I'm confused, but sw and jj are the same

[doug3020 842]

Wow...this has gotten heated. Let SW play 2 more games and then lets have a discussion....

But for arguments sake let's compare wk1 to wk 4.

SW- 20-28 passes-1 int.

JJ game 1- 11-21 1TD, 3 ints

I honestly think the biggest play of the year thus far was the holding call on the long TD pass against Louisville. JJ threw a pick later on that drive and it let Louisville back in the game. He looked serviceable up to that point, but it is evident that sank his confidence. Reminds me of the turds at UGA in 2008. UGA picks off turd QB in the endzone. Called for roughing the passer. Turds score and run UGA out of their own stadium. UGA then tale spins and turds take-off. Sometimes all it takes is one play...

[tigerbrotha12 2,362]

SW and JJ played the exact type game made the same mistakes. The only difference is that SW is more apt to run but usually that's viewed as a negative for a qb.

I say go with white since he's younger thus more upside and we may as well get the youth movement going at this position as well...But the way many was complaining about EVERY detail of one qb and to not say anything about the same stuff from another qb is funny to me.

I don't know about them playing equally. I though White out performed JJ thus far. Two mistakes. One pick, and one taken sack he should have thrown away. Understandable from freshman. Played well enough for us to win. JJ wasn't doing that. White is also a leader, by the looks of it. Think we could have a 2007 type season; start off very poor and turn it around as we slide into halfway point of season. I think we'll be playing our best fball come iron bowl time.

See I don't understand that leader part and I'm hoping someone could explain it to me what made him look like a leader this game? And I'm being forthright so if you choose to answer I'm not being smart or combative I'd like to just converse and bounce ideas cordially

I watched him a few times on the sideline talking to his o line and skill players in a circle. Don't know what he was saying, but he was obviously the man being listened to a lot.

[TexasTiger 12,974]

Wow...this has gotten heated. Let SW play 2 more games and then lets have a discussion....

But for arguments sake let's compare wk1 to wk 4.

SW- 20-28 passes-1 int.

JJ game 1- 11-21 1TD, 3 ints

I honestly think the biggest play of the year thus far was the holding call on the long TD pass against Louisville. JJ threw a pick later on that drive and it let Louisville back in the game. He looked serviceable up to that point, but it is evident that sank his confidence. Reminds me of the turds at UGA in 2008. UGA picks off turd QB in the endzone. Called for roughing the passer. Turds score and run UGA out of their own stadium. UGA then tale spins and turds take-off. Sometimes all it takes is one play...

That play was huge. That game would have felt very different.

[cole256 17,084]

SW and JJ played the exact type game made the same mistakes. The only difference is that SW is more apt to run but usually that's viewed as a negative for a qb.

I say go with white since he's younger thus more upside and we may as well get the youth movement going at this position as well...But the way many was complaining about EVERY detail of one qb and to not say anything about the same stuff from another qb is funny to me.

I don't know about them playing equally. I though White out performed JJ thus far. Two mistakes. One pick, and one taken sack he should have thrown away. Understandable from freshman. Played well enough for us to win. JJ wasn't doing that. White is also a leader, by the looks of it. Think we could have a 2007 type season; start off very poor and turn it around as we slide into halfway point of season. I think we'll be playing our best fball come iron bowl time.

See I don't understand that leader part and I'm hoping someone could explain it to me what made him look like a leader this game? And I'm being forthright so if you choose to answer I'm not being smart or combative I'd like to just converse and bounce ideas cordially

I watched him a few times on the sideline talking to his o line and skill players in a circle. Don't know what he was saying, but he was obviously the man being listened to a lot.

Gotcha. I don't think they showed that on tv any

[Fricking Ray 47]

The last thing this team needs is controversy at QB.

[Ronin 2]

SW played a much better game than anything JJ has done this year. Not even close.

If they catch those other two picks same exact game.

Scratch that first bad throw was on same drive of the first int so that sort of cancels out since you couldn't have two int's on the same drive

It looks like you've watched the games more times than I have. What is JJ's potential interception number? Did the other team catch all of them?

