than I was. We weren’t/aren’t in a position to be developing a QB on the job. Not with this offensive line and receiving corps. I never anticipated being so mediocre at WR especially. Bo wasn’t the guy to transcend all of that, but I’m certain Finley isn’t either. Maybe Geriner is, but that shouldn’t be our plan A. Bottom line is whoever we put out there is going to need more help around him than what Bo and TJ were provided with.

I agree with all of that. My point is Bo in his second year most of the people right now that's all tjcan't be QB were literally saying Bo is just a kid give him time in the same stage.

And as far as tj he didn't get to play until the end of the year throw him to bammer and he gets a few weeks to get reps and it's judge and jury with him. Just some bogus stuff imo

[Barnacle 9,064]

Just now, cole256 said:

I agree with all of that. My point is Bo in his second year most of the people right now that's all tjcan't be QB were literally saying Bo is just a kid give him time in the same stage.

And as far as tj he didn't get to play until the end of the year throw him to bammer and he gets a few weeks to get reps and it's judge and jury with him. Just some bogus stuff imo

Yeah I agree with you, and I was definitely one of the ones who wanted to remain patient with Bo. He’s just an enigma. More double standards attached to him than any player I can remember, and I think that’s been true from both his supporters and his critics. 

[AuburnNTexas 7,146]

11 hours ago, cole256 said:

I don't see how most of you were all wait on Bo but are so tj isn't it.......he'sliterally Bo his first 2 years as far as inconsistent throwing

No doubt Bo was over-hyped and QB development was lacking under previous coaching regime. You are correct that Bo's throwing in 1st two years was similar to TJ but there are differences in Bo's 1st 2 years O-line pass blocking was worse and the other difference is Bo's legs allowed us to keep drives going.  This year we saw a much better Bo for a variety of reasons. One improved pass blocking, two much improved footwork and much improved decisions. 

The reason some people are down on TJ unlike Bo he had almost a full season practicing with second team before he played 1st game where BO played Oregon in 1st game at Auburn. He had good coaching the whole time he was at Auburn and it showed yesterday. I watched Finley he made good decisions yesterday so the practice and coaching helped him just like it did Bo who also was in his 1st season under this staff. The difference between Bo and TJ is mobility and I am not just talking about running but the ability to move a little to help his linemen and to but time for a receiver to get open. TJ was hit a few times while passing today just because he didn't move at all not because there wasn't enough time. 

Look at game yesterday Tune was forced out of pocket but mobility allowed him to move and then throw. TJ is not capable of doing that. Behind a great O-Line TJ might be good but as we saw with BO this year when he had time he was real good.

I know you have always said that Bo was over-hyped and I agree but I also think Bo was a much better QB then you gave him credit for as seen this year.  His percentages were up he hit some nice deep throws this year because he had better pass protection. Bo was better on the road this year.  Bo was a legit SEC QB this year who was still playing behind a less then stellar O-line. A lot of QB's look great when they have plenty of time and look bad when constantly running because of a weak O-line.

[cole256 17,065]

11 hours ago, Barnacle said:

Yeah I agree with you, and I was definitely one of the ones who wanted to remain patient with Bo. He’s just an enigma. More double standards attached to him than any player I can remember, and I think that’s been true from both his supporters and his critics. 

Yeah I feel you. That just goes back to my original point with Bo though. If we're going to do stuff for him I just don't want other players to be dehumanized. They have parents, feelings, goals, ambitions as well. If people gave Bo a chance then tj or whoever should have one as well.

We really can't allow we went at QB's a certain way then make Bo special then go back a certain way when he leaves. We have to be better than that imo.

[cole256 17,065]

15 minutes ago, AuburnNTexas said:

No doubt Bo was over-hyped and QB development was lacking under previous coaching regime. You are correct that Bo's throwing in 1st two years was similar to TJ but there are differences in Bo's 1st 2 years O-line pass blocking was worse and the other difference is Bo's legs allowed us to keep drives going.  This year we saw a much better Bo for a variety of reasons. One improved pass blocking, two much improved footwork and much improved decisions. 

