JF3 posts a passing workout this morning

[Auhud08 596]

IMO it seems like Gus has taken a fall. When he was hired he was "an offensive genius". Now we're sayin he's only effective when he has a guy who can run a sub 4.4. What happened? Thats the reason  i want SW to start. I think we begin to back ourselves into a corner if we can only find success with a super-fast QB. Our recruiting will drop and i think we'll continue on this roller coaster. I hope gus can figure out how to utilize the players he has to be successful, and not just rely on one guys speed. FTR i have nothing against JJ or JFIII i just want to see the offensive mastermind return

[BlueFrogg 11]

5 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

I don't think anyone is saying this video settles the matter and JF3 is the starter.

It's a wrap, over, finito. We all know it's going to be JFIII.

Gus was right we had a lot of close games last year, but we looked terrible and desperate trying to drag ourselves into making the game close.

With JFIII improving his throwing ability and how mobile he is, maybe we can at least look like we are some kind of polished unit with a resemblance to a football team in close games...

We know it's going to be JFIII, once Gus tells this to all of us during fall camp we should be excited.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

2 minutes ago, Auhud08 said:

IMO it seems like Gus has taken a fall. When he was hired he was "an offensive genius". Now we're sayin he's only effective when he has a guy who can run a sub 4.4. 

No one said that.  Cam Newton wasn't a 4.4 guy (he ran a 4.59 at the combine).  Nick ran a 4.54. All that's being said is we know his offense works well with a serious running threat at QB. 

2 minutes ago, Auhud08 said:

What happened? Thats the reason  i want SW to start. I think we begin to back ourselves into a corner if we can only find success with a super-fast QB. Our recruiting will drop and i think we'll continue on this roller coaster. I hope gus can figure out how to utilize the players he has to be successful, and not just rely on one guys speed. FTR i have nothing against JJ or JFIII i just want to see the offensive mastermind return

Nothing happened.  He just hasn't had a sharp shooter pocket QB at Auburn to show it can be done the other way.  He did it at Tulsa, but it hasn't turned out that way so far here.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

1 minute ago, BlueFrogg said:

It's a wrap, over, finito. We all know it's going to be JFIII.

Gus was right we had a lot of close games last year, but we looked terrible and desperate trying to drag ourselves into making the game close.

With JFIII improving his throwing ability and how mobile he is, maybe we can at least look like we are some kind of polished unit with a resemblance to a football team in close games...

We know it's going to be JFIII, once Gus tells this to all of us during fall camp we should be excited.

Ok, one guy says that.  

[McFU 205]

One thing I noticed in the highlight video was that JFIII is decisive.  If the throw isn't there he recognized it pretty quickly and has the speed to get some yards with his feet.  As much as I like SW I think he holds on to the ball too long and by the time he decides to take off it is too late.  

 

**Disclaimer** JFIII's quick decision making maybe a product of scripted play or only 1 read.

[Auhud08 596]

Sorry that reads like im hatin on Gus. Not my intent. Was really just asking what happened. You're right TT he hasnt had a sharp shooter pocket QB, but i saw some great games from Sean White last year. If we take an objective look at what Sean AND Gus had to work with it really wasnt a whole lot- young line, no experienced RB, no TE or FB, and we lost our #1 WR. Sean and Jeremy were gonna have limited success no matter what. The surrounding talent and experience wasnt there. So why isnt our offensive genius HC able to have success woth Sean this year? Why isnt he as confident with Sean as he is with his ability to coach up JFIII? Im not tryin to start a "fire gus" topic, im just wondering why he doesnt feel like SW can be the guy. AND I think its gonna impact recruiting down the road

[AU64 10,122]

3 minutes ago, McFU said:

One thing I noticed in the highlight video was that JFIII is decisive.  If the throw isn't there he recognized it pretty quickly and has the speed to get some yards with his feet.  As much as I like SW I think he holds on to the ball too long and by the time he decides to take off it is too late.  

 

**Disclaimer** JFIII's quick decision making maybe a product of scripted play or only 1 read.

That is not necessarily an asset....if I recall, the major criticism of Cam and Nick too,  were their tendency to tuck and run at the first sign of a rush or the fact that their #1 target was not open.  

 

If we are going to have an effective passing game, the QB has to be able to check his options....willing to go through the progressions....rather than looking for a chance to run.   JMO.

