Hugh to take over play calling....

[CCTAU 3,336]

8 minutes ago, Mims44 said:

From the bits I found searching for it. Seems Freeze has called the offense plays his ENTIRE career. Until hired at Auburn. Was his first time ever not doing it.

What I could not find was anyone asking him why he chose 1st year at Auburn as the time to deviate from his career norm.

Everyone already knew he was concentrating on recruiting. So the question did not have to be asked over and over.

[W.E.D 11,070]

19 minutes ago, Hank2020 said:

I understood that 2023 offense was a mesh of Freeze system and OC system so maybe not as many changes.

Hopefully a lot of concepts carry forward 

[tigeraddikt 1,615]

17 minutes ago, CCTAU said:

Everyone already knew he was concentrating on recruiting. So the question did not have to be asked over and over.

Though he has consistently made it clear since hired that he needed to focus on roster improvement through relationship building/HS recruiting, I and (I think) most other AU fans didn’t realize that play calling and recruiting were mutually exclusive activities.

[Mims44 1,880]

1 hour ago, CCTAU said:

Everyone already knew he was concentrating on recruiting. So the question did not have to be asked over and over.

53 minutes ago, tigeraddikt said:

Though he has consistently made it clear since hired that he needed to focus on roster improvement through relationship building/HS recruiting, I and (I think) most other AU fans didn’t realize that play calling and recruiting were mutually exclusive activities.

What Addikt said basically.

But upon reflection, I mean WHO could possibly recruit and be a HC. Surely he never did both those things at OM or Liberty right?

And if you aren't gonna be the HC you've been at every other stop due to recruiting so hard... why show up on the field on saturday? That's prime 'cruitin time!  

[Browning4AU 405]

8 hours ago, Mims44 said:

Actually Auburn hired him to be a head coach, not an OC.

It should work out well though, I've read multiple times on this forum all the good plays this past year were Freeze, the bad ones were ones he didn't call, or sometimes... didn't even participate in game planning.

They hired him because he was the best available candidate that wanted the job. Him calling the plays, running the offense, and recruiting is the reason he has made a name for himself in the first place. He simply needs to go back to doing what he's known for. 

[CCTAU 3,336]

2 hours ago, Mims44 said:

What Addikt said basically.

But upon reflection, I mean WHO could possibly recruit and be a HC. Surely he never did both those things at OM or Liberty right?

And if you aren't gonna be the HC you've been at every other stop due to recruiting so hard... why show up on the field on saturday? That's prime 'cruitin time!  

Tell us you have no idea how bad off we were without saying it out loud. 
It’s like you watch the games…and that’s about it.

[DAG 33,998]

4 hours ago, Mims44 said:

From the bits I found searching for it. Seems Freeze has called the offense plays his ENTIRE career. Until hired at Auburn. Was his first time ever not doing it.

What I could not find was anyone asking him why he chose 1st year at Auburn as the time to deviate from his career norm.

Exactly . I was wondering that myself and never understood why coaches come to Auburn and do some trial and error stuff but here we are…

[Tiger Refuge 6,671]

3 minutes ago, DAG said:

Exactly . I was wondering that myself and never understood why coaches come to Auburn and do some trial and error stuff but here we are…

You got it. We don’t need experimental mac-n-cheese. Give us tried and true. Save the experimenting for behind closed doors in a private setting with no cameras.

Edited January 10 by Tiger Refuge

[DAG 33,998]

8 minutes ago, Tiger Refuge said:

You got it. We don’t need experimental mac-n-cheese. Give us tried and true. Save the experimenting for behind closed doors in a private setting with no cameras.

And I know the response will be from some “didn’t you know how much damage harsin did to us ?!” Yes , I acknowledge that. I also acknowledge Hugh Freeze could’ve hired ace recruiters to damage control versus going through a change at coordinators after one year. Last year we had a chance to get Coach Kelly and we apparently passed him up for Coach Roberts , who already had conflicting issues at Baylor with their head coach. I know it is Monday morning QB, but people Monday morning QB all the time and I am not the one getting paid six million dollars to figure these things out. [rant done].

[Hank2020 3,212]

3 minutes ago, DAG said:

And I know the response will be from some “didn’t you know how much damage harsin did to us ?!” Yes , I acknowledge that. I also acknowledge Hugh Freeze could’ve hired ace recruiters to damage control versus going through a change at coordinators after one year. Last year we had a chance to get Coach Kelly and we apparently passed him up for Coach Roberts , who already had conflicting issues at Baylor with their head coach. I know it is Monday morning QB, but people Monday morning QB all the time and I am not the one getting paid six million dollars to figure these things out. [rant done].

