Let's talk about Sean

[DAG 33,997]

1 minute ago, AU64 said:

I understand that...and was roundly criticized on this site when I said that about 6 months ago.  The loud voices assured everyone that he was a QB and was recruited to be a QB....and that he would be our QB this year.  And wasn't he recruited by FSU as a QB too.  

In this case I agree with you but you have to admit, this is the third school that has tried to make him a QB...and maybe it's time to pull the plug on that effort and put him somewhere that will enable him to use his athleticism.

 

He was recruited to be a QB. You got criticized because you refused to acknowledge this fact. Of course, you also claimed NM was a highly recruited QB, who threw for 4000 yards at the JUCO level too. So there is that.

[DAG 33,997]

1 minute ago, aujeff11 said:

He isn't wrong. It's just something you shouldn't put out in public regarding your ex teammates.

Listen to Ramsey tell the media, as a rookie, that he doesn't respect 16 year pro Steve Smith Sr. ...lol

 

He didn't want any problems with steve smith SR post game haha. Say it with your chest. 

[CleCoTiger 1,957]

21 minutes ago, lca408 said:

And that's what I don't buy. Either he's really that dense and can't pick up what is a relatively simple offense compared to a lot of other systems (ie getting a lot if not most of the calls/instructions from the sidelines) or he wasn't told to learn it. Either way, it's a failure of coaching and it just seems extremely difficult to think that even this staff, which has made enormous blunders thus far this month, was really that stupid as to mistreat what could be their #1 DT guy that way. 

Idk if Franklin just isn't that good or what but whatever it is, that explanation just doesn't make a lot of sense. 

Well, he couldn't beat out the Wyatt kid at junior college. Not saying that documentary they were in was entirely fair, but I got the sense that JFIII just expected to be handed the starting role at EMCC when he went there from F$U, and I sort of wonder if that's not what he thought when he signed with AU. I don't know that to be so mind you. I'm just wondering if he really understands that he has to earn it, that it's not just gonna be given to him.

(On an athlete not having the needed self-discipline to study, I hardly see that as a failure of coaching. I see that as a failure to exercise self-discipline, i.e. a personal failure on the part of the player. And again, before anyone thinks I'm accusing JFIII of this, I am not. I'm just wondering. Nick Marshall came in during the summer and didn't even have the advantage of going through spring like JFIII and Cam did, so the "insufficient time to learn the playbook" meme rings hollow to me.)

[AU64 10,122]

1 minute ago, DAG said:

He was recruited to be a QB. You got criticized because you refused to acknowledge this fact. Of course, you also claimed NM was a highly recruited QB, who threw for 4000 yards at the JUCO level too. So there is that.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1484361-nick-marshall-commits-to-auburn-what-stud-juco-qb-brings-to-tigers

You probably missed this....

 

[CleCoTiger 1,957]

19 minutes ago, ClaytonAU said:

Jalen Ramsey (old FSU CB now plays for Jax) tweeted about him saying something along the lines of "you've transferred three times and still can't start? Maybe it's not the school bro" during the Clemson game. 

Oh, snap!

[DAG 33,997]

Just now, AU64 said:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1484361-nick-marshall-commits-to-auburn-what-stud-juco-qb-brings-to-tigers

You probably missed this....

 

 

Indiana, NC state, Kansas. WOOOW so highly recruited. How did he choose AU so easily over those powerhouses. 

[JGLEATON 1,244]

3 hours ago, aujeff11 said:

Also, ironically, if the WR's didnt bail out the quarterback every now and then, there would have not been a near perfect percentage to begin with. Which is the problem in saying "if not for the drops." 

Absolutely correct...

But what I think we are missing is it is BOTH... SW fault sometimes not getting it to em (sometimes they have really bailed him out and made great catches on poor passes)...

and Receivers fault sometimes dropping SURE catches right in the hands they HAVE GOT to make (will receivers drop a few.... sure that's gonna happen gotta get back up and make a play on the next one)

but you have got to drop LESS and make that type of drop a RARE exception rather than a 50% or higher chance of a drop...  because you've got to figure the good Defenses will ALSO make good plays and break a up a higher percentage of pass plays too.... 

so you can NOT waste too many chances on catchable balls with drops....

AND at the same time...

SW cannot waste too many wide open receiver opportunities with bad throws...
 

We are wasting precious possessions on lost yardage / playing behind the chains... and wasting precious downs BOTH on some poor play calls and sometimes execution of good play calls...