[johnnyAU 3,630]

5 minutes ago, Auhud08 said:

Sorry that reads like im hatin on Gus. Not my intent. Was really just asking what happened. You're right TT he hasnt had a sharp shooter pocket QB, but i saw some great games from Sean White last year. If we take an objective look at what Sean AND Gus had to work with it really wasnt a whole lot- young line, no experienced RB, no TE or FB, and we lost our #1 WR. Sean and Jeremy were gonna have limited success no matter what. The surrounding talent and experience wasnt there. So why isnt our offensive genius HC able to have success woth Sean this year? Why isnt he as confident with Sean as he is with his ability to coach up JFIII? Im not tryin to start a "fire gus" topic, im just wondering why he doesnt feel like SW can be the guy. AND I think its gonna impact recruiting down the road

I don't know that is the case. Maybe Gus knows JFIII needs the most assistance right now in getting the total offense down.

[McLoofus 35,182]

5 minutes ago, Auhud08 said:

So why isnt our offensive genius HC able to have success woth Sean this year? Why isnt he as confident with Sean as he is with his ability to coach up JFIII? Im not tryin to start a "fire gus" topic, im just wondering why he doesnt feel like SW can be the guy. AND I think its gonna impact recruiting down the road

This has been discussed quite a bit in numerous other threads. Instead of perpetuating it in a JFIII thread, I'll suggest that you look at just about any other QB thread or just really think about it. Ask yourself: If a guy is the best player at his position, then what are some reasons why he might not be the starter? I'm not being a smart***. Just making the suggestion because nobody has the exact answer, only informed guesses. 

[McFU 205]

1 minute ago, AU64 said:

That is not necessarily an asset....if I recall, the major criticism of Cam and Nick too,  were their tendency to tuck and run at the first sign of a rush or the fact that their #1 target was not open.  

 

If we are going to have an effective passing game, the QB has to be able to check his options....willing to go through the progressions....rather than looking for a chance to run.   JMO.

I agree. Just something I noticed from the video that we seemed to be lacking last year.

[DAG 33,980]

1 hour ago, AU64 said:

So, has it been concluded without a doubt that only a running quarterback can operate the auburn offense? If that is the case , I don't understand why we are recruiting some of the quarterbacks that are currently on our list . 

 

Concluded by you? No one in this thread has uttered this.

[Strychnine 1,802]

8 minutes ago, AU64 said:

That is not necessarily an asset....if I recall, the major criticism of Cam and Nick too,  were their tendency to tuck and run at the first sign of a rush or the fact that their #1 target was not open.  

 

If we are going to have an effective passing game, the QB has to be able to check his options....willing to go through the progressions....rather than looking for a chance to run.   JMO.

 

While the point is valid, I look at it as dual-threat QB's change the conventional wisdom.  When the primary target is covered, and a rush is coming, a dual-threat QB can start running AND look for options until he crosses the line of scrimmage.  Nick was good at finding options on the run.  If there are no options, continue running and get positive yardage and/or the first down.

[shabby 1,958]

Take 57.......   and action!    

[weagle06 75]

I believe Sean can be a very good QB for Auburn. I watched last year and felt like if he was going to run this offense the way it is he has to keep the ball on the read every 4th or 5th attempt though to make it successful. That was what the offense lacked when he was running it last year. He is very capable of keeping the ball 5 or 6 times a game and having a positive impact on our entire rushing offense but as long as he only keeps it once in a blue moon the zone read offense just doesn't click .

[lionheartkc 6,150]

1 hour ago, AU64 said:

So, has it been concluded without a doubt that only a running quarterback can operate the auburn offense? If that is the case , I don't understand why we are recruiting some of the quarterbacks that are currently on our list . 

No... however it may be of benefit considering the lack of experienced supporting players.  Next year, when our receivers have a year under their belts, we could very well be able to annihilate a team through the air.  This year, it could be possible too, but it's far more of an unknown.  It's all about putting the odds in your favor.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

45 minutes ago, Auhud08 said:

Sorry that reads like im hatin on Gus. Not my intent. Was really just asking what happened. You're right TT he hasnt had a sharp shooter pocket QB, but i saw some great games from Sean White last year. If we take an objective look at what Sean AND Gus had to work with it really wasnt a whole lot- young line, no experienced RB, no TE or FB, and we lost our #1 WR. Sean and Jeremy were gonna have limited success no matter what. The surrounding talent and experience wasnt there. So why isnt our offensive genius HC able to have success woth Sean this year? Why isnt he as confident with Sean as he is with his ability to coach up JFIII? Im not tryin to start a "fire gus" topic, im just wondering why he doesnt feel like SW can be the guy. AND I think its gonna impact recruiting down the road

I don't think it's a matter of being unable to have success with Sean.  I don't think Gus is thinking that way.  He's just looking at who creates more problems for a defense?  Who is harder to defend?  Who gives us the best chance of winning?  If it's Sean, so be it, but if it's JF3, so be that too.

