Green energy sources....

[AuburnNTexas 7,213]

17 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

well we know many of the same on here are climate change deniers as well. the polar ice caps are literally melting right before our eyes and people still scream hoax.

Of course it is happening and we should do things but they need to be well planned and the cost does matter in doing it. If Texas had been at 50% Green people would have died now not in 50 years. If you want to do green do it with proper backup for when green isn't available and pay for it.  See what happens when you tell people their Electric bill will double.  The people least able to afford it will be hurt the most but you are for green so the poor don't matter.  By the way with the increase of power needs in China, India and developing world it would more than offset the improvement from the US.

There are common sense things we could do. Brad_ATX hit on one have downtown turn off the lights in office building except emergency lights lower temperature in commercial buildings, set our own thermostats lower in winter and higher in summer.  Replace all coal and Heating Oil with Natural Gas still pollutes but a whole lot less. Develop cheaper long term energy storage so green is viable still more expensive but competitive. If we keep improving solar panels and Wind farm efficiencies it will help offset the cost of long term energy storage. 

I want Green energy but I am a realist not a dreamer. What happens when electric cars become the norm we will have to dramatically increase energy production how can we do that with just Green when we don't have true long term energy storage or transfer of energy from one part of country to another. How vulnerable would a National Energy Grid be to bad characters all this must be thought about and planned for. 

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

18 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

If your electric grid is 25% reliant on green energy why wouldn’t you winterize?  If you make the decision to subject your citizens to this new technology you better be able to guarantee its reliability.  Some how Texas couldn’t see this storm coming?  I watched the weather channel and they knew it was coming days ago when it was 65 degrees.

When you go green, it is going to cost more, especially when the technology is not up speed with regard to severe weather.  Politicians are pushing a system that isn’t ready for reliable service.

Let me break this down in simple terms:

It's not just green energy sources that didn't winterize.  Coal, gas, nuclear, etc are having the same issues.  Stop putting all of the blame on green energy when it's nowhere near the biggest culprit of this power failure statewide.

The point I'm making though is why would you spend crazy money winterizing for 9 degrees in Texas?  It's a collosal waste of money 99.99% of the time and people would be up in arms about the frivolous spending.  Same reason people up north don't have AC for summer.  It's simply not needed 99.99% of the time, but when a crazy heat wave hits, their grids get over-worked and crash out.

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

18 minutes ago, AuburnNTexas said:

It happens every ten years. It is not a waste of money compared to danger. My brother-in-law has cancer and has an oxygen generating machine he needs to live while going through treatment, luckily my sister has portable tanks but just had the Fire department pick him up and move him so he will be warm and machine will work before portable tanks run out of air. Then I have to drive an hour each way to pick my sister up and bring her to my place.  You plan for emergencies 100 year storms ten year storms. Right now green energy relies on fossil Fuel when green doesn't work so because of both green not having a real backup and Power companies not winterizing we are in this predicament.  We have a cold snap like this about every 10 years.  I will leave once my sister calls and says Fire Department has taken my Brother-in-Law. 

I truly feel bad for your predicament and hope all is well with the family.  But 6 inches of snow and sub-zero temps happen every 10 years across Texas?  Really dude?  Austin literally had a Wind Chill Warning for the first time in recorded history this week.

If we spent money in Texas planning for this, people would call it a waste of cash because it legitimately doesn't happen here.

[johnnyAU 3,668]

1 minute ago, AuburnNTexas said:

Of course it is happening and we should do things but they need to be well planned and the cost does matter in doing it. If Texas had been at 50% Green people would have died now not in 50 years. If you want to do green do it with proper backup for when green isn't available and pay for it.  See what happens when you tell people their Electric bill will double.  The people least able to afford it will be hurt the most but you are for green so the poor don't matter.  By the way with the increase of power needs in China, India and developing world it would more than offset the improvement from the US.

