PSU SANCTIONS AND PATERNO

[JMassie11 1,610]

I'm just glad all the kids can transfer....if they would not have been able to then there would be problems

[fjenkins 0]

You WERE Penn State!

Bobby Bowden's a happy man today

[njAUfn 0]

yep..... i think they would have just preferred the DP

[auburnphan 6,050]

Personally, I think the NCAA is making a huge mistake and over stepping their bounds MASSIVELY. IMO, the NCAA has no place here. They have no precedent. They have no authority. They are not within their jurisdiction (so to speak) and they are not operating within the confines of their purpose and existance as an institution at all. We have criminal courts to handle these types of matters. The NCAA is in the wrong galaxy here (not just zip code), and I cannot understand what Emmerrit is doing. At all.

PSU should fight the NCAA every step of the way on this one.

And by the way, I am not coming from a point of caring one bit what happens to PSU. I am coming from a much broader perspective of the NCAA operating WAY WAY out of its bounds in an area that has nothing to do with their actual purpose. It is a horrible idea, what they are doing and if they want to get involved with stuff like this (crimes and felonies) what type of precedent does it set, and where does it begin and end?

This is exactly why I asked that question in the first place. If the NCAA is allowed to set this precedent, it will happen again and again. And pretty soon there will be no investigations, just punishments.

YOu are not understanding the process.  Penn State hired an individual to do their investigation instead of doing it themselves.  Standard procedure, University investigates itself and turns in findings to the NCAA.  The NCAA can further investigate the matter if there is distrust in the University or make a decision.  The NCAA trusted the independent investigatirs report on Penn States behalf and made a decision.  They are not setting any precedent in any way shape or form.  The clear lack of institutional control is the issue.  IF the adminastrators are found guilty in a court of law for numerous other charges that they in some way covered things up, lied, etc.  the NCAA will then again have the right to impose sanctions on those individuals as well. 

[around4ever 4,139]

The Institution did not have control of the situation.  If they did, Sandusky and everybody who knew of the first event would have been fired and prosecuted at that time. 

When do criminal proceding begin against the President, Athletic Director and all Assistant Coaches who were involved in the cover up? 

[bwillaub 0]

Going to take a long time before PSU is a viable football power again.......and RIGHTFULLY SO!

[dpwspringer 0]

 No, you misunderstood my statement.  Sandusky, although employed by PSU, was not working in the capacity of a PSU employee when these events happened.  He was working as an independent contractor, ie., a part-time job.  The youth camps were programs created, financed, and operated by Sandusky, not PSU.  The only involvement PSU had was their renting the facilities to him.  What will nullify my argument is if these youth programs were operated by/for PSU.

I believe you are in error about Sandusky and when this was first discovered. When it was first discovered he was still coaching at PSU as their DC and associate head coach.  He was on track to succeed Paterno as head coach when Paterno retired, which at that time was any year now.  When this was first discovered by PSU, they covered it up and gave Sandusky a sweet-heart retirement package-- apackage that allowed him to maintain an office and full use of PSU facilities.  I grant you, the folks at PSU figured and hoped that was the end of it and Sandusky made a one time mistake or they half way believed whatever he told them about what he was caught doing, but in the grand scheme of things that was just an excuse to protect the PSU brand and their own image/jobs.  I'm not sure about this, but I think the first incident that was uncovered was a kids mother complaining because her son came home with wet hair and she was upset when she found out he had showered alone with Coach Sandusky in the PSU locker room.

Now, with that in mind, you might want to reconsider your thoughts.

[WhiteTiger 2]

All in all it is a sad day for the sport of football. I don't disagree with the penalties but hate it for the sport that I love.

[tigeraddikt 1,619]

A jury of 12 sends Jerry to the slammer;

A jury of 1 blasts State with the hammer.

Mark Emmert = Beast.

[dpwspringer 0]

A jury of 12 sends Jerry to the slammer;

A jury of 1 blasts State with the hammer.

Mark Emmert = Beast.

NCAA did not give PSU the death penalty, they gave them the zombie penalty.

... and you can quote me.

[tigeraddikt 1,619]

A jury of 12 sends Jerry to the slammer;

A jury of 1 blasts State with the hammer.

Mark Emmert = Beast.

NCAA did not give PSU the death penalty, they gave them the zombie penalty.

... and you can quote me.

I was thinking "The Mortal Wound" Penalty, but I like your Zombie Penalty much better! Props!

[auburn4ever 1,266]

The program should have been totally shut down for at least 2 years.

