Gus’ Ceiling

[DAG 34,018]

Just now, Eagle-1 said:

All true if we are going to continue to run some form of Gus ball. What makes me nuts is he can't seem to decide what type of quarterback to recruit. We run the entire gambit. One year it's a pocket passer, the next we sign some guy from last chance U because he can run, but couldn't throw the ball into a barn with out a door.

I think he needs to go the Gary Paterson route and just recruit his type of player and make it work. I do believe we are seeing this in his last recruits. I think all four guys we have behind JS are made for the QB read, but they have to produce when they are put in that position.

[Zeek 16,660]

4 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

Well Rocky III may be more apropos.  Get your butt kicked early in the film, rehab your entire image, train hard, only to come back and win the whole thing.

Say what you will, Chizik at least made halftime adjustments.

[ChltteTiger 649]

22 minutes ago, Zeek said:

Define personell?

Seems like most agree 8-9 with a lucky 10. Isn’t that we mocked Richt for over the years?

So if we know he’s not going to reach the heights we hope for, what then?

Another insanely costly buyout? 

Isn't that what we do at Auburn?

[Swamp Eagle 5,144]

38 minutes ago, Zeek said:

Honest question and keep this civil, please. I’m not looking for a bash fest or more Auburn fans at each other’s throats.

Looking forward to the future what do you guys believe is Gus’ ceiling as a coach?

Personally, there is no way I can honestly say that I think he’ll ever win a National Championship much less with an undefeated season. He just doesn’t ever have a team that looks extremely  prepared and especially in postseason games.

For me I honestly don’t think, with the current SEC landscape, that he’ll ever win another SEC title so his ceiling for me is winning the division with at least two losses.

2013

[ChltteTiger 649]

As long as Saban and the REC keep it going at UAT every other team in the west is not likely to make the SECCG, last year notwithstanding.

[doug3020 842]

2 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

More like one.  The SECC was a one score game heading to the 4th.  It was still very winnable.

I honestly get the argument we were 1 qtr away, but watching the game it didn’t feel that way to me (I know, subjectiveness...). We had a hurt TB and you could just feel the game getting away after the JS fumble in the 1st qtr I believe. The problem I have is we never adjusted to having a hurt TB. Honestly, I have difficulty thinking of a time where he does adjust. He basically addressed this in his speech to the Tx HS coaches association this past summer. The same one where he said (paraphrasing) it’s easier to get a job being the HC at Auburn University than it is getting a HS HC gig in Tx  

We’re stuck w Gus in the end. He’s not going anywhere anytime soon. If Al Davis were still living there would be hope for me, but....

[Auhud08 596]

6 minutes ago, Zeek said:

Not being combative just making sure I’m addressing everything you said. Lists help me with that.

1. Nothing specifically in this game, it’s cumulative issues that all reflect on the person at the top.

2. He also lost a game to Georgia we had no business losing. Lost to UCF that barely sniffs 3* athletes and the 10 wins amounted to nothing of substance. No hardware to show for it.

3. Quarterback situations are almost completely on him. Our inability to develop a high school quarterback is painful.

4. I guess this gets down to my biggest issue with Gus. After years of inept defenses we finally have a stud D again and now we can’t remember how to offense. Gus’ greatest strength is supposed to be an offensive mastermind.

Recruiting and roster management has very much improved, agreed. But while it’s good it’s not excellent.

I will say this. There aren’t many coaches I believe could meet the expectations that I believe we have. Despite struggles he’s having at Nebraska, I think he’s the best “up and comer” the only “proven” coaches that would come close to our goals is really only Dabo. Urban is overrated, Smart is doing well but still has a small sample size and he couldn’t get away with his Bama recruiting here.

Thanls for a civil response. 

1. Idk what to say to that

2. If you mean the SEC Championship game then yes definately mismanaged the personnel for the season. However, we all see that kam martin still isnt there in terms pf being start worthy so who should he have gone to? UCF- team didnt care i can point to bama-utah as a NS example that it happens to everyone. 

