Payton Thorne

[AuburnNTexas 7,179]

This conversation can go on and on. Both sides have legitimate points. I will paraprase what I think both sides have said.

1. We need to use our NIL money wisely and it appears Hugh doesn't think we have enough pieces at this point to win big if we bring in a stud QB.  Bringing in a stud QB will take a lot of our NIL money and that will hurt us long term in getting the pieces that we will need around a QB to win big. We have brought in enough pieces that Thoronton with a years experince and better WR's will do a lot better and we will have a better season then this past season. We had to spend an awful lot of NIL dollars to get the pieces we are bringing in to complement Thorne at WR and to bolster our already solid D.

2. A stud QB can make an offense go even if all the pieces aren't there with the right game plan he can elevate a team.  The stud QB with the improved pieces might be able to get us into the big dance.

I think both are legitimate viewpoints.

One we have been told we have done well with raising NIL. That said NIL is finite. With the money we have already spent in HS class especially with the flip players Riddick, Coleman, and Thompson plus some others we may see soon there may not be enough money to also entice a stud QB. That is conjecture but I am betting Freeze would know if that is the case and that might affect his choice to go with Thorne plus he has seen Thorne for year in games and practice and knows if some of the bad reads were on the WR's and not on Thorne. Again conjecture on my part.

Two of the best QB's this year were Daniel's at LSU and Williams at USC both produced big numbers but neither was even able to win their conference as they didn't have the right pieces around them especially on defense. Maybe that is playing into why Freeze is not looking for a Portal stud QB this year.

I look at Nix at Auburn where he didn't have a great O-line and while he had some good receivers none qualified as elite. He was a good QB at Auburn with issues, yet some of those issues went away at Oregon where he had a better O-line and better receivers and looked good enough to be in contention for the Heisman. I think Bo Nix is a pretty darn good QB much better than Thorne. I said a pretty darn good QB I did not say elite. I expect Bo to get drafted but not super high and at best he will have a pedestrian career. This not a knock on BO as anybody good enough to be drafted and make a pro team is a really good player but only a few are stars. I hope I am wrong on Bo and he turns out to be a great pro QB. 

Freeze had to choose one of the two options.  I kind of lean towards what Freeze seems to have selected but I could easily be wrong. The next couple of years will decide if he made good choices or if he blew it.

Edited December 19, 2023 by AuburnNTexas

[PigskinPat 2,579]

Meanwhile, in Oregon….

 

[cole256 17,084]

16 minutes ago, PigskinPat said:

Meanwhile, in Oregon….

 

Watch how their offense not miss a step.....

[TeamZero77 1,785]

13 minutes ago, PigskinPat said:

Meanwhile, in Oregon….

 

Pretty easy sell to QB's. "Look what we did for Bo Nix's career. Step in and have a shot to possibly do what Bo did and you'll have a great O-Line to play behind eith great skill position guys. Plus we're headed to the Big 10 as well. This is pretty much a turn-key operation waiting for you to step into."

That's a pretty easy sell in my opinion. 

[tbone4jc 2,241]

5 hours ago, cole256 said:

Even when thinking about the future you need the QB here now and that isn't PT, he won't be here. The QB stuff is more imperative than some think. 

It's crazy to me to say we don't need a star at QB we just need somebody that's ok...... We don't have the talent and we're not going to be in a position any time soon to feel that way. That's the way teams have more talent than everybody else can think. That's bammer a few years ago, or USC when they were on their run, or Clemson a few years back. We're not and likely won't be in that position anytime soon.

Never said we need an OK QB, I said we don’t need a 5 * superstar type. 
 We have a really good QB for the 24’ class and we a will probably get 2 for 25’. It’s asinine to me to spend 2 mil to rent a QB who couldn’t start for the team he was with and to think he will automatically start here. PT is capable when he has weapons that can catch when thrown to them. Kinda logical don’t you think?
 

[aujohnson 300]

IMO if you didn’t have a QB (IMO a really good one) as a key member of your current recruiting class I think you could be a little more adventurous on trying to bring someone in. I don’t have any indication on how tight this recruit bunch is and what they’ve been told but that has to be a consideration. We need to change the receiver room in a much bigger way than the QB room. We have got to bring in the play makers that make every inch of the field dangerous for our opponent. 
We (our coaches) aren’t selling NFL tickets at the moment we are selling relationships. Me as a fan I don’t know how integrated our recruiting class is with current players or other recruits but that is at the very least a component to all this that we don’t understand the details of. 
I would love a world beating QB but I know it wouldn’t mean anything if the current roster didn’t get upgraded. 
A stacked class of wide receivers and a really good QB coming in seems to be a better way to build the future rather than getting on the expressway to a first round playoff loss this next year with a hot QB and risk the foundation we are building. 
 

Feel free to rip. I have no real info and just thought I 🤮 my opinion. 

