All Things Sean White (Merged)

[1auburn1 1,120]

Can we win 9-10 games with SW as the starter, yes.     Can we go beyond that, highly doubtful.   He doesn't do enough to pressure elite defenses and allow us to open up the field. JS was brought in to be the starter, and he will be unless he gets a case of Jeremy Johnsonitis in which case the seat of Gus' pants will be aflame.

[80Tiger 899]

39 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

It's insane how much Auburn fans discount all of that.

Stidham will be named the starter and it will be fine, but some of the responses in this thread... well, they're completely predictable and expected, actually. Thanks for bringing some sanity. 

The one thing that was not listed in what SW has done, is that we were a very good football team. We have been an average team the last few years. Not saying it was SW fault for all that but it just proves that AU needs more than a game manager at QB. We need more than that. Is JS that person? I don't know, but if SW is the starter, expect more of the same from the past few years: we run up stats on cupcakes, we break even with middle of the pack teams, and we don't compete with upper echelon teams. We need and upgrade in talent at the QB position. We need a guy that can make all the throws.

[McLoofus 35,182]

5 minutes ago, 80Tiger said:

The one thing that was not listed in what SW has done, is that we were a very good football team. We have been an average team the last few years. Not saying it was SW fault for all that but it just proves that AU needs more than a game manager at QB. We need more than that. Is JS that person? I don't know, but if SW is the starter, expect more of the same from the past few years: we run up stats on cupcakes, we break even with middle of the pack teams, and we don't compete with upper echelon teams. We need and upgrade in talent at the QB position. We need a guy that can make all the throws.

Oh dear. If anyone has read my thoughts on this before, feel free to stop now. 

How many times has a healthy Sean White competed against an upper echelon team as the starting QB? (I add that second disclaimer because Gus, in all his infinite wisdom, didn't actually let Sean start against Clemson last year.)

No, we haven't been an average team the last few years. In 2015, when Sean got his first ever snap as a college QB in the 4th game of the season as the starter, we were a bad team. Duke Williams was WR1. Behind him were such legends as Tony Stevens and Marcus Davis. We had a center who had never played the position before, and who had the starting QB- and game plan- changed on him in week 4. We had nothing but freshmen at RB, HB and TE. Well, except Jovon Robinson, who magically couldn't find the field for most of the year. Sean was supposed to succeed on that team? As a redshirt freshman? And yet, he actually played really well until he got hurt. 

We were a much better team in 2016, thanks in large part to Sean White. We were a freaking top 10 team going into the UGA game! That's not "very good"? Despite Gus crapping the bed against Clemson? But Sean got hurt again and we never stood a chance against UGA or bama. And then Sean started off great against OU, but got hurt yet again. 

So yes, the dude is injury prone. He misses 30+ yard passes on par with most good QBs, especially when he's throwing to freshmen. No denying it. I just don't understand why people have to take it further than that. 

[lionheartkc 6,150]

19 minutes ago, 80Tiger said:

The one thing that was not listed in what SW has done, is that we were a very good football team. We have been an average team the last few years. Not saying it was SW fault for all that but it just proves that AU needs more than a game manager at QB. We need more than that. Is JS that person? I don't know, but if SW is the starter, expect more of the same from the past few years: we run up stats on cupcakes, we break even with middle of the pack teams, and we don't compete with upper echelon teams. We need and upgrade in talent at the QB position. We need a guy that can make all the throws.

Three letters... L S & U.  It's amazing to me how easily people buy into talking points around here.

[Gowebb11 9,321]

23 minutes ago, 80Tiger said:

The one thing that was not listed in what SW has done, is that we were a very good football team. We have been an average team the last few years. Not saying it was SW fault for all that but it just proves that AU needs more than a game manager at QB. We need more than that. Is JS that person? I don't know, but if SW is the starter, expect more of the same from the past few years: we run up stats on cupcakes, we break even with middle of the pack teams, and we don't compete with upper echelon teams. We need and upgrade in talent at the QB position. We need a guy that can make all the throws.

SW is really good when he's allowed to throw and manage games. I'm convinced we would've beat Clemson if we hadn't played musical chairs with the QBs. Unfortunately, we have decided to run the ball 65-70% the past couple of seasons and that's never good for a throwing QB. If CCL truly commits to throwing more, I believe all of our QBs will look improved next season. 

[80Tiger 899]

1 minute ago, McLoofus said:

Oh dear. If anyone has read my thoughts on this before, feel free to stop now. 

How many times has a healthy Sean White competed against an upper echelon team as the starting QB? (I add that second disclaimer because Gus, in all his infinite wisdom, didn't actually let Sean start against Clemson last year.)