3. I disagree in that he thought and We all thought that from 2015-2016 we were very ready at the QB position with JJ. Go back to the arky game, back to the cupcake games. He looked ready. Yes he couldve recruited someone else, yes he was attached to JJ, but he also saw so many signs os success on a daily basis that he had to thinl itll turn around. 

4. I actually think we’re getting back towards Gus old offensive style which is good. We dont have the Oline we need right now (yep he shpuldve recruited better/ hand was a bad hire) but i think we’ll turn that corner. Saw OL get some push today that i hadnt seen yet. 

Name another coach who jas had there team in the national discussion almost every year that also plays a college football playoff team every year? There isnt one. No other team has had the level of success weve had Despite having to play bama, georgia, LSU, and Clemson. Im not happy with 8-4 thats not the standard we should have, but in the grand scheme- Gus is doing a good job. Hes npt perfect and hes made some really dumb moves along the way, but i also see him developing. (Thats the most frustrating part- that auburn has had to develop a coach) anyways...

[WarEagle1983 2,185]

47 minutes ago, jared52 said:

Sorry, you aren’t getting rational asking this tonight. Asking it preseason, yeah, but tonight no.

That said, I think Gus will probably have some opportunities talent-wise, but as long as uat is running roughshod through the CFB world, he’s 8-9 wins consistently, with the 10 win once every 4 years.

Agree. Thought this for the longest. Just who he is. Just have to accept it at this point. And for some to say it's due to Bama's run...i highly disagree b/c he's shown he has what it takes to beat Bama more than any other team in the country. It's his history of how we lose games that's an issue for me. A lot of this stuff is football 101 and issues we shouldn't be seeing in our HC at this point in his career. But like it or not...this what we have. Even though i'm no Gus fan...i think he has all the tools and talent to be a top 5 head coach. But for some reason, he's veered off far from the coach AU fans fell in love with. I'm not sure where it went all the wrong. 

[ToomersStreet 795]

Personally I am optimistic.  We all  new this season would be determined by the o-line play.  Right now our o-line is about a Kentucky/Ole  Miss level. Rest of the team is NC caliber.  Yes ultimately this is Gus's fault.  These linemen were recruited  by Grimes and Hand.  They are good,  but I have not seen one that looks great.  There may not  be a line coach out there that could  be doing a better job than Grimes right now  developing these guys.  The question for the future is does Gus part with Grimes and find someone that can recruit them as well as coach them?

Compared to previous  seasons I  like  this new Gus. However, Gus spent five  years digging himself a hoe  he is now trying to climb out of.   He hired his friend Hand instead of the most qualified person he could find.  Spent his first three years chasing away solid QB recruits with his private coach ban. etc.  I think he is learning and evolving but he has a lot of ground to make up.

[Auhud08 596]

2 minutes ago, WarEagle1983 said:

Agree. Thought this for the longest. Just who he is. Just have to accept it at this point. And for some to say it's due to Bama's run...i highly disagree b/c he's shown he has what it takes to beat Bama more than any other team in the country. It's his history of how we lose games that's an issue for me. A lot of this stuff is football 101 and issues we shouldn't be seeing in our HC at this point in his career. But like it or not...this what we have. Even though i'm no Gus fan...i think he has all the tools and talent to be a top 5 head coach. But for some reason, he's veered off far from the coach AU fans fell in love with. I'm not sure where it went all the wrong. 

Your post made me think of phil mickelson. Has made some really dumb errors in some of his biggest moments

[AUJedi 243]

6 minutes ago, Auhud08 said:

 

Name another coach who jas had there team in the national discussion almost every year that also plays a college football playoff team every year? There isnt one. No other team has had the level of success weve had Despite having to play bama, georgia, LSU, and Clemson. Im not happy with 8-4 thats not the standard we should have, but in the grand scheme- Gus is doing a good job. Hes npt perfect and hes made some really dumb moves along the way, but i also see him developing. (Thats the most frustrating part- that auburn has had to develop a coach) anyways...

You’re somewhat right. AU and Gus success would probably MORE than satisfy most programs in the country.  AU is in a sucky situation (which just seems fitting for AU). Our top rival is the most elite program in college football now and our next rival looks like they’re headed in that direction too. Just to be competitive with our rivals requires us to strive for this standard too all without getting any love from the media or the SEC office, which was apparent today. Is there any other program in as sucky a situation as AU? 