How many times during a game are you guaranteed you are going to GET into the red zone..  how many opportunities are you going to HAVE to make a play... Can not waste that many opportunities and expect to win.

BUT,

I think we (both the players AND coaches) are learning to TRUST each other to make the THROW and to make the CATCH.....

The running game is there and can be so much more dynamic if our passing game can just be a bit more consistent. I agree with CGM that we are very close. 

Gotta start hitting on ALL cylinders...  and I think they can.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

17 minutes ago, AU64 said:

So just wondering ..JF3 had half a year to learn the play book....and apparently is not ready yet if comments above are true.  Is the play book that much of an issue...would Stidham have the same trouble?   

Maybe we need a simpler play book...somehow freshmen seem ready to play at a number of schools.  They make freshman mistakes but I wonder if their coaches are only allowing them to run about 1/2 or less of their playbook.

From everything I've heard, our playbook is as simple as they come. 

[AU64 10,122]

2 minutes ago, DAG said:

Indiana, NC state, Kansas. WOOOW so highly recruited. How did he choose AU so easily over those powerhouses. 

Actually Kansas State....and guess you missed "elite DT quarterback" in HS....and meanwhile people were excited for us to get JF3...who had no serious offers as a QB....and yet people expected him to play right away.    Not that many schools recruit Juco QBs....as for those who did not go after Nick.....their loss...JMO

[DAG 33,997]

1 minute ago, AU64 said:

Actually Kansas State....and guess you missed "elite DT quarterback" in HS....and meanwhile people were excited for us to get JF3...who had no serious offers as a QB....and yet people expected him to play right away.    Not that many schools recruit Juco QBs....as for those who did not go after Nick.....their loss...JMO

 

He was so elite, he ended up playing DB in college initially? How did that happen? and now in the professionals, he is playing DB again. Say what?

Like NM, JF3 is an athlete playing QB. I do not like ATH playing QB, even though it worked out with NM. That is why Gus is going after a TRUE DT QB in Stidham.

[AU64 10,122]

6 minutes ago, lionheartkc said:

From everything I've heard, our playbook is as simple as they come. 

I have heard that but then every QB we have seems to enter games with limited play calling opportunities....JJ and SW last year and JF3 this year.   Just curious .....we complain about having a half dozen running plays.....there must be more to it than that? 

[CleCoTiger 1,957]

9 minutes ago, JGLEATON said:

SW cannot waste too many wide open receiver opportunities with bad throws...

I keep seeing this but what I have not seen from SW is a plethora of bad throws. No QB hits 'em all. But SW's completion percentage is dang good, and from what I recall (and I have been paying attention) he usually puts the ball right where it needs to be, often in stride and right on time.

[AU64 10,122]

11 minutes ago, DAG said:

He was so elite, he ended up playing DB in college initially? How did that happen? and now in the professionals, he is playing DB again. Say what?

Like NM, JF3 is an athlete playing QB. I do not like ATH playing QB, even though it worked out with NM. That is why Gus is going after a TRUE DT QB in Stidham.

Might have had something to do with the fact that Aaron Murray was their returning QB....not likely to take the job from that guy.

Meanwhile, hope we get Stidham but  ...and this is just my opinion....but sounds like he plans to follow his coach and I don't see either Briles coming to AU.

 

And Tebow is trying to play baseball.....you never know where a guy will end up.

[aujeff11 6,243]

3 minutes ago, CleCoTiger said:

I keep seeing this but what I have not seen from SW is a plethora of bad throws. No QB hits 'em all. But SW's completion percentage is dang good, and from what I recall (and I have been paying attention) he usually puts the ball right where it needs to be, often in stride and right on time.

Of course you saw that. You admitted to being a SW homer just the other day. We all know his completion percentage is dang good. It was dang good when he was pulled in the A&M game. He does hit the receivers. Sometimes not in stride though. I've seen some where they had to come back and scoop it. Also seen some where the ball left his hands a tad too late. Also seen some balls that were beautiful throws. 

[JGLEATON 1,244]

Just now, CleCoTiger said:

I keep seeing this but what I have not seen from SW is a plethora of bad throws. No QB hits 'em all. But SW's completion percentage is dang good, and from what I recall (and I have been paying attention) he usually puts the ball right where it needs to be, often in stride and right on time.

I'm not saying he's had many (plethora) but he has had a few he probably wishes he had a do over...

I'm thinking of that Lutz type throw back play that was wide open in the end zone in one game he missed...

and he's missed / got excited maybe too pumped up and over thrown a few more wide open guy's on a few plays....  you can see him immediately react to those cause he knows he should've hit that pass...

