Rhett leaves AU / New OC discussion (Merged)

[lionheartkc 6,150]

2 minutes ago, AUDevil said:

JF3...what the heck were they thinking?  It's obvious we have little nothing that is reliable at the QB position and the staff goes out in December/January and gets Franklin?  There were other more qualified options that we didn't get.  Options that performed pretty well this past year.  Now, maybe Evans told us no, but that's still all on Gus.  He knew we had a problem in September of 2015.  It took until January of 17 to get it fixed.

I would love to know the real story about the Franklin recruitment. I'm sure it's fascinating.  

On the plus side, I believe Willis is proof that Gus now gets it as far as QB recruiting goes. We have our man in Stidham, AND we have a backup who's got potential to be great but isn't likely to transfer after 1 year because he's on the bench.

[keesler 5,924]

8 minutes ago, lionheartkc said:

Yea... and he shot himself in the back by not being willing to let Lashlee go without a place to land. I think he's finally realized that there isn't enough time in the day for him to be HC and OC, when he would spend 18 hours a day just being an OC. 

To me that's on the AU people, as they certainly don't have a better idea of who should or shouldn't be coaching on the staff.  I'm with the others who say, if they are going to be choosing his staff, then they need to nut up, hand him his golden parachute, and start over from the top.  Telling a head coach who to put on his staff is a recipe for disaster.

We are in agreement 100%.  

[lionheartkc 6,150]

Just now, keesler said:

I don't believe that the AU men in charge are viewing this situation in specific details, i.e. QB development, injuries, hit and misses in recruiting......

They are viewing the situation from a wide picture perspective.  And like it or not, good or bad...CGM is the head coach and AU has lost 16 games in the past 3 seasons and we are 1-2 in bowl games with the one bowl win in the B'ham Bowl after a 6-6 regular season.  Bottom line, that's not acceptable at Auburn.

I think you're right... but I think they are looking at it from the same perspective as some posters here... 1 and 3 vs bama and Georgia... and that's enough for them to kick into their "this wouldn't have happened when Pat Dye was the coach" mantra and all hell starts breaking loose.

[DAG 33,991]

1 minute ago, Harp_AU2013 said:

thats your opinion. We have been to two national championships with him on board. Just because he stumbled a little doesn't mean he is over his head. you can't build a wall all at once, you have to build it brick by brick which takes time and sometimes doesn't go the way you thought it would. I disagree he is in over his head. Oh and by the way, people said the same things about Dabo when he was in his 3rd and 4th year at Clemson..

 

yes, Dabo Swinney had one year where he went 6-7 after going 9-5 previously. Since then, he hasn't lost under 10 games. Apples and Oranges comparison.

[Auctoritas 2,828]

The argument is fallacious, still. It doesn't take "15 months" to get fixed because there are set, specific times that new blood can come in. Again, any QB that is available after signing day is probably not that great. It's not like Gus could have come to a realization in May or something and then gone out and found a replacement. Doubly so for it happening in fall camp, and 10x that for during the actual season. I still haven't heard what solution he should have come up with during the season when we were down to a statue, a cripple, and someone who kept trying to play basketball with the football - yeah, all 5 of the options had problems, but what was the immediate solution? At a certain point in the year your hands are tied - and that point is a lot closer to February than October.

I think he was relying on SW as baseline. He took a flyer on JF3 knowing that at worst we would have Sean to fall back on.  Maybe JF3 would shock everyone, but if he didn't we would be OK. 

Blame the whirlybird on him, the coxcat, the debacle of a Clemson plan, those are fair. But he had 4 viable qbs not including JF3. SW had proven his abilities - he just turned out to be more injury prone than any of us knew - and again, projecting injuries is a failure of clairvoyance, not QB coaching. 

[JFDTiger80 790]

So, its been a while since we had any updated OC news. What's the latest?

[gravejd 3,270]

16 minutes ago, Auctoritas said:

I would go so far to say that the QB argument is fallacious at best, silly at worst. The premise is, apparently, that a QB coach could take any of us here with eligibility and spend a summer and then magically we are a game ready QB. There is only so much someone can do with the materials at hand. Beyond that, what was RL or CGM supposed to do? Spring practice happens after signing day - and does anyone think any QB still remaining unsigned in freakin April or August is going to be the answer we needed? Was he supposed to kidnap and dress up johnny manziel in a fake mustache and glasses and pass him off as a freshman walk on?