No, we haven't been an average team the last few years. In 2015, when Sean got his first ever snap as a college QB in the 4th game of the season as the starter, we were a bad team. Duke Williams was WR1. Behind him were such legends as Tony Stevens and Marcus Davis. We had a center who had never played the position before, and who had the starting QB- and game plan- changed on him in week 4. We had nothing but freshmen at RB, HB and TE. Well, except Jovon Robinson, who magically couldn't find the field for most of the year. Sean was supposed to succeed on that team? As a redshirt freshman? And yet, he actually played really well until he got hurt. 

We were a much better team in 2016, thanks in large part to Sean White. We were a freaking top 10 team going into the UGA game! That's not "very good"? Despite Gus crapping the bed against Clemson? But Sean got hurt again and we never stood a chance against UGA or bama. And then Sean started off great against OU, but got hurt yet again. 

So yes, the dude is injury prone. He misses 30+ yard passes on par with most good QBs, especially when he's throwing to freshmen. No denying it. I just don't understand why people have to take it further than that. 

So in other words, its everyone's else fault. Got it. Wow we were a top ten team before we lost 3 straight. Think that means we were truly not a top ten team? It's just my opinion but I think we need an upgrade at the QB position. If JS is not it, we are in for same type season. I mean we threw for the fewest yards in the SEC last season; yes play calling, yes freshman receiver, but also yes to the QB play.

[gr82b4au 5,568]

32 minutes ago, Tiger said:

The reaction on here will probably be the similar to when Chris Todd was named starter over Kodi before 2009. 

Not really the same comparison at all. Going into that competition Kodi had never played for another power 5 team, against good competition, with incredible numbers. JS has already done this. 

[80Tiger 899]

10 minutes ago, lionheartkc said:

Three letters... L S & U.  It's amazing to me how easily people buy into talking points around here.

Our offense was very pedestrian during the LSU game. Total of around 380 yds. We won that game because of the defense and the fact that Les mismanaged that game.

[gravejd 3,270]

I don't understand why Sean being named the starter would be meet by anything other than support from AU fans. If he is named started than that means the coaches think he is the best option. It would probably mean he was the best option by a large margin as I don't see him getting the nod if it is close. Coaches have been trying their best to not play Sean for 2 years now. Would love to see him transfer and show the coaches how good he can be with the right offense and support

[lionheartkc 6,150]

Just now, 80Tiger said:

So in other words, its everyone's else fault. Got it. Wow we were a top ten team before we lost 3 straight. Think that means we were truly not a top ten team? It's just my opinion but I think we need an upgrade at the QB position. If JS is not it, we are in for same type season. I mean we threw for the fewest yards in the SEC last season; yes play calling, yes freshman receiver, but also yes to the QB play.

You're totally right 80... in those three games we needed a serious upgrade from an injured QB.  Any team would. The stable is full, sit back and enjoy it instead of trying to make a case that one of our two best horses is a mule.

[Tiger 8,826]

6 minutes ago, gr82b4au said:

Not really the same comparison at all. Going into that competition Kodi had never played for another power 5 team, against good competition, with incredible numbers. JS has already done this. 

That doesn't mean the reaction on here wouldn't be the same. Some people were pissed Todd was named starter. Some were ok with it. I assume this is how it would go if SW was named starter.

[Barnacle 9,064]

18 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Oh dear. If anyone has read my thoughts on this before, feel free to stop now. 

How many times has a healthy Sean White competed against an upper echelon team as the starting QB? (I add that second disclaimer because Gus, in all his infinite wisdom, didn't actually let Sean start against Clemson last year.)

No, we haven't been an average team the last few years. In 2015, when Sean got his first ever snap as a college QB in the 4th game of the season as the starter, we were a bad team. Duke Williams was WR1. Behind him were such legends as Tony Stevens and Marcus Davis. We had a center who had never played the position before, and who had the starting QB- and game plan- changed on him in week 4. We had nothing but freshmen at RB, HB and TE. Well, except Jovon Robinson, who magically couldn't find the field for most of the year. Sean was supposed to succeed on that team? As a redshirt freshman? And yet, he actually played really well until he got hurt. 

We were a much better team in 2016, thanks in large part to Sean White. We were a freaking top 10 team going into the UGA game! That's not "very good"? Despite Gus crapping the bed against Clemson? But Sean got hurt again and we never stood a chance against UGA or bama. And then Sean started off great against OU, but got hurt yet again. 

So yes, the dude is injury prone. He misses 30+ yard passes on par with most good QBs, especially when he's throwing to freshmen. No denying it. I just don't understand why people have to take it further than that. 