There are common sense things we could do. Brad_ATX hit on one have downtown turn off the lights in office building except emergency lights lower temperature in commercial buildings, set our own thermostats lower in winter and higher in summer.  Replace all coal and Heating Oil with Natural Gas still pollutes but a whole lot less. Develop cheaper long term energy storage so green is viable still more expensive but competitive. If we keep improving solar panels and Wind farm efficiencies it will help offset the cost of long term energy storage. 

I want Green energy but I am a realist not a dreamer. What happens when electric cars become the norm we will have to dramatically increase energy production how can we do that with just Green when we don't have true long term energy storage or transfer of energy from one part of country to another. How vulnerable would a National Energy Grid be to bad characters all this must be thought about and planned for. 

Not to mention, the materials for wind turbines and solar panels can neither be mined or manufactured currently without the use of fossil fuels. We cannot build more wind and solar using only wind and solar sources, and we cannot adequately maintain them using only wind and solar sources. Relying on unreliable sources to sustain the grids that will be necessary in future is a fool's errand.  We simply aren't there yet. If you want to bridge the gap, use nuclear.  If we cannot supply the upcoming energy demands, or if the energy prices skyrocket, then those without energy (whether they cannot get it or cannot afford it) suffer. 

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

2 minutes ago, johnnyAU said:

Not to mention, the materials for wind turbines and solar panels can neither be mined or manufactured currently without the use of fossil fuels. We cannot build more wind and solar using only wind and solar sources, and we cannot adequately maintain them using only wind and solar sources. Relying on unreliable sources to sustain the grids that will be necessary in future is a fool's errand.  We simply aren't there yet. If you want to bridge the gap, use nuclear.  If we cannot supply the upcoming energy demands, or if the energy prices skyrocket, then those without energy (whether they cannot get it or cannot afford it) suffer. 

There's an underlying issue that goes well beyond any energy source with regards to Texas and it's our state's insistence on having its own grid.  We don't get help from other places largely in the name of avoiding federal regulations and pushing profits.  Puts us truly on our own and crying for help that isn't there when we need it most.

[I_M4_AU 8,139]

1 hour ago, Brad_ATX said:

Let me break this down in simple terms:

It's not just green energy sources that didn't winterize.  Coal, gas, nuclear, etc are having the same issues.  Stop putting all of the blame on green energy when it's nowhere near the biggest culprit of this power failure statewide.

The point I'm making though is why would you spend crazy money winterizing for 9 degrees in Texas?  It's a collosal waste of money 99.99% of the time and people would be up in arms about the frivolous spending.  Same reason people up north don't have AC for summer.  It's simply not needed 99.99% of the time, but when a crazy heat wave hits, their grids get over-worked and crash out.

Has Texas had rolling blackouts before it went to 20-25% green energy sources?  And what does Texas do when there is not wind blowing?  Is there backup plans to accommodate for this or is it just to tell its citizens to use less power like California?  

[wdefromtx 3,159]

1 hour ago, Brad_ATX said:

Why would you winterize for these extremes in Texas though?  It's a bit of a waste of money in many ways.  Same reason I wouldn't take crazy steps to shelter in for a long winter here.  It was 65 just a few days ago, which is normal for us in February.

We get cold snaps like this every 5-10 years so it is not wasting money. It’s a system wide failure run by idiots that would rather pocket the cash. This is what happens when you let governments and pseudo governments run things. And to think people want more government control. 

[wdefromtx 3,159]

1 hour ago, Brad_ATX said:

I truly feel bad for your predicament and hope all is well with the family.  But 6 inches of snow and sub-zero temps happen every 10 years across Texas?  Really dude?  Austin literally had a Wind Chill Warning for the first time in recorded history this week.

If we spent money in Texas planning for this, people would call it a waste of cash because it legitimately doesn't happen here.

Ummm, I have lived in Texas for 40 years. This has happened at least 4 times I can remember right off the top of my head. 