"He should have recruited better!" Hell, he brought in TWO qbs to go along with a returning starter! I mean, I can understand being mad that SW got injured and there not being a viable backup, but I think blaming Gus for it is being mad at him for not being clairvoyant. 

Recruiting misses happen. Nobody thought JJ was going to have the problems he had - and I will go a step further and say since JJs best games have come in situations where he had to come in in relief, I will argue that it was reasonable to assume we had a viable backup QB already. But then JJ regressed further, JF3 didn't progress like NM or Cam did, and Woody Barrett couldn't pick up the offense fast enough to make a difference for the season (at least in terms of burning a redshirt for 1 or 2 games). 

The premise is that it is inexcusable to have 1 option at QB when you are entering your 4th year as a coach. Things happen with guys and you miss on recruits but you can't fall off the map like we did when your starter goes down. Decrease in production? Sure. Being able to produce nothing...unacceptable and people have to be held accountable. 

[keesler 5,924]

3 minutes ago, Harp_AU2013 said:

thats your opinion. We have been to two national championships with him on board. Just because he stumbled a little doesn't mean he is over his head. you can't build a wall all at once, you have to build it brick by brick which takes time and sometimes doesn't go the way you thought it would. I disagree he is in over his head. Oh and by the way, people said the same things about Dabo when he was in his 3rd and 4th year at Clemson..

That is indeed just my opinion.  The alternative is to give Gus 3-4 more years, let him accumulate +/-$16-$18 million more in salary and trust that he will continue to learn from mistakes and make solid choices down the road.

Are the AU Men in charge patient enough to allow him to stay another 3-4 more years to prove himself when it appears they don't even trust him to hire his own freaking Offensive Coordinator?

[lionheartkc 6,150]

5 minutes ago, Harp_AU2013 said:

I disagree he is in over his head. Oh and by the way, people said the same things about Dabo when he was in his 3rd and 4th year at Clemson.

Gus is and Dabo was.  That's the nature of being a young coach. Dabo learned and grew and it worked out well. Gus is learning and growing, but it's yet to be seen if he's going to be allowed to or able to get his head above water. This OC hire might actually be the turning point in his story.

[autigersj 122]

They have waited too long.... The people are starting to crack!! 

[Harp_AU2013 221]

2 minutes ago, DAG said:

yes, Dabo Swinney had one year where he went 6-7 after going 9-5 previously. Since then, he hasn't lost under 10 games. Apples and Oranges comparison.

His record is better in a conference that struggled until FSU in 2013.. If you look at his wins, most of there are nothing to brag about yet Gus is in the hardest conference in college football..

[lionheartkc 6,150]

1 minute ago, JFDTiger80 said:

So, its been a while since we had any updated OC news. What's the latest?

Auburn still has internal issues... and the focus is on the big recruiting weekend... MAYBE something will happen on Sunday, but probably not.

[DAG 33,991]

Just now, Harp_AU2013 said:

His record is better in a conference that struggled until FSU in 2013.. If you look at his wins, most of there are nothing to brag about yet Gus is in the hardest conference in college football..

 

SEC is not the hardest conference in college football. That would be the ACC. Nevertheless, he has been to two NCs in his time, both against the great NS and the Bama hooligans. He clearly learned from his 6-7 season, no?

[DAG 33,991]

7 minutes ago, Auctoritas said:

The argument is fallacious, still. It doesn't take "15 months" to get fixed because there are set, specific times that new blood can come in. Again, any QB that is available after signing day is probably not that great. It's not like Gus could have come to a realization in May or something and then gone out and found a replacement. Doubly so for it happening in fall camp, and 10x that for during the actual season. I still haven't heard what solution he should have come up with during the season when we were down to a statue, a cripple, and someone who kept trying to play basketball with the football - yeah, all 5 of the options had problems, but what was the immediate solution? At a certain point in the year your hands are tied - and that point is a lot closer to February than October.

I think he was relying on SW as baseline. He took a flyer on JF3 knowing that at worst we would have Sean to fall back on.  Maybe JF3 would shock everyone, but if he didn't we would be OK. 

Blame the whirlybird on him, the coxcat, the debacle of a Clemson plan, those are fair. But he had 4 viable qbs not including JF3. SW had proven his abilities - he just turned out to be more injury prone than any of us knew - and again, projecting injuries is a failure of clairvoyance, not QB coaching. 

5

When did Auburn sign a QB after signing day? JF3 committed in November. 