[dpwspringer 0]

A jury of 12 sends Jerry to the slammer;

A jury of 1 blasts State with the hammer.

Mark Emmert = Beast.

NCAA did not give PSU the death penalty, they gave them the zombie penalty.

... and you can quote me.

I was thinking "The Mortal Wound" Penalty, but I like your Zombie Penalty much better! Props!

All joking or smart azz/clever comments aside, PSU may not want to play football under these conditions. It depends on what happens of course, but this opens the door for the program to be gutted at unprecedented levels.  They are limited to 15 initial counters (new scholarship players) for the next four years (this goes along with a 4 year post season ban).  Players can transfer out of PSU at will or they can stay on scholarship at PSU until they graduate and not play football.  If, and that if is a biggie, the existing PSU football team abandons PSU football, PSU football is screwed.  They can survive the initial counter limit as a wounded football team but not if the existing team abandons the team.  

[auburn4ever 1,266]

Since players can now transfer without loosing any years, are there any players we should try to get? I think so.

[msg6367 1]

I think the NCAA waaayyyyy overstepped their boundaries.   The loss of all victories from 1998-2011 is just plain ridiculous.

AU had 4 players convicted of an armed robbery.  Other players (i.e. Dyer) knew about the robbery beforehand but did nothing to stop it.  Should the NCAA make AU forfeit all games in 2011 that Dyer played in because of his knowledge that he didn't report?  The NCAA is on a slippery slope with this ruling.

Like I said before, Sandusky is the criminal here and there's a special place in hell for this man.  What he did to those innocent children in unfathomable but this should remain a legal issue not a NCAA one.  If those victims want to sue the University let them do so.....and I hope they get every penny they ask for....... but it shouldn't involve the NCAA.

[Newbomb 193]

I think the NCAA waaayyyyy overstepped their boundaries.   The loss of all victories from 1998-2011 is just plain ridiculous.

AU had 4 players convicted of an armed robbery.  Other players (i.e. Dyer) knew about the robbery beforehand but did nothing to stop it.  Should the NCAA make AU forfeit all games in 2011 that Dyer played in because of his knowledge that he didn't report?  The NCAA is on a slippery slope with this ruling.

Like I said before, Sandusky is the criminal here and there's a special place in hell for this man.  What he did to those innocent children in unfathomable but this should remain a legal issue not a NCAA one.  If those victims want to sue the University let them do so.....and I hope they get every penny they ask for....... but it shouldn't involve the NCAA.

No their were many criminals here not just Sadusky.  How many accessories after the fact were there?

[AUwent 3,776]

^^So that means that Clemson should have any wins forfeited this coming year because Yabo Dabo allows Sammy to play?

[fjenkins 0]

AU had 4 players convicted of an armed robbery.  Other players (i.e. Dyer) knew about the robbery beforehand but did nothing to stop it.  Should the NCAA make AU forfeit all games in 2011 that Dyer played in because of his knowledge that he didn't report?  The NCAA is on a slippery slope with this ruling.

We didn't have a widespread cover-up originating at the highest levels of the University.

[mcdover1345162833 0]

I think the NCAA waaayyyyy overstepped their boundaries.   The loss of all victories from 1998-2011 is just plain ridiculous.

AU had 4 players convicted of an armed robbery.  Other players (i.e. Dyer) knew about the robbery beforehand but did nothing to stop it.  Should the NCAA make AU forfeit all games in 2011 that Dyer played in because of his knowledge that he didn't report?  The NCAA is on a slippery slope with this ruling.

Like I said before, Sandusky is the criminal here and there's a special place in hell for this man.  What he did to those innocent children in unfathomable but this should remain a legal issue not a NCAA one.  If those victims want to sue the University let them do so.....and I hope they get every penny they ask for....... but it shouldn't involve the NCAA.

Apples and oranges.  Coach Chizik didn't attempt to cover up their crime.  In fact, he immediately removed them fro the team.  According to the Penn State released emails, the administrators were about to turn Sandusky over to the authorities, but a phone conversation with Paterno changed that. Sandusky was then allowed to go one victimizing children for years to come, all the while the most powerful men at PSU knew what kind of monster he was.

[msg6367 1]

I think the NCAA waaayyyyy overstepped their boundaries.   The loss of all victories from 1998-2011 is just plain ridiculous.

AU had 4 players convicted of an armed robbery.  Other players (i.e. Dyer) knew about the robbery beforehand but did nothing to stop it.  Should the NCAA make AU forfeit all games in 2011 that Dyer played in because of his knowledge that he didn't report?  The NCAA is on a slippery slope with this ruling.

