The first debate

[ArgoEagle 1,790]

What is the point of even having a debate between these 2?

Every poster on this forum who was a Trump supporter before the debate is still a Trump supporter, and every Biden supporter is still a Biden supporter. I would venture to say it is like this for 90+ percent of the entire US voting population.

It really simply comes down to what type of government people want to live under and not so much who the candidates are. We all know what Biden is about, and we all know what Trump is about.

Trump is about traditional Constitutional Government and Biden is about Progressive Liberal Government. In other words Trump wants the government to stay the same, and Biden wants to see wide range change in the government 

The x-factor in this year's race is the pandemic and the effect it will have election night and after election night.

Whomever is declared the winner; the other party is not going to be willing to accept the results and will claim some form of election fraud or tampering.

It is going to be a cluster for sure.

I just don't see any reason to have any more debates. Just wasting people's time.

[Mikey 16,616]

2 minutes ago, ArgoEagle said:

It really simply comes down to what type of government people want to live under and not so much who the candidates are.

You nailed it!

[Leftfield 2,607]

44 minutes ago, AUFAN78 said:

A lot of people are hanging their hat on that and I have no idea what Trump meant by his statement, but what is clear and on record is his previous condemnation of white supremacy. In fact multiple accounts.

Are you really going to defend him on this? The very fact he has to be asked the question in the first place is appalling. He shouldn't need to be prompted to say it, he should be shouting it from the rooftops. And the fact that he has spoken against it in the past means very little when he, in front of a worldwide audience, has an easy opportunity to condemn it again and takes a pass. What message does that send to minority groups and those around the world that once looked to us as leaders?

If you don't know what he meant by "...and stand by," then you are just willfully being ignorant and a blind loyalist. There is no other way to interpret what he said. Watch the video again - it gets worse every time. I don't know if Trump is a racist or bigot at heart, but whatever the case he wouldn't condemn these groups because they are useful to him, which makes him a coward.

[Leftfield 2,607]

7 minutes ago, ArgoEagle said:

Trump is about traditional Constitutional Government...

The very reason we're in this situation is that he's been able to fool people like you into believing this.

[TitanTiger 20,499]

12 minutes ago, ArgoEagle said:

What is the point of even having a debate between these 2?

Every poster on this forum who was a Trump supporter before the debate is still a Trump supporter, and every Biden supporter is still a Biden supporter. I would venture to say it is like this for 90+ percent of the entire US voting population.

I think you're probably right, except there is this sliver of people in the middle who tend to fluctuate between parties in national elections who are undecided or shakily leaning toward a candidate right now.  Debates help push them one direction or the other.

 

Quote

It really simply comes down to what type of government people want to live under and not so much who the candidates are. We all know what Biden is about, and we all know what Trump is about.

Trump is about traditional Constitutional Government and Biden is about Progressive Liberal Government. In other words Trump wants the government to stay the same, and Biden wants to see wide range change in the government 

The x-factor in this year's race is the pandemic and the effect it will have election night and after election night.

Whomever is declared the winner; the other party is not going to be willing to accept the results and will claim some form of election fraud or tampering.

It is going to be a cluster for sure.

I just don't see any reason to have any more debates. Just wasting people's time.

If Trump's just going to ignore all the ground rules he agreed to and shout over people all the time, it is a waste of everyone's time.  I don't see Biden backing out of any planned debates though, so if they decide not to have them, it will have to be because the Trump camp decides not to.

[ArgoEagle 1,790]

3 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

The very reason we're in this situation is that he's been able to fool people like you into believing this.

I;m not fooled.

[AuCivilEng1 11,012]

That debate was not equal. Yea, Biden blundered and messed up a few numbers, and wasn’t the most articulate at times. But ffs, it’s got to be hard for anyone to keep their thoughts straight when you have a howling baboon screaming in your ear every time you try to get a thought out. This was cut and dry a Biden win. He held his composure better than I would have and actually seemed to portray a sense of empathy and care. He spoke about his plans (when he was given the chance by Trump). Trump acted like an imbecile and offered not one thing to the American people. Anyone who is saying “both looked bad” is creating that good old GOP false equivalency. 

[SocialCircle 570]

13 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

Are you really going to defend him on this? The very fact he has to be asked the question in the first place is appalling. He shouldn't need to be prompted to say it, he should be shouting it from the rooftops. And the fact that he has spoken against it in the past means very little when he, in front of a worldwide audience, has an easy opportunity to condemn it again and takes a pass. What message does that send to minority groups and those around the world that once looked to us as leaders?