The reason some people are down on TJ unlike Bo he had almost a full season practicing with second team before he played 1st game where BO played Oregon in 1st game at Auburn. He had good coaching the whole time he was at Auburn and it showed yesterday. I watched Finley he made good decisions yesterday so the practice and coaching helped him just like it did Bo who also was in his 1st season under this staff. The difference between Bo and TJ is mobility and I am not just talking about running but the ability to move a little to help his linemen and to but time for a receiver to get open. TJ was hit a few times while passing today just because he didn't move at all not because there wasn't enough time. 

Look at game yesterday Tune was forced out of pocket but mobility allowed him to move and then throw. TJ is not capable of doing that. Behind a great O-Line TJ might be good but as we saw with BO this year when he had time he was real good.

I know you have always said that Bo was over-hyped and I agree but I also think Bo was a much better QB then you gave him credit for as seen this year.  His percentages were up he hit some nice deep throws this year because he had better pass protection. Bo was better on the road this year.  Bo was a legit SEC QB this year who was still playing behind a less then stellar O-line. A lot of QB's look great when they have plenty of time and look bad when constantly running because of a weak O-line.

Well I just disagree. This o line isn't any better than Bo's o line first couple of years. You also leave off how Bo had much more weapons as well.

And I just don't know where you saw this Bo much improved footwork and decisions. Certainly don't know all the deep balls you seen. He hit one first game of the season against scrubs and then he hit like 2 more the ENTIRE season. He still couldn't throw a deep ball. Bo had a two game streak where he played better against the average teams and you are painting it like he had a long span of consistency. That's not the case. 

But even with that said that's my point. Many of you preached let Bo grow for whatever reason. Well if it was good enough for him then TJ should have the same opportunity. It took Bo 3 years to see marginal improvement and many was for it, it makes no sense then to pretend that tj was given anywhere near the same opportunity. 

If Bo was able to improve then maybe other guys can if they are given the same opportunity as well. Running 30% reps with the second team isn't comparable at all as to say he was afforded an opportunity to really be evaluated. What happened was he was thrown into the fire without having too much time to even get acclimated. 

This is actually just the same thing we did to Willis all over again tbh.

Edited December 29, 2021 by cole256

[McLoofus 35,182]

15 minutes ago, cole256 said:

Yeah I feel you. That just goes back to my original point with Bo though. If we're going to do stuff for him I just don't want other players to be dehumanized. They have parents, feelings, goals, ambitions as well. If people gave Bo a chance then tj or whoever should have one as well.

We really can't allow we went at QB's a certain way then make Bo special then go back a certain way when he leaves. We have to be better than that imo.

This is undeniable. A huge portion of the fan base did not hold him to the same standard that they have and do other players. 

Dehumanize is the word. That's exactly it. That's exactly what we do with most players. You see it across the board. 

I do hope Finley sticks around. I am highly critical of his game yesterday, but who knows what he's capable of with the same advantages that, as you said, we want for the other guys. 

[johnnyAU 3,630]

5 minutes ago, cole256 said:

This is actually just the same thing we did to Willis all over again tbh.

We never gave Willis 1/2 the chances that TJ has had. That was bizarre.

[cole256 17,065]

1 minute ago, johnnyAU said:

We never gave Willis 1/2 the chances that TJ has had. That was bizarre.

Tj wasn't given a bunch a chances either. He got that opportunity because nobody can argue, it was clear as day we were about to lose with Bo so they threw him out there at the end of the game. 

Next game he got one series and then he played again when Bo was hurt and out. 

Willis just didn't have anybody get hurt. Ever since Bo stepped on campus he was bullet proof. Run a 1 st round talent away off for him

[abw0004 10,113]

8 minutes ago, cole256 said:

 

I am curious to see how much improvement we could potentially see with TJ in the winter/spring with Austin Davis and Harsin.  I don't think TJ played well at all yesterday, but like you said Bo had games just like that too.  I do, however, think there needs to be an open competition for the 2022 starting position at QB.  In my opinion, it will be between TJ and Holden.  I trust Davis to make the right decision on who could start and I hope Harsin gives Davis the reins to make that call.