Like I said before, Sandusky is the criminal here and there's a special place in hell for this man.  What he did to those innocent children in unfathomable but this should remain a legal issue not a NCAA one.  If those victims want to sue the University let them do so.....and I hope they get every penny they ask for....... but it shouldn't involve the NCAA.

No their were many criminals here not just Sadusky.  How many accessories after the fact were there?

Let me rephrase it then for you.  Sandusky is the child rapist here.  The others should be tried and convicted (if guilty) in criminal court as accessories.  Have any of the "accessories" been arrested and convicted yet?  

[Elephant Tipper 430]

 No, you misunderstood my statement.  Sandusky, although employed by PSU, was not working in the capacity of a PSU employee when these events happened.  He was working as an independent contractor, ie., a part-time job.  The youth camps were programs created, financed, and operated by Sandusky, not PSU.  The only involvement PSU had was their renting the facilities to him.  What will nullify my argument is if these youth programs were operated by/for PSU.

I believe you are in error about Sandusky and when this was first discovered. When it was first discovered he was still coaching at PSU as their DC and associate head coach.  He was on track to succeed Paterno as head coach when Paterno retired, which at that time was any year now.  When this was first discovered by PSU, they covered it up and gave Sandusky a sweet-heart retirement package-- apackage that allowed him to maintain an office and full use of PSU facilities.  I grant you, the folks at PSU figured and hoped that was the end of it and Sandusky made a one time mistake or they half way believed whatever he told them about what he was caught doing, but in the grand scheme of things that was just an excuse to protect the PSU brand and their own image/jobs.  I'm not sure about this, but I think the first incident that was uncovered was a kids mother complaining because her son came home with wet hair and she was upset when she found out he had showered alone with Coach Sandusky in the PSU locker room.

Now, with that in mind, you might want to reconsider your thoughts.

No, you also misunderstand.  The youth programs were not operated by Sandusky the PSU employee but as Sandusky the independent contractor.  Yes, Sandusky was employed by PSU at the time, but the youth program was not originated, financed or directed by PSU, therefore not a "sanctioned" PSU event.  PSU was doing Sandusky a favor by allowing the use of their premises and now they are paying for that courtesy they gave him.

Look, I'm not defending PSU at all.  They need to be BURIED for what they allowed to happen.  But because of these "unprecedented" actions which the NCAA has granted itself they are now expanding their authority as to the operation of AU's program, which is my concern. 

[bigbird 60,580]

I agree with you, MSG.  The forfeiture of victories is silly. It does nothing.  Jopa's rep is forever tarnished, how does removing those victories, won by the players, an effective punishment?  Fining the university and reducing the schollies punishes the school for their involvement.  Vacating wins only punishes the players that are long gone and had no involvement in the first place.

[tigerfangs 269]

I think the NCAA waaayyyyy overstepped their boundaries.   The loss of all victories from 1998-2011 is just plain ridiculous.

AU had 4 players convicted of an armed robbery.  Other players (i.e. Dyer) knew about the robbery beforehand but did nothing to stop it.  Should the NCAA make AU forfeit all games in 2011 that Dyer played in because of his knowledge that he didn't report?  The NCAA is on a slippery slope with this ruling.

Like I said before, Sandusky is the criminal here and there's a special place in hell for this man.  What he did to those innocent children in unfathomable but this should remain a legal issue not a NCAA one.  If those victims want to sue the University let them do so.....and I hope they get every penny they ask for....... but it shouldn't involve the NCAA.

I agree with this as of now. Its a tragedy what happened to these children. I just feel like its a police matter.

[AuburnGrad97 37]

I agree with you, MSG.  The forfeiture of victories is silly. It does nothing.  Jopa's rep is forever tarnished, how does removing those victories, won by the players, an effective punishment?  Fining the university and reducing the schollies punishes the school for their involvement.  Vacating wins only punishes the players that are long gone and had no involvement in the first place.

Personally, I think the part of vacating all of those wins is in anticipation of PSU's appeal to this decision.  PSU appeals, the NCAA says "okay, we'll drop the vacating the wins penalty, and everything else stands".  This way, the NCAA has a compromise built into the judgement they handed down.

Vacating the wins is kinda silly, if you ask me, but the NCAA is trying to send a strict message that covering up severe issues will not be tolerated. 

[WarEagle10 77]

This will cripple PSU for a decade. It may take another decade to rebuild. The death penalty, for one year, would have been better IMO.