Rant on my good man….

[japantiger 4,051]

So he can't recruit and game plan at the same time, so the fix is fire OC, fire DC and become the OC and be permanently responsible for game planning and play calling ...genius. 

The failed HC playbook.  Get in over your head.  Make bad hires. Blow several million as a result.  Inability to manage at the new level. Fire coordinator and takeover their role.  Get in more over your head........

Edited January 10 by japantiger

[gman87 398]

42 minutes ago, japantiger said:

So he can't recruit and game plan at the same time, so the fix is fire OC, fire DC and become the OC and be permanently responsible for game planning and play calling ...genius. 

The failed HC playbook.  Get in over your head.  Make bad hires. Inability to manage at the new level. Fire coordinator and takeover their role.  Get in more over your head........

May be a good idea to wait and see who we get as DC and assistants before you get too high on that soapbox.

[LAtoAU 8]

Just now, gman87 said:

May be a good idea to wait and see who we get as DC and assistants before you get too high on that soapbox.

It can't help itself!

[CCTAU 3,336]

1 hour ago, DAG said:

And I know the response will be from some “didn’t you know how much damage harsin did to us ?!” Yes , I acknowledge that. I also acknowledge Hugh Freeze could’ve hired ace recruiters to damage control versus going through a change at coordinators after one year. Last year we had a chance to get Coach Kelly and we apparently passed him up for Coach Roberts , who already had conflicting issues at Baylor with their head coach. I know it is Monday morning QB, but people Monday morning QB all the time and I am not the one getting paid six million dollars to figure these things out. [rant done].

Ace recruiters can’t repair broken relationships with high school coaches. The coaches never say they haven’t seen the ace recruiter at their school. They say they haven’t seen the head coach. Hugh had to repair those relationships. And there were a great many that needed repairing. 

[LAtoAU 8]

6 hours ago, CCTAU said:

Everyone already knew he was concentrating on recruiting. So the question did not have to be asked over and over.

The ignore feature is your friend....some of these people are bamtard trolls...  

[toddc 13,194]

24 minutes ago, gman87 said:

May be a good idea to wait and see who we get as DC and assistants before you get too high on that soapbox.

That’s his shtick!

[japantiger 4,051]

25 minutes ago, gman87 said:

May be a good idea to wait and see who we get as DC and assistants before you get too high on that soapbox.

So which one did I get wrong?  Let's see:

-- Admitted he's in over his head already by inability to manage games and recruit.... something every other major successful coach does - check

-- made bad hires...and is having to piss away in excess of $3m to pay at least one off - check

-- fired both coordinators - check

-- taking over duties of fired OC - check

-- unless he just invented more time in a day, he's now in a spiral.  He was already struggling with time management, he just made it worse - check

When you do someone else's job you aren't doing your own.  It's an unmutable law, like gravity.  No one is immune .  

 

 

[DAG 33,998]

46 minutes ago, CCTAU said:

Ace recruiters can’t repair broken relationships with high school coaches. The coaches never say they haven’t seen the ace recruiter at their school. They say they haven’t seen the head coach. Hugh had to repair those relationships. And there were a great many that needed repairing. 

It doesn’t have to be one extreme or another. You don’t have to completely abandon game planning to repair relationships. He has said as such. Hugh Freeze has never made one excuse for things like so many on here have done. Hugh freeze can make an appearance at their school and be apart of game planning. Now we are back to another extreme where he is 100% back to game planning, something he is use to. Don’t understand why you guys have to play apologist when Hugh doesn’t do so. The reality is Auburn fans whined about stability with Gus and his coordinators and big time with Harsin and his coordinators. Yet we are still struggling with stability. 

Edited January 10 by DAG

[cbo 7,865]

57 minutes ago, CCTAU said:

Ace recruiters can’t repair broken relationships with high school coaches. The coaches never say they haven’t seen the ace recruiter at their school. They say they haven’t seen the head coach. Hugh had to repair those relationships. And there were a great many that needed repairing. 

The "repairing high school relationships" thing is overblown, IMO. Why would a HS coach hold Harsin against Hugh? 

HS coaches have usually been around for a long time. They didn't form their first opinion of AU with Harsin. Some face time with Freeze, throw in some NIL money, and the rest comes down to recruiting the kid. 