[cole256 17,065]

7 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

This is undeniable. A huge portion of the fan base did not hold him to the same standard that they have and do other players. 

Dehumanize is the word. That's exactly it. That's exactly what we do with most players. You see it across the board. 

I do hope Finley sticks around. I am highly critical of his game yesterday, but who knows what he's capable of with the same advantages that, as you said, we want for the other guys. 

I'm frustrated and critical of his performance as well but I don't feel bad about it because I was that way with Bo too. I just don't see how.....well I don't need to keep repeating it,I know you feel me

[McLoofus 35,182]

2 minutes ago, cole256 said:

I'm frustrated and critical of his performance as well but I don't feel bad about it because I was that way with Bo too. I just don't see how.....well I don't need to keep repeating it,I know you feel me

Yes sir, exactly. 

[Sizzle 3,912]

12 hours ago, Clayboau said:

The Bo Nix experiment failed. We're trying to fix it now. Coach Harsin is having to pick-up the pieces from a kid only interested in going pro. Good luck Ducks! You're gonna need it. He's bringing daddy too. FYI, I was there when we won the National Championship in 2010 season. 

Most kids main interest is going pro. That’s one of Saban’s main recruiting pitches. 

[AuburnNTexas 7,146]

9 minutes ago, cole256 said:

Well I just disagree. This o line isn't any better than Bo's o line first couple of years. You also leave off how Bo had much more weapons as well.

And I just don't know where you saw this Bo much improved footwork and decisions. Certainly don't know all the deep balls you seen. He hit one first game of the season against scrubs and then he hit like 2 more the ENTIRE season. He still couldn't throw a deep ball. Bo had a two game streak where he played better against the average teams and you are painting it like he had a long span of consistency. That's not the case. 

But even with that said that's my point. Many of you preached let Bo grow for whatever reason. Well if it was good enough for him then TJ should have the same opportunity. It took Bo 3 years to see marginal improvement and many was for it, it makes no sense then to pretend that tj was given anywhere near the same opportunity. 

If Bo was able to improve then maybe other guys can if they are given the same opportunity as well. Running 30% reps with the second team isn't comparable at all as to say he was afforded an opportunity to really be evaluated. What happened was he was thrown into the fire without having too much time to even get acclimated. 

This is actually just the same thing we did to Willis all over again tbh.

Normally you and I agree but there are huge differences TJ had some starter experience at LSU and almost a season as a backup at Auburn before he was thrown into the fire. Bo was thrown into the fire in his very 1st game. Lots of QB's get thrown into the fire The big difference is Bo's ability to run behind a less then stellar O-line. I will conceed that last year he had better WR's last year but we didn't utilize the TE's last year. LSU game Bo's legs and ability to keep play alive won us the game, Arkansas game Bo was great 1st half against Miss State he was great then O-Line and Defense both collapsed great 1st half against Ole Miss when he had blocking. Rogers looked pedestrian in 1st half when we were getting to him in second half with no pressure he looked great.  Young from bama was great this year but when under pressure in Iron Bowl looked Pedestrian.  I doubt BO would have passed any better against bama then TJ because of pressure but Bo would have picked up a couple of 1st downs with his legs. 

What I saw with BO this year was a solid (not great) SEC QB who played well when O-line did its job and who spread ball around to multiple players. I do think the O-line pass blocking was better this year then last year but still not great.  I never thought Bo was a 5* QB and I think it hurt him starting as a freshman especially behind a weak O-Line just like TJ at LSU when he started there. TJ behind the bama or Ga. O-line might be a great QB as he would be more confident but as long as playing behind the current Auburn O-line you need a mobile QB. My opinion is not a reflection of TJ but of how he fits with our current O-Line. Now if we get some key O-Line players from Portal where he has a consistent pocket then he could very well win the staring QB1 job next year. If O-line is not greatly improved by next year I want DD as a running QB or a portal QB who can run and throw over TJ or Geriner as I don't want to do to Geriner what was done to both BO and TJ stating as freshman behind a weak O-Line. 