[SaltyTiger 7,870]

9 minutes ago, aujohnson said:

IMO if you didn’t have a QB (IMO a really good one) as a key member of your current recruiting class I think you could be a little more adventurous on trying to bring someone in. I don’t have any indication on how tight this recruit bunch is and what they’ve been told but that has to be a consideration. We need to change the receiver room in a much bigger way than the QB room. We have got to bring in the play makers that make every inch of the field dangerous for our opponent. 
We (our coaches) aren’t selling NFL tickets at the moment we are selling relationships. Me as a fan I don’t know how integrated our recruiting class is with current players or other recruits but that is at the very least a component to all this that we don’t understand the details of. 
I would love a world beating QB but I know it wouldn’t mean anything if the current roster didn’t get upgraded. 
A stacked class of wide receivers and a really good QB coming in seems to be a better way to build the future rather than getting on the expressway to a first round playoff loss this next year with a hot QB and risk the foundation we are building. 
 

Feel free to rip. I have no real info and just thought I 🤮 my opinion. 

Exactly. Great to see our coaching staff feels we are  not in desperate portal mode to buy a QB. From my understanding doing a great job in needs. 

Edited December 19, 2023 by SaltyTiger

[PigskinPat 2,579]

39 minutes ago, TeamZero77 said:

Pretty easy sell to QB's. "Look what we did for Bo Nix's career. Step in and have a shot to possibly do what Bo did and you'll have a great O-Line to play behind eith great skill position guys. Plus we're headed to the Big 10 as well. This is pretty much a turn-key operation waiting for you to step into."

That's a pretty easy sell in my opinion. 

But how do you get the #2 and #3 quarterbacks to both buy in?

[aujohnson 300]

Just now, PigskinPat said:

But how do you get the #2 and #3 quarterbacks to both buy in?

That’s a head scratcher to me. 

[cole256 17,084]

30 minutes ago, tbone4jc said:

Never said we need an OK QB, I said we don’t need a 5 * superstar type. 
 We have a really good QB for the 24’ class and we a will probably get 2 for 25’. It’s asinine to me to spend 2 mil to rent a QB who couldn’t start for the team he was with and to think he will automatically start here. PT is capable when he has weapons that can catch when thrown to them. Kinda logical don’t you think?
 

You completely lost me with the wasn't good enough to start for his team, like do you guys not realize the last 4 or heisman winners were transfers? The whole putting your fruit in one basket is why we have sucked at QB for so long. 

But there's no reason to keep repeating ourselves over and over I guess. But no I don't blame everybody else for PT struggling. Saying we don't need a super star is just wild to me. But thanks for the convo though I disagree I respect your opinion.

[cole256 17,084]

6 minutes ago, aujohnson said:

That’s a head scratcher to me. 

You find competitors and tell them the best man will win.... The same thing we should be doing. 

[cole256 17,084]

If we are not doing the QB and instead getting some crazy good d ends or d tackles I'd feel a little better, but I'm confused as to why we can't do both. 

I'm not going to lie though I'm going to laugh if the 5 star wr leave because we don't have a good QB. That would be hilarious to me.

But besides a great QB I'd say the second most important thing would be Uber athletic d ends. Or actually a crazy good linebacker that can rush. Like a 6’5” guy who can really move. 

[PigskinPat 2,579]

4 minutes ago, cole256 said:

You find competitors and tell them the best man will win.... The same thing we should be doing. 

Yep. Oregon has 3-4 quarterbacks returning next year and has the #2 and #3 portal quarterbacks transferring in. No guarantees, no favoritism. You compete and the best man starts.

[Quietmaninthecorner 1,945]

6 minutes ago, cole256 said:

If we are not doing the QB and instead getting some crazy good d ends or d tackles I'd feel a little better, but I'm confused as to why we can't do both. 

I'm not going to lie though I'm going to laugh if the 5 star wr leave because we don't have a good QB. That would be hilarious to me.

But besides a great QB I'd say the second most important thing would be Uber athletic d ends. Or actually a crazy good linebacker that can rush. Like a 6’5” guy who can really move. 

I wonder if it is an NIL issue ATM.  We had/have sooooo many needs across the team that there is just not enough to go around.   Top notch QB$ suck NIL away from the rest of the team (and other sports).   We can afford to go out and get a top notch QB,  but there may not be enough to go around to bring in top notch players at other positions, and we need/needed a lot!   We have been playing from behind the 8 ball with our talent gap.

[cole256 17,084]

8 minutes ago, Quietmaninthecorner said:

I wonder if it is an NIL issue ATM.  We had/have sooooo many needs across the team that there is just not enough to go around.   Top notch QB$ suck NIL away from the rest of the team (and other sports).   We can afford to go out and get a top notch QB,  but there may not be enough to go around to bring in top notch players at other positions, and we need/needed a lot!   We have been playing from behind the 8 ball with our talent gap.

