Allen Greene needs to step up concerning vaccinations

[au701948 1,009]

32 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Yup! We've fallen very very far from the times when women would draw lines on the back of their legs because they'd given up pantyhose for the war effort. Now we have a bunch of damned Karens- gender neutral at this point- buying up all the toilet paper and scared of a damned needle.

And, of course, they're the ones whining about the country being "soft". 

Amen!

[Didba 5,256]

4 minutes ago, AuburnEagle79 said:

This thread is ugly and should probably go away. Nobody here is going to change their minds based on anyone else's opinions. Tribalism at it's finest. I have my opinions as do others, but after countless threads of arguing, I think it's time to let this one go away.

 

I disagree. Having an open forum to discuss one's opinions and differing of opinions, especially on issues as important as this, are important to society and its growth as a whole.

 

As a famous Supreme Court Justice said [paraphrased of course]. We do not prohibit the expressions of ideas simply because the idea or discussion of the idea is one that parts of society find offensive or disagreeable. 

[AuburnEagle79 2,170]

1 minute ago, Didba said:

I disagree. Having an open forum to discuss one's opinions and differing of opinions, especially on issues as important as this, are important to society and its growth as a whole.

 

As a famous Supreme Court Justice said [paraphrased of course]. We do not prohibit the expressions of ideas simply because the idea or discussion of the idea is one that parts of society find offensive or disagreeable. 

That's fine if you want to argue amongst people who have zero chance of ever agreeing with your or changing their minds based on your view, but get it out of the football forum.

This goes on both sides of it. Right, wrong, or somewhere in the middle, it's just exhausting all the way around. 

State your piece, move on, let's get to football. 

[japantiger 4,051]

6 minutes ago, Didba said:

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/best-healthcare-in-the-world

 

Article that cites a study with industry standard established methodologies. The US is ranked 32nd. The majority of the countries in the top 20 have some form of universal Healthcare. The old argument of universal healthcare=bad Healthcare really hasn't held weight in the last twenty years.

I have personal experience with healthcare in 3 of the countries ranked above the US; I lived in each of them for a minimum of 3 years each (UK, Japan, Singapore).  I would not choose any of the 3 above the level of care and availability you get in the US.  I have had everything from normal preventative visits to surgery  and ER care outside the US; and all the above with family.  Getting anything approaching urgent care requires private health insurance...otherwise, get in line...a long line with no guarantee of treatment.  The basis level of care is like watching a Medical Center episode circa 1970.  The fact that this list has Columbia and Morocco higher than the US and Cuba only 2 spots behind the US should tell you all you need to know.

[McLoofus 35,182]

Just now, AuburnEagle79 said:

let's get to football. 

Our football coach is sitting at home for another week because he has COVID.

Several of our football players are missing practices because of COVID. One of them has (had) an outside shot at being our starting quarterback.

Our defensive coordinator, who actually is vaccinated, has COVID.

Your turn. What important football matters would you like to discuss? All ears. 

 

[japantiger 4,051]

10 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

You mean individualism at its worst. 

Damn Bill of Rights...

[Didba 5,256]

1 minute ago, McLoofus said:

Our football coach is sitting at home for another week because he has COVID.

Several of our football players are missing practices because of COVID. One of them has (had) an outside shot at being our starting quarterback.

Our defensive coordinator, who actually is vaccinated, has COVID.

Your turn. What important football matters would you like to discuss? All ears. 

 

I couldn't have written it up better if I tried. Beautiful.

[DAG 34,016]

4 minutes ago, AuburnEagle79 said:

it's just exhausting all the way around. 

Then why did you come into this thread? I don't get you guys. There are several threads surrounded around football. Fifty posts how many articles with limited responses. Go to one of those.

[au701948 1,009]

34 minutes ago, AU_Canoe said:

Vaccine discussion is a loaded topic and often relegated to heavy categories such as politics or religion. It's trying to have a chat based on a polarizing perspective...in other words "It's a Trap!" discussion. 

Regardless, at a superficial level, it's not a good look for AU when Harsin is sitting at home quarantining in August. It just isn't. I am not talking about vaccine choice but a mature and successful head coach is on the field getting their team ready for September. There is no substitute for that quality in-person time. Everyday is important. 

Championship level teams are hyper focused on exposure because the risk of forfeiture means they are most likely out of the CFP conversation. It's not about one person getting exposed but the contact tracing that follows. I want to give Harsin every opportunity to make a difference at AU and I believe in the coaching staff but again this is a bad look for AU at the local and national level. Especially, vs. SEC peers and CFP heavyweights. Makes us look like we don't belong in the sandbox. 

Mason sounded more like a head coach and leader of young men on this topic. I believe the SEC proposed vaccination levels which can equate to a reduction or elimination in testing and mask wearing. I would think that alone would be HUGE incentive for programs. 