[AU120289 379]

Felt like this was the approach at times this year. 

Whether he did it on his own or was forced into it, Freeze burned his ships. I hope it gives him the fuel to flip the script.

Going into year 2, there is no grace. Will be interesting to see how it plays out. 

[Chaotic_zx 1,046]

4 hours ago, DAG said:

Exactly . I was wondering that myself and never understood why coaches come to Auburn and do some trial and error stuff but here we are…

Here is my scientific wild @## guess.

Auburn has been hurt before by a coach that would always meddle in the offense. I won't won't say a name. He'd say that the OC was calling plays. Then he'd take it back the first chance that he got. Then when that failed he would turn it over to the OC for a short time again. Just to take it back. Wash, rinse, repeat.  Over and over. Again, I won't say a name. 

So Freeze comes along and will do almost anything to get a major college job again. Then the Auburn people that have been hurt before tell him to let the OC call plays. Freeze wanting to appease agrees to the terms. 

Here is the crux of the issue. There is no guarantee that Freeze will perform better or worse than the coach not named. It is almost like people are different and will perform differently. Which if it did happen as theorized, would make it silly. 

I subscribe to a doctrine that you put someone in charge that you trust. You give them everything that is within your power to succeed. If you don't or won't, then you are the issue and not them. If your trust is broken or shown to not be warranted, you take them out of power. You don't place stipulations on them. That only increases the likelihood of failure. 

[Mims44 1,880]

11 hours ago, CCTAU said:

Tell us you have no idea how bad off we were without saying it out loud. 
It’s like you watch the games…and that’s about it.

You are a hilariously silly goose. Keep it up man  

8 hours ago, LAtoAU said:

The ignore feature is your friend....some of these people are bamtard trolls...  

Not prostrating yourself before any HC at AU. Or being an apologist for every HC hire. Is not a requirement for being an Auburn fan.

Some twisted logic; to see Auburn fans watch AU get it's butt beat by NMSU/Maryland, hear the HC wasn't involved with game planning, and see another year of 'cleaning house' and be upset about it.

Then claim those people are only upset with all these negative happening because they are "bamtard trolls"  

8 hours ago, japantiger said:

So which one did I get wrong?  Let's see:

-- Admitted he's in over his head already by inability to manage games and recruit.... something every other major successful coach does - check

-- made bad hires...and is having to piss away in excess of $3m to pay at least one off - check

-- fired both coordinators - check

-- taking over duties of fired OC - check

-- unless he just invented more time in a day, he's now in a spiral.  He was already struggling with time management, he just made it worse - check

When you do someone else's job you aren't doing your own.  It's an unmutable law, like gravity.  No one is immune .  

 

 

8 hours ago, DAG said:

It doesn’t have to be one extreme or another. You don’t have to completely abandon game planning to repair relationships. He has said as such. Hugh Freeze has never made one excuse for things like so many on here have done. Hugh freeze can make an appearance at their school and be apart of game planning. Now we are back to another extreme where he is 100% back to game planning, something he is use to. Don’t understand why you guys have to play apologist when Hugh doesn’t do so. The reality is Auburn fans whined about stability with Gus and his coordinators and big time with Harsin and his coordinators. Yet we are still struggling with stability. 

6 hours ago, Chaotic_zx said:

Here is my scientific wild @## guess.

Auburn has been hurt before by a coach that would always meddle in the offense. I won't won't say a name. He'd say that the OC was calling plays. Then he'd take it back the first chance that he got. Then when that failed he would turn it over to the OC for a short time again. Just to take it back. Wash, rinse, repeat.  Over and over. Again, I won't say a name. 

So Freeze comes along and will do almost anything to get a major college job again. Then the Auburn people that have been hurt before tell him to let the OC call plays. Freeze wanting to appease agrees to the terms. 

Here is the crux of the issue. There is no guarantee that Freeze will perform better or worse than the coach not named. It is almost like people are different and will perform differently. Which if it did happen as theorized, would make it silly. 

I subscribe to a doctrine that you put someone in charge that you trust. You give them everything that is within your power to succeed. If you don't or won't, then you are the issue and not them. If your trust is broken or shown to not be warranted, you take them out of power. You don't place stipulations on them. That only increases the likelihood of failure. 

I agree with all three of you guys.

Jap, I'm hoping when we see the hires it will alleviate some of the perceived problems. Hope!  