I guess I need to look at our recruiting a bit and see what we got. I know it better be good though. I really want to get back to dominant defensive lines.

[Quietmaninthecorner 1,945]

3 minutes ago, cole256 said:

I guess I need to look at our recruiting a bit and see what we got. I know it better be good though. I really want to get back to dominant defensive lines.

I'm a defense guy myself.

Q:  If you have 4 spots  (3 DL  and QB) you need to fill with talent and $1 million,  what are you going to do?  Go for 3   5* DL and average QB ?  or just one 5* QB? (assuming you had a good chance at signing all of them)

glad I am not making those decisions. 

It would be interesting to see how much of the total football  NIL budget goes to each player, and compare that to other teams.  And, how each team allocates the NIL per position.  Some may invest heavily in QB  while other in the rest of the team.

It is all so new,  there is not a lot of data yet.

 

[TigerPAC 983]

Quick question….why is Gabriel leaving OK?

[Cardin Drake 1,857]

Cuz OU sucks. Everyone in Texas knows that.

[tbone4jc 2,241]

2 hours ago, Quietmaninthecorner said:

I wonder if it is an NIL issue ATM.  We had/have sooooo many needs across the team that there is just not enough to go around.   Top notch QB$ suck NIL away from the rest of the team (and other sports).   We can afford to go out and get a top notch QB,  but there may not be enough to go around to bring in top notch players at other positions, and we need/needed a lot!   We have been playing from behind the 8 ball with our talent gap.

We will have 4 scholarship QBs on the roster next season. Not sure of the star rankings but unless it is a sure fire home run I just think whatever monies we have would be better spent on more critical needs. JMHO

[GreenTiger 1,007]

10 hours ago, TeamZero77 said:

Pretty easy sell to QB's. "Look what we did for Bo Nix's career. Step in and have a shot to possibly do what Bo did and you'll have a great O-Line to play behind eith great skill position guys. Plus we're headed to the Big 10 as well. This is pretty much a turn-key operation waiting for you to step into."

That's a pretty easy sell in my opinion. 

Yup. And Nike money helps as well 

[Gowebb11 9,387]

9 hours ago, cole256 said:

I guess I need to look at our recruiting a bit and see what we got. I know it better be good though. I really want to get back to dominant defensive lines.

Agree completely. A great d line makes average LBs and DBs look much better. We need more impact players up front. 

[Mikey 16,757]

7 hours ago, TigerPAC said:

Quick question….why is Gabriel leaving OK?

It has to be money. Nothing else makes any sense. The guy leaving UCF for Oklahoma made sense. This second move makes no sense.

[LPTiger 5,173]

11 hours ago, PigskinPat said:

But how do you get the #2 and #3 quarterbacks to both buy in?

What is the answer to so many questions?   $$$$

[nthemix 92]

12 hours ago, Quietmaninthecorner said:

I'm a defense guy myself.

Q:  If you have 4 spots  (3 DL  and QB) you need to fill with talent and $1 million,  what are you going to do?  Go for 3   5* DL and average QB ?  or just one 5* QB? (assuming you had a good chance at signing all of them)

glad I am not making those decisions. 

It would be interesting to see how much of the total football  NIL budget goes to each player, and compare that to other teams.  And, how each team allocates the NIL per position.  Some may invest heavily in QB  while other in the rest of the team.

It is all so new,  there is not a lot of data yet.

 

IMO in the modern college game to be in contention (especially in the SEC) a team needs … at least three very good D lineman, at least four very good O lineman, a quality QB & probably the most important two exceptional CB’s … I’d look at my pay roll (NIL) & adjust accordingly … of course other positions are important BUT if you have these positions locked in I think you can be competitive at a high level 

[Quietmaninthecorner 1,945]

22 minutes ago, nthemix said:

IMO in the modern college game to be in contention (especially in the SEC) a team needs … at least three very good D lineman, at least four very good O lineman, a quality QB & probably the most important two exceptional CB’s … I’d look at my pay roll (NIL) & adjust accordingly … of course other positions are important BUT if you have these positions locked in I think you can be competitive at a high level 

 agree, 

but what do you do if you budget can not afford 8-9  4*+players ... AND,  afford to give everyone else  on the team a fair deal?  You can only do so much every year.   We have so many needs it is difficult to prioritize them.   

an extreme and simple example:  You have the budget ($1M) to get a 5* QB at ($1M)  or two 5*WR, ($500 grand each)?   So it may take 2 years to get all three.   Do you go for a QB in year one, even though you have crappy WRs,  or do you get 2 WRs and wait on the exceptional QB?

what if you have to pay NIL 100+ players in 4-5 years?  you cant just lowball DBs and RBs and you are competing with other schools for their services also.

Without a budget that will top other schools at every position (and sport) ,  you are kind of screwed.

It's a mess.

Edited December 19, 2023 by Quietmaninthecorner