And what top coach would be willing to take on a challenge like the AU job? But I’m no Gus fan. It is what it is and he gets fully compensated for any heat or pressure he takes 

[Tigger1985 814]

The problem is we are in the West. Unfortunately Bama is so very good right now. When they should/çould have had a QB bust like we did, Jalen was good enough to win as the other teams couldn't score. Then comes Tua but we have caught up talent wise almost. The offensive line has to gell every year and is not consistent. We need to upgrade coaches there. LSU has always been lacking a QB for years but is a talented team. They are second behind Bama in NFL players. Defensive backs are playing better than past years but are young. We are not in the replacement mode like Bama except on the Defense line. It remains to be seen as to Georgia because the East is so weak. We were Not dominated but were fairly evenly matched. Can we be better, yes. 

[Eagle-1 3,821]

3 minutes ago, ToomersStreet said:

Personally I am optimistic.  We all  new this season would be determined by the o-line play.  Right now our o-line is about a Kentucky/Ole  Miss level. Rest of the team is NC caliber.  Yes ultimately this is Gus's fault.  These linemen were recruited  by Grimes and Hand.  They are good,  but I have not seen one that looks great.  There may not  be a line coach out there that could  be doing a better job than Grimes right now  developing these guys.  The question for the future is does Gus part with Grimes and find someone that can recruit them as well as coach them?

Compared to previous  seasons I  like  this new Gus. However, Gus spent five  years digging himself a hoe  he is now trying to climb out of.   He hired his friend Hand instead of the most qualified person he could find.  Spent his first three years chasing away solid QB recruits with his private coach ban. etc.  I think he is learning and evolving but he has a lot of ground to make up.

When he goes out of the box, and hires a true offensive mind, instead of a yes man I might return some optimism. College football has evolved to creating one on one matchups with superior athletes at the WR position. We seem to be able to recruit some very promising players that seem to fit that mold. However, they just disappear from the game plan for no apparent reason. Gus's excuse in his press conference tonight was " we have got to run the football better." No Gus, you have got to learn to develop an offense to get playmakers open down the field, and get the football in the hands of playmakers. You do that, and I guarantee the run game will open up. We have almost no slants, crossing routes, and elements of an intermediate passing game. I watch game after game of linebackers aggressively attacking the line of scrimmage, and no passes over the middle behind them. It makes me nuts!

[ToomersStreet 795]

3 minutes ago, Eagle-1 said:

When he goes out of the box, and hires a true offensive mind, instead of a yes man I might return some optimism. College football has evolved to creating one on one matchups with superior athletes at the WR position. We seem to be able to recruit some very promising players that seem to fit that mold. However, they just disappear from the game plan for no apparent reason. Gus's excuse in his press conference tonight was " we have got to run the football better." No Gus, you have got to learn to develop an offense to get playmakers open down the field, and get the football in the hands of playmakers. You do that, and I guarantee the run game will open up. We have almost no slants, crossing routes, and elements of an intermediate passing game. I watch game after game of linebackers aggressively attacking the line of scrimmage, and no passes over the middle behind them. It makes me nuts!

Sooner or later Lindsey will leave.  Gus will have to hire someone else.  However, I stand bythe fact  that we lost because our o-line isnt up to snuff

[Eagle-1 3,821]

1 minute ago, ToomersStreet said:

Sooner or later Lindsey will leave.  Gus will have to hire someone else.  However, I stand bythe fact  that we lost because our o-line isnt up to snuff

That's very true as well. Had a discussion on here just a couple of days ago with someone on that very subject.  I said our O line evaluation, and recruiting has been very suspect.  can't remember who it was now, but he proceeded to throw out a bunch of star ratings for some players we have recruited in the last few years.  either they were Mis evaluated, or we're doing a poor job of coaching them.  the one 5-star offensive lineman we have recruited in the last 3 years has yet to see the field in a starting role.