The thing is, the game of football is evolving and more and more teams are looking for guys who have both dimensions and can hurt a defense either way.  So if you have two guys with roughly equal leadership skills, and both can run enough of the playbook to be effective, but one has an edge in passing while the other can pass well enough but has a huge edge in speed and running ability, it would be hard to overlook that.  Sure, if you're Tom Brady slicing up a defense in the pocket and never really being a running threat, that'll work.  But if that's what you have you better be awesome at it, not just serviceable.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

47 minutes ago, Auhud08 said:

Sorry that reads like im hatin on Gus. Not my intent. Was really just asking what happened. You're right TT he hasnt had a sharp shooter pocket QB, but i saw some great games from Sean White last year. If we take an objective look at what Sean AND Gus had to work with it really wasnt a whole lot- young line, no experienced RB, no TE or FB, and we lost our #1 WR. Sean and Jeremy were gonna have limited success no matter what. The surrounding talent and experience wasnt there. So why isnt our offensive genius HC able to have success woth Sean this year? Why isnt he as confident with Sean as he is with his ability to coach up JFIII? Im not tryin to start a "fire gus" topic, im just wondering why he doesnt feel like SW can be the guy. AND I think its gonna impact recruiting down the road

You actually answered your own question.  While their may be other non-field related reasons, "the surrounding experience" still isn't there.  We have talent at receiver, now, but the new stars have zero experience at the college level. 

[Butthead 525]

If (yes, IF) JF3 ends up as the starter, does that strengthen the argument that Gus and co. cannot develop h/s quarterbacks and make it harder to recruit same?

[Barnacle 9,064]

1 minute ago, Butthead said:

If (yes, IF) JF3 ends up as the starter, does that strengthen the argument that Gus and co. cannot develop h/s quarterbacks and make it harder to recruit same?

I believe it would weaken it should he have success 

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

18 hours ago, augolf1716 said:

He's putting in the effort to win the job. Got to give credit where it's due

Yep. 

[lionheartkc 6,150]

59 minutes ago, Butthead said:

If (yes, IF) JF3 ends up as the starter, does that strengthen the argument that Gus and co. cannot develop h/s quarterbacks and make it harder to recruit same?

No... it weakens that argument, since it's pretty common knowledge that Franklin was a huge project coming out of juco.  However, it does give people more ammo for the "Gus needs a dual threat" mantra which would make it harder for us to recruit pocket passers in the future, and may make it hard to maintain the level of receiver recruiting that we established last year.

Of course, in this day and age, anyone can take anything and spin it to make it either support their talking points or negate the opposite talking points, so you can bet Smart, Craig, Sumlin, etc would claim it shows that Gus can only work with juco QBs. 

[AU64 10,122]

2 hours ago, DAG said:

Concluded by you? No one in this thread has uttered this.

 

 

It's been uttered a hundred times on a dozen different threads......including one active on the site now.....and implied repeatedly by the frequent assertions that a guy with modest QB experience in JUCO is a better fit to start this year...... almost solely because he has a reputation as a running QB...or that the other 2 candidates don't run as well as if that is the primary need.   

[IronMan70 3,277]

So here is how I look at it. JF3 is better than I thought he was which means SW isn't going to be able to get the job by default.  He has a fight on his hands. SW can still win the job but he will have to prove he is better. But, I see it as a win-win situation. The only downside would be if the best of the 2 still isn't good enough to make the offense run better and I doubt that is the case.   

[lionheartkc 6,150]

1 minute ago, IronMan70 said:

So here is how I look at it now. JF3 is better than I thought he was and that means SW isn't going to be able to get the job by default. But, if SW can still win the job, I think he will have to show he is better than I thought he was too. I see it as a win-win situation. The only downside would be if the best of the 2 still isn't good enough to make the offense run better. I doubt that is the case however.   

The only way I see a complete meltdown is if Sean gets the start and the receiver corps doesn't step up and do their part.

[AU64 10,122]

3 minutes ago, lionheartkc said:

The only way I see a complete meltdown is if Sean gets the start and the receiver corps doesn't step up and do their part.

 

 

True...but I find it hard to believe that our receiver situation will not be improved.  We had every possible problem last year....an attitude, stone hands, bad routes, etc.   Things just seem to have no way to go but up IMO and the WRs will help the QBs this year.