As our favorite “real” nemesis in the College Football World said at his Press Conference earlier this week from Tuscaloosa “this is not a democracy”. And he wasn’t  discussing politics but the preparedness of his football players. None of us AU fans are crazy about the guy, but he is on point  and in charge. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

2 minutes ago, au701948 said:

As our favorite “real” nemesis in the College Football World said at his Press Conference earlier this week from Tuscaloosa “this is not a democracy”. And he wasn’t  discussing politics but the preparedness of his football players. None of us AU fans are crazy about the guy, but he is on point  and in charge. 

I've actually grown to respect him quite a bit. Honestly the only two things that give me pause are the story of him literally stepping over a sick player when he was in Miami (if true) and his daughter is certainly not a good reflection on the parenting she received. Two big asterisks but otherwise he's very admirable as a leader and clearly more fit for it than the guys we've trotted out in the post-Dye era. (Harsin is on the clock. This issue, failure of leadership though it may be, will not be his epitaph.)

[EastAl_Tiger 228]

2 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

I've actually grown to respect him quite a bit. Honestly the only two things that give me pause are the story of him literally stepping over a sick player when he was in Miami (if true) and his daughter is certainly not a good reflection on the parenting she received. Two big asterisks but otherwise he's very admirable as a leader and clearly more fit for it than the guys we've trotted out in the post-Dye era. (Harsin is on the clock. This issue, failure of leadership though it may be, will not be his epitaph.)

That's because he gets paid to win championships. you don't do that with your starting QB and half the line out with Covid. If you want to be a part of a team that competes for NC's then do what I say, if you don't, there's the door. You're free to refuse vaccination and the coach is free to give your scholly to someone else who isn't in sick bay.

[McLoofus 35,182]

3 minutes ago, EastAl_Tiger said:

That's because he gets paid to win championships. you don't do that with your starting QB and half the line out with Covid. If you want to be a part of a team that competes for NC's then do what I say, if you don't, there's the door. You're free to refuse vaccination and the coach is free to give your scholly to someone else who isn't in sick bay.

Replace any words related to COVID and vaccination with just about any other words at all and every person defending Harsin on this would be 100% agreeing with you. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

FB post from a local high school. Curious if y'all also pick up on the word that stuck out most to me.

Quote

Due to the significant increase in COVID positive cases, quarantining, medical leave, and bereavement leave, you may experience some late buses Monday, August 23rd 2021.

 

[Auctoritas 2,828]

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

You mean individualism at its worst. 

Somewhere along the way, we went from American Exceptionalism to I'm an American, Therefore I Must Be Exceptional.

[McLoofus 35,182]

Step up, Auburn. LFG!

 

[aubaseball 2,648]

2 hours ago, au701948 said:

As our favorite “real” nemesis in the College Football World said at his Press Conference earlier this week from Tuscaloosa “this is not a democracy”. And he wasn’t  discussing politics but the preparedness of his football players. None of us AU fans are crazy about the guy, but he is on point  and in charge. 

He wasn’t talking about vaccinations.  He was referring to doing things in practice and outside of practice.   

[Carnell 592]

20 hours ago, Quietmaninthecorner said:

your examples do not represent a nation health emergency.    out of your list,  only STD's are contagious,  but are you telling me... If an STD became an epidemic in your area,  or a global pandemic,  you wouldn't go get tested on your own?

The people on this board was inferring we should implement procedures such as Saben did.  Saben indicated in general that Bama is not a democracy.  He didn't state that Bama was a democracy until it comes to matters of a national health emergency.  Since people are inferring we should be like Saben then my examples are very relevant.  

If I had not been partciipating in high risk practices for contacting STD or had a blood transfusion the answer is no I would not go for an STD test.  Even during an outbreak, people with low risk that employ the medical services may in affect abuse the system.

[WarDamnDoc 390]

4 hours ago, passthebiscuits said:

I respect a person’s right to make decisions for oneself (with a doctors’ input as well). I understand the pushback to the idea that the government mandates or coerces us into anything. I also understand the hesitancy regarding the vaccine’s safety. I am keenly aware of the talking points and the uncertainties inevitable to these kinds of issues. 
 

However, there are some things that are clear at this point: 

1) Covid is real, and despite it being 99% survivable, it causes long term complications in many. And that 1% that have succumbed to the illness are real people. Fathers, mothers, brothers, sisters, pregnant patients, kids! I am surrounded by it every day as I work as a physician. We have no beds.Unvaccinated hospitalized covid patients cost our health care system over 2 billion dollars in June and July alone.  I have watched people die with Covid. 