[keesler 5,924]

7 minutes ago, Harp_AU2013 said:

His record is better in a conference that struggled until FSU in 2013.. If you look at his wins, most of there are nothing to brag about yet Gus is in the hardest conference in college football..

Well, perhaps the AU Men in charge will view Gus the same way you view him.  Maybe they will step back today and let the man hire his own OC without any interruption of the process.  Maybe Jay Jacobs will be able to go before the BOT and plead to get Gus another contract extension with a raise and the BOT will hope to the heavens that the time will come in the next 3-4 years where Gus will finally be able to take off his training wheels.  

[Harp_AU2013 221]

2 minutes ago, DAG said:

SEC is not the hardest conference in college football. That would be the ACC. Nevertheless, he has been to two NCs in his time, both against the great NS and the Bama hooligans. He clearly learned from his 6-7 season, no?

There is no way you will ever convince me that from 2009 to now that the ACC has been this hardest conference. This year, maybe. just look at the national champion winners since 2007.. nothing else can be said on this.

[keesler 5,924]

I'm being too sarcastic ~ I'm going to see if a Momma's Love and some Momma's Nacho's with extra peppers will put me in a better frame of mind for the afternoon session.

[DAG 33,991]

Just now, Harp_AU2013 said:

There is no way you will ever convince me that from 2009 to now that the ACC has been this hardest conference. This year, maybe. just look at the national champion winners since 2007.. nothing else can be said on this.

 

I am not trying to convince you of anything other than comparing Dabo to Gus is apples and oranges. Quit deflecting. Dabo is very successful and consistent, I don't care how much of a disdain you have for the ACC. To compare Gus situation to his is foolish, as Dabo was never in the situation that Gus is currently in.

[AUApostle 7,651]

15 minutes ago, Auctoritas said:

The argument is fallacious, still. It doesn't take "15 months" to get fixed because there are set, specific times that new blood can come in. Again, any QB that is available after signing day is probably not that great. It's not like Gus could have come to a realization in May or something and then gone out and found a replacement. Doubly so for it happening in fall camp, and 10x that for during the actual season. I still haven't heard what solution he should have come up with during the season when we were down to a statue, a cripple, and someone who kept trying to play basketball with the football - yeah, all 5 of the options had problems, but what was the immediate solution?

There were at least 2 other capable JUCOs with starting experience available...really good QBs.

[Eagle-1 3,821]

16 minutes ago, gravejd said:

The premise is that it is inexcusable to have 1 option at QB when you are entering your 4th year as a coach. Things happen with guys and you miss on recruits but you can't fall off the map like we did when your starter goes down. Decrease in production? Sure. Being able to produce nothing...unacceptable and people have to be held accountable. 

Don't forget,  Two years in a row same problem! 

[Eagle-1 3,821]

5 minutes ago, DAG said:

I am not trying to convince you of anything other than comparing Dabo to Gus is apples and oranges. Quit deflecting. Dabo is very successful and consistent, I don't care how much of a disdain you have for the ACC. To compare Gus situation to his is foolish, as Dabo was never in the situation that Gus is currently in.

More like comparing apples to a peach pit. 

[bigbird 60,552]

28 minutes ago, JFDTiger80 said:

So, its been a while since we had any updated OC news. What's the latest?

[VipersStrike1 230]

29 minutes ago, Auctoritas said:

he just turned out to be more injury prone than any of us knew

"Any of us"? Speak for yourself. 

[aubiefifty 16,803]

does anyone know for a fact if riley has turned us down? seems rumors i hear are we are waiting on him after offering to make him rich and that chip is the fallback guy. and it makes sense chip would wait since the opportunity would be such a step forward for him if he succeeds.

[Auctoritas 2,828]

9 minutes ago, AUDevil said:

There were at least 2 other capable JUCOs with starting experience available...really good QBs.

OK- did they want to come to AU? 

We act like we're the only school that will go after a JUCO QB, and the only school they would ever want to come to, instead of one out of 128 or so. 

20 minutes ago, DAG said:

When did Auburn sign a QB after signing day? JF3 committed in November. 

To play the next year. Which is my point. After a certain point you can't just go find a new QB when yours are stinking up the stadium. It's not pretty but it's also not always immediately fixable. 

And, once more, we had 5 QBs, not 1. SW is a capable starter and JJ historically had lit it up in a backup role. JF3 was a project that didn't end up working out - but it's not Gus's fault that auburn fans hyped him up as the next coming of NM. 

The point is that at a certain time you have what you have, and sometimes that time is too late to fix it for the rest of the year.