Dag, 100% agree. Can't wrap my head around the posters who ascribe to "Harsin was so bad at his job, that now his replacement can't do all facets of their job"

Chaotic, That was 100% my hangup yesterday. Gus's OC carousel had worn me down over the years. Had really high hopes Freeze would bring at least a year or two of stability, and was wrong. Yet you are also right that that does not mean it's going to lead to the same outcome 🤷‍♂️ Just gotta wait and see.

[TitanTiger 20,499]

I think Hugh looked at the roster then looked at the rosters of our rivals, looked at the sad state of relationships with HS coaches in the area, and thought his most important task was to go full bore after improving this roster.  He thought maybe if he hired a couple of experienced coordinators capable of running their side of the ball without him having to be deeply involved, he could sort of assume a CEO role at least for the first 2-3 years, and be able to devote more time to recruiting, relationship building with high school programs, to the politicking involved with $$ folks at Auburn, and all of those things.  It's not a crazy thought.  It just didn't work as planned, particularly on the offensive side of the ball.  Ultimately it's his responsibility - both the results on the field this year, and for him to fix going forward.

I think the DC situation was something you wouldn't have predicted.  Roberts had a reputation for being hard nosed and abrasive, but it's not like there'd been a mutiny among his players at previous stops or assistants bailing and calling him impossible to work for.  He and Aranda weren't seeing eye to eye on how to run the defense his last year there but that was about it.  I don't think anyone could have reasonably foreseen the situation with the secondary players and McGriff.

So he's fixing the problem.  He's taking back over play calling and will hire an OC that's good with that paradigm.  He encouraged Roberts to find a new job and repaired the relationships with the players getting ready to bail.  Unfortunately the timeline didn't work to keep Crime on board but the bottom line is, he's not just letting things ride and unafraid to make the necessary moves.  It's not ideal to fire both coordinators after year one.  It's also not unprecedented for very good coaches to make big changes of this nature after their first season.  So neither is it a catastrophe indicative of a bad head coach.

We'll see how it works out.  His HS efforts in recruiting clearly panned out well in his first full recruiting cycle.  He tried something a little different given the circumstances he walked into, it didn't work and he's going back to what got him here.  Saban fired both coordinators after his first season at Alabama then had 4 years of stability at both positions after that (and several more on the DC side with Smart).

[NWALA Tiger 3,535]

12 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

I think Hugh looked at the roster then looked at the rosters of our rivals, looked at the sad state of relationships with HS coaches in the area, and thought his most important task was to go full bore after improving this roster.  He thought maybe if he hired a couple of experienced coordinators capable of running their side of the ball without him having to be deeply involved, he could sort of assume a CEO role at least for the first 2-3 years, and be able to devote more time to recruiting, relationship building with high school programs, to the politicking involved with $$ folks at Auburn, and all of those things.  It's not a crazy thought.  It just didn't work as planned, particularly on the offensive side of the ball.  Ultimately it's his responsibility - both the results on the field this year, and for him to fix going forward.

I think the DC situation was something you wouldn't have predicted.  Roberts had a reputation for being hard nosed and abrasive, but it's not like there'd been a mutiny among his players at previous stops or assistants bailing and calling him impossible to work for.  He and Aranda weren't seeing eye to eye on how to run the defense his last year there but that was about it.  I don't think anyone could have reasonably foreseen the situation with the secondary players and McGriff.

So he's fixing the problem.  He's taking back over play calling and will hire an OC that's good with that paradigm.  He encouraged Roberts to find a new job and repaired the relationships with the players getting ready to bail.  Unfortunately the timeline didn't work to keep Crime on board but the bottom line is, he's not just letting things ride and unafraid to make the necessary moves.  It's not ideal to fire both coordinators after year one.  It's also not unprecedented for very good coaches to make big changes of this nature after their first season.  So neither is it a catastrophe indicative of a bad head coach.

We'll see how it works out.  His HS efforts in recruiting clearly panned out well in his first full recruiting cycle.  He tried something a little different given the circumstances he walked into, it didn't work and he's going back to what got him here.  Saban fired both coordinators after his first season at Alabama then had 4 years of stability at both positions after that (and several more on the DC side with Smart).

I think I read somewhere that Saban has had 7 different OC's in the last 9 yrs. So, it's not just an AU thing.  To me, the only similarly to Harsin's 1st year is the record only. Different vibe around Freeze

Edited January 10 by NWALA Tiger

[imaolgatiger 523]

10 hours ago, LAtoAU said:

The ignore feature is your friend....some of these people are bamtard trolls...  

Great idea! I just added several…😁