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

54 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Has Texas had rolling blackouts before it went to 20-25% green energy sources?  And what does Texas do when there is not wind blowing?  Is there backup plans to accommodate for this or is it just to tell its citizens to use less power like California?  

Yes.  We had rolling blackouts as recently as 2011.  And no, no real backup plan.  That's the problem when you're on your own grid.

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

44 minutes ago, wdefromtx said:

We get cold snaps like this every 5-10 years so it is not wasting money. It’s a system wide failure run by idiots that would rather pocket the cash. This is what happens when you let governments and pseudo governments run things. And to think people want more government control. 

Except ERCOT, a non-federally controlled agency, is the one screwing the pooch here.

And we get cold snaps, sure.  But never anything like this across the entire grid.  That's the point here.  The entire state is never like this.  Areas?  Sure.  Dallas gets ice storms nearly every winter.  But the RGV area dealing with this?  Yeah, not so much.

[wdefromtx 3,159]

4 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

Except ERCOT, a non-federally controlled agency, is the one screwing the pooch here.

And we get cold snaps, sure.  But never anything like this across the entire grid.  That's the point here.  The entire state is never like this.  Areas?  Sure.  Dallas gets ice storms nearly every winter.  But the RGV area dealing with this?  Yeah, not so much.

2011 and 1989. Two years that come to mind. Basically the whole state. There is plenty of money to make the grid what it needs to be. There is no excuse for this, ERCOT needs to have heads roll. 
 

This isn’t the first time they screwed the pooch, 2011 wasn’t as bad all across the state but the same exact thing happened. They had 10 years to sort this crap out, but nope. 
 

They cut power to emergency communication places down here and many cell towers as well. Yet empty buildings downtown stayed lit. 

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

12 minutes ago, wdefromtx said:

2011 and 1989. Two years that come to mind. Basically the whole state. There is plenty of money to make the grid what it needs to be. There is no excuse for this, ERCOT needs to have heads roll. 
 

This isn’t the first time they screwed the pooch, 2011 wasn’t as bad all across the state but the same exact thing happened. They had 10 years to sort this crap out, but nope. 
 

They cut power to emergency communication places down here and many cell towers as well. Yet empty buildings downtown stayed lit. 

ERCOT just said that they took measures after 2011, but measures were for that level of storm, not this.  It's in the thread here.

 

[wdefromtx 3,159]

3 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

ERCOT just said that they took measures after 2011, but measures were for that level of storm, not this.  It's in the thread here.

 

They need to up their game to this level of storm then. Or they need to find a new line of employment. 

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

 

[wdefromtx 3,159]

Just read where about half of the turbine capacity went offline. Which this time of year turbines provide about 25% of the total power. 13% went offline. 

If the state relied more on turbines than we do it could have been worse. A 50% out of service rate is pretty bad. 
 

They need to upgrade the support equipment at the NG/Coal plants to keep them online in frigid temps. 

[wdefromtx 3,159]

Power is starting to go out nearby again. Just got power back a few hours ago after 40 hours without it. Ugh 

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

For the first and probably only time in my life, I wish I lived in El Paso.   They aren't on the Texas power grid and haven't lost significant power.  Had one minor interruption for 3,000 homes that was apparently handled swiftly.

[wdefromtx 3,159]

Just had a rolling blackout. Hopefully it stays on now moving forward. 

[aubiefifty 17,333]

rolling rolling rolling  keep dem power grids rollin................. rawhide................and yes i just sang that for some weird reason or another.

[aubiefifty 17,333]

this is a friend of a good friend on facebook. take it for what it is worth.

 

Brian Stansberry

Christians Against Trump

12tSpoehfntisormed  ·

Hour 42 of no power or heat in Austin Texas.

Last night outside temps were 9 degrees.

It's the proverbial three dog night. But I only have one dog, and he's a blanket hog.