[cole256 17,084]

I think I saw a poster say it should be ten. I know one more in the LSU game. And at least one more in the Louisville game for sure

[ClaytonAU 4,606]

The deep pass was taken away due to the deep safeties. I don't think Sean was scared as much as he didn't have that option due to the safeties playing so deep.

Plenty of one on one opportunities that we did not take.

With all the time he had to throw the deep ball, right?

[cole256 17,084]

I didn't see them and definitely didn't have time. O line play haven't been the best but run blocking seemed to improve that game

[cole256 17,084]

Oh and it was more than o line. I saw Cox miss a couple and barber missed one on Brown on a sack. We just need to improve everywhere

[doug3020 842]

Oh and it was more than o line. I saw Cox miss a couple and barber missed one on Brown on a sack. We just need to improve everywhere

Amen!

[Auburnguy101 325]

I might be off in interpreting what you are trying to say cole, and others might have better explained it, since I haven't read all of this thread. But, I think I understand what you're saying. I believe Auburn fans have such low expectations of QB play now because of JJ in that anything SW did last night was going to be amazing as long as he didn't turn the ball over 3 times or throw into triple coverage multiple times, like JJ. However, as an objective person can see, the offense still had the same issues like when JJ was in there, and the offense didn't produce a TD, whereas JJ at least did. Another point, I don't know if you have hit on this or not, but I ask those who are saying SW did great to look at how Miss. State was playing us, basically disrespecting SW as a runner, and they were right. SW was not a threat to Miss. State, hence why they were willing to sacrifice those dink and dunk throws. In my honest opinion, I believe many Auburn fans have issues with a QB who is a dual threat, for some reason or another. I have been blasted for saying this offense needs a playmaker at QB for us to compete for championhips, but just like Gus, I believe our fans think we can win with a QB who is no threat at running in this offense, which, as I stated before, is not true. What do Cam and NM have in common, and what do Chris Todd, Barrett Trotter/Clint Moseley, JJ, and SW have in common?

[IronMan70 3,277]

Well, I think we may be splitting hairs here, IronMan -- and you know I don't want to argue with you. What you initially said, and what I initially responded to, was about "a thread to compare SW to JJ." My response was that the thread got sidetracked, and that it wasn't the main purpose of the OP to compare SW to JJ. That's what led to my talk of cole's motives; but I think those motives are relevant to discussing what it means to have "a thread like this."

Maybe I just misunderstood your posts. It happens.

We aren't splitting hairs at all. The theme of "the thread" was clear in all 3 of my very short comments. You apparently misunderstood.

"But, I don't see any need to have a thread to compare SW to JJ. All it does is cause negative comments to be posted about one or the other."

"Which is exactly what I said is caused by a thread like this."

"That's all well and good but my comment was about "a thread like this", not the originator of the thread or motives."

Indeed, I see that "the thread" was a thread in all your comments. I still think the OP's motives are relevant to discussing the need to have a thread like this. But I can also understand it if someone wants to say that we should determine the need based on the consequences of a thread like this (negative comments about both players) and say we don't need that.

Uhhh

[FoundationEagle 637]

I might be off in interpreting what you are trying to say cole, and others might have better explained it, since I haven't read all of this thread. But, I think I understand what you're saying. I believe Auburn fans have such low expectations of QB play now because of JJ in that anything SW did last night was going to be amazing as long as he didn't turn the ball over 3 times or throw into triple coverage multiple times, like JJ. However, as an objective person can see, the offense still had the same issues like when JJ was in there, and the offense didn't produce a TD, whereas JJ at least did. Another point, I don't know if you have hit on this or not, but I ask those who are saying SW did great to look at how Miss. State was playing us, basically disrespecting SW as a runner, and they were right. SW was not a threat to Miss. State, hence why they were willing to sacrifice those dink and dunk throws. In my honest opinion, I believe many Auburn fans have issues with a QB who is a dual threat, for some reason or another. I have been blasted for saying this offense needs a playmaker at QB for us to compete for championhips, but just like Gus, I believe our fans think we can win with a QB who is no threat at running in this offense, which, as I stated before, is not true. What do Cam and NM have in common, and what do Chris Todd, Barrett Trotter/Clint Moseley, JJ, and SW have in common?