If you don't know what he meant by "...and stand by," then you are just willfully being ignorant and a blind loyalist. There is no other way to interpret what he said. Watch the video again - it gets worse every time. I don't know if Trump is a racist or bigot at heart, but whatever the case he wouldn't condemn these groups because they are useful to him, which makes him a coward.

You could say the same thing about Biden as it relates to Antifa.
 

Meanwhile Trump has in fact publicly denounced white supremists. I don’t believe Biden has ever denounced Antifa. 

[Leftfield 2,607]

6 minutes ago, ArgoEagle said:

I;m not fooled.

Meaning you agree he is not what he says he is?

[McLoofus 35,182]

We really need to talk more about the fact that so many are openly calling for moderators to cut off mics rather than for ******* presidential nominees to exhibit a modicum of self control while having a conversation with another adult. 

You can't even hold your nominee accountable to keep himself out of timeout. You're blaming a ******* moderator for not spanking him when he was bad. 

******* madness. You've lost your god damned minds. 

[DAG 33,994]

Independent voter here:

Biden didn’t win the debate, more so Trump lost it IMO. 
 

However, the American citizens should feel embarrassed that these two are our best options. That debate was a shitshow and absolutely did nothing to sway people who are in the middle one way or another. We need better moderation (or a way for moderates to cut off mics) and a way to get more substance. Honestly. Majority of people know who they want to vote for based on social media and this forum. I don’t see how having two more debates would be anymore beneficial. 

[TitanTiger 20,499]

Just now, SocialCircle said:

You could say the same thing about Biden as it relates to Antifa.
 

Meanwhile Trump has in fact publicly denounced white supremists. I don’t believe Biden has ever denounced Antifa. 

Captain Both Sides weighs in.

[ArgoEagle 1,790]

4 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

Meaning you agree he is not what he says he is?

no. Meaning I don't agree with your assessment.

[TitanTiger 20,499]

Just now, DAG said:

Independent voter here:

Biden didn’t win the debate, more so Trump lost it IMO. 
 

However, the American citizens should feel embarrassed that these two are our best options. That debate was a shitshow and absolutely did nothing to sway people who are in the middle one way or another. We need better moderation and a way to get more substance. Honestly. Majority of people know who they want to vote for based on social media and this forum. I don’t see how having two more debates would be anymore beneficial. 

Mostly agree.  If this were a tennis match, I'd say Biden won because of Trump double faulting every other game and getting penalized for yelling at the line judge.  Biden for the most part just played pedestrian tennis and committed very few unforced errors.

But the reason this thing was a shitshow wasn't because the moderator didn't try to keep things under control (without the ability to shut off a person's mic, you can only raise your voice and talk over them so much).  It was because primarily one candidate adamantly refused to abide by the rules of the debate that he agreed to beforehand.  Like, didn't even make an attempt.  Right out the gate he was in howler monkey throwing feces mode and no amount of trying to remind him of the rules mattered.  Biden did interrupt some (I can't recall any presidential debate totally devoid of it) but it was a fart in a hurricane compared to what Trump was pulling.  

Chris Wallace did about all he could do in that situation.  He shouldn't need to mute a mic to get someone to shut the **** up every once in a while, but it appears at least when Trump is involved, that's what will have to be in place.  And frankly, if I'm Biden I might insist on that ability going forward. 

[AuCivilEng1 11,012]

Trump seemed to want the debate format to go...

Moderator: Question

Trump: Answer (or non answer in his case)

Biden: Response

Trump: Response to Biden

END

 

[DAG 33,994]

18 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Mostly agree.  If this were a tennis match, I'd say Biden won because of Trump double faulting every other game and getting penalized for yelling at the line judge.  Biden for the most part just played pedestrian tennis and committed very few unforced errors.

But the reason this thing was a shitshow wasn't because the moderator didn't try to keep things under control (without the ability to shut off a person's mic, you can only raise your voice and talk over them so much).  It was because primarily one candidate adamantly refused to abide by the rules of the debate that he agreed to beforehand.  Like, didn't even make an attempt.  Right out the gate he was in howler monkey throwing feces mode and no amount of trying to remind him of the rules mattered.  Biden did interrupt some (I can't recall any presidential debate totally devoid of it) but it was a fart in a hurricane compared to what Trump was pulling.  

Chris Wallace did about all he could do in that situation.  He shouldn't need to mute a mic to get someone to shut the **** up every once in a while, but it appears at least when Trump is involved, that's what will have to be in place.  And frankly, if I'm Biden I might insist on that ability going forward. 

