Why are we having a problem getting a pass rush????

[AUwingsfan 1]

I think your first point is key. I feel like we might have just decided to keep the QB in the pocket and stuff the line to be good against the run since we don't have an elite pass rusher off the edge. This strategy mainly seems to burn us when we get to third down and the QB has plenty of time to make a decision if we don't have good pressure. I'm sure the coaches are thinking of ways to remedy this problem (i.e. moving King). Perhaps they have more solutions but they don't want to tip their hand until they absolutely have to. This week might be one of those weeks. War Eagle!

For what it's worth, which may be nothing, when watching Auburn defensive line play I see:

A tendency to hold the line instead of penetrating as though the d-line is pass blocking.

Very little aggressive movement in arms and shoulders.

Very few hands up as the QB is passing.

Occasional attempts to skirt the pass blocking which doesn't work because they are woefully too slow.

Rest-break downs where little effort is made to do more than hold position in case of a run.

To me, it looks like there are conditioning, technique and motivational factors here - aspects that might be improved upon even if they aren't 5-star players. Michigan State has a solid d-line. Are their players bigger or better? KState? Ole Miss?

I still stand behind the suggestion I made the other day. Call the Great Kevin Greene and have him put on a clinic for the line and LBs. Teach them something new and get them excited about the challenges they're facing.

[Browning4AU 405]

WHy not put Garrett on the end on some plays and still have Frost and Nova as LBs with Therezie at star?

Why not put Garrett at linebacker and the bigger Nova at DE/LB Hybrid? Or as bama calls it the Jack

I just feel like moving Nova away from the Mike spot would be bad for the middle of the D.

[war eagle6 0]

WHy not put Garrett on the end on some plays and still have Frost and Nova as LBs with Therezie at star?

Why not put Garrett at linebacker and the bigger Nova at DE/LB Hybrid? Or as bama calls it the Jack

I just feel like moving Nova away from the Mike spot would be bad for the middle of the D.

That's when u start tre at lb, kid has huge upside

[minister of music 0]

Talent is there, coaching is not.Bottom line.

[sevenlee36 1,654]

Talent is there, coaching is not.Bottom line.

So Garner is the problem?

[AURealist 2,185]

I think your first point is key. I feel like we might have just decided to keep the QB in the pocket and stuff the line to be good against the run since we don't have an elite pass rusher off the edge. This strategy mainly seems to burn us when we get to third down and the QB has plenty of time to make a decision if we don't have good pressure. I'm sure the coaches are thinking of ways to remedy this problem (i.e. moving King). Perhaps they have more solutions but they don't want to tip their hand until they absolutely have to. This week might be one of those weeks. War Eagle!

I agree completely that stacking up the middle is probably a stop-gap measure to compensate for the non-extant pass rush. But how did AU get into a situation where the best thing they can do is to repeatedly commit such acts of last-ditch desperation?

The second part to this, as you mentioned, are these embarrassing 3rd down pass plays where the defense basically plays something approaching a very slack prevent D. No rush and a bunch of guys standing around waiting for the receiver to catch the ball for 12 yards.

The final piece of these plays is the 'hit' on the receiver without wrapping him up and bringing him down. The backs hit the receivers who then often get a few more yards before going down from the impact or from being actually 'tackled' by another player. Hitting is fun, but it's not smart football. Look and you won't see Kstate, MichState or Ole Miss doing that, but you'll see the Georgia Tech defense do it every single play. Proper tackling is based on a few a fundamental concepts that can be taught to any player with ears. I think fundamentals on the defense are being neglected and the defensive play and the defensive players are suffering for it.

[AU64 10,122]

I think your first point is key. I feel like we might have just decided to keep the QB in the pocket and stuff the line to be good against the run since we don't have an elite pass rusher off the edge. This strategy mainly seems to burn us when we get to third down and the QB has plenty of time to make a decision if we don't have good pressure. I'm sure the coaches are thinking of ways to remedy this problem (i.e. moving King). Perhaps they have more solutions but they don't want to tip their hand until they absolutely have to. This week might be one of those weeks. War Eagle!

I agree completely that stacking up the middle is probably a stop-gap measure to compensate for the non-extant pass rush. But how did AU get into a situation where the best thing they can do is to repeatedly commit such acts of last-ditch desperation?

The second part to this, as you mentioned, are these embarrassing 3rd down pass plays where the defense basically plays something approaching a very slack prevent D. No rush and a bunch of guys standing around waiting for the receiver to catch the ball for 12 yards.