2) The shot is safe and effective. It is a true miracle. To the very best that we can study a vaccine that was needed in record time, it is safe. Early August’s numbers alone show that 11,600 unvaccinated people in Alabama have died of Covid. 26 died of Covid that have been vaccinated. Even a Bama fan can tell you that the score 11,600-26 is real.

3) I am on the front lines. I don’t wear a lab coat. I probably stand with you in your grocery store. I am probably the least politically motivated person in the  world. I am also a cancer survivor. I am a physician.  I am absolutely dismayed at the lack of empathy and compassion toward human life. The shot saves people. This is absolutely a public health issue and not a political one. 

In summary: There is no debate. If you care about yourself, get the shot. If you care about those around you, get the shot. If you make a decision NOT to get the shot based on your own personal health reasons, personal religious convictions, or because you’ve had the virus and feel that you have antibodies—fine. But please, I’m begging you here, don’t make the decision based on political ideology. It’s not worth it. 

What I think we are seeing in real time is distrust. We don’t trust our government, leaders, politicians, church-leaders, doctors, etc.. To whom do we turn to then? I am a Christian. My Bible says that I am to treat others better than myself. (Phil 2)  I wonder sometimes if we fight each other to win the argument so much that we miss the big idea that what we should trust is God’s unfailing love for us. 

I have only your best interests at heart. I want to see all of you in Jordan-Hare healthy. I don’t think it’s Harsin’s job to tell anyone to get the shot or not. At this point, it’s out there and trustworthy people have spoken. 
 

War Eagle. 

Well said Dr Biscuits.

I would appreciate a statement from Harsin endorsing the vaccine for the many of the reasons you stated above. What Mason said was excellent without being coercive, IMO. Having said that, I recognize that Harsin is not a physician, and none of us should be relying on the opinions of football coaches to make our healthcare decisions. 

Thank you for your work and perspective. 

[cbo 7,917]

4 hours ago, McLoofus said:

FB post from a local high school. Curious if y'all also pick up on the word that stuck out most to me.

 

Bereavement?

[Grumps 3,704]

7 hours ago, passthebiscuits said:

I respect a person’s right to make decisions for oneself (with a doctors’ input as well). I understand the pushback to the idea that the government mandates or coerces us into anything. I also understand the hesitancy regarding the vaccine’s safety. I am keenly aware of the talking points and the uncertainties inevitable to these kinds of issues. 
 

However, there are some things that are clear at this point: 

1) Covid is real, and despite it being 99% survivable, it causes long term complications in many. And that 1% that have succumbed to the illness are real people. Fathers, mothers, brothers, sisters, pregnant patients, kids! I am surrounded by it every day as I work as a physician. We have no beds.Unvaccinated hospitalized covid patients cost our health care system over 2 billion dollars in June and July alone.  I have watched people die with Covid. 

2) The shot is safe and effective. It is a true miracle. To the very best that we can study a vaccine that was needed in record time, it is safe. Early August’s numbers alone show that 11,600 unvaccinated people in Alabama have died of Covid. 26 died of Covid that have been vaccinated. Even a Bama fan can tell you that the score 11,600-26 is real.

3) I am on the front lines. I don’t wear a lab coat. I probably stand with you in your grocery store. I am probably the least politically motivated person in the  world. I am also a cancer survivor. I am a physician.  I am absolutely dismayed at the lack of empathy and compassion toward human life. The shot saves people. This is absolutely a public health issue and not a political one. 

In summary: There is no debate. If you care about yourself, get the shot. If you care about those around you, get the shot. If you make a decision NOT to get the shot based on your own personal health reasons, personal religious convictions, or because you’ve had the virus and feel that you have antibodies—fine. But please, I’m begging you here, don’t make the decision based on political ideology. It’s not worth it. 

What I think we are seeing in real time is distrust. We don’t trust our government, leaders, politicians, church-leaders, doctors, etc.. To whom do we turn to then? I am a Christian. My Bible says that I am to treat others better than myself. (Phil 2)  I wonder sometimes if we fight each other to win the argument so much that we miss the big idea that what we should trust is God’s unfailing love for us. 

I have only your best interests at heart. I want to see all of you in Jordan-Hare healthy. I don’t think it’s Harsin’s job to tell anyone to get the shot or not. At this point, it’s out there and trustworthy people have spoken. 
 

War Eagle. 

Thank you for an honest, sincere, compassionate, and factual appeal to those who have not yet chosen to get vaccinated. It is awesome to see this approach to this contentious issue. I pray that it is effective!

[aubiefifty 16,903]

16 hours ago, Didba said:

I couldn't have written it up better if I tried. Beautiful.

hey didba welcome to the board! i am not a mod or anything  i just wanted to welcome you to aufam.