He shouldn’t need to mute someone mic but the fact is that’s where we are. We shouldn’t need to do a lot in this country that quite frankly needs to be done or said. The bottom line is, I don’t think either candidate did anything to sway the minds of independent voters. I suppose Trumos behavior would do, but it’s not like Biden did anything worth substance tbh. Legit, Trump buried himself. Obviously , him not denouncing white supremacy was big for me. However, I am now stuck with voting on someone who I do not believe has anything of substance to value because the other candidate was acting a lot less professional. 

[DAG 33,994]

3 hours ago, AUEngineer2016 said:

Just going to drop this here as an example:

 

Man I love this 

[creed 1,640]

I believe I’m starting to realize Trump’s strategy since he’s behind in the polls. Make the debates a sh-t show to the point that Biden can’t get his points across, which may convince voters, democrats and republicans to take a pass at voting. Then he hopes only the hardcore voters turnout, which he hopes he has more. If I was Biden I would want very strict rules in place for future debates or I would say no. Then Biden should strategically conduct town-halls going forward. 

[Leftfield 2,607]

14 minutes ago, ArgoEagle said:

no. Meaning I don't agree with your assessment.

The fooled rarely admit they've been fooled, even after they realize it.

[TitanTiger 20,499]

3 minutes ago, creed said:

I believe I’m starting to realize Trump’s strategy since he’s behind in the polls. Make the debates a sh-t show to the point that Biden can’t get his points across, which may convince voters, democrats and republicans to take a pass at voting. Then he hopes only the hardcore voters turnout, which he hopes he has more. If I was Biden I would want very strict rules in place for future debates or I would say no. Then Biden should strategically conduct town-halls going forward. 

I think the next debate scheduled is a town hall format which will probably cut down on some of this crap.  I don't know the format of the third.  But if I'm Biden, I would insist that for the last two debates, during the portion where each speaker is supposed to be given time to give an answer uninterrupted, the opposition's mic is turned off.  It comes back on at the 2 minute mark or whatever is allotted, or when the "free debate" part starts.  And the moderator(s) have a kill switch to turn off anyone's mic after one or two warnings are given about talking over people or interrupting the moderator.  If Trump won't agree to that, maybe I cancel the debates and host multiple town halls.

[DAG 33,994]

5 minutes ago, creed said:

I believe I’m starting to realize Trump’s strategy since he’s behind in the polls. Make the debates a sh-t show to the point that Biden can’t get his points across, which may convince voters, democrats and republicans to take a pass at voting. Then he hopes only the hardcore voters turnout, which he hopes he has more. If I was Biden I would want very strict rules in place for future debates or I would say no. Then Biden should strategically conduct town-halls going forward. 

I think his bigger strategy is to attack the polling system. You saw last night he is very worried about absentee voting and “voting fraud.”

Even if he loses , he will fight like hell to remain in the White House. We need to brace ourselves for several weeks of uncertainty even after Election Day. 
 

I will say I agree . Biden does need more townhalls. I want to hear specifics about his plan with COVID, addressing the defunding or lack of for policing, and how he is going to go about paying for ways to deal with global warming. 

[ArgoEagle 1,790]

19 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

The fooled rarely admit they've been fooled, even after they realize it.

I don't agree with you. Really nothing more to say about it.

[McLoofus 35,182]

35 minutes ago, creed said:

I believe I’m starting to realize Trump’s strategy since he’s behind in the polls. Make the debates a sh-t show to the point that Biden can’t get his points across, which may convince voters, democrats and republicans to take a pass at voting. Then he hopes only the hardcore voters turnout, which he hopes he has more. If I was Biden I would want very strict rules in place for future debates or I would say no. Then Biden should strategically conduct town-halls going forward. 

It's very much an "I'll drag you down with me" strategy. It has been from the start. He doesn't rise. He drags everything around him down. 

That's what's frustrating about folks saying that last night didn't tell them anything. It's clear that one person sank the entire event, but they're still kind of blaming the other person for even being on the boat. 

[AuCivilEng1 11,012]

8 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

It's very much an "I'll drag you down with me" strategy. It has been from the start. He doesn't rise. He drags everything around him down. 

That's what's frustrating about folks saying that last night didn't tell them anything. It's clear that one person sank the entire event, but they're still kind of blaming the other person for even being on the boat. 

“Yea Trump insulted Joe’s intelligence, his family and refused to denounce white supremacy, telling one group to stand by. And yea he refused to keep his mouth shut during Biden’s speaking time. But Biden stumbled on a couple of words and told Trump to shut up, so it’s basically a wash”. Both candidates are equally terrible.

-Trump supporters

[homersapien 11,386]

Trump's gotta do what an immature, narcissistic, psychopathic, con man has gotta do.

He's perfectly reliable that way.