The final piece of these plays is the 'hit' on the receiver without wrapping him up and bringing him down. The backs hit the receivers who then often get a few more yards before going down from the impact or from being actually 'tackled' by another player. Hitting is fun, but it's not smart football. Look and you won't see Kstate, MichState or Ole Miss doing that, but you'll see the Georgia Tech defense do it every single play. Proper tackling is based on a few a fundamental concepts that can be taught to any player with ears. I think fundamentals on the defense are being neglected and the defensive play and the defensive players are suffering for it.

I don't think this is stop-gap...seem to me that the objective of the D is to make the opposition pass the ball and for the most part the first objective of the DL and LBs is to stop the running game and not let the QB get outside of the ends. That's been successful for the most past this year.

All of this is predicated on the DBs being able to cover the WRs, and slow up/stop the oppositions passing game. We have 13 Int this year which is well above our usual.....so something must be working. The USCe game in my view was an anomaly ...who else is going to play 4 down football an entire game? ...and USCe had a pretty poor record on 3rd down situations.

I (as noted above) our defensive problems result more from poor tackling and mediocre coverage by the DBs than the sack totals or QB pressure. I mean, how much pressure are you going to get from a 3 or 4 man pass rush against a decent OL with all but the most flagrant holding being ignored by the officials? So maybe the deal is to stop the run..period....and defend the pass.

[McLoofus 35,182]

I (as noted above) our defensive problems result more from poor tackling and mediocre coverage by the DBs than the sack totals or QB pressure.

No DB can cover a WR forever. Go back and watch the KSU game. More than half of that one little dude's- don't remember his name- catches came after he'd broken off his original route because he was covered but we couldn't get to the quarterback. You just can't give the quarterback time or he will complete passes against *any* defensive backfield.

[AU64 10,122]

I (as noted above) our defensive problems result more from poor tackling and mediocre coverage by the DBs than the sack totals or QB pressure.

No DB can cover a WR forever. Go back and watch the KSU game. More than half of that one little dude's- don't remember his name- catches came after he'd broken off his original route because he was covered but we couldn't get to the quarterback. You just can't give the quarterback time or he will complete passes against *any* defensive backfield.

Despite some criticism of AU's performance in the KSU game, AU held KSU to their lowest offensive output of the entire season...less than 300 yards of total offense and their QB got NOTHING on the ground which was ..pre-game...thought to be their most serious threat.

[juscAUse 1]

I (as noted above) our defensive problems result more from poor tackling and mediocre coverage by the DBs than the sack totals or QB pressure.

No DB can cover a WR forever. Go back and watch the KSU game. More than half of that one little dude's- don't remember his name- catches came after he'd broken off his original route because he was covered but we couldn't get to the quarterback. You just can't give the quarterback time or he will complete passes against *any* defensive backfield.

Their all- american pass catcher did not beat us. He's beaten everybody else they have played. EVERY good defense gives up something to a GOOD offense. If we have a vastly superior defense, well , we don't give up much. But those are few and far between. I would like to have that d every year. If you can figure out how to do that, your wasting your time here.

[AURealist 2,185]

I don't think this is stop-gap...seem to me that the objective of the D is to make the opposition pass the ball and for the most part the first objective of the DL and LBs is to stop the running game and not let the QB get outside of the ends. That's been successful for the most past this year.

All of this is predicated on the DBs being able to cover the WRs, and slow up/stop the oppositions passing game. We have 13 Int this year which is well above our usual.....so something must be working. The USCe game in my view was an anomaly ...who else is going to play 4 down football an entire game? ...and USCe had a pretty poor record on 3rd down situations.

I (as noted above) our defensive problems result more from poor tackling and mediocre coverage by the DBs than the sack totals or QB pressure. I mean, how much pressure are you going to get from a 3 or 4 man pass rush against a decent OL with all but the most flagrant holding being ignored by the officials? So maybe the deal is to stop the run..period....and defend the pass.

The most important part of pass defense is a strong pass rush. That's Football 101. The three man rush with everyone else standing around waiting for the ball to be thrown is called the 'Prevent Defense' which, as has been pointed out for years, only serves to prevent those who employ it from winning. Unfortunately, Auburn's standard pass defensive set sometimes looks disturbingly similar to the prevent, but with a four man rush and slightly different personnel.