[cole256 17,065]

8 minutes ago, AuburnNTexas said:

Normally you and I agree but there are huge differences TJ had some starter experience at LSU and almost a season as a backup at Auburn before he was thrown into the fire. Bo was thrown into the fire in his very 1st game. Lots of QB's get thrown into the fire The big difference is Bo's ability to run behind a less then stellar O-line. I will conceed that last year he had better WR's last year but we didn't utilize the TE's last year. LSU game Bo's legs and ability to keep play alive won us the game, Arkansas game Bo was great 1st half against Miss State he was great then O-Line and Defense both collapsed great 1st half against Ole Miss when he had blocking. Rogers looked pedestrian in 1st half when we were getting to him in second half with no pressure he looked great.  Young from bama was great this year but when under pressure in Iron Bowl looked Pedestrian.  I doubt BO would have passed any better against bama then TJ because of pressure but Bo would have picked up a couple of 1st downs with his legs. 

What I saw with BO this year was a solid (not great) SEC QB who played well when O-line did its job and who spread ball around to multiple players. I do think the O-line pass blocking was better this year then last year but still not great.  I never thought Bo was a 5* QB and I think it hurt him starting as a freshman especially behind a weak O-Line just like TJ at LSU when he started there. TJ behind the bama or Ga. O-line might be a great QB as he would be more confident but as long as playing behind the current Auburn O-line you need a mobile QB. My opinion is not a reflection of TJ but of how he fits with our current O-Line. Now if we get some key O-Line players from Portal where he has a consistent pocket then he could very well win the staring QB1 job next year. If O-line is not greatly improved by next year I want DD as a running QB or a portal QB who can run and throw over TJ or Geriner as I don't want to do to Geriner what was done to both BO and TJ stating as freshman behind a weak O-Line. 

You're bringing up an argument that I'm not really having. My point is TJ just completed his second year and had good moments and bad. Bo first two years he had good moments and bad. With Bo it was always it's everybody else fault and give him time. With tj it's he's not it and he can't play. 

That's what I'm talking about and it makes no sense to be adamant to give one but chance after chance and with the other guy say you know he can't do it when on top of everything he wasn't even given first team reps to prepare. That's it. 

I don't really care about the running stuff. Yeah it can help at times but in reality all of Bo's running in circles really only helped win one game. And that game it could have easily went another way because the running around has been as big of a detriment as help at times as well. 

Bo had good games against suck teams. Bo didn't perform well against any good team because against good defenses you're not going to usually be able to do a bunch of running in circles. 

Don't care tj started a few games that's outside of the point that just like Bo improved even be it marginally TJ could improve as well. Just like Bo had some bad games then the after a game or two he'd have a good one TJ may be able to do that as well. 

Don't want to get into a bunch of convoluted semantics I just know you can't give one guy 3 seasons and then give another guy 3 games and write him off

[PoetTiger 1,896]

45 minutes ago, johnnyAU said:

We never gave Willis 1/2 the chances that TJ has had. That was bizarre.

We??? Hell Gus did not give Willis enough chances for us to even determine how good he was, especially throwing the ball. Harsin gave TJ far more opportunity than Gus gave Malik, so we have a little more to go with on our armchair assessments.

[johnnyAU 3,630]

1 minute ago, PoetTiger said:

We??? Hell Gus did not give Willis enough chances for us to even determine how good he was, especially throwing the ball. Harsin gave TJ far more opportunity than Gus gave Malik, so we have a little more to go with on our armchair assessments.

No kidding. I don't recall Willis having as much as a couple of drives in meaningless games. He sure as heck never started and finished a game to my recollection. Even when he did get in, he wasn't even given the whole offense to work with. He was hand off or run 90% of the time. Never had the chance to show what he could do in a real game.

[cole256 17,065]

I'm just missing the given opportunities I guess. Somebody has to run out and play

[milehighfan 1,240]

This was not an overly talented team to begin with. Add to that Auburn was missing two starting LB's, our top DB and last but certainly not least, our three year starting QB and took them to the wire. Correct the problems on the OL and hopefully, find a QB who can make a difference, this team has the possibility of being new and improved. JMO