Preach

[lionheartkc 6,150]

Just now, 80Tiger said:

Our offense was very pedestrian during the LSU game. Total of around 380 yds. We won that game because of the defense and the fact that Les mismanaged that game.

Yea and 234 of those yards were in the air against a D that gave up less than 200 yards per game in the air all season. Chad Kelly only threw for 214 against them and the "Heisman hopeful" Hurts barely cracked 100. But yea... you're right, Sean sucks against good teams.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

2 minutes ago, Tiger said:

That doesn't mean the reaction on here wouldn't be the same. People were pissed Todd was named starter.

The funny thing here is that the two sides of the argument that most people are trying to start are "Stidham is going to start, but Sean is a good QB" and "Stidham is going to start and Sean sucks". I honestly wonder if this isn't one of those Cam vs. the media things, were people continue to bash him, year-after-year, because they don't want to admit that they were wrong in the first place.

[Barnacle 9,064]

I'm not going to lie though, I want Jarrett Stidham to win the job. I want him to win the job because I think he has the potential right now to be better than White. If White gets the nod, I'll be disappointed that Stidham didn't live up to my expectations, but at the same time I won't be disappointed that Sean White is our starter. 

Either way, we have depth at the position this year. Real depth, and that's a luxury in this league. Should take a lot of pressure off of everyone, honestly. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

1 minute ago, 80Tiger said:

So in other words, its everyone's else fault. Got it. Wow we were a top ten team before we lost 3 straight. Think that means we were truly not a top ten team? It's just my opinion but I think we need an upgrade at the QB position. If JS is not it, we are in for same type season. I mean we threw for the fewest yards in the SEC last season; yes play calling, yes freshman receiver, but also yes to the QB play.

Please take a moment to think about that. A couple things have changed on our offense since last year. You might start at our new offensive coordinator, and then proceed to roster changes, and then eventually work your way down to whether or not we're going to have every single RB injured at one point or another- to include all of them either out or playing injured against UGA, in addition to our QB being injured.

Will Stidham be an upgrade over White? Probably. Have we ever lost a football game with a healthy Sean White as the starter where I can't name a dozen other reasons we lost it? Nope. 

As for LSU last year, what Lion said, but also that was the first game where Gus handed the play calling duties over to Lashlee and that was also Dampeer's last game at center, for part of which he played hurt. 

[Strychnine 1,802]

12 minutes ago, lionheartkc said:

The funny thing here is that the two sides of the argument that most people are trying to start are "Stidham is going to start, but Sean is a good QB" and "Stidham is going to start and Sean sucks". I honestly wonder if this isn't one of those Cam vs. the media things, were people continue to bash him, year-after-year, because they don't want to admit that they were wrong in the first place.

 

If Sean White can beat out Stidham and Barrett for the starting job, then I feel fine about his play in an offense that supposedly intends to pass more.

[Barnacle 9,064]

Something else that hasn't been talked about in this thread is Lindsey. He's the biggest wild card in this equation to me. I never thought our quarterbacks were getting what they needed last year. Not from a continuity standpoint, neither from a scheme or play-calling standpoint. 

I'm more hopeful than anything that all of our quarterbacks get a 4 point bump on their EA NCAA rating because our new offensive coordinator is calling an offense that is better tailored to their strengths. White and Stidham will likely be 1/2, 2/1 on the depth chart. They are also most similar to each other in terms of their skill set. I'd like to see an offense built to their strengths, not one that that's built for them or JFIII to come into at any point in the game. 

[80Tiger 899]

6 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Please take a moment to think about that. A couple things have changed on our offense since last year. You might start at our new offensive coordinator, and then proceed to roster changes, and then eventually work your way down to whether or not we're going to have every single RB injured at one point or another- to include all of them either out or playing injured against UGA, in addition to our QB being injured.

Will Stidham be an upgrade over White? Probably. Have we ever lost a football game with a healthy Sean White as the starter where I can't name a dozen other reasons we lost it? Nope. 

As for LSU last year, what Lion said, but also that was the first game where Gus handed the play calling duties over to Lashlee and that was also Dampeer's last game at center, for part of which he played hurt. 

All those are points to be considered for the success of the team. My point is that we need better talent at QB that can perform. I believe that Barrett has better talent than SW but don't know if he can perform. I believe JS has better talent but don't know if he can perform either. I think better talent on the field no matter the position will lead to better results. That is what I hoping for.