[Auhud08 596]

8 minutes ago, AUJedi said:

You’re somewhat right. AU and Gus success would probably MORE than satisfy most programs in the country.  AU is in a sucky situation (which just seems fitting for AU). Our top rival is the most elite program in college football now and our next rival looks like they’re headed in that direction too. Just to be competitive with our rivals requires us to strive for this standard too all without getting any love from the media or the SEC office, which was apparent today. Is there any other program in as sucky a situation as AU? 

And what top coach would be willing to take on a challenge like the AU job? But I’m no Gus fan. It is what it is and he gets fully compensated for any heat or pressure he takes 

Nah i hear ya. I hate it to and i dont think we should accept it. I think we shpuld challenge them. But i also think were moving in the right direction. Go look at dabo. How many years did it take him to turn it around at clemson. I think *think* were moving the right way

[Mid Atlantic Tiger 150]

13 minutes ago, Eagle-1 said:

When he goes out of the box, and hires a true offensive mind, instead of a yes man I might return some optimism. College football has evolved to creating one on one matchups with superior athletes at the WR position. We seem to be able to recruit some very promising players that seem to fit that mold. However, they just disappear from the game plan for no apparent reason. Gus's excuse in his press conference tonight was " we have got to run the football better." No Gus, you have got to learn to develop an offense to get playmakers open down the field, and get the football in the hands of playmakers. You do that, and I guarantee the run game will open up. We have almost no slants, crossing routes, and elements of an intermediate passing game. I watch game after game of linebackers aggressively attacking the line of scrimmage, and no passes over the middle behind them. It makes me nuts!

You're not the only one.  That is just insane ignorance and stupidity on his part.  And, might I add, arrogance.

[Eagle-1 3,821]

1 minute ago, Mid Atlantic Tiger said:

You're not the only one.  That is just insane ignorance and stupidity on his part.  And, might I add, arrogance.

Careful, you're approaching Debbie downer status. LOL

[Mid Atlantic Tiger 150]

1 minute ago, Eagle-1 said:

Careful, you're approaching Debbie downer status. LOL

Yeah, sorry about that. I'd really rather not be a Debbie Downer, but the same scenario, two years running...that smells.

[Tigercj 242]

4 minutes ago, Auhud08 said:

Nah i hear ya. I hate it to and i dont think we should accept it. I think we shpuld challenge them. But i also think were moving in the right direction. Go look at dabo. How many years did it take him to turn it around at clemson. I think *think* were moving the right way

We have more talent at Auburn right now than we have had in a long time. But yet the results we are getting does nit pan out these facts. Gus for whatever reason cannot win a big game and his record against our rivals proves this point. So are we heading in the right direction I am not sure anymore. I just think Gus is at his ceiling and we can either accept it or demand a change. 

[Tiger Refuge 6,675]

Vaulted sheetrock? No? Sorry.

 

Too bad Jay Jacobs isn’t around to share some blame...

[Eagle-1 3,821]

1 minute ago, Mid Atlantic Tiger said:

Yeah, sorry about that. I'd really rather not be a Debbie Downer, but the same scenario, two years running...that smells.

LOL, I wish I had a dollar for every time I've been referred to by that title. Personally I don't care. I've been off the bus since the 5 QB Monty against Clemson. Beating Bama, and GA last year was not even enough for me to climb back on. Of course Gus, true to form, capped the bed the next two times out. Count me in the group that wasn't surprised.

[Zeek 16,660]

Gus should hand over coaching duties after getting the team a lead of 10+. Get the lead and let someone else run the show from there.

[jptiger 481]

I think he’s average at best. He has regressed and the raises and job security only seem to make it worse. We do have some talent but ah blah whatever goodnight 

[Eagle-1 3,821]

8 minutes ago, jptiger said:

I think he’s average at best. He has regressed and the raises and job security only seem to make it worse. We do have some talent but ah blah whatever goodnight 

I think average is actually quite a compliment. In 5 years Gus is 16-15 against our top competition in the SEC West. That includes a 4-1 record against Ole Miss. Take Miss out of the equation, and he is 12-14.

That's M. State, A&M, OM, AL LSU, and GA. I do realize GA is in the East, but included them because they are a permanent opponent.