But yes that is gonna happen too,

no QB can make every throw (plus you'll have good games and bad games too) and again... no there hasn't been very many bad passes, and yes overall I think he's been very good with the ball, not a lot of INT (protected the ball) and has a good pass completion percentage...

on the flip side the receivers are not dropping THAT many either, overall pretty good I think (except we have got to go past the first down marker more on pass attempts)... I think the drops do sometimes show up at some crucial times however... 

[DAG 33,997]

1 minute ago, AU64 said:

Might have had something to do with the fact that Aaron Murray was their returning QB....not likely to take the job from that guy.

Meanwhile, hope we get Stidham but  ...and this is just my opinion....but sounds like he plans to follow his coach and I don't see either Briles coming to AU.

 

Might've been that all the schools that offered him, did so as an Athlete and not a true DT-QB. No? Coincidently he is back at playing DB in the NFL. Gus took a chance, rolled the dice and it worked. He did the same thing with JF3 and it has not. That is the risk you take when recruiting athletes.                                                                                                                                 

And I hope you are 100% wrong.

[DAG 33,997]

10 minutes ago, AU64 said:

Might have had something to do with the fact that Aaron Murray was their returning QB....not likely to take the job from that guy.

Meanwhile, hope we get Stidham but  ...and this is just my opinion....but sounds like he plans to follow his coach and I don't see either Briles coming to AU.

 

And Tebow is trying to play baseball.....you never know where a guy will end up.

 

Tim Tebow got drafted as a QB and failed. NM knew he would not get drafted as a QB or even get signed to a practice squad at that position and switch to DB. Apples to Oranges. 

Anyway, I am off that.

[McLoofus 35,182]

14 minutes ago, austudnt23 said:

There isn't any inaccurate observation. Up to this point SW has been an average qb. I am basing this on his on the field play, win loss record, and stats.  How can you make any other assunption

You said he lacks arm strength. I consider that inaccurate. You said that his level of experience isn't a factor in his performance. I consider that inaccurate, also. 

As for how I make a different assumption, it's by watching him play, paying attention to the things he does wrong, paying attention to whether or not he repeats mistakes, paying attention to what he does well, and paying attention to the same things from his teammates and coaches. I'm no coach or expert in any way, but after taking those things into consideration, I think Sean can be quite good.

[Tiger Scout 92]

50 minutes ago, DAG said:

Indiana, NC state, Kansas. WOOOW so highly recruited. How did he choose AU so easily over those powerhouses. 

most teams had a qb its alittle different coming out of juco then high school

[Tiger Scout 92]

if sean white was at some school outside the sec he would be amazing probably. being in the sec is like being in the pros

[Tiger Scout 92]

so far malzahn the qb guru hasnt been able to recruit and develop a high school qb at auburn. its been one dud after another. maybe he needs new glasses

[CleCoTiger 1,957]

1 hour ago, AU64 said:

I understand that...and was roundly criticized on this site when I said that about 6 months ago.  The loud voices assured everyone that he was a QB and was recruited to be a QB....and that he would be our QB this year.  

Yup. '23 was pretty adamant that JFIII was the guy right slap up to the moment that SW was announced as the starter. And ever since, '23 has still been beating the "JFIII is really the guy the coaches want!" drum, but as we saw against LSWho in maybe the biggest must win game of CGM's career thus far at AU, it was SW who basically played the entire game. More than that, even at the end of the Clemson game when it came down to which QB was going to be on the field with the game still winnable, it was SW they sent out there, and he moved the ball right down to where we had two shots into the end zone on the last two plays.

[CleCoTiger 1,957]

47 minutes ago, JGLEATON said:

I'm not saying he's had many (plethora) but he has had a few he probably wishes he had a do over...

I'm thinking of that Lutz type throw back play that was wide open in the end zone in one game he missed...
 

Oh, I'm not disagreeing with that and really my comment, while in response to you, was largely about the folks here that for some reason or another think that SW is an inaccurate passer.  Everyone from the coaches to SW in post-game interviews have talked about a few he'd like to have back.  I think the next QB that never wants one or two back from a game will be the first I've ever heard of.

 

War Eagle!

[CleCoTiger 1,957]

15 minutes ago, Tiger Scout said:

so far malzahn the qb guru hasnt been able to recruit and develop a high school qb at auburn. its been one dud after another. maybe he needs new glasses

He's developing one now. His name is Sean White. He's a red shirt sophomore. Throws a dang pretty ball. Accurate as heck. Very high completion rate. You oughta look him up on the roster.