[gr82b4au 5,568]

SW was very efficient in several games. Against top competition, he has 1 win, the only one that he was healthy for... every other time we played against a top team, he was not on the field because he was hurt (or he played hurt because he was basically all we had). SW was the best QB on the AU roster the last 2 years by default. The others behind him were not just average, they were terrible. He is a gutsy kid that is accurate with short throws. We have proven that we can win with him, but in most cases it is with him as a game manager on offense (short throws, running the ball a ton) and playing solid defense. He is gutsy and the team rallies around him. 

But SW has a few things going against him. 1) There is a new OC with new plays and he has opened competition. 2) SW is hurt, so he is not able to show what he can do this spring 3) JS will probably take all 1st string reps this spring, learn the new offense, and have some timing down with the players, and 4) JS has proven that he is talented and can sling it against good competition.

My only concern with JS is rust (not playing for year) and the fact that he also sustained a season ending injury 2 years ago. I hope he is not frail as well. But if he practices/plays like he did in the big 12, he will be named the starter and none of this will matter. That is what I expect to happen. 

[Rednilla 5,391]

47 minutes ago, 80Tiger said:

The one thing that was not listed in what SW has done, is that we were a very good football team. We have been an average team the last few years. Not saying it was SW fault for all that but it just proves that AU needs more than a game manager at QB. We need more than that. Is JS that person? I don't know, but if SW is the starter, expect more of the same from the past few years: we run up stats on cupcakes, we break even with middle of the pack teams, and we don't compete with upper echelon teams. We need and upgrade in talent at the QB position. We need a guy that can make all the throws.

No, we don't need a guy who can make all the throws. We need a guy who knows how to make things happen, sure, but we have plenty of talent to win with a solid and HEALTHY game manager. I wouldn't say Nick Marshall could make all the throws. I mean, there's a reason he's not playing QB in the NFL. But he made things happen.

There was mention of us being an 11 win team with Stidham, a 9 win team with White, and that may not be far off...but it's only because Sean has had injury problems and it's only with no backup. Of course, Stidham broke his ankle in his one and only season, so it isn't as if we don't need a backup for him, too, and if Sean were to start and get hurt this year he'd have two capable backups, unlike last season.

And that's the whole reason for so much optimism. It isn't just that Stidham signed, it's that we have two QBs who have proven themselves, at least to some extent, in a Power 5 conference, as well as a former four star who physically fits the mold of a quality QB. Depth. Something we simply didn't have at QB last year.

[Strychnine 1,802]

2 minutes ago, Barnacle said:

Something else that hasn't been talked about in this thread is Lindsey. He's the biggest wild card in this equation to me. I never thought our quarterbacks were getting what they needed last year. Not from a continuity standpoint, neither from a scheme or play-calling standpoint. 

I'm more hopeful than anything that all of our quarterbacks get a 4 point bump on their NCAA ranking because our new offensive coordinator is calling an offense that is better tailored to their strengths. White and Stidham will likely be 1/2, 2/1 on the depth chart. They are also most similar to each other in terms of their skill set. I'd like to see an offense built to their strengths, not one that that's built for them or JFIII to come into at any point in the game. 

 

As I have said in another thread, JFIII has no business being on the depth chart at the QB position.  He has no business being used as a substitution running QB either.  Personally, I would rather see an offense that is not built around anyone's skill set, but is built for balance.

[ToomersStreet 795]

14 hours ago, lutzcammed said:

I don't believe Queen will even be a player in this equation.

 

I'm not going to lie. With all the hype on Stidham and my hopes riding with his potential, if White is announced the starter I'm gonna say lots of bad words and either drop kick something or throw something.

I'm gona be a kid just because I can.  I'll get over it and try not to fuss, but I will not be happy about it.

If there is a drop kick you are required to put it on youtube!

[Barnacle 9,064]

Just now, Strychnine said:

 

As I have said in another thread, JFIII has no business being on the depth chart at the QB position.  He has no business being used as a substitution running QB either.  Personally, I would rather see an offense that is not built around anyone's skill set, but is built for balance.

Well, let's be honest, he's not going to be on the depth chart this season. Last season, it was a necessity.

My point is, that Gus was so committed to not committing to a quarterback last year, that our offense never got to take on the identity of our quarterback. Instead, our different quarterbacks were being put in situations where they needed to adjust to our offense. If that makes sense. 

[lionheartkc 6,150]

17 hours ago, steeleagle said:

.i wondered how would fans feel if White in the fall was named the starter?

I change my answer... if White is named starting QB, a bunch of people who have read too many ill-informed, negative things about Sean and not really looked at the big picture, will don Baylor green hats, make pro-Stidham signs and march up and down the Concourse chanting #notmyquarterback.