2009 offense with Chris Todd (who had a bum shoulder and absolutely no running ability) ranked 2nd in the SEC in yards per game and 3rd in points. 16th in the nation in both categories. In 2007 and 2008 at Tulsa his O with a non mobile qb lead the nation in yards per game both years. In 2012 Arky State was top 25 in both categories. So before this season you have 4 good to great years and 1 not good year with a non mobile qb. I'd say those stats speak for themselves.

[amsterjam 107]

Cole let me ask you a question. How many career reps do you think JJ has had with the 1st team and how many do you think White has had? Pretty sure you can figure out your question by answering my question.

[EclecticTiger 146]

The o line and the play calling did SW no favors. Heavy blitz that everyone knows is coming....and we do a double fake reverse that takes an extreme amount of time to run?

Long developing plays mixed with poor blocking and a blitz happy defense set the tone for the offense.

Looked like SW was handcuffed a lot. Seemed like Gus did want to ease him into the game but then played to not lose. Playing not to lose means you are going to lose.

I really liked what I saw from SW in such a small sample size.

Fact, fact, fact, fact.

[Auburnguy101 325]

I might be off in interpreting what you are trying to say cole, and others might have better explained it, since I haven't read all of this thread. But, I think I understand what you're saying. I believe Auburn fans have such low expectations of QB play now because of JJ in that anything SW did last night was going to be amazing as long as he didn't turn the ball over 3 times or throw into triple coverage multiple times, like JJ. However, as an objective person can see, the offense still had the same issues like when JJ was in there, and the offense didn't produce a TD, whereas JJ at least did. Another point, I don't know if you have hit on this or not, but I ask those who are saying SW did great to look at how Miss. State was playing us, basically disrespecting SW as a runner, and they were right. SW was not a threat to Miss. State, hence why they were willing to sacrifice those dink and dunk throws. In my honest opinion, I believe many Auburn fans have issues with a QB who is a dual threat, for some reason or another. I have been blasted for saying this offense needs a playmaker at QB for us to compete for championhips, but just like Gus, I believe our fans think we can win with a QB who is no threat at running in this offense, which, as I stated before, is not true. What do Cam and NM have in common, and what do Chris Todd, Barrett Trotter/Clint Moseley, JJ, and SW have in common?

2009 offense with Chris Todd (who had a bum shoulder and absolutely no running ability) ranked 2nd in the SEC in yards per game and 3rd in points. 16th in the nation in both categories. In 2007 and 2008 at Tulsa his O with a non mobile qb lead the nation in yards per game both years. In 2012 Arky State was top 25 in both categories. So before this season you have 4 good to great years and 1 not good year with a non mobile qb. I'd say those stats speak for themselves.

2009: Gus came in with an offense that was just becoming popular and was novel at the time, therefore we beat teams that we had more talent than, and were somewhat competitive in our losses. Teams had no idea what Gus' offense looked like before 2009. And don't even get me started with the Tulsa thing. Because, we all know Tulsa and SEC defenses are comparable. Let's do this though. When he's been at Auburn how many championships have we won with dual threat QBs compared to QBs like SW and JJ (who's careers are just starting I know) and Clint Moseley and Barrett Trotter and Chris Todd? Also, which offense is more difficult to defend and has been more successful for Auburn in Gus' offense, Cam and NM's, or the one you saw last night? I'll hang up and listen...

[chimesAU 89]

Made a couple of nice runs but JJ went 60+ last week.

Congrats to Jeremy for running unimpeded in a straight line for that far.

He did recognize and take it. Which was progress.

He didn't recognize anything. It was the play that was called and took zero skill. He was TERRIFIED throughout the whole run.

[FoundationEagle 637]

So...2009 and anything outside the SEC don't count...when you can cherry pick facts and disregard anything that doesn't prove your point then the discussion is pointless. So, then we have you're entire argument based off of 1 year, 2012...and this year which isn't done. No sense in discussing anymore. How about one year with NM and an 8-5 season? Let me guess, all on the defense? Even the Georgia game?

[AURealist 2,185]

Made a couple of nice runs but JJ went 60+ last week.

Congrats to Jeremy for running unimpeded in a straight line for that far.