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

6 hours ago, bigbird said:

 You really think the defense last year didn't protect JJ but they are protecting Sean this year. Thats funny. What is even funnier is you think that was the problem. Good Lord. 

Come on Bird, you KNOW this defense is HANDS DOWN WITHOUT QUESTION a better defense than last year.. 

6 hours ago, willieguns said:

Lets be honest since everyone is avoiding the elephant in the room.  Sean white was an accident he wasn't even supposed to be here at Auburn.  We didn't get several DT QB's like Deondre Francis, etc.  You seem to be the underdog champ rooting for the great white hype.  Malzahn recruits DT's every year because he only has one offense that works  and it involves the read option.  White hardly ever keeps it on the read option and defenses know that.  You seem to love Auburn as much as I do but lets stop trying to make SW something he is not.  He is hiding white behind an improved defense that we didn't have last season therefore he isn't asked to air it out like last season or in the past even cam didn't have this kind of defense.  Do you realize that if our defense wasn't as good as it is we would be 1-3?  Because you watch from your TV and I watch from the endzone Sec 39 row 9 I see where his helmet is the entire time, its hard to throw anywhere other than where your looking.   If you ever come to Auburn seriously DM I will save a ticket for you we can watch together and maybe your bias man crush for SW will end.   

While leaving out the "great white hype" part, he isnt all together wrong. We had missed on several DT QBs. CGMs offense (at Auburn) has done much better at AU when utilizing the read option. 

But I certainly wouldn't say White signing was an accident. He HAD just won the Elite 11 when he committed. He preformed better than those DT QBs we missed at the Elite 11...  I also wouldn't agree watching in person gives you a better vantage point in what's going on. There is a reason coaches are in the press box (higher than most) and there is a reason they watch film to correct mistakes. If everything could be seen best from field level, or just above, that's where film room stuff would be filmed as well...but its not...

6 hours ago, willieguns said:

Cool.  We have an offense genius and you belive the best we can do from an offensive perspective is 6 FG's?  you put zero blame SW ability or lack thereof just like most bias fans you blame play calling.  has it ever dawned on you  that the coaches don't fell comfortable calling certain things?  have you ever considered that?  The bowl game last year tells you something about SW.

The bowl game against Memphis told me White was hurt and probably shouldn't of played...

6 hours ago, bigbird said:

Oh okay, because you get to watch the games there you in a better position to critique? I'd argue I have a much better view of what is going on than you. That and since this is literally what I do, I'm gonna go ahead and say my understanding is a bit better too.

Also what is telling is you say White can't be an effective  QB because he's not a dual-treat QB. If that's the case, then why, did you prop up JJ all of last year as well as continuing that thought this year? You do realize that he's not a DTQB, right? Interesting that you call Sean the great white hype. I'm not saying...I'm just saying.

I agree

6 hours ago, bigbird said:

I'm gonna try and explain something that I though was pretty understood and was one of JJ's biggest problems last year. When you stare down a receiver, you tell the defense where you are going to throw it. That's why good safeties read the QBs eyes. So one way to counter this is for the QB to "look off" his target. Another is to keep your eyes down field till the route breaks. The first way moves the safety opening up the zone where he wants to throw to. The second holds the safety,in essence, opening another part of the field. So you are right, SW does hold his eyes down field. That's a pretty good skill most younger QBs don't possess. 

I approve this message as well

5 hours ago, willieguns said:

Our Playbook isn't made to fit SW strengths

So your saying the TV from Texas gives you the same view as a person at the game?   You must have fell out the stupid tree and hit every branch on your way down.  I attend the games and also record them to watch it once I get home.  Jeremy Johnson was classified as a dual threat.  You may critique players and things of that sort in Texas but you only see what the camera allows you to see from an Auburn football perspective most of the time your getting an aerial view.  Maybe the high school games you attend in Texas your critiquing but there is zero way your seeing what people in the stadium see. I can watch the QB helmet every snap which I do on passing downs.    

I agree with the 1st part. As for the 2nd, ive already written about.

5 hours ago, selias said:

That's a dangerous throw without stopping to square his shoulders and set his feet. The end zone is only 10 yards deep and if the pass is a floater you're looking at potential INT. Eat the sack and take the points

Personally I thought he should of thrown it out of bounds...not to take the sack.

But I agree. Never make that across the body throws like that.