[Eagle Eye 7 2,535]

What’s really disturbing is folks that believe unfounded conspiracies on the internet that gave zero credentials as opposed to specialist like doctors and scientist that have devoted their lives to the field. It’s pathetic as to how stupid the internet has made a lot of low IQ people. Anyone with any semblance of intelligence can see that we have successfully used vaccines over the last 100 years and saved millions maybe billions of life. Are there a few that have a serious outcome? Yes. Very few. First a lot of the lies you hear about folks dying after the vaccine are talking about folks that due for some other reason. The people who report those numbers just look to someone who died in the month after their vaccination. Not how they died. IE a car wreck, heart attack or even covid they caught before their immunity took hold. Hell we are to a point some kid or Russian troll can go on the dark web and call their self “Q” and millions of folks will bow down and worship them, even though they have zero idea who they are. It amazes me. If someone tells me something, I want to know who they are and what credibility they bring to the table and can it be proven with certified public information. Just like Covid deaths can. Simply look at each states total deaths that are recorded every year by all of the states and you can see that deaths were up over 500000 from 2019 to 2020. Normally that figure of increase is around 20000. It’s not rocket science to disprove most of these lies and conspiracies, if you are truly looking for the truth. I think most of these folks have no desire for truth, just want to look special so they stick to their lies and conspiracies. I agree with Sir Charles Barkley, if you have a problem with mask or vaccines then you are an idiot and have zero moral character . I have absolutely no doubt Jesus would say take the vaccine and wear they mask if there is there is slightest proof that it helps others. With that I will refer back to my original  point of this was that as Head Coach you don’t have to demand folks to get a vaccine but as a leader you should lead as others good coaches have done by doing what is right and taking the vaccine in front of folks so they know it’s safe and effective. I took mine. I also took blood test at 45 days and 90 days and my antibodies were extremely high in both case. Maybe even higher than if I had actually gotten the virus . But the main thing for me is that I had the understanding that I would not be part of the problem but part of the solution. War Eagle. Try remembering our Auburn philosophy.  

[homersapien 11,440]

19 hours ago, AuburnEagle79 said:

That's fine if you want to argue amongst people who have zero chance of ever agreeing with your or changing their minds based on your view, but get it out of the football forum.

This goes on both sides of it. Right, wrong, or somewhere in the middle, it's just exhausting all the way around. 

State your piece, move on, let's get to football. 

And that's what I love about the South.  

 

[AU9377 5,035]

20 hours ago, Didba said:

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/best-healthcare-in-the-world

 

Article that cites a study with industry standard established methodologies. The US is ranked 32nd. The majority of the countries in the top 20 have some form of universal Healthcare. The old argument of universal healthcare=bad Healthcare really hasn't held weight in the last twenty years.

You are spot on.  I listened to someone argue that people had to wait 26 days for back surgery in the U.K. and that was an example of the evils of universal coverage.  They completely ignored the fact that the average wait time to see a doctor as a first time patient  in the U.S. is 24 days.  In large markets that wait time is 29 days.  Many areas have forced their local ER to serve as the community clinic, over burdening their emergency services and causing people to allow small issues to become major concerns.

[Eagle Eye 7 2,535]

3 hours ago, AU9377 said:

You are spot on.  I listened to someone argue that people had to wait 26 days for back surgery in the U.K. and that was an example of the evils of universal coverage.  They completely ignored the fact that the average wait time to see a doctor as a first time patient  in the U.S. is 24 days.  In large markets that wait time is 29 days.  Many areas have forced their local ER to serve as the community clinic, over burdening their emergency services and causing people to allow small issues to become major concerns.

Exactly. Folks just throw up crap because they can’t use real facts. But here are some 14 of the top 15 economic countries have a single payer system. Why? Because cutting out the middleman ( private insurance) saves money. Medicare for example runs on less than 3% overhead. Compare that to the 30% you are paying the insurance companies. Right now BCBS is having to pay a class action lawsuit where it admitted that it worked with other companies to limit competition in each area from 2013 to present. I left a Top 100 company 5 years ago to retire ( even before my Medicare kicked in) and my cost was cheaper for as good a coverage than what I was paying thru my company. The US pays more than double per person than the next 6 combined averages. What do we get for it? We rank 41st in the world in life expectancy. And headed lower. I talk to people in Canada and Europe from time to time.95% brag on their healthcare system and the small price they pay. The people posting negatives against our positives are just cherry picking the information. Take for example people can buy medicine produced in the US cheaper in other countries than Americans can. Why? Because insurance companies are making a profit off it. Would it mean some restrictions? Yes. And much needed. Just like most companies Putin their people now. If you follow good health practices then you get a lower rate. Why? Because you cost the system less. Just spend some time on honest websites and get the info. I mean it’s not complicated to realize if I make something and sell it to Frank and then Frank is posing to sell it to you, either your going to pay more or someone like the provider is going to lose more. 🤔