He did recognize and take it. Which was progress.

He didn't recognize anything. It was the play that was called and took zero skill. He was TERRIFIED throughout the whole run.

The kid played - on a week's notice and against an SEC opponent - as well as JJ did against Jax State.

I think SW shows much greater situational awareness.

I also believe the greatest difference between the two - as I stated earlier - is that JJ runs plays and SW plays football.

..

[FoundationEagle 637]

Made a couple of nice runs but JJ went 60+ last week.

Congrats to Jeremy for running unimpeded in a straight line for that far.

He did recognize and take it. Which was progress.

He didn't recognize anything. It was the play that was called and took zero skill. He was TERRIFIED throughout the whole run.

The kid played - on a week's notice and against an SEC opponent - as well as JJ did against Jax State.

I think SW shows much greater situational awareness.

I also believe the greatest difference between the two - as I stated earlier - is that JJ runs plays and SW plays football.

..

I think you guys are agreeing and don't realize it. He's saying JJs run was called and he was scared, not SW.

[sevenlee36 1,654]

Sean White's play reminds me of Russell Wilson. Not in anyway saying he will be that good but just his play style. I'd like to see if he can throw the rock downfield that and his height are my concerns right now.

[Sully to Beasley 643]

From Stat's latest post:

"Auburn had 7 impact plays in the passing game thru 3 games and 5 against MSU. Hopefully this latest improvement will continue. "

Don't confuse the doom and gloomers with facts.

[autan 742]

The deep pass was taken away due to the deep safeties. I don't think Sean was scared as much as he didn't have that option due to the safeties playing so deep.

It's true that the defense was set up to deny us the deep pass, and I agree that SW wasn't scared to throw it deep, in principle.

This makes me think about some of the criticisms of the playcalling, too, though.

I mean, you want to force Miss State to bring one of those safeties down into the box to open up the passing game. So, you run the ball more. We did that. But Miss State was still able to play with two high safeties for almost all of the game. So, what gives?

We didn't convert in the redzone. They could play essentially a 'prevent' D all night, because they never broke. And we didn't do enough to get them to change their strategy.

Ding, Ding you hit the nail on the head. If we stick it in the end zone when we get in the red zone, we win and all this is moot. SW has saved our season. But that didn't happen. Some mistakes were on SW, some were on CGM, some on others but bottom line we didn't finish. In comparing the two QBs JJ is much bigger and stronger and seems to have a pretty good arc on the deep ball. Other than that, Seam seems quicker, more elusive, better ball handler, runs read option better. Also more accurate on short and medium throws at least. I think they are both good leaders just in different ways. Coaches will go with who they think gives us the best chance to win. I think that was SW last night. We just didn't convert in the red zone.

[Auburnguy101 325]

So...2009 and anything outside the SEC don't count...when you can cherry pick facts and disregard anything that doesn't prove your point then the discussion is pointless. So, then we have you're entire argument based off of 1 year, 2012...and this year which isn't done. No sense in discussing anymore. How about one year with NM and an 8-5 season? Let me guess, all on the defense? Even the Georgia game?

First of all, kind of hard to comprehend what you were refuting, but I digress. Anyways, yes, I know how successful his years at Tulsa were, but what does that mean in the SEC? He was playing against defenses with nowhere near the talent and complicated schemes as in the SEC, and his personnel were probably the same as the defenses he was playing against, so a wash. But then you add in the fact the advantages an offense like his has over an average to below average defense, then yes, he can be successful, especially with a QB who is not a threat to run. However, you can't deny the impact and world of difference it is to have a dual threat QB like Cam and NM has. And let's talk about last year with NM by the way. I would say against Miss. State and UGA were the only games where our offense plainly stunk it up and lost us the game, but the other games, where we scored at least 30 points, I will blame it on the defense. By the way, it seems like you discount what NM did his first year, you know, winning the SEC and stuff, but whatever. All I'm saying is, look at the difference between the offenses, one with a dual threat, and the other, where SW and JJ are, and where the Tulsa QBs, Chris Todd, Barrett Trotter and Clint Mosely aare placed, and tell me which one has been more successful, i.e., winning championships? I'll hang up and listen...