If I stand on the right hilltop in my neighborhood I can almost see Gov Abbotts taxpayer- funded mansion.

Bet he's got power. And heat. And food. And reliable water.

All of which are now in short supply for millions in Texas.

There's virtually no internet or data access, and even basic phone service has broken down for many.

This morning my husband and I trudged through four inches of ice cold water to find which of our pipes had burst overnight.

Bet Ted Cruz didn't start his day that way.

Mid day today I saw a family huddled around a charcoal grill in their front yard, burning cardboard and old clothes to get a glimmer of warmth.

My neighbor slept in her car overnight because she was afraid her tiny dog might sneak off to another room and freeze to death.

My family and I are lucky. We likely will just be very miserable another day or two, but we won't die because of this.

Some other Texans won't be so lucky.

And already Texas Republicans - never ones to let a human tragedy go unexploited - are saying this is because of green energy and wind power. Simply not true. It's because Texas deregulated and didn't require any power sources to adequately winterize or to plan for events like this.

They willfully screwed the pandemic response into the ground so even when neighbors manage to scrape together some type of heat or other resources we can't share without exposing others and their families to danger.

The hubris and lack of giving a damn about actual people are breathtakingly abhorrent.

https://www.google.com/.../texas-wind-turbines-frozen/amp/

[McLoofus 35,182]

12 hours ago, Brad_ATX said:

For the first and probably only time in my life, I wish I lived in El Paso.

Just wanted to give a shout out to this sentence. 

[wdefromtx 3,159]

37 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

this is a friend of a good friend on facebook. take it for what it is worth.

 

Brian Stansberry

Christians Against Trump

12tSpoehfntisormed  ·

Hour 42 of no power or heat in Austin Texas.

Last night outside temps were 9 degrees.

It's the proverbial three dog night. But I only have one dog, and he's a blanket hog.

If I stand on the right hilltop in my neighborhood I can almost see Gov Abbotts taxpayer- funded mansion.

Bet he's got power. And heat. And food. And reliable water.

All of which are now in short supply for millions in Texas.

There's virtually no internet or data access, and even basic phone service has broken down for many.

This morning my husband and I trudged through four inches of ice cold water to find which of our pipes had burst overnight.

Bet Ted Cruz didn't start his day that way.

Mid day today I saw a family huddled around a charcoal grill in their front yard, burning cardboard and old clothes to get a glimmer of warmth.

My neighbor slept in her car overnight because she was afraid her tiny dog might sneak off to another room and freeze to death.

My family and I are lucky. We likely will just be very miserable another day or two, but we won't die because of this.

Some other Texans won't be so lucky.

And already Texas Republicans - never ones to let a human tragedy go unexploited - are saying this is because of green energy and wind power. Simply not true. It's because Texas deregulated and didn't require any power sources to adequately winterize or to plan for events like this.

They willfully screwed the pandemic response into the ground so even when neighbors manage to scrape together some type of heat or other resources we can't share without exposing others and their families to danger.

The hubris and lack of giving a damn about actual people are breathtakingly abhorrent.

https://www.google.com/.../texas-wind-turbines-frozen/amp/

The wind turbines had a 50%+ fail rate. 
 

Thankfully they were accounting for only 25% of supply when it hit. It would have been worse. 
 

So much for our delivery charges going to maintenance at power plants. ERCOT needs to pay for all the busted pipes. 

[wdefromtx 3,159]

The issue isn’t the rolling blackouts, it was the 40 hour blackouts. 

[homersapien 11,622]

55 minutes ago, wdefromtx said:

The wind turbines had a 50%+ fail rate. 
 

 

You have a source for that?

I heard that the main problems with loss of generating capacity was with the technologies that convert water to steam (gas, coal and nuclear).

 

[wdefromtx 3,159]

12 minutes ago, homersapien said:

You have a source for that?

 

Yeah ERCOT said during a conference call with the local ABC affiliate