When you play against a team with a good quarterback, the very last thing you want to do is to let him stand safely in his pocket and pass the ball. That pocket that's formed around the QB is there because the offense wants it there! Forcing the QB into trying to run around the end is exactly what the defense wants because a passing QB running cannot make the yards of a completed pass.

I beg to differ with you that what AU did last week on D against USCar could be considered "working". What happened was Auburn's offense simply outscored USC's offense. Both defenses were equally bad.

Is there any real difference on how a defense plays 3rd and 4th downs? I don't understand how anyone could feel any sense of peace while Auburn's 'prevent' defense allows SC to convert on 4 of 5 4th-down attempts. And I'll take the ability to deny 1st downs and stopping drives with solid fundamental play over a high interception count any day.

With time, a good QB will complete passes against any DB. Pressure on the QB is crucial to pass defense.

[bigbird 60,525]

Talent is there, coaching is not.Bottom line.

[Browning4AU 405]

WHy not put Garrett on the end on some plays and still have Frost and Nova as LBs with Therezie at star?

Why not put Garrett at linebacker and the bigger Nova at DE/LB Hybrid? Or as bama calls it the Jack

I just feel like moving Nova away from the Mike spot would be bad for the middle of the D.

Or Frost to Mike and Garrett to Will...Either way, the DL has to do their part. I really had higher hopes for Whitaker this year. I also thought Gabe would be better, but I think losing a lot of that weight may not have helped on the interior.

[auburn4ever 1,266]

It all starts with coaching.

[war eagle6 0]

It all starts with coaching.

Enough said^^

[AUFlyer99 647]

So good coaching can turn anyone into an elite pass rusher?

If that's the case Dee Ford's performance last year backs that statement up and at the same time blows the argument out of the water that coaching lies at the core of the problem this year.

Bottom line. We don't have the personnel this year with Lawson injured. Hopefully that lack if depth is corrected for next year.

[war eagle6 0]

So good coaching can turn anyone into an elite pass rusher?

If that's the case Dee Ford's performance last year backs that statement up and at the same time blows the argument out of the water that coaching lies at the core of the problem this year.

Bottom line. We don't have the personnel this year with Lawson injured. Hopefully that lack if depth is corrected for next year.

If ulm, uab, troy can get a pass rush against sec schools, Without the Personnel,then what do u call it?

[Altima 200]

Talent is there, coaching is not.Bottom line.

I'll take this opportunity to respectfully disagree.

The talent is not there...

With Lawson out and Owens not 100%, we have no edge rushers. Kennion and Thornton both hover around 225 pounds... not ready yet.

Moving Wright outside is the tell tale sign that the talent NOT there.

Coaching has nothing to do with it! EJ and Garner are mixing and matching trying to put a unit out there that will pressure the QB... They're doing all they can.

[kd4au 1,145]

What about the freshman Andrew Williams is he injured or just not ready to play?

[mustache eagle 2,405]

Talent is there, coaching is not.Bottom line.

do you think he'll get it? Or just keep hatin on the coaches?

[bigbird 60,525]

It all starts with coaching.

Enough said^^

How in the world can the two of you believe this? I'm being for real. I don't understand how any fan with any semblance of football IQ can think this? We do not have the players with the necessary skill set to be elite pass rushers playing on the field right now. And that is due to lack of coaching? Really? How do ya'll make that association? I guess it is lack of coaching that has us playing a safety at end,huh? I mean, If they could coach then obviously a converted safety playing end for less than two weeks should've made a huge impact. Geez....

[war eagle6 0]

It all starts with coaching.

Enough said^^

How in the world can the two of you believe this? I'm being for real. I don't understand how any fan with any semblance of football IQ can think this? We do not have the players with the necessary skill set to be elite pass rushers playing on the field right now. And that is due to lack of coaching? Really? How do ya'll make that association? I guess it is lack of coaching that has us playing a safety at end,huh? I mean, If they could coach then obviously a converted safety playing end for less than two weeks should've made a huge impact. Geez....

I don't just watch AU play defense. I've seen ulm, uab, troy, be able to get a pass rush. If ur telling me that their defensive ends are better than AU's, then somebody needs to do a better job in recruiting

[WarDamn24 0]

Carl Lawson isn't back yet. That's why.

[alexava 6,973]

Defense screwed up but offense could do better too. It will.

[tbone4jc 2,241]

Got very good pressure tonight!